Recycling isn't all that it appears to be.

[Skidmore]

This is a really good article on some of the misconceptions people have about recycling and what actually happens to what you put in those bins. Some of it is pretty breathtakingly fraudulent. An eye opening article worth taking the time to read. Why we need the solidified byproducts of petroleum to be given such a prominent role in our culture truly makes me angry.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/conservation/issues/recycling-reality.htm

This morning on ABC there was an item on how the fashion industry is now looking at 3-D printers for people to eventually download fashion designs and print out clothing and jewelry in their homes in the future. Wow! Everyone needs to wear plastic clothing. Let's just hug those carcinogens close, and is any thought going into what to do with all of this envisioned crap when fashion whims change and people are stuck with clothing articles that will not biodegrade or be recycled since plastics have very limited recycling potential? Here's an article about the future of fashion as some in the industry see it.

http://www.tedxamsterdam.com/3d-printing-the-face-of-future-fashion/

I know we have avid fans of 3-d technology on DU, but I 'd like to hear a little bit about how this techology could be used without creating more damage to the environment and to people. Developing a prosthetic device is a good application. I can't think of much more it is useful for except to put people out of works and create mountains of toxic junk.

[Historic NY]

1. My town used to have recycling trucks....

they spent hundreds of thousands on. They now just dump the stuff in a garbage truck all together. I have caught and call them out on dumping recycle stuff with garbage and usually get a lame excuse. I've recently been putting out old metal pots and pans (aluminum) and watch the quizzical look they have. I've been told there is such a glut in this stuff the price has declined to the point its not worth the trouble.

[liberal N proud]

2. As far as wearing plastic clothing - Nylon and Polyester (not Rayon) are plastic

Last edited Wed Apr 23, 2014, 03:12 PM - Edit history (1)

How many items in your closet are made of or contain either Nylon or Rayon? So printing them at home just means you shop at home, download and create it right there in you basement or workshop.

But that is assuming a lot, 3D printers capable of doing such printing are not going to be cheap and not many are going to have them in their home. There are cheap 3D printers but they are only capable of small objects and limited materials.

3D printed technology has an endless array of applications many of which are as you say, going to create mountains of junk. If printed from the right material, the things printed can be recycled. Being in Engineering, we see 3D printers as a way to test a part before we spend the money to cut the metal, it simply saves time and money.

There are many applications for 3D printing that are for improved lifestyle such as prosthetics as you indicate, but think of better fitting joints and even saving a limb vs amputation because a 3D printed bone was generated from MRI information. Now they are even moving into 3D printed human tissue.

I just don't see printed clothing taking off anytime soon.

The recycling story is discouraging because we are diligent about recycling separating paper from glass, aluminum and plastic. Or weekly disposal consist of more than 90% sent to the recycling bin. I would hate to find out it was for nothing.

[Skidmore]

3. I buy cotton, silk, or linen clothing.

My preference for the fabrics made from plants goes back to my childhood. There was a very bad fire at a nearby armory where a square dance was being held in one of the large rooms there. This was back in the day of tulle can-cans and heavy duty nylon stockings. Some of the women at that dance were so badly disfigured through having their clothing melt onto their bodies. That has stayed with me throughout my life. I limit my consumption of fabrics that touch the skin to natural products.

As for printed bones, is there no concern for the leeching of carcinogens into the body? Or, are you talking about the ability to construct actual bone and not plastic forms resembling bones?

[liberal N proud]

5. There are 3D printing processes that are more than just plastic

They have developed 3D printing that will do celluloid material, metals and yes even living tissue although I believe most of that is still in the testing/development stages.

3D printing is not necessarily a machine spitting out a plastic steam into a blob, the technology has become so much more and very rapidly.

Current technologies for joint replacement include plastic materials combined with metal so printing them would be no more of a concern than that.

