There are whales alive today born before Moby-Dick was written

[Recursion]

That is amazing...

[Scootaloo]

1. Imagine how many more if Moby Dick had never been written, for lack of a subject!

[JDPriestly]

13. Actually, whalers used to kill more of the whales. Today they are protected by many countries.

http://www.animallaw.info/articles/ovuswhalelaws.htm

[Scootaloo]

14. That's what I was getting at - awkwardly worded, I suppose!

What I meant was, imagine if there had not been whaling in the first place (and thus incidentall, nothing for Melville to write about) - how many more ancient brothers would be in the sea?

[JDPriestly]

38. Sorry, My mistake. I did not read it to mean what you meant.

[BrotherIvan]

16. Unfortunately, whale oil was the equivalent to modern day petroleum so it wasn't the book

The whaling industry was one of the most profitable in the world, with spermaceti almost worth its weight in gold. It wasn't a fad based on the book. It was commerce. Melville just wrote about it (and lived rather poor despite his early success). In some ways, the discovery of alternative forms of heat and light saved the whales, but due to the destruction of the environment, we still have a long way to go.

I pray in my heart that once we humans have died off due to our own ignorance and avarice, that whales will take their rightful place once again as sovereign of the seas. They are truly marvels, wonders on this earth. I imagined the other day what it might be like to be a sperm whale, one of the deepest diving creatures, to know the light but know the secrets of the depths as well. For whales to live so long, to fear nothing but man, to glide through the oceans and time...one can only imagine...

[Scootaloo]

24. See my reply to JD

I was saying, "what if there had been no whale industry to write about?"

[BrotherIvan]

25. Yeah, I saw that after I posted

Sorry for the misinterpretation. Humans have long been a scourge on this planet.

[Scootaloo]

31. No, that's asteroids

Humans are just an internal altration mechanism, a tribe of big-dicked ape that just so happens to have a large environmental impact. When we're done and gone - and make no mistake, nothing escapes extinction, not even us - we'll leave behind what is, assuredly, a fucking frightening world from our perspective...

but life is as certain as death on this planet,and SPMETHING will come up to take it over. Probably not anything "Wildlife as Canon Sees it" would want a picture of, though.

Imagine, for a moment, five hundred thousand years from now. Multicolored mats of cyanobacteria drift across the GUlf of Mexico, devouring decayed hydrocarbons from the pepetual seafloor seeps. In their shade are swarms of jellyfish, Stput, acid-resistant tentacles lancing the soft-bodied zooplankton that shares the water with them, occasionally being snatched by hte claws of a lurking mzantis shrimp clinging to the bottom of hte mat, supplementing its phytoplantonic symbiotes with a meal of jellyfish flesh.

On land, the smooth contours of the kudzu jungle are yellowing under the midday sun, while ground-dwelling rodents related to the eastern grey squirrel of old scurry through, collecting the dry seed pods to store away for the dry winter. They forget caches, and thus their home is propagated. Stalking them are the variegated descendants of housecats, themselves prey for the large constrictors, once native to southeast asia, but now found throughout the tropical and subtropical latitudes the world over.Occasionally a roaming herd of goats or boars - the two largest animals in this landscape - tear through, leaving a swath of soil open for quick-growing smaller plants before the kudzu forest recovers.

Far, far to the north, canine creatures - whether they were once wolves, dogs, or coyotes is irrelevant at this point - stalk the muddy, warm beaches of Prudhoe Bay - well, about fifteen miles inland from what is TODAY Pruhoe bay. They're hunting after gulls and, if they're lucky, a chick from the penguins - introduced ages and ages ago when Antarctica was flooding and humans thought a northwern population of adele penguins was the best way to deal with that particular crisis.

We're just the period on the final sentence of a short chapter a third of the way through in the planet's big book of life.

[JVS]

30. Petroleum derived lamp oils were originally touted as having less offensive odors than whale oil.

[etherealtruth]

2. Wow ... amazing

I had no idea.

Thank you

[pipoman]

3. Well don't tell the Japanese whalers ffs

[Scuba]

4. I did not know this. Very cool, thanks Recursion.

[LittleBlue]

5. Truly amazing. To think some of them were alive to see the

age of the sail and the transition to steamships.

