Zimmerman's Homeowner's Association is likely to owe millions.

[pnwmom]

Turns out that Zimmerman was OFFICIALLY recognized as the HOA's watch "captain." So the homeowners -- individually and collectively -- are "stuck" with liability now.

Good. Maybe other HOA's will think twice before they let fake cops run around their property now.

http://www.businessweek.com/ap/2012-04/D9U1EC1G0.htm

"So, if you're going to send out a newsletter saying, `Hey, he is the captain. Whatever he says goes,' You have now basically rented a free police officer for your neighborhood," Clark said. "He certainly took on that role with the homeowners association, and it seems to me that they recognized that."

SNIP

If Zimmerman were to be convicted of a crime, the door would likely be wide open to a lawsuit -- Florida courts have held that homeowners associations can be held liable in wrongful-death cases.

SNIP

Who would pay in the event of such a lawsuit would probably be determined by the type of insurance coverage the association has, Clark said. Some policies may be wide enough to cover Zimmerman's actions. If there is no policy or the policy in place is very narrow in its coverage, homeowners likely would have to pay out of their own pockets through higher monthly assessment fees because most associations don't have very deep reserves, he said. He noted that policies typically cover about $1 million.

"I almost guarantee you there are going to be checks written," Clark said.

[exboyfil]

1. So the residents who will be the only witnesses

have a motivation to lie. Not saying that they won't do the right thing and it is a collective risk for all residents so per person cost may not be that great.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

3. That's what I've been saying all along.

I'd look long and hard at the witnesses who are on the recorded as having supported Zimmerman as watch captain. There is always the possibility they're engaging in an attempt at some CYA.

[bongbong]

14. Yes

I wouldn't bet a penny that the "eye" witnesses are telling the truth when the rubber (finally) hits the road.

[mactime]

2. Great Idea

Let's punish people that get involved in their community. What a stupid thing to do. We need more neighborhood/community involvement, not less

[Hugabear]

5. Yes, what we need is MORE untrained armed wannabe cops patrolling looking for "suspicious" people

Yep. We would all be better if every neighborhood had a Zimmerman walking around, gun at hand, ready to confront - and kill - anyone they deemed suspicious. Especially if they're black.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

6. Real neighborhood watch people don't carry guns.

They also don't engage any person they suspect of wrong doing.

It's not the community involvement, but rather the fact that they sanctioned a person who used unorthodox methods which led to an innocent person being killed.

Choices have consequences. When you make a bad choice the consequences are usually bad as well.

[mactime]

7. But why hold the community responsible for the action of one person?

If the HOA hires a landscaper that ends up getting a DUI, is the HOA somehow responsible?

[CatWoman]

9. if he drove around on the lawn doing cartwheels with his car

which is pretty much what Zimmerman did.

In this case, his "car" was his gun.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

13. Because his methods were already a source of contention for some there.

When that little factoid came to light, this end result was inevitable.

They may have made themselves legally responsible by having sanctioned him to do as he did. It's all going to depend on testimony of what they actually knew based on HOA meetings.

[Kaleva]

15. HOA could have laid out some basic ground rules.

They could have made sure the neighborhood watch in the area was registered with and followed the guidelines of the National Neighborhood Watch program which is this country's standard.

[mactime]

20. Damn I better look in to my neighbors then

I think the lady that volunteered to plant daisies at the neighborhood entrance looks a little suspicious. Hope she doesn't kill someone on her way home from work today, I might just get sued

[frylock]

25. you should take a better look at your analogy fail

[CatWoman]

26. LOL, Fry

[pnwmom]

27. This is a problem because the official publication from the HOA announced

that he was the "Captain" of the watch and anyone with concerns should go through him.

He wasn't some random, self-appointed jerk, as it appeared -- he was a HOA appointed jerk -- which makes him the HOA's responsibility.

[Hugabear]

44. You don't fucking get it

Either that or you're being deliberately obtuse.

If the little old lady planting flowers or the landscaper had killed somebody while doing their duty, then maybe you could make their case.