[politicat]

11. Nylon and polyester, you mean. Rayon is cellulose.

Rayon (and Tencel) are made from wood chips or bamboo. Rayon will biodegrade (and often does, in the washing machine, with improper care.) rayon is considered a semi-synthetic, in that it does require significant processing to turn a wood chip into a spinnable fiber, but it retains much of the qualities of a natural cellulose fiber.

Nylon, acetate, microfiber, fleece, polyester -- those are all fossil fuel based, and in theory could be printed, but at this point, there is no functional protein or cellulose (wool/silk or cotton/linen/rayon) feedstock that can be used to print.

Printable fashion is going to require creating a new form of fabric, because current non-woven fabrics are pretty sketchy. Even the very light weight ones tend to be stiff and lack fluidity (think tyvek envelopes or non-woven fusible interfacing) and little breathability. Weaving/knitting the fibers from a home 3D printer will require a significant additional technology, and weaving/knitting then cutting and sewing are why garments fit well and do their their job of keeping us from burning/freezing. Every seam matters.

On the other hand, if the developers can overcome the unattractive fabric problem, then I see it as a huge leap. A single mass produced tee or pair of underwear or sock has a gigantic carbon footprint, given that industrial cotton uses major fertilizer and pesticides, significant water, heavy machinery for harvesting, then must be shipped to be spun, then shipped to be knitted, then shipped to be cut and sewn, then shipped again to be distributed and sold. If we can figure out how to print something like Interlock Twist Yarn jersey (which is a smooth, fluid, drapable, breathable, durable, cool and comfortable polyester jersey, often seen in fast fashion), the carbon footprint of a home printed shirt drops to feedstock plus power to run the printer, plus amortization on the printer itself. If we can come up with a rayon (remember, wood chips and biodegradable) feedstock, then the fabric will biodegrade and be closer to carbon neutral. But that unattractive fabric problem is a pretty major one. I've seen what current printers can manage. Good for ponchos and maybe rain jackets, not fashion.

[liberal N proud]

12. I do stand corrected and yes

I was most surely thinking of polyester, hell it has the word poly right in it

[bettyellen]

33. I think they will develop some materials that are novel and different that will work well for

structured pieces that can use the limitations of rigidity to their advantage. A new kind of tailoring, or support garments like bustiers, and of course accessories. I think a lot of the intricate things they can do with lasers on material can sort of be reverse engineered- like creating lace effects with unheard of materials and new properties. A lot would probably be about these new textures combining with the new fit tech capabilities , which could function like your own custom tailor.
I don't see it making a dent in the jeans and tees commodities market. I wish the zero waste thing was more of fad though.

[politicat]

35. Oh, don't get me wrong -- I am a textiles geek and I want to see what is possible.

If it's not clear from my first post. I agree, there will be interesting fabrics developed, and I can totally see some functional garments being developed -- goretex jackets without any seams, diabetic socks formed on a digital cast of the diabetic's foot, micro thin warming garments that can be worn next to the skin and provide micro electric heating for cold climates.

I'm not so sure on formables. I've made stays and corsets, and the means by which they are both form-fitting, comfortable and do their shaping job comes from the properties of the weaves and the structuring material. I can definitely see something like a batman abs piece coming into fashion, or perhaps functional body armor build from carbon-fiber, though.

There is a reason that textile technology has not changed in qualitative ways in 7000 years. Looms are bigger and faster and more automated, but they're not functionally that different than Ancient Greek looms. Knits, especially, have some fabulous properties -- the stretching can accommodate a lot of body variations, or compress (as in compression stockings). That's what I don't see being replaced.

On the other hand -- accessories will be revolutionized.

