Just home from putting a young man on a bus.

[redwitch]

He is on his way to be homeless in a small NE city. Showed up at our front door two days ago, hadn't seen him in 12 years, he is 27 and was a childhood friend of our son. I'll call him John Doe. Within 24 hours of his being here we had found him a summer job at a retreat center, he could stay with us but there were a few rules. The retreat wanted a background check and for him to go to the county social services agency to get hooked up with whatever services they could provide. He decided against that route and wanted to travel on. Mental illness involved, he also asked my husband yesterday morning if he could make himself a vodka tonic. At 10 AM.

We knew it wasn't going to work out and I admit to feeling relief when he told me he wanted to leave. We drove him to a bus stop that would get him to where he was going. Sent him off with a list of shelters, free community lunches, clinic for basic medical and dental, a Subway gift card, small Visa gift card and $40 cash. And a bag of fruit and snacks.

He has been homeless for about a year and a half. Obviously needs mental help but has had opportunities that he has turned down repeatedly. His family gave up on him over a decade ago and I wish with all my heart they had not.

I feel so emotionally drained, I wish we could have done more for him.

[Frustratedlady]

1. Those mental health hospitals that Reagan closed...

should be opened. Perhaps not as many as there were, but more than are available now.

You did what you could, which was more than most people would do. I hope the gesture was enough to turn him down a different path.

[redwitch]

6. He showed up at our door once before when he was 14.

He had run away from home. We fed him ( he was starving, hadn't eaten in 3 days ), and we gave him a bed for the night. Called his parents the next morning and his dad came to get him. After that his parents enrolled him in a high school military academy. He ran away from there, worst place they could have put him. His parents are really cold people and when his illness manifested itself when he hit puberty they got frustrated very quickly.

[Javaman]

9. some people think they are parents but haven't the slightest clue as to what it actually entails.

Poor guy. I hope he finds peace.

[RKP5637]

28. And some people should never be parents ever. They just aren't cut out for it, even if they think

they are, some were victims of bad parenting themselves passing down onto their offspring what they learned.

[Javaman]

60. That's my case.

I knew I didn't have the skills or the patience.

I made that choice years ago.

I knew I would be a crappy dad.

[TBF]

20. I talked about that in another thread on DU and was shut down

by all the third-way dems who want to blame individuals for their behavior.

It is a nightmare that so many services have been cut. The republican meme is to put everything on the individual level & blame individuals for being stupid, lazy, ill, bad etc ... Then society does not have to take responsibility - it is all on the individual.

So very sad that it has come to this in this country.

[Maedhros]

27. Third Way = Reagan Democrats (or, equivalently, Obama Republicans) [n/t]

[valerief]

34. Third Way = 1%er Way. nt

[Maedhros]

45. Among elected officials, yes.

For the rank-and-file, those with Third Way sensibilities are the entitled middle class with the "I got mine, pull yourself up by your bootstraps and get yours" mentality.

[valerief]

57. 1%er wannabes. nt

[villager]

29. Why do we call them "Third Way Dems" when they are clearly "Wrong Way Dems?"

[Maedhros]

46. Marketing. [n/t]

[villager]

47. Which is all they have, since it sure ain't "policy!"

[Maedhros]

50. That's all they need.

Today's Democrats need only be told for whom to vote. Things like "policies" and "ideals" are distractions.

[1StrongBlackMan]

30. Uh ...

neither mental health and safety net funding cuts, nor promoting the personal responsibility narrative, are not 3rd way lines.

[TBF]

40. If that is true then we have too many repugs

signing up on this site. I was being charitable with my accusations.

The "personal responsibility" narrative is a repug meme. Not that democrats do not expect folks to exhibit responsible behavior, but we do understand when there are mitigating factors and that is why we advocate for safety nets.

[1StrongBlackMan]

41. Maybe you could provide a link to a single DUer ...

advocating cuts in mental health spending or social safety net spending. I must have missed that.

