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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWill Ukraine Continue to Exist as a Sovereign State? Essay by Richard DeLong (my Former Son in Law)
Last edited Wed Mar 19, 2014, 07:25 PM - Edit history (1)
Richard is my former Son in Law and has lived in the Ukraine for most of the last 12 years. He is the reason my Daughter still lives in Kyiv to this day.
His understanding of the people and culture of Ukraine is very high. He is a very intelligent and kind hearted man and I respect him deeply.
snip>
For many years I've said a terrible thing to my Ukrainian friends in private conversations:
"I don't even know if Ukraine will exist in twenty years."
The country has only been independent for a little over two decades and suffers from deep though hardly insurmountable political, cultural, and linguistic divisions. It has historically not remained independent for lengthy periods of time, and regional wars tend to rewrite its boundaries. Even though a whole generation has grown up accustomed to the idea of an independent Ukraine, a sense of fragility has always lingered in the air.
It appears that Ukraine's moment of truth has arrived. The country currently known as Ukraine is now at a historical crossroads. The range of possible near-term scenarios is more or less clear, but there is absolutely no certainty as to which path the country will take.
< snip
An interesting read that will help anyone who wishes to understand the situation in Ukraine.
He was also interviewed in a new documentary "My Revolution" which I posted a link to in the video section here at the DU.
MH
http://tryukraine.blogspot.com/2014/03/will-ukraine-continue-to-exist-as.html
here is the link to my posting in the video section...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017181757
mythology
(9,527 posts)Thanks for sharing it.
MysticHuman
(219 posts)As I stated ... I know Richard well and although he is the first to admit he doesn't know everything ...he certainly understands the people and the culture.
Tommy_Carcetti
(43,145 posts)Fortunately, the culture has remained throughout the centuries, despite episode after episode of foreign domination--most notoriously with its larger neighbor to the north and east.
Independence didn't come easy for Ukraine, nor will it stay easy.
MysticHuman
(219 posts)When you read about the history of Ukraine it is one of brutality and heartache. Stalin murdered upwards of 3 million Ukrainians and left a scar that has been carried to this day with the hatred many of Ukrainian citizens have for Russia.
MH
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)But I am not a big fan of nation states anyway.
Tommy_Carcetti
(43,145 posts)hfojvt
(37,573 posts)is about the size of California-Oregon-Washington in both size and people.
Is it a bad thing that Calorewash does not exist as a "sovereign nation"?
There are scenarios where life would be awful for the 45 million in a sovereign Ukraine and there are scenarios where life would be decent for the 45 million living in a non-sovereign Ukraine.
For me, the ultimate good, or an absolute key to the ultimate good, does NOT reside in this notion of "national sovereignty".
Tommy_Carcetti
(43,145 posts)...exactly who then would have control over Ukraine?
Just so I'm clear as to your position here.
MysticHuman
(219 posts)That people shouldn't have the freedom to govern themselves and not under a oppessive country as Russia is?
The Ukrainian people have been brutalized by one country or another over the last few centuries... it is time they have a government they can trust.
That is all I am seeing....
hfojvt
(37,573 posts)they still end up with the Taliban, or Idi Amin, or Saddam, or Pol Pot,or a Putin, etc., etc., etc.
Sure and what if they lost their "national sovereignty" because they were forced to become part of Austria-Hungary?
MysticHuman
(219 posts)of course the Taliban were Reagan's "Freedom Fighters" and the Kmer Rouge were assisted into power by the U.S. also.
At some point the consciousness of man has to be great enough to rule with honesty and integrity. I realize that we are a long way from that being the case but Ukrainians should be allowed to determine their own destiny.
If they put in power corrupt leaders the people will hopefully eventually see that and demand changes and that is what we are seeing today.
Thanks for you input and perspective.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)Recommend!
As I stated Rick is a good man and has traveled the world. He is an avid hiker and once hiked the entire Pacific Coast Trail from Mexico to Canada averaging about 25 or so miles a day for over 3 months.
He and my Daughter hiked from Southern Colorado to Northern Colorado over a 3 week period.
I have never met a man quite like him...very determined and focused.
Tommy_Carcetti
(43,145 posts)Offers a much fairer and more complete picture of thought on the street in Ukraine than what some so-called "residents" have offered here.
MysticHuman
(219 posts)With the input of the others also interviewed you get a decent feel to what the mindset has been for the vast majority of Ukrainians.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)Tommy_Carcetti
(43,145 posts)Cha
(296,773 posts)MysticHuman
(219 posts)Check out the video also...it's very well done....
Cha
(296,773 posts)former son-in-law who lives in the Ukraine.
My Daughter actually met him in Ukraine while in college. She had volunteered to help at an orphanage one summer near Kyiv and needed a translator. He happened to be the person she hired.
He came from a Mormon family and had went on a mission for the church and never really came back to the U.S. He loved the country and the people and even though he distanced himself from the LDS faith he stayed in Ukraine and then started hiking trails around the world always returning to Ukraine.
Cha
(296,773 posts)the world.
Cha
(296,773 posts)the whole Universe!
"If you take a really long view, such matters are of less importance than preserving and improving soil fertility and biodiversity, the loss of which would throw human civilization back to a much more primitive stage of development and permanently limit humanity's options. Compared to preserving the basic ecology upon which civilization depends, the problem of Ukraine is relatively trivial."
I knew nothing much about this area of the world but since the crisis started have been learning more and more.. I use to live in upper state New York and we had Ukainians come into our co-op and I got to know them over the years.. Nice hard working people.. Otherwise I would have no clue.
He is quite the philosopher! As I said he is very intelligent yet admits he doesn't know it all.
Sounds like a very interesting chap!
reformist2
(9,841 posts)I have a hard time believing that places that voted 70%, 80%, and 90% (see below) for a leader that this Maidan movement drove from office can be talked into sticking around.
MysticHuman
(219 posts)I have seen these numbers in the past and it is apparent with these percentages that indeed that could happen. Putin justified taking Crimea because of the "Russian" speaking people... I am sure he feels the same way with eastern Ukraine.
Democracyinkind
(4,015 posts)The West - and the fascist elements in Ukraine - have been inadvetently playing into the Russians hands ever since the demise of the Juschtschenko government. This will go down in history as an epic strategic blunder for western interests.
Then again, Poland and Hungary would probably welcome such a situation, and they ostensibly belong to the West now.
We live in interesting times. The Second World War is only just ending in this region.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)Reading and watching the video now.