This hilarious graph of Netflix speeds shows the importance of net neutrality

[Ichingcarpenter]

Since Netflix gave into Comcast’s demands for payment in exchange for a promise to deliver movies smoothly over the Internet to Netflix’s customers, speeds on Comcast for Netflix users have rocketed upward. Speeds on the larger service providers have been decreasing steadily since last fall, but following the deal, Comcast restored all the speed that Netflix had lost and much more in the space of a couple of months. Netflix might also have to pay Verizon and AT&T a similar fee to ensure that its customers enjoy reasonable speeds when they are watching films. Presumably, Netflix would eventually pass those fees on to its subscribers in the form of higher rates.


As the Federal Communications Commission considers new rules on whether service providers can charge popular Web sites additional fees to carry their traffic, advocates for consumers worry that deals like Netflix’s with Comcast will become common throughout the industry.








The graph above is by The Washington Post’s Christopher Ingraham. The data are from Netflix.


http://knowmore.washingtonpost.com/2014/04/25/this-hilarious-graph-of-netflix-speeds-shows-the-importance-of-net-neutrality/

[txwhitedove]

1. Well that explains why I could barely connect to Netflix last fall! I hate Comcast/Xfinity. Plan

to buy HD Antennae and cut cable this spring. Netflix is awesome and I can get favorite current TV shows like The Walking Dead on Amazon Prime.

[2banon]

28. I quit cable and satellite three or four years ago. Use a digital antenna picked up from radio shack

I can receive about 32 or so channels, only a few I frequently watch anyway. 3 local PBS stations, local abc, nbc, and fox. Interesting local fox station bears no resemblance to the cable version whatsoever. Not a shred. Which is telling. Probably impossible to survive San Francisco Bar Area demographics, but even so...

Point is, I haven't missed it at all. I think it would be an important act of citizenship to quit cable/sat completely. though to be honest, my budget force the issue. the exorbitant cable and sat fees put it in the "unnecessary expense" category. But now, if suddenly I was able to afford I would not do so as an act of protest - boycotting Cable industry gives me satisfaction on several different levels. Right wing Propaganda 24/7/365 on every single "news" channel, (yes, definitely including MSNBC) and 5000 sports/shopping channels etc etc. Being forced into these ridiculous plans and still refusing to provide a low cost 'a la carte' .

Really wish there was a "critical mass" boycott of this industry, on principle. But it's not even a blip on anyones list of concerns. Oh well, just another undesirable element within the culture we live in.

[txwhitedove]

47. My budget is forcing the issue too, and I warned the kids that it's about to happen. Comcast raised

rates repeatedly until my economy internet and low level HD channels went to $110/month. I get news from DU and other internet sites so don't mind boosting internet.

[2banon]

55. exactly. that' ole $19.99 turns into over a $100 a month in no time...n/t

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

2. "Presumably, Netflix would eventually pass those fees on to its subscribers..."

They are. Netflix is raising prices by a dollar or two for new subscriptions in a month or so

Netflix is going to raise prices for new customers

[dixiegrrrrl]

7. And Comcast will charge users by how much bandwidth they use.

So I am sure Comcast does not mind speeding up all the streaming, since they can charge more.

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

16. Comcast's 250gb/month data cap makes streaming videos in HD a risky endeavor.

You max out the cap quickly, and with more and more services going to "Stream only", this is a perfect storm for Comcast/Cox/GreedyCableCompany to rake in millions.

[lostincalifornia]

26. Actually comcast.com got rid of its data caps some time ago

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

42. Not according to their website:

http://customer.comcast.com/help-and-support/internet/common-questions-excessive-use/

http://customer.comcast.com/help-and-support/internet/data-usage-what-are-the-different-plans-launching

Comcast already has a deal with Microsoft so any Xfinity streams via an XBox on their network will not go against the customer's data package.

[lostincalifornia]

43. They do not have data caps in San Jose, California, as of now, and when I spoke with them a few days

ago, of course customer reps don't necessarily have up to date information. They said except in Arizona they knew of no other cities that have data caps.

Obviously, your link runs counter to that

Thanks

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

44. Yeah...it looks like they're going to "roll out" these caps eventually.

Glad to know it's not overtaken the entire service yet. In St. Paul, MN, it's Comcast or...nothing, really.