[TBF]

43. Did I say that?

[1StrongBlackMan]

54. Well, Yeah ... you did ...

You said:

I talked about that in another thread on DU and was shut down by all the third-way dems who want to blame individuals for their behavior.

And I said:

Uh ... neither mental health and safety net funding cuts, nor promoting the personal responsibility narrative, are not 3rd way lines.

Then you said:

If that is true then we have too many repugs signing up on this site. I was being charitable with my accusations.

That's why I asked for the/a link to DUers doing what you claim.

[Squinch]

42. The imbecilic thing about it is that, as people are experimenting with actually taking care of those

among us who need to be taken care of, they are finding that helping these people is infinitely cheaper than having to deal with the ramifications of what happens to them when they are not taken care of.

Even if you are totally selfish, you just have to support this idea of ramping up public services for the mentally ill -a lot - because the financial benefits for all of us of doing so are huge.

[Nye Bevan]

48. And would you suggest that people like this young man should be forcibly committed

to such a hospital?

There are no quick fixes or easy answers in cases like this.

[Frustratedlady]

51. The OP said there was mental illness involved.

No, I did not say he should be forcibly committed, but it was obvious he could use some help which would possibly require hospitalization of one type or another.

[Rhymes With Orange]

52. I wonder why we're not working on getting them back open. nt

[lumberjack_jeff]

56. Institutions suck. n/t

[seveneyes]

62. How did Reagan close mental institutions without help from Congress?

I don't remember the details from way back then, I do know we had a Democratic Congress. Wouldn't something like closing down mental institutions require an act of Congress?

[Frustratedlady]

63. Supposedly, many "boll weevil" Democrats voted with the Republicans at that time.

Carter had just passed the Mental Health Systems Act a month before the elections, but it was short-lived. This would support the federal programs, but increase state involvement.

The Repugs took over the Senate, (53-46) but the House remained Democratic (243-192).

Reagan was reportedly rather naïve when it came to mental illness and considered mental illness akin to Communism. That's a stretch, but not uncommon for that period of time. Everything was connected to Communism, just as everything is being connected to Hitler/Nazi's and God only knows how many other names/groups in today's politics.

I remember there was a problem around that time where California mental institutes were loading patients in cabs and sending them to bus stations to find their way in the world. That probably sticks in my mind more than the mechanics of Congress at that time.

See http://www.salon.com/2013/09/29/ronald_reagans_shameful_legacy_violence_the_homeless_mental_illness/

[shenmue]

2. Mercy

[djean111]

3. I don't see how you could have done any more for him!

The only other option, as far as I can see, would have been to have him committed to some sort of mental help facility against his will, which might have made his mental condition even worse.
You really did help him as much as humanly possible, you are good people.

[redwitch]

11. I always feel like more could have been done.

But the fact of the matter is the effort had to come from him and he just couldn't do it. We couldn't have had him committed I don't think. And unless there is major support system in place for when he got out we are right back to square one. Just more drained emotionally and financially. We have major financial stress as it is and couldn't afford to add him to our family, we are barely getting by. I haven't slept well the last 2 nights, need to make peace with myself, send him loving thoughts and move forward.

He is so vulnerable and I know there are thousands more like him wandering without the proper tools to do more than survive.

Just getting through the average day deserves a brass band and a big hooray for the average person who doesn't have his problems.


Today is our wedding anniversary. Normally I would make a sumptuous meal ( can't afford to eat out at nice restaurants these days) and buy champagne. I have never felt less like champagne that I do today.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. The problem is the way the system works

These stories are way too common. We really cannot force intervention until these people become a threat to themselves or others in an obvious way.

[Warpy]

5. There was no more you could have done

The cash and Visa will go to alcohol, which he uses to self medicate his mental health issues. Chances are he needs the alcohol and will go into DTs if it's withheld too long. Untreated DTs, which his will be, are 50% fatal.

He's living the way he wants to and is doing the best he can with the illness he has.

You gave him something he doesn't have all that often these days: choices.

