What the h3ll is wrong with this country??????

[shraby]

I see other countries all over the world take in refugees when things go south in their own country and feed and shelter them sometimes for several years...and this country can't feed and shelter some children?

I'm totally ashamed of the United States, particularly Texas and other states trying to round up some "protection" from the children.

The whole world is watching the meanness, and it isn't pretty.

[itsrobert]

1. What countries are those?

thanks

[shraby]

3. Thailand took in Cambodians; Pakistan took in Afghans; Turkey took in

Iraqis, the list is long if one wants to look.
We can't even take in children without calling out the Guardsmen to protect the mighty Texan.

[itsrobert]

4. Weren't those countries taking in people from countries that border them?

And in many cases the United States was running food aid and supplies during those trouble times. For example, I have served in many military humanitarian operations such as running food down to Turkey.

Operation Provide Comfort. Operation Support Hope.

I also deployed down to Uganda where United States was leading the supply for people fleeing Rwanda.

[shraby]

5. The other countries between where they are coming from and here aren't

a whole hell of a lot safer. European countries take in refugees too and those refugees don't have a common border with the refugee...they ask for asylum and are often granted it.
Children are asking for asylum right now. Like I said,
I'M ASHAMED OF OUR COUNTRY.

[itsrobert]

7. What European countries are those?

I was stationed in England and the Netheralands, and Greece. I don't remember any Europeans taking in a lot of refugees. In fact, there was and is a backlash to refugees in Europe.

[Quantess]

25. Several european countries take in more asylum seekers, per capita,

than the USA. I can get you a source, if you don't mind waiting.

Here is one link that shows USA down at #68
http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/stats/People/Migration/Refugee-population-by-country-or-territory-of-asylum/Per-capita

[Quantess]

26. .

http://www.thelocal.se/20140324/sweden-leads-eu-in-asylum-approvals

Here is a pdf, but it's a lot of good information on the 2nd page https://www.tagesschau.de/ausland/unhcr108.pdf

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/07/05/world/asia/refugees-asylum-statistics/

[sabrina 1]

42. European countries who are members of the EU MUST take in

refugees and people from other countries. Ireland eg, has increased its population 10% of which is foreign, from many parts of the world. AND those 'aliens' as we call them here, can vote and take advantage of the Social Programs there.

Britain also has a huge population of 'aliens' from all over the world.

Not to mention Jordan and Syria, which took in over 4 million Iraqis fleeing the US invasion there.

You need to learn more about Europe and the EU. Google London on this topic eg.

[brush]

48. What is your point?

Are you against taking in these children?

This country was built by immigrants from distant lands that don't border the US.

It's shameful, ugly and unhumanitarian how these "border security" people are acting.

Are you siding with them?

[cui bono]

50. What difference does it make whether the country borders the other? n/t

[yeoman6987]

16. Good luck trying to get into New Zealand or Australia as an illegal or become a citizen. Very hard!

Oh for that matter, try getting into Mexico illegally and see what happens. You should be very thankful to be living in the United States. Seriously, I know you are just venting and spouting your annoyance but really we are a great country that has spent trillions of assisting other countries million times over. New Zealand has extremely strict requirements to become a citizen of that country. We don't have hardly any.

[shraby]

22. I've been a citizen of this country since I was born. My family helped

settle this county, came here in the mid 1600s. 23 of them fought in the Revolutionary war.
This country is no longer the one they helped build. I don't even recognize it anymore as the one I grew up in.
I will say it again I'M ASHAMED OF MY COUNTRY'S REACTION TO SOME CHILDREN SEEKING ASYLUM.

I don't care what Australia's and New Zealand's laws are. I'm concerned about our own.
In the 1960s Australia was paying air/ship fare to people if they would go there to work..I thought about it at the time since I was just out of school and thought it might be an interesting thing to do. Changed my mind and stayed here.

[yeoman6987]

23. You certainly can feel that way

Thankfully we still have the first amendment.

[Mopar151]

40. Very hard to get a work visa here without an "in demand" tech job lined up

Tourist visas "time out". I know an expat Aussie who had to move bact to OZ. (No loss there...)

[madamesilverspurs]

2. Recommending

a high colonic, starting with Texas.

[maced666]

24. Or, to set example-start with your home?

Lead by example, always makes ones words more meaningful. Otherwise it's just a bunch of meaningless, counter-productive chatter.

[madamesilverspurs]

27. Been there done that, thanks.

Next?