Astonishing.

[Brother Buzz]

6. I wonder if the whale that stove-in the Essex and inspired Melville's tale is still alive?

In the Heart of the Sea by Nathaniel Philbrick is a good read.

[Recursion]

7. That was either a sperm whale or a fin whale, so probably not

They only live 70 years or so

[Brother Buzz]

8. Understood

And I was just pointing out Melville's story was partly based on a real event.

Do you remember the dating of a Bowhead a few years ago based on steel point?

Whale survives harpoon attack 130 years ago to become 'world's oldest mammal'

A giant bowhead whale caught off the coast of Alaska had a harpoon point embedded in its neck that showed it survived a similar hunt – more than a century ago.

Biologists claim the find helps prove the bowhead is the oldest living mammal on earth.

They say the 13-centimetre arrow-shaped fragment dates back to around 1880, meaning the 50-ton whale had been coasting around the freezing arctic waters since Victorian times.

Because traditional whale hunters never took calves, experts estimate the bowhead was several years old when it was first shot and about 130 when it died last month.

"No other finding has been so precise," said John Bockstoce, a curator at the New Bedford Whaling Museum in Massachusetts.

Calculating a bowhead whale's age can be difficult, and is usually gauged by amino acids in the eye lenses.

It is rare to find one that has lived more than a century, but experts now believe the oldest were close to 200 years old.

The weapon fragment lodged in a bone between the whale's neck and shoulder blade comes from a 19th century bomb lance.

<snip>

Experts have pinned down the weapons manufacture to a New England factory in about 1880 and say it was rendered obsolete by a less bulky darting gun a few years later.

<more>

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-461703/Whale-survives-harpoon-attack-130-years-ago-worlds-oldest-mammal.html#ixzz2tpPhaAsP

[BrotherIvan]

12. Very interesting

And for another interesting sea yarn, check out The Wreck of the Medusa

http://www.amazon.com/The-Wreck-Medusa-Disaster-Nineteenth/dp/080214392X

And anyone interested in anything having to do with the age of discovery will be delighted by Markus Rediker who knows his subject and is absolutely worth reading. I'm reading The Slave Ship now and am in awe of his scholarship but also loved Villains of All Nations and Between the Devil and the Deep Blue Sea.

http://www.amazon.com/Marcus-Rediker/e/B001IGJXYE/ref=sr_tc_2_0?qid=1392868667&sr=1-2-ent

Also Two Years Before the Mast by Richard Dana (Dana Point being named after him)

But I must say, no one compares to Melville. Typee and Omoo are extraordinary but Moby Dick just knocks me out. I recommend anyone who had to suffer through it and skipped all the passages about whales to reread it as an adult. It is transporting, sublime, stunning, and worthy of all the praise it has gotten. As a true devotee of Faulkner, I would still place Moby Dick as the great American novel. JMHO.

[Brother Buzz]

41. The first two books sound good....

but I fear my reading stack has grown to dangerously enormous proportions. Maybe, just maybe...

Two Years Before the Mast is a grand book, I must have read it entirely a half dozen times. I also reference it when reading other histories of California. Some later editions include an addendum Dana wrote after visiting California in 1859 where he observed a significant weather shift, today we know it as El Niño. Interesting, after he left California the second time, the state experienced two years of record heavy rains and apocalyptic flooding, followed by four years of record droughts that are only now being eclipsed in severity by today's drought.

Off topic: I apprenticed with Dana's grandson, an old salt and an accomplished boat builder who was an extremely entertaining philosopher when he was drinking his demon rum.

[BrotherIvan]

43. That is a tale!

Sounds like his grandson would have some interesting things to say. And if you have some recommendations for great maritime books, I am working my way through just about anything I can find for research. I've been trying to read all I can up until about (and including) Cook. Being a landsman, I've been tackling the subject the same way I would learning a new language. It's tough and slow going, but I keep forging ahead. I found Jewish Pirates of the Caribbean immensely fascinating and gave a whole new view of history.

I'm on my second run of Dana's book as well as The Seaman's Friend. Also working on Redburn. Any others you can point me to, I would be grateful. Sometimes they are hard to find but I have had good luck digging through bookstores online.

