Even Zionist Cohen has had enough

[malaise]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/30/opinion/roger-cohen-zionism-and-israels-war-with-hamas-in-gaza.html?ref=opinion&_r=1
<snip>
I am a Zionist because the story of my forebears convinces me that Jews needed the homeland voted into existence by United Nations Resolution 181 of 1947, calling for the establishment of two states — one Jewish, one Arab — in Mandate Palestine. I am a Zionist who believes in the words of Israel’s founding charter of 1948 declaring that the nascent state would be based “on freedom, justice and peace as envisaged by the prophets of Israel.”
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What I cannot accept, however, is the perversion of Zionism that has seen the inexorable growth of a Messianic Israeli nationalism claiming all the land between the Mediterranean and the Jordan River; that has, for almost a half-century now, produced the systematic oppression of another people in the West Bank; that has led to the steady expansion of Israeli settlements on the very West Bank land of any Palestinian state; that isolates moderate Palestinians like Salam Fayyad in the name of divide-and-rule; that pursues policies that will make it impossible to remain a Jewish and democratic state; that seeks tactical advantage rather than the strategic breakthrough of a two-state peace; that blockades Gaza with 1.8 million people locked in its prison and is then surprised by the periodic eruptions of the inmates; and that responds disproportionately to attack in a way that kills hundreds of children.

This, as a Zionist, I cannot accept. Jews, above all people, know what oppression is. Children over millennia were the transmission belt of Jewish survival, the object of what the Israeli novelist Amos Oz and his daughter Fania Oz-Salzberger have called “the intergenerational quizzing that ensures the passing of the torch.” No argument, no Palestinian outrage or subterfuge, can gloss over what Jewish failure the killing of children in such numbers represents.

The Israeli case for the bombardment of Gaza could be foolproof. If Benjamin Netanyahu had made a good-faith effort to find common cause with Palestinian moderates for peace and been rebuffed, it would be. He has not. Hamas is vile. I would happily see it destroyed. But Hamas is also the product of a situation that Israel has reinforced rather than sought to resolve.

This corrosive Israeli exercise in the control of another people, breeding the contempt of the powerful for the oppressed, is a betrayal of the Zionism in which I still believe.

[rateyes]

1. Big K & R

[democrank]

2. K & R

~PEACE~

[Hubert Flottz]

3. "Those who stir the shit, should ALWAYS have to lick the spoon!"

And why are we ALWAYS drawn in...Why is it that we are always paying to protect everyone on the globe and letting the USA rot and fall apart?

[MannyGoldstein]

4. Because the MIC makes a killing on killing

Not on infrastructure.

[cantbeserious]

6. + 1,000

eom

[Hubert Flottz]

8. Not at all, what the founders had in mind.

The GOP has been on a down hill slide since 1865 and so has integrity in Washington.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

16. War is business and business is good. n/t

[hifiguy]

27. truer words, etc...

[GoneFishin]

34. They always resist any measure that uses a large amount of money and distributes

among the many, even refusing small raises to combat troops at one point. They always support big ticket items wherein a lot of pork can be concealed.

Putting many thousands of americans to work fixing our roads and bridges isn't conducive to the easy skimming and gouging to which their beltway friends have grown accustomed.

[sabrina 1]

14. We don't protect anyone, see what we left behind in Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Vietnam etc. No matter

how bad things are when we go there to 'protect' people, it is far, far worse when we leave IF we ever leave.

What we do is 'make a killing' both literally and metaphorically speaking, enrich more of the wealthy and powerful with the people's tax dollars, (how better to extract money from Congress than to bribe them with our 'national security'?) then rush off to another 'gold rush' in some other part of the world.

Our next venture appears to be Ukraine, same formula, same run-up as to all of our 'humanitarian interventions' so I guess they need MORE money for whatever they spend it on.

We are now viewed as the biggest threat to world peace, along with Israel. We protect the fortunes of the privileged few, that's about it.

[NealK]

36. +1

[TNNurse]

5. I am no expert on this very complicated situation.

I am actually a pretty simple person and look at most situations that way. What I understand is that killing children is wrong. I read a quote from Eleanor Roosevelt last night. "I cannot believe war is the answer. No one won the last war and no one will win the next one". I believe her words would apply today.

[DeSwiss]

18. +1000

[Botany]

7. The truth

"But Hamas is also the product of a situation that Israel has reinforced
rather than sought to resolve."

