Is there a consensus on whether the Muslim religion allows forced conversions?

[pnwmom]

I know there isn't a fixed hierarchy in the religion, but I was wondering if there is some more or less universally accepted teaching that this is wrong.

This is with regard to the Nigerian girls who have supposedly been forced by their captors to convert from Christianity.

I'm wondering why I haven't heard of any Muslims speaking out against this.

[MADem]

1. Their exists a POV that everyone is born Muslim.

I am not saying it is the ONLY POV, but there are elements that believe that the natural state of a person is to be born as a Muslim, and anyone who follows a differing "brand" is, while a person of The Book, a follower of the God of Ibrahim (aka Abraham), somehow misguided.

As you noted, there is not only no fixed hierarchy, there's plenty of creative interpretation when it comes to Islam. Some branches are completely unrecognizable to others, save the basic "holiday" structure, directing prayers towards Meccah, and events like the Hajj.

[Hekate]

2. It feels like we're in a period of medievalism, such as Christianity went through for some centuries

Not everyone falls into this category, of course, because Islam and Muslims are quite capable of being modern and tolerant -- so it's not the religion so much as who's interpreting it.

No idea how this is going to work out, or how long it will take.

[Chan790]

3. No consensus, but "Yes. Islamic law as applied in many countries allows forced conversion."

Forced conversion is most common in Egypt (though formally illegal, enforcement is hard-to-obtain), rural parts of Pakistan and the Middle East. Usually, the punishments are increased taxes for non-Muslims (jizya), only rarely with government sanction do they go so far as incarceration or threat of death.

Generally, Wikipedia isn't all that useful, but this is one topic where their information is both well-cited and thorough.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forced_conversion#Islam_2

[La Lioness Priyanka]

4. have you actually tried to find out how many muslim clerics routinely

speak out against Boko Haram??? in nigeria EVERY SINGLE TIME boko haram does something, mainstream muslim clerics speak out.

if you haven't heard of it, it is your lack of looking into the issue, not the fault of Muslims overall.

[pnwmom]

6. I googled. Please point me to a link where a mainstream cleric spoke out

against the forced conversions.

That was the issue I was addressing in the OP, not the kidnappings themselves. I know that clerics have spoken out against the kidnappings.

[Swede Atlanta]

5. I believe there is a general "acceptance" of forced conversion within Islam

but I believe that is embraced differently in differing parts of the world.

We do need to keep in mind this is part and parcel of Christianity, Islam and Judaism in some respects.

Israel forced conversions after military victories in the Old Testament. Christians forced conversions during the Crusades or during the Inquisition (especially of Jews in Spain).

So this idea of forcing conversions is nothing exclusive of Islam.

It is a symptom of a religion that has a superiority/anti-tolerance complex. When any religion believes they are the only way to salvation or the only way to live and has no respect for others this is the outcome.

[pnwmom]

7. This is several hundred years past the time when the other religions were

forcing conversions.

Not much of a comparison.

[LeftyMom]

8. Islam is rather decentralized, there's not really a general consensus about much of anything.

It's a bit like saying "is there a general consensus about baptisms in Protestant Christianity?" in that after a million schisms and shifts in opinion (and without even that minimal degree of centralized organization) there's barely any consensus about what color the sky is, let alone any major theological point.

[CJCRANE]

10. Just found this article on the Daily Beast:

(I googled muslim leaders boko haram).

The Boko Haram Terrorists Are Not ‘Islamic’

Excerpt:

Attention members of the media: Kindly stop referring to the Nigerian terrorist group Boko Haram as “Islamic terrorists,” “Islamists” or anything else involving the word “Islam.” The despicable acts taken by this militant group—from kidnapping schoolgirls to slaughtering people at churches and mosques—have absolutely nothing to do with Islam. In fact, as one well-known Imam told me, the claim by Boko Haram’s leader that its actions are based on Islamic principles is “blasphemy” of the worst kind.

Why do our media continually use terms like “Islamist” or “Islamic radical” to describe people or groups without doing the bare minimum investigation into whether there’s actually a connection between their conduct and Islam? Instead, it appears that the media assume that if the person is Muslim and claims he is acting in accordance the faith, that’s good enough for them. It shouldn’t be.

Here’s some real “breaking news”: Want to know how much of the violent acts committed by Boko Haram are based on Islamic principles? Nothing, nada, niente, rien, or any word you want to use for having no connection.

And this isn’t just my view. It’s what Muslims around the world having been saying for the past week as they have both denounced Boko Haram’s savagery and stated that Boko Haram’s actions are in no way sanctioned or supported by Islamic principles. We heard this from leaders of major American-Muslim organizations who held a press conference last week, as well as from leading clerics in Saudi Arabia, Canada and Nigeria. Hopefully, this ends the claim we hear from those who ask, “Why don’t we see Muslims denounce terrorism?”