You couldn't have done any more because no one will back you up with it. There are no places to put people with mental health problems to dry them out and put them on meds that will actually work because they were shut down in the 60s-80s and the mental health facilities in the community were never funded and failed to materialize.

[redwitch]

7. The cops picked him up early January.

He was walking the streets of Albany, NY in the freezing cold and snow. They took him to a hospital to be checked and he was evaluated, given 3 medications and prescriptions for more. Of course he had no money to pay for the new prescriptions so he was right back to where he started. I commend those officers for getting him to the hospital and then to an emergency shelter.

[Warpy]

12. There were always cracks in the system

but now they've turned into chasms and the mentally ill are the first to fall through them.

A too narrow definition of "harm to oneself or others" is partly to blame. It needs to be widened considerably.

[JNelson6563]

8. You did right by this young man.

Of the many good things you did (and tried to do) making it crystal clear that you CARE about him was probably the most valuable.

Hugs & encouragement my dear!

Julie

[pnwmom]

10. Good for you for trying. There are limits to what anyone can do in this kind of situation,

even for a family. I watched a friend struggle with this for decades, with two of her family members who were mentally ill and drug abusers. What a nightmare.

[ChisolmTrailDem]

13. Redwitch, don't kick yourself, you did what you could do for him. You were a friend to

someone who needed one, even if for a couple of days.

I cannot thank you enough for what you did for him. Unfortunately, you can only do what he allows you to do. I know you will worry about him. We all will. But you did for him what you were allowed to do. Remember that.

[redwitch]

14. Thank you all for the kind words, they are much appreciated.

If he had been able to do the few things he was asked to do I know I could have put a group of friends and neighbors to pull together to do more. That just wasn't possible. I know I will shake this gloom in a bit but right now my heart is very heavy.

Love and light to all who struggle with mental health issues including the people who love them and the good people who dedicate their lives to helping.

[Kaleva]

15. It's very, very hard to get someone commited so they can get the help they need...

My ex has an adult child who needs help but refuses to get any as it his opinion that it's everyone else who is screwed up. If everybody else he knows would get their act together, his life would be fine.

[nilesobek]

16. How could you do any more?

All those years I was wandering homeless I never met a such a nice angel like you. He should have taken the job offer if he was able to do it. I don't know the person so I'm not sure about that because some people are unable to work because of their problems. I know that for about 8 years I was unfit to work any job.

The most difficult part of empathy for me is to actually live with the person. Then you can see some of the problems and issues that led to the situation, and you have to live with it also.

[redwitch]

19. Are you ok now?

I hope you have a place to call home.

It was already a strain by day two, he is not used to living with other people. He woke us up at 2 AM making too much noise 2 rooms away. I am running on empty today, about 4 hours of sleep and that was in small increments.

I don't know if he will ever get the sustained help he needs. It will take a lot for him to find the strength to do his part to get well. With a system so broken I am afraid he will always fall through the cracks. The man who offered the job was so incredibly kind to do it and it would have been basic groundskeeping with all the tools, instruction and supervision he would have needed. An easy and beautiful walk from our house to work. It was so perfect for him, he won't find many situations like that, created in a day and a half. Instant relief from the elements, food to eat, people to watch out for him. It would have probably been a strain for us but we would have made it work because it would have made a real difference in the life of a damaged fellow being. If only. Sigh.

[nilesobek]

22. I'm quite alright now thank you very much.

I ripped and stretched every tendon and ligament in my right leg in a fall in 2005. My wife and I separated, I lost my job and was ambulatory for six months.

I didn't know what to do so I just headed to the woods where at least I could spend my tiny disability check on food instead of landlord rent.

My life was full and is still full of issues like this young man. There has been an incredible amount of drinking going on. I grew up in an abusive household, and have holdover issues there.

The thought occurs to me that I might be manic, and in a long-term manic phase now, because I work 2 jobs and don't seem to need any sleep, and have this ultra determined idea in my head to work until I drop. But I have never had an evaluation or treatment.