[BrotherIvan]

44. I forgot to ask about your California history studies

Are you are local/native? I'm a Southern California native so I found Dana's book doubly fascinating.

[Brother Buzz]

45. Fifth generation Northern Californian

I totally loved Dana's chance encounter with Russians on the San Francisco bay: Dana and the other Yankees were freezing in their butts off in their ragged light clothing while the Russians were sweating in their full fur attire.

[BrotherIvan]

46. Lucky You

I went to university in Palo Alto and stayed in San Francisco and Sonoma for five years. I'll get back there some day. Definitely one of the best places on earth. Jack London park is a place I visit often in my memory.

I loved the time they were tanning the hides. Just something about that hard work coupled with lazy days, plus the fact that he would read just about any book he could find by stubs of candles, just sounded like a little piece of heaven. The whole book is one to savour.

[Brother Buzz]

47. My brother teaches one class a year at that university

The pay is poor, but he's kinda retired and teaches, basically, for tee times on their fine golf course two miles from his house.

Charmian London gave my Godfather a set of blueprints of the Wolf House for a wacky project when he attended the architectural school at Berkeley, then the war intervened, he enlisted, and the project faded. True story.



Them boys rubbed the hair off their head transporting those dried hides around.

[BrotherIvan]

48. You're a veritable who's who of NorCal lore

And yes, the work on ships and the hides seemed like back-breaking, super-human work. I can't truly imagine what is what like except by watching crabbers and the like. The life was definitely brutish and short, but the adventure must have really been something. In an age when I can just buy a plane ticket and fly anywhere in the world, it's hard to understand what it was like to sail to far off lands.

It was nice to meet you and talk with you a bit.

[Skip Intro]

9. Were we only to see the Earth as the wonder it is, rather than a resource to be exploited. n/t

[defacto7]

10. Magnificent creatures.

I am in awe of cetaceans especially whales.

[Beacool]

11. Cool!!!

I didn't know that they could live for over 200 years.

[awoke_in_2003]

18. We agree for once, Bea...

stop the presses

[Beacool]

21. Well, it's about whales.

Not politics..........

[awoke_in_2003]

23. When I think of whales...

I always think of Echoes by Pink Floyd

http://m.

[Beacool]

27. Yes, quite apropos.

Thanks for posting it.

[awoke_in_2003]

26. And, just so you know...

I have disagreed with you on more than one occasion. But, I have always respected your opinion and tenacity. You are a fighter.

[Beacool]

28. That I am, just like my "gal".

Thank you.

[awoke_in_2003]

33. You are welcome...

glad you liked the Pink Floyd vid- I have always loved that song. The subdued organ always catches my attention.

[Beacool]

40. Yes, it's a great song.

[oldandhappy]

15. thanks!!!

I did not know some whales lived that long. Appreciate the post. Currently I am reading Moby Dick so your timing is perfect, smile.

[GReedDiamond]

17. Wind On the Water...Crosby & Nash...

Long live the Bowheads!

[Recursion]

19. Cool. I didn't know Neil Young's backup band had their own career!

[GReedDiamond]

22. That's just one of Neil's backup bands...

...starting with Buffalo Springfield.

[SMC22307]

32. I tend to get choked up when I listen to that...

such a sad, beautiful song.

[GReedDiamond]

36. Yeah, me too...

...hopefully, that's the effect of that tune on "normal" people.

I literally 96 Tears-up...not just from the lyrical content...but also from the superb musical interpretation of that level of passion for the cetaceans.

[SMC22307]

37. I just Googled the lyrics...

even that got to me.

96 Tears -- haven't heard that in ages!

[flvegan]

20. Shit, keep them out of Japan's "research" way then please.

[abelenkpe]

39. I know right? nt

[Spitfire of ATJ]

29. Humans are always AMAZED that there are things that live longer than them...

After all, we're supposed to be "special".

God's favorites.

Right?

[MindMover]

34. Can get most of Melville's works here for free ... enjoy

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/1900

[Egalitarian Thug]

35. No the recovery, such as it is, is amazing.

This whitewash/cover up is de rigueur.

[sakabatou]

42. Wow