[bettyellen]

44. I could tell you were a textiles geek, LOL.

I'm a fashion geek as well. You're spot on about not replacing knits anytime soon. I'm just surprised with the price spikes we've had in some fibers over the past 4-5 years that there is not more interest in "Zero waste" methods for using yard goods. I tried to get into the class at Parsons a few years ago, but it was co sponsored by Madewelll, and they did not want anyone who worked for a competitor attending. The professor was kind enough to send me the reading list. Interestingly enough, a lot of it was based on very old designs, using selvedges and all. Do you know about the whole knitting sweater machines? They sound incredible. No yarn wasted, machine attaches everything, just spits them out. Pretty cool.

[KittyWampus]

24. Oops, someone else corrected that about rayon.

have a nice day

[pansypoo53219]

27. i don't think rayon is plastic. i only get polartec for warm. otherwise it is only natural.

ad the more resale clothes i find, the better.

[Bosonic]

4. Predicting the future of any technology is hard

http://www.livescience.com/38876-10-worst-tech-predictions-of-all-time.html

3D-printing as-is may or may not take off, but I think generally distributed manufacturing (& distributed energy production) will be significant future tech.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

13. Star Trek has been doing it since the 60's...

we're only weeks away from FTL travel and transporters...

sP

[Skidmore]

6. Will get back to this thread later

but am interested in reading more from you all. Have to go do my bit for recycling by donating books to the local school.

[Shankapotomus]

7. Apparently

biodegradable 3D printer filament is available. If you do a search, it will come up.

And there is also this:

http://www.3ders.org/articles/20140304-turning-old-plastic-into-3d-printer-filament-is-greener-than-conventional-recycling.html

And this:

http://www.3ders.org/articles/20140124-plastic-garbage-becomes-ink-for-3d-printers.html

[DebJ]

8. Our recycling pick ups must be genuine here, because the stuff is picked up for free.

On recycling day, there are two truck runs, one for garbage, one for recycling.
Our township pays zero for recycling. It is picked up for free, so they must
be making money from it or they couldn't pay their drivers or fuel and maintain
their vehicles.

I bet part of the issue is where the items are picked up and what the population density is
in those areas. Can enough be collected to allow for a profitable recycling business?
Where I live now in south central Pa, the city has about 43,000 residents, and then there are the
suburbs where we live. I grew up in Maryland suburbs of DC, so this barely even seems like civilization
to me here. BUT, my parents retired to Points, WV 25 years ago....the closest town, Romney,
has only 1800 people, and the minimal other population is scattered widely about the
hills and curving streets and dirt back-roads.

Recycling in the Romney area is pretty much impossible. It is a two hour ride to the dump. A car
full of plastics and cans really doesn't return much in the way of cash, compared to the
gas costs of a four-hour round trip. The population density is so low in that area that a
recycling truck would drive miles and miles for very little pick up. Many people (like my father)
didn't even hire the trash removal company; instead they burn what they can't compost.
I don't know WHAT they do with their non-burnable leftovers; my Dad was a hoarder and
we just removed waste from a 30' x 30' garage that he had accumulated for the last
three decades. That's another tale...........

And hazardous waste disposal in 'Wild, Wonderful West Virginia?'
Get this: the advice is to load up your vehicle with hazardous waste materials, drive the
two hours to the dump around winding mountain roads, and when you get there, they will
look at the stuff and tell you whether they will take it, or not. Four hour round trip, and you
might end up bringing all of it back with you. That's their 'system'. I think that most of the
plastics and hazardous waste up there must end up in the woods, feeding the streams and
wildlife.

[jwirr]

10. Our garbage truck companies furnish us with extra garbage cans and two times a month they have a

special garbage truck to pick them up and it is included in the bill for the regular garbage. The recycling is not extra.

We also have programs in schools that collect colored paper and sell it for the school. We are also encouraged to recycle clothing and usable items in bin mark DVA - Disabled Vets of Ameica. They take these items and sell many of them at a used store and often at rummage sales.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

9. 3D printing spare parts means less toxic emissions trucking stuff around. 1 example. nt

[LeftyMom]

14. Even if 3D printed fabric pieces could be printed to size, they would still need to be assembled.

Even very simple garments consist of multiple pieces, and these days very few people know how to sew well enough to assemble simple things.