[lostincalifornia]

46. That is the problem with monopolies. I am surprised that Uverse isn't in St. Paul, though they have

data caps also.

That is why I am really cheering for Aero and Google Fiber to succeed

Because of T-Mobile, there is starting to be some movement in the cell phone industry

[FarCenter]

48. Aero isn't in distribution networks. It delivers via other ISPs. Google Fiber is a distribution net.

[lostincalifornia]

50. Right about aero I was mixing metaphors, my point was that there

Is too much communication in a few selected companies

Heck google is another giant

[FarCenter]

52. To connect up a few million homes at a couple thousand per home means you have to be big.

Plus, getting franchises, construction permits, environmental studies, and the other regulatory relief to actually build out a distribution network is a complex and demanding job.

[lostincalifornia]

54. sure it is, which is why it should be regulated

[Hong Kong Cavalier]

49. The city applied to be a test market for Google Fiber.

We can't eve get Verizon FiOS.

[rhett o rick]

11. And Comcast will sell their streaming for less. Eventually Netflix will sell out

to Comcast and the rates will go much higher. This is what the Libertarians mistakenly call the free market.

[L0oniX]

3. I'm going back to dial up BBS.

[TroglodyteScholar]

19. Amen

Been a while since I telnetted into Helsinki.

[L0oniX]

21. Watch out for them port sniffers.

[DirkGently]

4. It is a little ironic Netflix got "throttled."

I remember when Netflix got caught deliberately delaying sending out new discs to people by routing them through distant hubs. If you turned your movies around too quickly, you were costing them money, and "mail delays" were the solution.

But of course we're all going to get throttled now.

[Auggie]

14. Netflix still throttles

I have a mail plan for my parents. It's not as bad as years before, but they still do it.

[NuclearDem]

5. 10%...15%...20%....22%...23%...24%....25%....25%...25%...

"Netflix is having trouble playing this title right now."

[snot]

6. Useful; but the least of my worries.

I'm a lot more concerned about access to Democracy Now et al.

[Ichingcarpenter]

8. X Comcast attorney is on the FCC

The backgrounds of the new FCC staff have not been reported until now.

Take Daniel Alvarez, an attorney who has long represented Comcast through the law firm Willkie Farr & Gallagher LLP. In 2010, Alvarez wrote a letter to the FCC on behalf of Comcast protesting net neutrality rules, arguing that regulators failed to appreciate “socially beneficial discrimination.” The proposed rules, Alvarez wrote in the letter co-authored with a top Comcast lobbyist named Joe Waz, should be reconsidered.

Today, someone in Comcast’s Philadelphia headquarters is probably smiling. Alvarez is now on the other side, working among a small group of legal advisors hired directly under Tom Wheeler, the new FCC Commissioner who began his job in November.

As soon as Wheeler came into office, he also announced the hiring of former Ambassador Philip Verveer as his senior counselor. A records request reveals that Verveer also worked for Comcast in the last year. In addition, he was retained by two industry groups that have worked to block net neutrality, the Wireless Association (CTIA) and the National Cable and Telecommunications Association.

In February, Matthew DelNero was brought into the agency to work specifically on net neutrality. DelNero has previously worked as an attorney for TDS Telecom, an Internet service provider that has lobbied on net neutrality, according to filings.

Around the time of Delnero’s hiring, FCC Commissioner Ajit Pai, a former associate general counsel at Verizon, announced a new advisor by the name of Brendan Carr. Pai, a Republican, has criticized the open Internet regulations, calling them a “problem in search of a solution.” It should be of little surprise that Carr, Pai’s new legal hand, has worked for years as an attorney to AT&T, CenturyLink, Verizon, and the U.S. Telecom Association, a trade group that has waged war in Washington against net neutrality since 2006. A trail of online documents show that Carr worked specifically to monitor net neutrality regulations on behalf of some of his industry clients.


http://www.vice.com/read/former-comcast-and-verizon-attorneys-now-manage-the-fcc-and-are-about-to-kill-the-internet

[snot]

9. Would someone pls tell Obama,

it's not a "team of rivals" if only 1% of his team actually represents the interests of the 99%?

[bobduca]

17. No he's hiring rivals from each industry not party.

We just were not clear on what teams he was picking from, we assumed he meant the Republican and Democratic teams.

