Ukraine - MH17 like Shoot Down Predicted a Month Ago

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Ukraine - MH17 like Shoot Down Predicted a Month Ago plus Russian Defense Chief in English

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Ukraine--MH17-like-Shoot-by-Michael-Collins-Brand-Obama_Mh17-Airline-Crash_Russia_War-In-Ukraine-140725-823.html

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1. More conspiracy mongering from Team Putin

From his author page, one easily observes that Collins gets much of his information from the Vineyard Saker, a Russian Christo-fascist hate site that peddles theories blaming Jews for most of 20th century Europe's problems and, of course,Holocaust denial.

Indeed "the Saker " is the source of these videos, with the hilarious statement that claims by the separatist in the video are not part if the propaganda wars.

Cute.

[SidDithers]

2. Collins is the OP..,

And I agree with you.

Sid

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3. From the proprietor of the source of the video

I think that the "official" "6 million" figure is open to debate. I am very dubious about the mass use of either the gas chambers or the crematoria. They make for great Hollywood movies, but for bad extermination methods.

More:

I am fully aware of the role which Jews played in the horrors of the 20th century, I am aware that they declared war on Russia first, and on Germany after that (both times the order came from organized American Jewry and Jewish banks), I loathe both Rabbinical Judaism and Zionism because both are based on self-worship and racism. I don't need lectures on all the bad things Jews have done or are still doing. Believe me, I have read more anti-Jewish books than most people here (if only because I read them all not only English, but also in Russian which has at least 10 times as many anti-Jewish books as there are in English).

Anyone citing that site is a filthy racist and fascist.

[SidDithers]

4. It's amazing how many holicaust-deniers are lining up with the Russians...nt

Sid

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6. And other conspiracy theorists nt

[reorg]

7. who is the "proprietor of the source of the video"?

I cannot find any anti-semitic statements at Antimaidan.

Did you confuse them with these types:

Ukraine is home to Svoboda, arguably Europe's most influential far-right movement today. (In the photo above, Svoboda activists seize a Ministry of Agriculture building during Kiev's Euromaidan protests in January.) Party leader Oleh Tyahnybok is on record complaining that his country is controlled by a "Muscovite-Jewish mafia," while his deputy derided the Ukrainian-born film star Mila Kunis as a "dirty Jewess." In Svoboda's eyes, gays are perverts and black people unfit to represent the nation at Eurovision, lest viewers come away thinking Ukraine is somewhere besides Uganda.

Svoboda began life in the mid-90s as the Social-National Party (a name deliberately redolent of the National Socialist Party, better known as Nazis), with its logo the fascist Wolfsangel. In 2004, the party gave itself an unobjectionable new name (Svoboda means "Freedom&quot and canned the Nazi imagery, and in the subsequent decade has seen its star swiftly rise.

Today, Svoboda holds a larger chunk of its nation's ministries (nearly a quarter, including the prized defense portfolio) than any other far-right party on the continent.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2014/03/18/yes_there_are_bad_guys_in_the_ukrainian_government

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10. The blog Vineyard Seeker

which the author cites as his source of the article.

You guys really need to pick your reason for blaming the Ukrainians in order to help Mother Russia avoid accountability. Because at once pushing "Ukrainians used airliners as human shields against rebels' Buks" and "rebels had no Buks" just seems like the most cynical and clumsy of propaganda techniques.

Which is it?

[reorg]

13. obviously wrong

The blog you mention, whoever may be behind it (a cursory glance doesn't reveal any anti-semitic posts), is not the proprietor of this video. Nor is the article cited in the OP in any way related to this blog.

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14. I quoted the blog's views on Jews

http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com/2014/05/ukrainian-news-two-phone-call-leaks.html?m=1

I am fully aware of the role which Jews played in the horrors of the 20th century, I am aware that they declared war on Russia first, and on Germany after that (both times the order came from organized American Jewry and Jewish banks), I loathe both Rabbinical Judaism and Zionism because both are based on self-worship and racism. I don't need lectures on all the bad things Jews have done or are still doing. Believe me, I have read more anti-Jewish books than most people here (if only because I read them all not only English, but also in Russian which has at least 10 times as many anti-Jewish books as there are in English).

In case that is not enough;

I will go as far as saying that Rabbinical Judaism is, in my sincerely held conclusion, Satanic at its core and at least as evil as Wahabi Islam.

That is the crowd that pushes this-same creeps that pushed the child crucifixion story--adapting the anti-Semitic blood libel for use against Ukrainians.

The author of the article gets most of his Ukraine news from that filthy hate site. He explicitly cited that fascist, racist site for this and most of his other stories.

Lay down with a filthy bigoted, crazy dog and one tends to get fleas.