[jeff47]

18. The theory is you just print the fully-assembled form

Instead of having pieces that are connected via seams, you just print the final shape. No sewing required.

It would be more like knitting than sewing.

[LeftyMom]

28. Yeah, that really doesn't make sense in terms of how functional garments work.

Making affordable functional garments was probably the biggest project of the earlier industrial revolution and mechanizing those processes was the holy grail of engineering for most of the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries, so the notion that we're going to reinvent the wheel there should meet with significant skepticism. That the ladies in the OP are doing isn't a process that could lead to a garment people would want to wear, and really nothing about where 3D printing appears to be headed suggests that's going to change, because the whole utility of 3D printing is it's general utility, and garment making uses very specific and intricate processes that vary wildly from garment to garment.

I mean, basically this is the process for making a wearable, functional garment:

1. Threads are made by winding fibers into a stronger multi-strand cord. This is important for creating a product that has give and stretch but which is still strong. Simpler processes can be used for things like reusable grocery bags, but don't really work for comfortable, wearable garments.

2. Material is made by combining many fibers by weaving or knitting them. Again, this is important for stretch and drape as well as strength. A weaving process could create a single-piece garment, but even knit or crochet garments are generally made of multiple pieces which are ultimately sewn together in order to create different levels of stretch or to change the grain line in a flattering way. For example a sweater generally has separate sleeves which are added to the torso near the end of the assembly process. A simplified process would really limit possibilities as well as utility and likely fit. Custom fitting would add some fit back to the garment but I'm dubious that such a garment would be comfortable, at best you'd get the best fitting tyvek jumpsuit you've ever worn.

3. Assembly combines pieces in flattering ways. All but the simplest garments need multiple materials (often hidden) to stiffen some areas (collars, etc) while allowing others to drape, to line areas where a little more concealment is needed, etc. Most garments combine pieces in such a way that the grain line is not unidirectional. Even a simple t-shirt combines two materials (knit body with light stretch, stretchier rib knit neck collar,) and three different grain line directions (the body, sleeves and hem are all cut at different angles) in order to create a very simple garment. You can't really skip this step and get any garment more complicated than a tube sock.

3D printing garments would either require comically simplifying our understanding of what garments are and what they do (which I don't think there's any benefit to doing or social interest in pursuing) or Star Trek-grade handwaving of the steps required to make a thing possible.

[Bosonic]

32. Here's an experimental 3D printed dress

Definitely not sewn together (possibly sections connected together lego-like)

[LeftyMom]

39. Yeah, that's not a dress anybody would actually wear. That's a body shaped plastic net.

70% of coture is doing crazy shit to get your name in the trades, but no actual person is going to actually spend money for that. It only doesn't seem completely goddamn ridiculous because it's on a model who doesn't need a flattering outfit (or foundation garments) to look great. Picture any person you know IRL getting something like that to wear out to dinner? Moving around, sitting down in it, not looking like a complete weirdo? Yeah, not gonna happen.

[jeff47]

38. Imagine your loom can output a completed dress instead of a sheet of fabric. (nt)

[LeftyMom]

40. Again, it doesn't work that way. And a 3D printer certainly can't do anything like that.

It's like saying you could 3D print a house with a big enough printer. It only makes sense until you think about all the plumbing and electrical work and stuff that makes a functional house. You could make a house shaped object, but not a house anybody with any sense would want to live in.

You could make a dress shaped object in a 3D printer, but not a wearable, comfortable, flattering dress.

[jeff47]

43. You can 3D print a house with a big enough printer.

Last edited Thu Apr 24, 2014, 09:57 AM - Edit history (1)

It only makes sense until you think about all the plumbing and electrical work and stuff that makes a functional house.