[IrishAyes]

41. I'd bet my own life that a lot of people who try to slam us with that kind of challenge

have never stepped up to the plate themselves. Doncha just love it when they accuse us of all sorts of perfidy even though they have absolutely NO KNOWLEDGE of our past? But it seems okay to them to cast baseless accusations even so. Where it gets most weird is when they expect others to listen to them; they said so, and that MAKES it so!

[sabrina 1]

43. Two people in this thread have already proved you wrong. We

have taken in people in our home also. People are people. I don't know your background, so I won't bet, but I'll guess that, unless you are Native American, your own ancestors once faced the kind of unacceptance these refugees are facing here today. Certainly most Americans' ancestors did, because no one who is not Native American was not an 'alien' at some point.

[shraby]

30. Been there done that too.

[shraby]

11. The U.S. has been most of the problem for some of the Central American

countries...hasn't it Reaganites?

[Fred Sanders]

8. Children as determined as these will make great citizens, keep the children, deport the racists.

[Jamastiene]

33. That sounds like a good idea.

I could go for that.

[WillyT]

9. K & R !!!

[Puzzledtraveller]

10. Not really.

The idea that "other" countries are more welcoming is not based in reality.

[itsrobert]

12. Correct -- "France rejects four out of five asylum seekers"

France turned down 83 percent of asylum cases last year - a far higher rate than other European countries, new figures revealed this week. Asylum-seeker rights groups in France have expressed their concern.

In 2013 France looked at 61,455 asylum cases but only granted protection to 10,470 of those seeking sanctuary in the country, according to new figures from the EU’s Eurostat agency released on Monday. Msot of those were granted refugee status, with a small number given a lesser "subsidiary protection".

That’s an acceptance rate of just 17 percent, which compares unfavourably with the Europe-wide average of 34 percent for first-instance decisions, which asylum seekers have the chance of overturning on appeal.

http://www.thelocal.fr/20140324/france-asylum-refugee-rejects-four-out-of-five-asylum-seekers

[shraby]

15. France granting asylum to 10,000 is nothing to sneeze at.

They were asked and helped out. I'm sure they didn't try to put guns to the asylum seekers heads.

[itsrobert]

18. The United States grants asylum to 8 times that of France

http://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/refugees-and-asylees-united-states


80,000 plus is something to sneeze at?

[Quantess]

29. self delete

[whistler162]

59. Remember the number 1 rule of many

no matter what the USA does the USA is bad!

[shraby]

13. I can see the tent cities that sprout up from time to time when necessary

They may not welcome the intrusion, but they tolerate it and the world community sends help when it's asked for.

[itsrobert]

14. Yes, led by the United States

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2011/aug/19/humanitarian-development-data

by far, the United States lead in Humanitarian Aid

Nobody else is close.

[shraby]

17. Apparently unless the need is in the United States, then we have

people exactly like Gov. Perry and the boneheads yelling for more guns on the border.

[itsrobert]

19. 80,000 a year refugees and asylees to the US.

http://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/refugees-and-asylees-united-states

[Uncle Joe]

32. That figure of 80,000 is down 65% from the 1980 level of 231,700, this precipitous drop was

initiated by the Reagan Administration.

Less than 5500 are allowed in from Latin America, this would be the same region that saw Reagan work to undermine democratically elected governments while supporting abusive dictators, and this area of the world also experienced the brunt of the so called "War on Drugs."

http://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/refugees-and-asylees-united-states

The last time the admission ceiling for refugees was revised was in 2008 when it was set at 80,000, increasing from the ceiling of 70,000 established in 2002 and maintained through 2007. The ceiling was raised by 10,000 in response to an expected increase in refugee resettlement from Iraq, Iran, and Bhutan. However, the current ceiling is 65 percent lower than the 1980 ceiling of 231,700 (see Figure 1).

The 80,000 worldwide ceiling for 2011 is further broken down into regional caps: 15,000 from Africa (down by 500 compared to 2010); 19,000 from East Asia (up by 1,000); 2,000 from Europe and Central Asia (down by 500); 5,500 from Latin America and the Caribbean (no change from 2010); and 35,500 from Near East and South Asia (down by 2,500); 3,000 were unallocated reserve (compared to 500 in 2010 and zero in 2009).

The Reagan Administration; basically put a tight lid on a pot of boiling water which it placed on a hot burner in the first place.

We need to take the lid off the pot and raise the refugee and asylees cap if no where else at least for this neck of the woods, especially since our policies have contributed so greatly to their chaos and instability.

We owe these children that much.

[sabrina 1]

44. Thanks Uncle Joe.

[Hippo_Tron]

28. The US has a quarter of the world's GDP and less than 5% of its population

Leading in aggregate humanitarian aid doesn't make us morally superior when we also have an obscene amount of the world's wealth. As a percentage of GDP we lag far behind other developed nations in foreign aid.