[reorg]

17. so you admit that the video has nothing to do with that blog

good.

The author of the article may be reading it, I don't know. He didn't cite it for this particular story.

As to whether this blog (haven't heard about it before) is "a filthy hate site", one would have to read a little more than your excerpts to judge them in contex because it would appear to me that he argues AGAINST someone who is anti-semitic, acknowledging some of the "points" these people usually make, but continuing with another conclusion, a few sentences further down (from your link):

YES there are Jewish oligarchs out there who are almost a perfect caricature of the loathsome Jewish plutocrat-thug and they are very bit as bad as the worst anti-Jewish propaganda likes to portray them. But NO, they are not typical of a Jewish community which is every bit as complex and diverse as any other. Some Jews are truly horrified by what these oligarchs to and they are acutely aware that the backlash against such scum will hit the entire Jewish community.

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18. If you want to defend anti-Semitism that is your

choice. The statements I quoted

I am aware that they declared war on Russia first, and on Germany after that (both times the order came from organized American Jewry and Jewish banks), I loathe both Rabbinical Judaism and Zionism because both are based on self-worship and racism. ... I will go as far as saying that Rabbinical Judaism is, in my sincerely held conclusion, Satanic at its core.

are something only a filthy, insane bigot is capable of saying or believing. No context can change that. No one who rejects such bigotry would deny it.

Even David Irving pretends he isn't an anti-Semite.

Putin's thugs knew there were passenger jets in the area, and were trying to preemptively blame someone else for a crime they knew they might commit.

[reorg]

19. I do not and your attempt to construe

anything I said as a defense of anti-semitism is absolutely disgusting.

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20. You were the one trying to claim

that material lifted straight from Mein Kampf and The Protocols of The Elders of Zion did not indicate anti-semitism and that further 'context' was necessary.

My advice to you is to not try to defend the indefensible.

[Igel]

5. Technologically unlikely.

I mean, really. The "border" between Slavyansk and where the planes would be coming from was about 5-10 miles from Slavyansk.

The bombers are usually Sukhoi-24s. They don't get up to 30k feet without special gear and for limited time periods.

They're not going to drop 20k feet, release their loads (at 10k feet, still unguided munitions--they bomb from much lower if they want to hit their target). If they were at 30k feet and wanted to bomb Slavyansk, they'd need to descend at about a 45 degree angle as soon as they entered "DPR" airspace. Which means when they got to Slavyansk they wouldn't be at the passenger liner's altitude.

Then there's the question of whether the militants in Slavyansk at the time had the weaponry for shooting down something that high.

Put a uniform on a young woman and suddenly she's an expert on all kinds of things. Probably didn't bother with physics and had Ds and perhaps Cs in history. Give her an axe and she'd probably say she could split the atom.

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8. This is interesting -

Put a uniform on a young woman and suddenly she's an expert on all kinds of things. Probably didn't bother with physics and had Ds and perhaps Cs in history. Give her an axe and she'd probably say she could split the atom.


Really?

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12. Do you trust everything anyone wearing the

uniform of Team Putin says? Because there's really no other apparent reason for someone to buy this.

[reorg]

9. the woman doesn't talk about flight levels

and nobody said that "hiding" behind a passenger plane means flying at the same height.

Flight paths can differ and even be changed during ongoing flights, depending on weather conditions, we have been told.

As to your debasing remarks towards young women I'd advise you to turn it down a notch. Young and pretty doesn't mean stupid. It can be much worse with older guys who happen to blather a lot.

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11. Which is it-- are you denying that there's evidence

the rebels had high altitude SAMs or are you claiming that they did have them and the Ukrainians were using airliners as human shields?
Because an honest human being can't claim both, and switching to this one after trying to deny that the rebels did it doesn't seem like desperate propaganda.

[reorg]

15. I already replied to this non-question

in an earlier post.

Unless the Antimaidan posters can manipulate YouTube technology, this video was posted way before the MH17 catastrophe.

It clearly shows that militants in the east had observed at least one incident where bombers were flying very close to a passenger plane. They clearly had the impression that these bombers were "hiding" behind the passenger plane, which means the passengers were used as human shields.

If this impression was true, then the Ukrainians must have thought or feared that the militants were in the possession of missiles that could reach their bombers. Some military planes were actually shot down, so the assumption was not unreasonable. As to the possible reach of such missiles, their possible origin and what expertise was needed to launch them, I'll leave it to the experts, self-appointed or real, to speculate.

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16. It clearly shows Putin's thugs knew passenger jets

flew over that airspace. Meaning that when the international investigation shows it was launched from rebel positions, there will be hell to pay unless they are extradited.