You can 3D print metal too. There's no reason you couldn't print the pipes and wires too. 3D printed objects don't actually have to be solid. Or even attached to their surroundings. They've 3D printed a ball within another ball and the two balls were not attached to each other.

You could make a dress shaped object in a 3D printer, but not a wearable, comfortable, flattering dress.

A dress is just thread in a particular arrangement. Yes, at the moment we do that via weaving together panels that we then sew together. But that isn't the only way to arrange thread.

[FarCenter]

15. China doesn’t even want to buy our garbage anymore

May 9, 2013 -- Since 2007, one of America's top exports to China has been... trash. Yes, trash. That includes everything from scrap metal and paper to cardboard and crumpled soda cans. The United States sold $10.8 billion worth of metal and paper scrap to China in 2011.

It sounds weird, but the trade made a lot of sense. China had been sending so many consumer goods to the United States that all those shipping containers were coming back empty. So U.S. companies began stuffing the return-trip containers with recycled cardboard boxes, waste paper and other scrap. China could, in turn, harvest the raw materials. Everyone won.

Especially U.S. recycling programs. Those trash exports to China became indispensable for municipal recycling. In 2011, the United States recycled some 52.8 million tons of paper and paperboard — and about 15.8 million of those tons were sent to China. Likewise, China imports nearly half of America's recycled plastics, including bottles and containers of all sorts, around $500 million worth.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/05/09/chinas-crackdown-on-trash-could-make-it-harder-for-u-s-cities-to-recycle/

[Skidmore]

21. Yikes! What have the Chinese been doing with this stuff?

I had heard that they have huge landfill issues. Does some of this get dumped into the ocean? I would like to see us eliminate a great deal of the plastic packaging we have in our stores. Perhaps we could return to using glass for liquids. I rarely buy any liquid kept in plastic if I can avoid it. Wax paper should make a comeback.

So much of this goes back to cases where there was tampering with medicine and food products. And then there are those among us who engage in thievery. So few can ruin things for so many.

[FarCenter]

26. With single-stream recycling, you need really cheap labor to separate materials

China has a lot of cheap labor, although less now.

iPods are made of aluminum - probably our beer cans coming back to us.

Cardboard probably gets recycled into new packaging to contain goods for export. Otherwise they would have to import wood pulp or cardboard.

[Nitram]

16. the article actually is very positive about re-cycling

[Bosonic]

17. EU funds 3D-printed 'smoothfood' for care homes

EU funds 3D-printed 'smoothfood' for care homes

The European Union is funding a project to develop 3D-printed "smoothfood" for people in care homes who suffer from problems related to mastication and swallowing.

The project, called PERFORMANCE, is hoping to build on the success of German company Biozoon, which first created the smoothfood concept in 2010 and has since seen it be adopted in over 1,000 care homes across Germany.

For people who have trouble masticating or swallowing, meal times often become such a chore that loss of appetite and subsequently malnutrition can be a huge problem, as they start to dread rather than look forward to their next meals. Smoothfood has proven an effective solution to this, as it not only makes food easier to eat, but keeps it palatable and varied.

A smoothfood meal consists of deconstructing elements of a dish and then reconstructing them in a form that makes them both safe and easy to chew and swallow. Biozoon does this by cooking, pureeing and straining food, before mixing it with a solidifying agent and moulding it into the shape that would resemble its original form.

http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2014-04/11/eu-3d-printed-food

[ljm2002]

19. We should all keep in mind the 3 R's...

...Reduce, Reuse, Recycle -- in that order.

