Progressive pain equals republican gain

[Cartoonist]

I had an unexpected argument with someone who couldn't understand why I had a 99% bumper sticker and one for Obama. She claims he sold us out on the Public Option. She also didn't like his use of drones. Snowden's name didn't come up, but I can guess what she would have said. I don't get paid by the hour, so I made the conversation short and went my way.

It's going to happen again. Progressives with high standards are going to turn the country over to the republicans in 2016. There are already people here who say they wont vote for Hillary the war monger. And Snowden, the traitor, has really messed progressives up big time. I think it's great he exposed the NSA spying. Giving our pal Putin hard-drives is dangerous. The former doesn't bother me, the latter should bother everyone.

I asked her if she would have preferred Romney. She said there wasn't much difference. So here we go. Progressives won't support the Dem candidate because of flaws, but have no problem with letting the repub candidate win. Bush-Gore-Nader all over again. Meanwhile, the right is a concrete bloc that will even vote for a Mormon if he has an R after his name.

Insert Nazi reference here:
Hitler never won an election in his life. The best he got was about 30%. The Communist Party and the Socialist Democrats each pulled about 30% on their own. In the parliamentary form of government they had at the time, that means if they united, they could have made Hitler irrelevant. But Noooooooooo, their ideals were too high.
Here, the Naderites put Bush in power. Here, the anti-Obama, anti-Hillary and pro-Snowden Democrats are going to elect Todd Cruz or Rand Paul.

Fortunately, because my health is not too good for an old man, I might not live to see this happen. Still, I resent that my twilight years are filled with disgust at all those people here and elsewhere who can't see the harm they are doing, and what it will eventually lead to. The repubs are the enemy. Friendly fire is the GOP's best ticket to the White House.

[OnyxCollie]

1. Compromise is good!

Open-face shit sandwiches for everyone!

[1StrongBlackMan]

4. No ...

the better analogy would be: Open-face Sh!t sandwiches or bologna sandwiches on rye ... you choose! And you see them both the same because you don't like bologna or rye bread ... besides, you would rather have a Philly Cheese Steak.

The two choices are not the same ... or even close ... so please stop framing it so.

[OnyxCollie]

5. Yes, sir, Mr. Status Quo!

[JaneyVee]

7. Lets celebrate David Jolly defeating that corporatist Alex Sink!

I'm sure we could twist his arm and have him caucusing with the Dems in no time.

[1StrongBlackMan]

17. The last 6 years has not been status quo ...

it has been frustratingly, but understandedly, slow progress ... the ACA is better than what preceded it ... GLBTQ rights are better today than 6 years ago ... the economy is better than 6 years ago ... even, the NSA misadventure is better today than 6 years ago ... pick a matrix and compare it to 6 years ago.

Go out and vote Democratic, flip the house and expand the senate and you will get you cheese steak!

[kimbutgar]

2. I hear you brother

I am usually an optimistic person but I fear this country will go into further into a ditch under right winger control. Once they get in power it will be the Salem witch hunt, inquisition and internment/ re-education camps. The current crop of right wingers are evil and heartless unless you are a white Christian male.

I fear for my disabled son's future. In right wing world he is a taker because he gets SDI.

[Cartoonist]

3. In right wing world he is a taker because he gets SDI.

But his phone won't be tapped under a repub prez. Oh wait, yes it will.

[kimbutgar]

6. I could really call you out on that comment

Very insensitive. I told a personal thing about my son. Whether you believe it our not we have ALWAYS been spied starting after WW 2 to now. Your hatred for the president is really showing. The spy industry makes big bucks for corporations to sell to the Government their technology which used to be done in house got outsourced starting under your St. Ronnie Reagan. You should be really mad about the corporations spying on You. And you have no recourse against them because you've bought into the government is the problem bullshit. In the past we went after them. Now we can't touch them because they brought the government you so hate. Blame the corporations not the President.

[JaneyVee]

8. I think you misinterpreted what poster is saying.

[Cartoonist]

11. Thank you

for seeing it more the way I intended. I guess one really does have to use the sarcasm graphic, because the vocal inflection is missing.
I just used the quote as a lead-in to the point I was making that there IS a difference between the two parties even though they both do things wrong sometimes.