He meant he'd hire rivals from the comcast and time-warner teams.

[jtuck004]

23. He knows that better than many of us, I expect. n/t

[Enthusiast]

57. +1 an entire shit load.

[blackspade]

20. So fucking corrupt it's sickening.....

[Enthusiast]

58. It's corruption from sea to shining sea.

I hope you don't mind.

[MohRokTah]

35. Although your response is factual, it has exactly NOTHING to do with the graph...

in the OP.

[Ichingcarpenter]

38. It involves Comcast and its my thread

so there!!!!........LOL

[MohRokTah]

40. The graph has nothing to do with Net Neutrality in the first place.

So there.

[MohRokTah]

10. The issue with Netflix is peering between Comcast and the tier 1 providers.

Netflix located it's content delivery servers in data centers connected via peer 1 providers so when Netflix started exploding with streaming to Comcast, Comcast started not delivering enough of it's content to the tier 1 providers thus blowing up the peering agreement forcing Comcast to pay more money to those providers.

The solution, which is perfectly acceptable in my mind, was for Comcast and Netflix to come to an agreement to place a boatload of Netflix Content Delivery systems in data centers serviced by Comcast. This pushed much of the traffic from Comcast to many of the tier 1 providers, thus evening out the mutal agreement. And yes, Comcast not only saved money on the deal, but is making money as well.

This is perfectly acceptable because certain content blows up the peering agreements. The better solution in the end is to regulate cable broadband providers identically to the old telephony providers. Comcast doesn't want this, but screw that. It's all the same thing regardless of how that last mile is delivered.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

25. You sound like you know what you're talking about; could you explain that in layman's terms, please?

[MohRokTah]

29. Not really, but this guy on DK does an outstanding job of explaining it

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/04/25/1294666/-Everyday-Magic-A-Complete-Look-at-Comcast-Netflix-Net-Neutrality

[rhett o rick]

12. k&r thanks for posting. Looks like "net neutrality" is another subject boycotted by

some here.

[MohRokTah]

34. If the graph pointed out in the OP was about Net Neutrality, you'd see a lot more tech savvy people

posting in this thread.

[rhett o rick]

36. My point is that there is a very vocal group here boycotting net neutrality threads.

Either they dont support net neutrality or they think this issue could look badly for the President. Just sayin.

[MohRokTah]

37. I doubt that.

I nearly trashed this thread because the presentation that the Netflix traffic throttling was somehow related to net neutrality and not due to arcane peering arrangements that lead to massive streaming content providers breaking how the internet originally functioned. Instead I showed up to point out the factual errors and link to a DailyKos Diary where the diarist who is obviously knowledgeable on the subject was also quite capable of explaining it in layman's terms in a way I'll never be capable of doing.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/04/25/1294666/-Everyday-Magic-A-Complete-Look-at-Comcast-Netflix-Net-Neutrality

[djean111]

45. To be fair, I was told to get my head out of my ass when I criticized the ruling.

And was admonished that NO ONE would support a tiered system.
Shrugged and snickeredat the low-class tastelessness. But so much shit comes out of Washington these days I was hoping that my head was indeed up my ass, because that would explain a lot. But, alas, really crapola like net neutrality loss, TPP, etc. is what I am seeing.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

13. business scams. business scams...

As far as the eye can see.

[Sunlei]

15. my Verizon DSL has been HORRIBLE slow with Netflix lately, especially if I have google logged on.

I have dumped google + and will never 'logon' to google again because they constantly track & share anything they can sell- but......

Verizon should stop trying to profit from consumers by 'filtering the internet' so they can charge people different rates & there would not be a problem with streaming Netflix.


I wish the USA had free, Gov. provided, & everywhere internet, like so many other countries have!

Then companies like Verizon can pay us Americans, to use OUR, Gov. provided internet.

[Jamastiene]

18. Not really such a hilarious graph when it's real, though, is it?

K&R

[MohRokTah]

30. Not really related to Net Neutrality, though. It's due to peering agreements between Comcast and...

the tier 1 providers.

