Did Trayvon's family know there was an armed vigilante prowling the streets?

[Hugabear]

I wonder how many people knew there was an armed vigilante roaming their neighborhood. Perhaps if Trayvon's family had known there was a self-appointed "neighborhood watch captain" with a CCW, they might not have let Trayvon walk to the store by himself, and he would still be alive.

IMHO, people should have the right to know if their neighbors are walking around packing firearms. They may have the right to carry them, but we should also be allowed to decide if we feel safe around them.

[99th_Monkey]

1. I heard/saw some Neighborhood Watch specialists saying

that it is NEVER ok for a person on "watch" to be carrying firearms -- NEVER.

[DallasNE]

23. "These a$$holes, they always get away"

To Zimmerman the only way to stop this is with a bullet. Zimmerman told the police Martin said "you got me" right after Zimmerman shot him, confirming he didn't get away. (Funny how all the background sound on the 911 call went silent as soon at the shot was fired).

Oh, and the dispatcher asked Zimmerman if he was following Martin and when he said "yeah" the dispatcher told Zimmerman "you don't need to do that" so Zimmerman was rogue and not following any of the standard procedures for a neighborhood watch person.

Do neighborhood watch people get any training and what happens when they don't follow the training guidelines. Something tells me that 40 some calls over the last couple of years also violates the guidelines. Zimmerman should have been relieved of his duties a long time ago for cause. Hopefully, this issue will be looked into in detail so rogue people like Zimmerman can be removed long before they can create a nightmare.

[99th_Monkey]

27. "Oh, hi George!"

is how 911 dispatch operator greeted Zimmerman's call.

before she told him "you don't need to do that".

So many odd pieces to this story.

[Fawke Em]

31. Huh?

The dispatcher was a "he."

[99th_Monkey]

32. my bad - I must have just seen a transcript.

and i do generally associate that job with females for whatever reason.

thanks for straightening me out on this.

[Initech]

2. I'm starting to think that might not be a bad idea.

If you have a CCW permit we should know about it. If you're a twice convinced felon like Zimmerman *AND* have a CCW permit - you bet your ass we should have a right to know about it!

[Hugabear]

3. Exactly

We should have the right to know who has CCW

[niyad]

4. I believe he was never convicted--all cases closed.

[Life Long Dem]

17. Some are just making up new laws as they go.

He's a "convinced felon".

[csziggy]

19. Here's the interesting thing - Concealed carry is one of the FEW Florida records

NOT covered by the Sunshine laws - you CANNOT find out if a particular person has a CCW permit.

[Initech]

24. That *IS* interesting. Why are we not allowed to find out who has a CCW permit or not?

And if Zimmerman was a member of the neighborhood watch association - that is something we should know about. I've been saying this since it happened but he basically had a free pass to declare himself judge, jury, and executioner - and he's a *suspected* felon who has a history of assaulting police officers - what the fuck did you think was going to happen? He's basically LYING HIS ASS OFF about this whole ordeal that he murdered an innocent teenager, this whole thing is just so fucked up.

[99th_Monkey]

28. I think the operative phrase here is "self-appointed" neighborhood watch "volunteer"

God, some M$M outlets tout him as being a neighborhood watch "captain", without
missing a beat.

But the more reliable sources generally referred to him as "self-appointed", which
should be a HUGE concern here. the word "rogue" comes to mind.

[jaysunb]

5. They'll all know pretty soon...when the HOA is named in the suit.

Trust me...it will be coming very soon.

[EFerrari]

6. I wonder if the Homeowner's association knew that he'd been fired from his job

as a bouncer because he behaved worse than the drunks he was supposed to be watching.

[Ecumenist]

7. Exactly....if you want to join N.W. and you're a gun nut, I don't think that you ahould be allowed

to join, to say the least and Hell yes, if his parents had known that this nut was roaming the streets of the neighborhood, I doubt that his father would have let them even play outside, let lone walk unescorted in the neighborhood.

[Hugabear]

8. Zimmerman didn't join the N.W. He appointed himself.

Zimmerman was so anxious to harass suspicious black men, that he appointed himself as the neighborhood watch. With his gun, of course.