Fact is, Zimmerman was acting as a neighborhood watch, carrying a deadly weapon, apparently with the blessing of the HOA.

[pnwmom]

17. The HOA has an obligation to make prudent decisions.

If a HOA hired a landscaper that had a criminal record involving breaking into homes and attacking occupants, an injured party could certainly sue the HOA. Whether or not the victim would win would depend on all the circumstances.

But if someone without a record got his first DUI, there would be no way for the HOA to have predicted that. That doesn't mean someone couldn't sue them, but the claimant would be unlikely to win.

[frylock]

24. is this fictitious landscaper "on the clock" at the time of the DUI?

[uppityperson]

45. If the landscaper planted a big leaning tree right over a house, and then made it fall, yes, they

could. Your analogy makes no sense since Zimmy didn't shoot Trayvon blocks away at the minimart.

[CatWoman]

8. how about we punish people who get involved in their community

via reckless, immoral and irresponsible behavior?

Those people knew this asshole was what he is. AND that he was armed.

Fuck them.

[Quixote1818]

10. Exactly! nt

[Cali_Democrat]

33. It's nice to know that Frank Taffee could be paying for Zimmerman's actions

[CatWoman]

35. bwahahahahaha

*in my evil cackle voice*

[pnwmom]

12. You don't understand. The Homeowner's association membership isn't made up of volunteers.

It's made up of all the home owners. And in this case, all these homeowners decided to save themselves some money, and to make themselves feel safer, by letting Zimmerman run around the premises pretending to be a cop.

In other words, it won't just be the people running the HOA who are liable -- it will be everyone who owns a home there.

[joeybee12]

22. And the board of the HOA is elected by those owners in that community...

They have legal obligations, it's not just some group of people who get together to do stuff.

[Cali_Democrat]

32. LOL

You're funny.

When the "community" decides to hire a nut like Zimmerman to be the "captain" of the neighborhood watch and an unarmed child is killed by him, you better believe they will be liable.

I'm sure you would feel differently if it was your child that was killed.

You so want Zimmerman to get off. It's obvious.

[Snake Alchemist]

4. Time to raise dues? nt

[bongbong]

11. And....

I bet the local hardware store is suddenly out of "House For Sale" signs.

That, and the banks that wrote the mortgages on those houses (AKA, The Real Owners) will be facing a sudden, giant surge in "The Borrower Walked Away From The House" cases.

[bongbong]

16. Another interesting point

As a result of this finding, another interesting point raises it's scaly head...

Let's say some HOA voted in a gun-nut like Zimmerman as de-facto watchman, but that 49% (or whatever) objected to it. It looks like those 49 (or whatever) percent might very well end up paying a lot of money in damages. Due not ONLY to something they had nothing to do with, but they even were against it!

It looks like in a place with loose gun laws like SYG, you had better not buy a place with common charges, or for that matter any kind of common ownership.

This is good news for Florida house prices!

[pnwmom]

28. When you buy into a condo or any other place with a HOA, it IS important

to make sure what your legal liability is, and to make sure that both the HOA and you are adequately insured for any liability.

[joeybee12]

18. And if people complained to the HOA Board about him in the past...

which I've heard has happened and they did nothing, the liability skyrockets.

[Fawke Em]

19. So, in essence, Brandy Green will be paying for the murder

of her soon-to-be step-son?

How sad.

[pnwmom]

29. Her husband can reimburse her for her share of any payment due. n/t

[Fawke Em]

36. My point was more that the homeowners,

Ms. Green, in particular, who are probably traumatized by all this might be held accountable for something they effectively didn't do while the real killer walks free.

[pnwmom]

40. That's why any homeowner should have homeowners insurance with liability coverage.

If people who are acting as your agents do things that hurt people, you can be liable for their actions.

The members of the HOA knew Zimmerman was running around playing cop, so they share some of the responsibility, unless they were trying to stop him.

[Fawke Em]

49. Oh, I know this.

I'm married to an insurance agent.