1 - Reduce the amount of stuff you use / waste you produce in the first place
2 - Reuse whatever can be reused
3 - Recycle whatever is recyclable

Obviously the order counts. I try to keep it in mind. Can't say I'm the best at it, but still, the 3 R's is a good rule of thumb to keep in mind. (#2 can be problematic for hoarders, though -- e.g., I have a bunch of small spice bottles, not sure what I think I'll be using them for)

[Skidmore]

22. We use these principles quite a bit.

Add another R to that list--Repair. It would be nice to see cottage industries for small appliance repair return as job opportunities. Planned obscelence and the limiting of warrantees to force people into using corporate repair services have really made it easier for people to dispose of items that would have been pricey in the past and repaired to allow for a long life of use. My husband repairs a great deal of our appliances himself. He also knows how to repair electronics at circuit board level. Our contribution to the community is that he will take appliances, including entertainment equipment, from people who want to dispose of it and rehab it. He then donates these items to various charitable organizations so that they can find a second life with someone else. Once in a while, he'll take a few items to a consignment store to sell so that he can break even on what he puts into parts. It keeps this stuff out of the landfills.

[ljm2002]

29. I like it...

...4 R's instead of 3: Reduce, Reuse, Repair, Recycle.

[Jesus Malverde]

20. The 3D printer revolution is on it's way.

shipping a piece of plastic, made in a no environmental controls Chinese factory. or downloading and printing it at home or the local 3d printer specialist. Maintaining an expensive inventory of parts or creating them as needed. There are tons of benefits to the technology.

It will put people out of work, so will the coming robotic revolution. Millions of jobs will be lost. the genie is out, the bottle is broken.

[Skidmore]

23. I view plastics as noxious polluting compounds.

I don't care how much energy you save by printing this junk at home, plastic crap is still something that is a blight on the world.

BTW, what do you see happening to the lives of all those people who are displaced by this technology, particularly if the technology becomes an expensive piece of equipment in the home? How is this sustainable? Do people just service the machine?

[Jesus Malverde]

25. Container shipping fueled by bunker oil might be a bigger blight.

Making things out of wood and or metals have their own environmental problems.

[bettyellen]

30. I know a big town and multinational business that both fake recycle- green building is for tax $

[underpants]

31. +

[Bosonic]

34. Chinese company uses 3D printing to build 10 houses in a day

Chinese company uses 3D printing to build 10 houses in a day

This small home may look plain, but it represents a significant achievement in rapid construction. A Chinese company has demonstrated the capabilities of its giant 3D printer by rapidly constructing 10 houses in less than 24 hours. Built from predominantly recycled materials, these homes cost less than US$5,000 and could be rolled out en masse to ease housing crises in developing countries.

If you’ve been to a major city in China recently, you’ll have noticed a theme. Construction is absolutely rampant, with skyscraper after skyscraper going up as cities scramble to deal with a massive population that’s urbanizing at an unprecedented rate.

Outside the major urban centers, there’s still a vast need for quick, cheap housing, and Suzhou-based construction materials firm Winsun has stepped forward with a very impressive demonstration of rapid construction by using 3D printing techniques to build 10 small houses in 24 hours using predominantly recycled materials.

Rather than printing the homes in one go, Winsun’s 3D printer creates building blocks by layering up a cement/glass mix in structural patterns (watch the process here). The diagonally reinforced print pattern leaves plenty of air gaps to act as insulation. These blocks are printed in a central factory and rapidly assembled on site.

http://www.gizmag.com/china-winsun-3d-printed-house/31757/

[DireStrike]

36. That it will "Put people out of work" is a problem with politics, not technology.

In Capitalism, you are forced to scrounge for a "job" that some rich person has decided is useful to them, so that you can eat.

Imagine if people being put out of work was taken as the mark of progress that it should be! Everyone should be out of work. Work was only seen as noble because it was necessary and helpful to society. How many people can say that about their jobs today?

The technology may not be 100%, but we are getting there, slowly but surely.

Don't demand jobs - demand freedom.

[Skidmore]

37. Still need income though.

In Makers and Takers World, freedom is only a buzzword.

[Jesus Malverde]

41. Agreed, there is no stopping tech.

[Adrahil]

42. At my local university...

... A technology prof is experimenting with recycling plastic in 3d printing filament