[Divernan]

45. US foreign aid comes with profiteering strings attached

http://blogs.ubc.ca/datavis/2012/04/04/cutting-the-strings-attached-to-development-aid/

When foreign development aid comes with strings attached—forcing recipients to spend it on goods and services from donor country—it can double the time it takes the help to arrive. Children have died awaiting such “tied” aid, which also can increase costs by more than 30 per cent.

Understandably, these policies have led to sharp criticism by activists. The decision by the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID) to untie it’s donations was big news.
Some of the nations with the highest amount of aid reported as “untied” still end up using companies within their borders to fulfill the majority of their aid contracts. Simply because less aid is coming with strings attached does not translate into investment in the poorest nations of the world.

Finally, food aid, pharmaceutical aid and automobiles were all excluded from the new agreement for USAID. Data at this level of detail is not readily available, but would make for a good target for a Freedom of Information Act request. It is interesting to note that these are all among the most powerful political lobbies in the U.S.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/GA07Dj02.html

Relief organizations have calculated that as much as 75% of foreign aid is directly tied to trade access or other economic and political strategies. Some comes with so many strings attached, including preferential tendering on contracts and the hiring of consultants, that only 30-40% of dollar value is ever realized.

US policy dictates that much foreign aid be spent on costly imported medicines, weapons, agricultural produce or manufactured goods. Some European nations have a similar approach.

In the US, it was counter-terrorism activities and military cooperation that consumed most offshore funding through the first term of President George W Bush, in a period when other foreign development assistance from Washington stagnated.

As a proportion of gross national product (GNP), the US was the lowest aid contributor among the industrialized nations in 2001-03, allocating only 0.12% of total income in this period. Although Washington paradoxically displaced Japan as the largest donor in dollar terms, this was primarily due to its terrorism response.

http://www.globalissues.org/article/35/foreign-aid-development-assistance

In 1970, the world’s rich countries agreed to give 0.7% of their GNI (Gross National Income) as official international development aid, annually. Since that time, despite billions given each year, rich nations have rarely met their actual promised targets. For example, the US is often the largest donor in dollar terms, but ranks amongst the lowest in terms of meeting the stated 0.7% target.

Furthermore, aid has often come with a price of its own for the developing nations:

-- Aid is often wasted on conditions that the recipient must use overpriced goods and services from donor countries
-- Most aid does not actually go to the poorest who would need it the most
-- Aid amounts are dwarfed by rich country protectionism that denies market access for poor country products, while rich nations use aid as a lever to open poor country markets to their products
-- Large projects or massive grand strategies often fail to help the vulnerable as money can often be embezzled away

.

[woo me with science]

56. Excellent post.

Thank you.

[Quantess]

34. Sweden, with a tiny fraction of the USA's population

In 2012 tiny Sweden took in 120,482
Compared to giant USA, who took in 280,996

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/jun/19/refugees-unhcr-statistics-data

[woo me with science]

58. Thank you. nt

[Jenoch]

20. I have not yet read the replies to your OP.

However, I do not believe there is another country on his planet which has taken in more refugees from more countries in the wirld than the United States of America. I will willingly be corrected with facts and links.

[jeff47]

55. Perhaps you should look at post #34 directly above yours.

(At least at the time of this reply it is directly above)

[Jenoch]

60. Yes, that post confirms my point

[jeff47]

61. No, actually it counters it.

Sweden has a population of about 9.5 million. They took in 120,482 refugees, or 1.3% of their population

The US has a population of about 314 million. We took in 280,996 refugees, or 0.09% of our population.

Sweden took in 16 times more refugees than the US.

[Jenoch]

63. Go back and reqd my post and your reply again.

Good job moving the goalposts.

[jeff47]

64. No, we're still using your statement that the US takes in more than everyone else

We're just bothering to correct for the size of the country instead of being morons.

[Jenoch]

69. Th U.S. does take in more refugees than most other countries.

[jeff47]

70. As long as you don't correct for the size of those countries.

Or if your list of countries is all the countries in the world instead of first-world nations.

"Hey kids! We're gonna flee the violence here in El Salvador for the safety of North Korea!"