This young man has his whole life ahead of him. He just needs a few breaks like the one you tried to give to him.

Sometimes when your homeless its hard to change your MO. It might be why he didn't take the opportunity.

[redwitch]

23. Everyone needs to sleep enough.

If you have a place to get a check up that you can afford please do it. Take care of yourself. I am so sorry the perfect storm of events happened to you.

[nilesobek]

26. You have a beautiful heart.

You can't save the whole world. I hope you get some sleep too.

[redwitch]

31. Thank you. I know I can't save the whole world. :-)

But when someone's pain is in front of me I will do what I can. I have always loved the story of the young girl and the stranded starfish.

A man came upon a young girl rescuing a mound of stranded starfish on the beach. She was throwing them back into the ocean one at a time. "Why are you bothering?" the man asked. "You can't save them all, you won't make any difference". She threw another back in and said "Made a difference to that one."

Redwitch, rescuer of starfish


I have a brother who keeps a baby animal rescue kit in his home and car, just in case he needs to bottle feed some poor little orphaned one. It's just what we were put here to do, you know?

I am going to sleep tonight. Have to. Or I will be walking into walls and no help to anyone including myself.

[nilesobek]

32. I will remember that story the next time

I decide that my efforts at helping others have been futile. She did make a difference with that one.

[FSogol]

37. +1 n/t

[freshwest]

61. I love you, redwitch. That is my view too. One at a time is still good.

[redwitch]

64. How sweet!

I love you too!

[ChisolmTrailDem]

33. "I don't know if he will ever get the sustained help he needs." Thanks to Ronald Reagan:

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/04/timeline-mental-health-america

http://www.sociology.org/content/vol003.004/thomas.html

But also to red states, like Texas, that also cut services to the mentally ill.

[seabeyond]

17. My family has yet to give up on 53 yr old brother and it has cost all us dearly for three decades

No end that I see.

I hear what you are saying. Is there any answers? Your relief? Of course. Gentle to his family, also.

It is hard.

[redwitch]

21. I am sorry to hear that.

At least your family has been doing it together.

[n2doc]

18. America! Land of the Free!

Free to be as ill as you 'want' to be. I understand the problems with the old forced mental health system but we now have gone far too much in the libertarian/survival of the fittest direction.

Thank you for helping him. Maybe at least knowing somebody cares will be a comfort.

[hunter]

24. The skills, coping mechanisms, and reflexes one develops living on the streets...

... make it more difficult to return to a less dangerous lifestyle.

Especially when there is a serious mental illness involved.

It's a vicious circle.

My grandma had a good pension and a house she owned outright but she was still a mentally ill "bag lady" little different than any you might find pushing a shopping cart down a big city street.

After my grandma was removed from her house as a danger to herself and others in a violent confrontation with police and paramedics there were no "assisted living" places, or later nursing homes, who would tolerate her for long, so she'd live with my parents.

I have some ideas for dealing with troublesome people like my grandma, or your son's childhood friend, or even people as I've been in my very worst places, but our society does not seem to have the compassion and generosity required, preferring instead to blame the victim of a mental illness and demanding there can be no such thing as a "free lunch," even for someone who cannot be fully functional in this society.

A single person, or even an entire family, cannot handle a severely disruptive mentally ill person on their own. That's a job for an entire community, an entire society.

You did what you could, redwitch, you did much more than anyone has a right to expect of you. People who have no experience with these situations really have no idea...

[redwitch]

25. You are right about the blame.

We would never expect someone with cancer or MS or any other illness to just pull themselves up or snap out of it. We have to do much better than we are doing somehow.

I am sorry about your grandmother, that must have been so hard on everyone.



P.S. I love "Candles in the Rain".

[Ilsa]

35. His family gave up before he turned 18? Maybe they

Should have tried to establish guardianship if he was that bad off at age 17. And if he was that bad at 17, I would be surprised that there wasn't some other intervening going on before he left the school system.