I am sorry to hear of kimbutgar's persecution by spying. I don't like any spying, really, though there is a difference between personally targeted spying and random word searches. I could live without both, but I personally am not freaking out about what the Gov learns about me. I am probably boring them to death even though I belong to leftist organizations that have no qualms about civil disobedience.

[kimbutgar]

16. I apologize for misinterpreting your comment

[baldguy]

9. "Progressives with high standards are going to turn the country over to the republicans in 2016."

And some of them aren't even progressives - they just claim they are.

[lonestarnot]

10. Hold that friendly fire, but if you smell troll, by all means fire in the hole!

[Cartoonist]

12. Whoa, what happened?

I thought I was scolding some wrong-headedness and suddenly I'm a disciple of Ronnie Raygun.

[lonestarnot]

13. I dunno. I didn't alert did he/she?

I never alert unless I know the whole thread which I have not. So now maybe I should.

[Cartoonist]

15. If she had alerted on me . . .

I would not have been allowed to defend myself. I wouldn't have been able to explain what I meant. I would be barred from posting for a time. Where am I?

[lonestarnot]

14. OK so what I meant when I first posted fire in the hole was referencing your last paragraph and the

trolls that like to sneak around over here without really sneaking. I know who they are when I read 'em.

"Friendly fire is the GOP's best ticket to the White House." I agree! Ever tried to herd cats?

[LWolf]

18. I disagree.

I think Democrats who don't have the courage to stand their ground are allowing the party to be run by neo-liberals that drive the left-of-center vote away. I think that the perennial efforts to bully the left into line at the voting booth is disgusting, and that those that allow themselves to be bullied ARE the problem.

I think it's hypocritical and anti-democratic to try to bully people into voting against their own positions.

I think people who vote for Republicans turn the country over to them, and I think centrist Democrats are the reason why the party has lost the support of the left.

We all have our perspective on Democratic losses.

[Cartoonist]

19. I hear what your saying

HOWEVER:
One has to be pragmatic and realistic. So far, there is no viable alternative to Dems vs repubs. I think the Green Party blew it by trying to win from the top down. In order to create a real third party, you have to start at the local level and build your way up. The religious right did it by running for school boards and local elections. Let's face it, even if Nader won, there wouldn't have been a single Green member in Congress. He would have been a flag without a pole

I think it's hypocritical and anti-democratic to try to bully people into voting against their own positions.
-
Here was the choice: Bush or Gore. A vote for Gore would have been a vote for at least one progressive position you held, maybe more. A vote for Bush would have been a vote against practically ALL your positions. A vote for Nader was a vote for Bush, it was NOT an instance of courage to take a stand. The republican party must be defeated at ALL COSTS, even if it means voting for Hillary.

[LWolf]

20. Same tired argument, recycled every campaign season.

Those who use that old argument, and those who allow themselves to be swayed by it, ARE the reason why the party loses votes on the left.

Vote for Nader a vote for Bush? Not a chance in hell. A vote for anyone is a vote for that person. You just stepped in to do exactly what I despise: rationalize caving in to neo-liberals. That argument not only does not sway me, it reinforces my opposition and loses any respect I might have had for the person posing it.

You want to keep the votes in the party? Then nominate someone who earns them. Don't want to nominate someone who can energize votes from the left? Then be upfront about it, and don't blame them for your losses.

fyi: I voted for Gore. I understand, though, why some didn't, and I've never blamed them. I blame several things for the debacle in 2000:

election fraud; the corrupt machine that engineered the selection; the choice of lieberman as running mate; and the right-wing machine.

I don't blame people for voting for the person that best represents them on the issues. That's called democracy.

[Cartoonist]

21. Suit yourself

As I said earlier, I might not live to see the republicans completely take over our country in 2016. If it happens, I won't be mad at the GOP, I'll be disappointed to my death at those who could have stopped it but voted for a wish instead of reality.

[LWolf]

22. Be disappointed in whatever helps you rationalize selling out.

I will be disgusted to my death with those who do.