[Jenoch]

71. Aren't you tired of this yet? I am.

[maced666]

21. Yea, we never help anyone. Oh, wait-there's that 50 BILLION.

Every year-
the United States recently has continued to pump around $50 billion in aid to other countries each year.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/30/us-foreign-aid-by-country_n_1837824.html

[Divernan]

46. With profiteering strings attached:see Post 45, above.

[Jamastiene]

31. Even though Obama is president, it is truly the fundy nutjob

right wing types that are really still in charge. They control everything now. This is their doing. This is the kind of thing they think of as good. Not feeding people or helping the poor, but hating gays, women, and people from the other side of the border (to the south only, usually) seems to be their latest trend.

[freshwest]

37. +1

[Divernan]

35. My corporation tis of thee, sweet 1% prosperity

If there were profits to be made and providing shelter was privatized like our prisons, the borders would be thrown open and chartered bus service made available from Central America. This would result in the stock market ticking even further upward to the always increasing profits of the investment class, and the claims that our economy is booming cause look at the Dow Jones.

[IrishAyes]

36. Thank God for Massachusetts Governor Deval Patrick.

He wants to open unused military facilities to house the refugees.

[JI7]

38. it's not so great in other countries either

[Quantess]

51. And you know this, how?

I posted some links upthread. Would you like me to post them especially for you?

[JI7]

53. because i read about these things all the time

[Quantess]

54. Well, you do have a point about the attitude.

But in terms of real numbers of asylum seekers admitted to the USA, it's fairly low compared to many other countries, especially when you count per-capita.

[markpkessinger]

39. Saw this on Facebook today . . .

. . . works for me!

[calimary]

52. Love this!!!

[Duppers]

67. Second that!!!!

I love it too!

[certainot]

47. since you ask: 1000 think tank coordinated radio stations featuring about 400 of the

most ignorant authoritarian liars they could find. protected by call screeners and cut buttons, fed by a few corporate/GOP think tanks, and prompted by paid callers.

limbaugh gets first dibs when they want to derail a national discussion and he started off the first day suggesting they were diseased, gang members, and terrorists and that the obama admin knew abut it and maybe even organized it to stimulate immigration reform and force amnesty.

soon the other 400 ignorant lying blowhards are all calling them diseased.

so here in this diary there will be people discussing this as if those same tea bagging assholes that stopped the public option are a legitimate representation of 'popular' sentiment.

that's what happens to all national discussions the think tanks want to divert, distort, pollute, and derail. it starts with your local rw radio stations.

and the left lets them, and it's been going on for 25 years, for health care, global warming, gun control, etc.

and over 25% of those radio stations wear the sports logos of state funded colleges while they scream their ignorant racist outrage in order to make sure there will not be any immigration reform, so they can get cheap labor and keep wages low.

and ironically, what may have started the increase might have been all the talk by fox (which is some of the only us tv news foreigners get- much like in the red states) saying obama and the dems are going to amnesty everyone if they get the house and keep the senate.

[BillZBubb]

49. How the right wing is fomenting this inhumane response is disgusting.

These are children. Obviously very desperate children at that to make such a treacherous journey to get here.

The deserve to be well treated and given a chance to explain why we should allow them to stay. We certainly shouldn't just ship them back without any concern with what they may be returning to.

To do otherwise is shameful.

[LittleBlue]

62. We need fewer people, not more

The unprecedented water crisis of the American Southwest

http://theweek.com/article/index/255814/the-unprecedented-water-crisis-of-the-american-southwest

Western Kansas farmers worry as Ogallala Aquifer disappears
Concerns over aquifer depletion rising

http://cjonline.com/news/business/2014-07-22/western-kansas-farmers-worry-ogallala-aquifer-disappears

We are literally drinking whole rivers and aquifers dry.

Our concern should be more birth control and less immigration. Thank God I don't live down there because one of these days we're going to experience a crisis that makes Katrina look like a rainstorm.

[shraby]

65. You're referring to one section of a huge country. The rest of the country

seems to be having enough rain...right, Minnesota?
I'm in Wisconsin and only had to water the garden a couple of times..plenty of rainfall here.
The east and southeast are doing quite well rain-wise.

I'm sure those children won't make us suffer any.

[Duppers]

66. here's some major hypocrisy ..

This rightwing, southern town is vowing civil disobedience if the Obama administration deports a large German homeschooling family for over-staying their visas.

Yet these good krischens and Baptist minister opposed all the kids coming into our southern border.

Rich, isn't it ?!

read:
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014/03/04/christians-vow-civil-disobedience-if-home-school-family-is-deported/



Edited to add that I know these idiots. This was my hometown.

[shraby]

68. I appreciate the posters who came through with facts and figures

supporting my position that more can and should be done for the little ones..and the ones not so little.

To the rest who threw hearsay at this thread with no fact to back them up, go sit on it!