Article:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/05/12/the-boko-haram-terrorists-are-not-islamic.html

[riderinthestorm]

17. Classic "no true Scotsman" fallacy with an Islamic twist

If a person says they are Jewish/ Christian/Muslim etc then they are unless there's a central authority like a Pope that says you're outta the faith.

[FarCenter]

11. On the other hand, conversion from Islam to Christianity may be punishable by death

It depends on the country and the degree of fundamentalism in power.

[951-Riverside]

12. I read somewhere that Arab Muslims don't look at Black African Muslims as equals

or even true Muslims which might explain why we've never seen Black Africans fighting alongside Arab fighters in Syria, Egypt or Iraq.

[genwah]

13. Is there a consensus about anything in ANY religion?

Pretty much the only consistent thing about God/Gods is that they seem to conveniently hate the same people you hate. God/Gods always agree with you.

[FarCenter]

14. Isn't Roman Catholicism whatever the Pope says it is?

Anything else is an approximation.

[genwah]

18. Not so much or there wouldn't be Nuns on the Bus. As for me, I was Catholic during Vatican II,

and always wondered what happened when the whole "meat on Fridays" thing stopped being a sin. Did millions of Hell's denizens suddenly migrate? For that matter, now that priestly pedophilia is finally unpopular with the Pontiff, are there many of the Heavenly clergy packing their bags?

[Fumesucker]

21. A lot of them really, really loathe atheists

[genwah]

22. Well, yes, but they hate "heretics" even more. There's an old joke that starts...

a man crossing a bridge sees another man starting to climb over the railing. "Hey, wait a minute," the first man says, "what are you doing?"

"I have nothing to live for." the other man says.
First Man (F.M.) "Well, don't take this the wrong way, but I'm a believer, and I think The Lord doesn't approve of suicide."
Second Man (S.M.) "Well, I am a Baptist..."
F.M. "Hey, me too! I'm Southern Baptist, through and through."
S.M. "Really? Me, too. I'm Southern Full Immersion..."
F.M. "Me, too! Are you Left Bank Full Immersion?
S.M. "Absolutely! You know, you're right. As a Jacobean Left Bank, Full Immersion Southern Baptist, suicide is a sin..."
F.M. "Wait, did you say Jacobean? You're not a Mancerian Left Bank Full Immersion Southern Baptist?"
S.M. "Well, no...but..."
F.M. "DIE HERETIC" (AS HE PUSHES THE SECOND MAN OFF THE BRIDGE.

[Cleita]

15. I was taught in school that the followers of Muhammed did convert by

the sword, which is why most of the ME is Muslim whereas it had been largely Christian before. Of course this was Catholic school and they might have been trying to justify the Crusades.

[hunter]

16. Most religions have violent nutjobs forcing "conversion."

Look what happens to homosexual or transsexual kids in fundamentalist Christian households and communities here in the U.S.A..



Modern cosmopolitan religions encourage peaceful coexistence with those following other paths.

[ancianita]

19. Thanks. Wondered, too. Overall, I'd say there's no official teaching that it's wrong.

But teaching may vary with continent, country and mosque, best I can tell without being a Muslim.

Just read reports of three condemnations listed in The Daily Beast.


There's this, a history of action, from wikipedia:

Mughal ruler Aurangzeb cherished the ambition of converting India into a land of Islam. For this, he encouraged forced religious conversions and destroyed thousands of Hindu temples during his reign.[50][51] During Tipu Sultan's invasion of Malabar in the late 18th century, he forcefully converted over 400,000 Hindus to Islam.[52][53][54] During the Moplah Riots of 1921 in Kerala, Muslim Mappilas forcibly converted thousands of Hindus to Islam[55] and killed all those who refused to apostatise.[56] During the Noakhali genocide of Hindus in 1946, several thousand Hindus were forcibly converted to Islam by Muslim mobs.[57][58]

In Bangladesh, the International Crimes Tribunal tried and convicted several leaders of the Islamic Razakar militias, as well as Bangladesh Jamaat-e-Islami (Delwar Hossain Sayeedi), of war crimes committed against Hindus during the 1971 Bangladesh atrocities. The charges included forced conversion of Bengali Hindus to Islam.[59] In the 1998 Prankote massacre, 26 Kashmiri Hindus were beheaded by Islamist militants after their denial of converting into Islam. The militants struck when the villagers refused demands from the gunmen to convert to Islam and prove their conversion by eating beef.[60]

There's some official quoting: http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Qur'an,_Hadith_and_Scholars:Forced_Conversion

Ashhab said that children are considered to have the din of those who captured them. If they refuse that, they are compelled to become Muslim. Children have no din and that is why they are compelled to enter Islam so that they do not go to a false din. When other types of unbelievers pay the jizya, they are forced to become Muslim, whether they are Arabs or non-Arabs, Quraysh or otherwise. This will be dealt with in Surat at-Tawba.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

20. No, absolutely no such consensus exists.

It is very easy to find Muslims on either side of the issue.

A more interesting question, to which I do not know the answer, is "what fraction of Muslims are on each side?".