I dunno, maybe they didn't know what to do to help him. But they must have been poorly equipped to manage his situation to give up on him so early. A coworker has been involved in trying to help a mentally ill family member in their 30's. It is wearing him down to nothing, and he said it is affecting his other sibling more. Sometimes there isn't anything more that family can do without enabling.

[redwitch]

38. His adoptive father is a doctor who worked in hospital administration for decades.

The family structure was always very rigid and mental illness doesn't fit in their narrow comfort zone. I admit I am pissed at them, they should have set up some kind of trust/guardianship ten years ago. He saw them last week, they came back east to go to their daughter's college graduation. They met him at the local Panera and they bought him lunch. That's all they did besides a half hour of stilted conversation. They are very comfortable financially and had resources from dad's work to help him but they did not. Shameful.

[Ilsa]

59. That is quite shameful.

He would have been better off adopted by a poorer family that was committed to him and loved him. I'm shocked that someone didn't take them to task over this ages ago, not that they would listen.

[xchrom]

36. May Peace be with you, him and your family. nt

[redwitch]

39. Thank you.

I hope he is safe tonight and all nights, I hope he utilizes some of the resource info we gave him. Shelter, food, guidance, basic medical care will all be right nearby him there whether he sleeps in a shelter or out in the open. I cannot imagine being in his situation, my family will always be there for me and I for them. We are put here to take care of each other and everything else is just window dressing.

[Squinch]

44. What you did for him was show him that there is a place that is always open for him

when he needs it, where he can stop and catch his breath. Even if he can't see himself staying with you, I am sure that means the world to him.

[Liberal_in_LA]

49. you did a lot

[Demo_Chris]

53. If there was something more you could have done you would have DONE it....

That much seems obvious. You seem like one hell of a good person.

[gwheezie]

55. You did a good thing

Most of my patients are homeless and mentally ill. We find placement in a shelter if they have no funds or in a group home if they have ssd. We hook them up with the local community services board and send them out with a week's worth of meds. There are all kinds of reasons this fails, some have to do with the nature of the illness itself, some has to do with lack of resources, some has to do with lack of money and some has to do with lack of support. Every time one of them come back in the hospital, I am glad to find out they are still alive or not in jail. Right now I'm doing a study to identify the most costly patients we have, find out why their discharge plan didn't work and then when we finish gathering the data, I plan to work with the local community services boards to set up a more aggressive plan for these folks. My gut and 40 years working with the chronic mentally ill tells me more pro active support is lacking. The system is very disconnected between inpatient and outpatient care. In my ideal world there would be one big agency that just addresses mental illness at the community level that takes care of people along the continum of these diseases from fully independent living to involuntary acute inpatient hospitalization that is geered towards the specific community where these folks live. It would include intensive in home supervision, small family structured group homes with a case manager, emergency psych clinic,day programs, supported work programs, minimal paper work to transition from one level of care to another, I could go on and on. Some of these folks really absolutely are never going to be able to work to support themselves, but I would like to see a collaboration between services and employers so that when a person has an exacerbation of their illness they will not lose their job. People are rarely psychotic every day, 365/7. They are rarely depressed or manic 365/7. But if they go to work, they lose their benefits, why not recognize the nature of the disease and let them work when they can. Why can't all their records be available through the continuum of care.
Some of my repeat patients and I work on the simple goals, like "last year I see you made 36 er visits and you were hospitalized 15 times, as a result you lost placement in 3 group homes along with never getting your belongings back and losing whatever friends you had and requiring new outpatient follow up with a new community services board, can we work on a discharge plan that would reduce your hospitalizations,reduce your er visits and keep you in your same housing?"
So to the OP, if all the resources of our mental health system cannot reach this young man, you couldn't either. Many of these folks have been in the system and know it's bullshit. But you did do something this person rarely gets which is respect.

[redwitch]

58. You have an amazing job.

Thank you for your dedication to it. I have friends who are therapists, ministers, psychologists and how you all don't burn out on it is amazing to me. Thank you.