Read this link from DK to understand what's really going on:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/04/25/1294666/-Everyday-Magic-A-Complete-Look-at-Comcast-Netflix-Net-Neutrality

[KeepItReal]

22. I've seen this firsthand. Comcast extortion.

Netflix was perfectly fine, then started having degraded performance. After Netflix signed that compensation agreement.... Works swimmingly now.

[MohRokTah]

31. NOT Comcast extortion. COGENT Extortion

Read this:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/04/25/1294666/-Everyday-Magic-A-Complete-Look-at-Comcast-Netflix-Net-Neutrality

[ThoughtCriminal]

24. I would like to see the same chart for other content providers

over the same period. The price is likely not just higher fees to consumers, but also a decline in service for everybody who did not pay. That gain for Netfix didn't come from magic cables.

[MohRokTah]

32. You'd be wrong.

Seriously, this is not exclusive to Netflix, it's exclusive to Tier 1 providers which affected all content delivered by those providers going through Comcast's network.

See the link I provided above. This is about peering, not net neutrality. The solution, though, is not the FCC proposal, but a regulatory solution where all ISPs are treated as common carriers.

[FarCenter]

27. This is all about network peering arrangements

Netflix stopped using the Akamai content distribution network (CDN) and built its own CDN called Open Connect. This offers "free peering" to ISPs at a number of points, mainly hosting data centers of Equinix and Level 3 Communications. Of course, "free peering" is not a good deal for the ISPs, who then carry mainly downstream video traffic to their customers. So the ISPs want Netflix to pay for the ISPs running connections to the Open Connect data centers and hooking up to Netflix.

It's just a normal peering dispute between content provider, content distribution networks, hosting data centers, backbone ISPs, and local ISPs. They have to connect, but the speeds, distances, direction of traffic, etc. determine how much money changes hands for a given peering arrangement.

It has little or nothing to do with net neutrality, which is about discriminating between different types of traffic, e.g. video, voice, email, file transfer, character data, etc., ...

[MohRokTah]

33. ^^^^^ This is factual. The OP is wrong looking at it from anet neutrality viewpoint.

You'd see the same thing for Amazon services or any other Akamai client's services during the same time period.

[Ichingcarpenter]

39. Call the washington post

and complain.......

[MohRokTah]

41. Christopher Ingraham is an idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about.

Collect the same data from any Akamai client during the same time period and you'd have the same graph.

It's due to peering agreements between tier 1 and tier 2 providers. Cogent, for example, is a tier 1 provider. Comcast is a tier 2 provider. Because Comcast was pulling so much more content from the tier 1 providers due to the massive increase of Netflix and Amazon (as well as others like Youtube) traffic, the arcane peering agreement kicked in because Comcast content was not matching the content delivery to the tier 1 providers as was being pulled in from those tier 1 providers. This resulted in massive payments to the tier 1 providers by Comcast to make up the difference. Had it continued, Comcast would have gone broke.

I hate to say it because I hate to "stick up" for a piss poor company like Comcast, but the fact is the streaming traffic from Netflix, Amazon, and Youtube did, indeed, break part of the internet due to these arcane peering agreements.

The issue is, Comcast is not treated like a standard ISP because it is a cable company. Verizon has the same issue with its massive 4G wireless network. Cable and wireless Internet need to be regulated as common carriers to promote competition from competing ISPs.

What this would do would remove the necessity for the peering agreements, but would force Comcast and Verizon to allow competing ISPs to leverage their infrastructure so you can get the service without the Comcast and Verizon crap. It's like how AT&T may own the infrastructure that delivers landline voice capability to your house, but you can choose another carrier instead of AT&T as your phone company. This bit of regulatory competitiveness has not kept up with the technology as evidenced by how cable delivery or wirless 4G are not regulated the same way.

[merrily]

51. Broadband providers have a lot of incentive to slow down so that people go up a tier or six.

With TV, some bundles are less expensive than others, but, if you want to tighten your belt, you can get 4 commercial networks plus PBS and your local access channels. No matter how limited your selection, you can still watch NBC the same way that a billionaire watches. That is not necessarily how it's going to work with tiers of broadband service. I

[madville]

53. Makes sense

The toll road or ferry charges a semi-truck more money than a motorcycle or a passenger car. Why shouldn't Netflix have to pay extra fees since they are using substantially more bandwidth than others?

[BlindTiresias]

56. This is practcally rent seeking behavior.