With every home they build and every Palestinian that is killed or wounded
Israel sows the seeds of its own destruction.

[Fantastic Anarchist]

17. That is the elephant in the room no one wants to talk about.

[n2doc]

9. Too bad that our 'leaders' in the USA can't come to the same conclusions n/t

[mazzarro]

10. Very well said indeed

Shame on the so called political and religious leaders.

[malaise]

12. Thread winner

[n2doc]

13. If you haven't seen this I think you might appreciate it

First part of toon roundup today...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025310642

[malaise]

19. Thanks

That was powerful

[Enthusiast]

26. That tells us something very ugly about the great US of A.

[randome]

11. I don't understand how anyone can still be a 'believer'.

Statements such as that smack of intellectual laziness. Magic clothes, magic listoligies? Is that what he means? To hell with all of it.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]You have to play the game to find out why you're playing the game. -Existenz[/center][/font][hr]

[freshwest]

32. I'm not sure how you can believe that. It's never about that cover up. It's about resources, always.

Arguing religion is at fault is the same as those suckered into calling it religion. The truth is a much darker matter that people of all kinds skate around as it challenges their own actions and removes their comfort zone.

The world must come to an equal view of people and make hard decisions about land use and the lives of people themselves. Those who don't want to do that, run away and point fingers. It's the one thing that would achieve peace, but people find cover by calling it something else.

We all want and need a place to live and thrive. We have not been universal in granting it to others, as we'd have to give something up.

To achieve a lasting peace, how much material prosperity are we willing to give up? Will we agree to leave in small apartments in crowded cities with little utilities like much of the world's population both rich and poor do?

Or do we continue with the fantasy that all these miles in the USA and western nations, and the wealth that we took from others, is not to blame?

I suspect much of the rest of the world has an opinion of the USA and the west that is not at all flattering. It was said long ago that one child born in the first world nations does more damage to the world's environment than a thousand in a third world nation.

Because we demand a certain standard of living that comes from the exploitation of other lands. Our complaints about losing this or that rings hollow to the poor of the world.

I'm not jumping on you for what may be an off the cuff post that is trendy here.

The truth of what we are doing to others is never popular unless it fits under a label. And it will require a lot of sacrifice that few are willing to make personally. That's why it's pretty unpopular.

To appears to me that theologies, ideologies and the anti's of each are evasions away from facing brutal facts of existance on life on this entire planet, as created by human beings.

JMHO. YMMV.

[awoke_in_2003]

33. this isnt about religion

it is about what every war has always been about- land and resources

[Orsino]

15. +1

Death merchants on both sides of this and every other divide should be called to accounts.

[cpwm17]

20. "one Jewish, one Arab — in Mandate Palestine. I am a Zionist

who believes in the words of Israel’s founding charter of 1948 declaring that the nascent state would be based “on freedom, justice and peace as envisaged by the prophets of Israel.”

So apparently he has no problems with the Palestinian Nakba, since he apparently supports Israel's actions in 1947 and 1948. The Palestinian Nakba where 700,000 Palestinians were expelled and hundreds of Palestinian villages were razed, because he "believes in the words of Israel’s founding charter of 1948 declaring that the nascent state would be based “on freedom, justice and peace as envisaged by the prophets of Israel.” "

[malaise]

21. I have several issues with Cohen

The only reason I posted this link is because this is too much for a well known Zionist.

[cpwm17]

22. Thank you for the OP

I wasn't attacking you. I was just noting that he is very slow on the uptake on what Zionism is about in reality.

[LeftishBrit]

25. Zionism basically just means supporting Israel's continued existence.

I think Israel has the right to continue to exist; just like the UK or USA or any other countries; however, as in the other cases, it doesn't justify bad and insane policies and actions.

[BlueStreak]

23. This is what all good Jews need to stand up and say. Kudos

Right-wingers are war criminals, both in the IS and Israel. Netanyahu is not acting in the best interests of Israel. He has them on a path that will end very, very badly. There is still time to change, but we have to break the stranglehold AIPAC has over the US government.

[LeftishBrit]

24. k&r.

[snagglepuss]

28. Zionism: The God That Failed.

[Blue Owl]

29. K&R

[Uncle Joe]

30. Kicked, recommended and kudos to Cohen.

Thanks for the thread, malaise.

[freshwest]

31. Good for him! Got me crying here. nt

[Bonobo]

35. I agree. nt