[Ecumenist]

10. I know but I'm saying that if someone has CCW, THEY SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO JOIN N.W. unless they

check in that firearm in a secured location WITH CONFIRMATION that that gun isn't on the Watch with them.

[dionysus]

15. i don't get the concealed weapons thing. if i lived in really dangerous place, i can see getting one

but i don't live in a really dangerous place, nor do i want to. zimmerman, lived in a gated community, most definately not a dangerous place.

what's even worse is open carry.

i went was in a diner last year, and this freeper type with a 45 in a belt holster walks in and sits down. i dont know if it is legal to open caryy in wetsern new york, but no one there was asking a word. everyone is like ""wtf is a guy with a gun doing here"

[Ecumenist]

18. I know what you mean, Now, he's actually going to get a CCW BECAUSE Bof the business he's starting

that requires him to carry large sums of money and meet with prospective clients doing test drives of cars. There've been several people kidnapped and even murdered here doing just that but you won't ever see him carrying in regular situations. Certainly not into our local diner.

Arizona has an open carry law and nuts wear guns in stores, etc. Talk about crazy.

[Major Nikon]

21. Open carry is not worse

People who carry a concealed weapon know they have an insurance policy such that if they start to get their ass kicked, they can pull out their 'equalizer' and blow the other person away. That's exactly what happened with Zimmerman. Had he not been carrying a gun, there's no way he would have followed Martin in the first place.

[JDPriestly]

22. I share that opinion, Major Nikon.

Having a weapon emboldens people who are by nature aggressive to be even more aggressive. The weapon itself has a power for them.

That is great if you are hunting for your food.

But, unless a person hunts animals for sport or food, a gun is only good to hurt or kill another person. The shooting may actually be in self-defense, but sometimes it really isn't.

A shooting of an intruder into a home may frequently be real self-defense. But how often are people shot in actual self-defense outside a home? Is it really that common? Other than, of course police officers.

[Major Nikon]

25. When enough people have guns readily available all the time, inevitably they use them

The gun nuts will always point out that the majority of those who carry guns do so responsibly. That's all well and good, but the ones who don't manage to kill people and cause serious injuries. There's simply no statistics to support that concealed carry laws have any impact on crime. So for zero benefit we get a negative impact, and for those who get loved ones killed, they just get dead friends and relatives. With the shoot first laws they can't even sue and those who shoot can't be prosecuted. Zimmerman is not the only moran walking around with a concealed gun. He just so happens to be the one in the news right now.

[Hoyt]

9. Lots of your neighbours carry guns, whether or not in neighborhood watch.

Well not sure about yours-- but on average.

[Ecumenist]

11. My husband is a gun owner BUT he DOES NOT CARRY THAT GUN on the street!

My point is that CCW does not jibe with N.W.

[Hoyt]

12. I wish more gun owners were truly responsible like your husband.

[EFerrari]

13. The point is, Neighborhood Watch isn't supposed to pack, let alone, shoot. nt

[shraby]

14. Yes, and from what I understand they aren't even to engage but to call the

police if they see something.

[TorchTheWitch]

16. what I'm hearing from the legal experts on this is that

A regular CCW isn't enough when one is carrying in the capacity of a security person (whether that's a paid security guard or "watch" volunteer or whatever) and that some other higher level permit is required which Zimmerman didn't have. I have no idea if this is just for the state of Florida or if this is some kind of federal thing or what.

As I understand it, anyone that is a volunteer within the national Neighborhood Watch program isn't allowed to carry ANY kind of weapon be it a gun, pepper spray, knife, crowbar or whatever.

[HooptieWagon]

20. The HOA is heavily liable

And im guessing their insirance only covers board members and paid employees like maintenence.

[Major Nikon]

26. Maybe not

The HOA may not have had any way to prohibit dipshits like Zimmerman from carrying a weapon.

[HooptieWagon]

29. Sure they could.

An injuction or restraning order. Since there were complaints about Zimmys overzealousness and harassment by residents to the HOA, and apparently no background check of Zimmy by the HOA (which would have turned up his arrest record, anger management issues, and ccw permit), the HOA is liable for permitting the menace to patrol the community under their sanction.

[Ruby the Liberal]

30. Could be a nice compliment to SYG/Castle laws

A national gun registry.