[Ganja Ninja]

21. Another good reason to never buy property that is ...

deeded as part of a community and requires a homeowner to pay dues or fees and adhere to rules and restrictions.

[Ecumenist]

23. EXACTLY, Ganja! Here in California, there are thousands of HOAS and when we were looking for

a home, WE MADE A POINT TO STAY AWAY from HOA'S!! They're just a pain in the behind.

[bpj62]

30. No fifth amendment rights in Civil Cases

I have an interesting twist on this situation. According to the National Neighborhood Watch Association you are not allowed to carry a gun while on neighborhood watch. If Zimmernan is not charged you know that he will be called to testify as to what the association knew about his CWP and what they told him. This HOA is screwed and as far as I am concerned they deserve what happens to them.

[Kaleva]

42. There is no legal requirement for a neighborhood watch program...

to be registered with the National Neighborhood Watch program. I also read in other articles that while the Sanford PD doesn't encourage volunteers in a neighborhood watch to be armed, they said they can't prohibit either as long as the person is legally allowed to carry a weapon. In these same articles, the coordinator of volunteer programs said that they stressed over and over again for those in the neighborhood watch not to confront anyone.

I've also read that Zimmerman was considered to be "overzealous" so my guess, and it's only a guess, is that he has ignored his training in the past (Not to confront. Only to observe and report) and people in the HOA were aware of what he was doing but did nothing.

[Initech]

31. We need to work to declare Stand Your Ground unconstitutional.

That should be the goal of this. The fake cops will continue to patrol our neighborhoods and you give them a free pass to declare themselves judge, jury, and executioner - expect incidents to happen that will completely dwarf the Treyvon Martin case. We need to get this overturned and declared unconstitutional - or expect far worse.

[pnwmom]

34. Or simply to have it repealed. It is a very poor law. n/t

[Initech]

37. No - because then the NRA will rewrite it with even harsher terminology.

This law must be gone for good - if wr don't make it unconstitutional it will just open the door for harsher and scarier laws that will be worse than Stand Your Ground. Plus you really think with a tea party douchebag like Rick Scott in charge that they're itching to repeal that law? Hell no.

[goclark]

48. Agree

[notadmblnd]

38. Does there really need to be a conviction?

couldn't the Martin family sue the HOA in a civil court even if charges against Zimmermann are never filed. Seems that I recall that OJ was acquitted of criminal charges but Nicole's family sued civilly and won. Am I wrong?

[pnwmom]

46. I think you're right. The evidential standard is different for civil damages.

Guilt must be proved based on a "preponderance" of the evidence -- rather than beyond a reasonable doubt.

[bemildred]

39. I've always wanted to own an entire housing development. nt

[Air Marshal8]

41. Are Trayvon's father and his current girlfriend who live in the gated community

part of the HOA?

[pnwmom]

43. Probably, unless he's just renting. But if he sues the HOA,

he would be able to pay himself back for his fraction of any financial liability.

He'll always have to live with his share of ethical responsibility for acquiescing to Zimmerman's cop act.

[Air Marshal8]

50. Interesting. But of course if he's a renter he wouldn't be an owner.

Has anyone discovered whether he was satisfied with Zimmerman before the night of the confrontation?...isn't it possible he was completely in favor of the arrangement?

[DonCoquixote]

47. facts

One: Zimmerman had a police record. The man has assualted a COP. That alone should have disqualifed him from BEING on the Neighborhood watch, much less having any authority on it.

Two: proper neighborhood watches tell people NOT to carry guns. If the neighborhood watch knew this clown was carrying a gun, he needed to be thrown out, period.

Three: The police officer told him clearly NOT TO FOLLOW, that cops were on the way. Instead, he whined "They always get away" and, knowing he was being taped, said "F__ing _C__s!" Even Nancy grace, hardly a progressive, dismissed the claim he said "goons" as BS.

Four: Self defense still requires a Jury. It is one thing for him to be out on Bail, which, as any bondsman will tell you, has a whole series of requirements. As of right now, there is NOTHING stopping him from boarding a plane to somehwere where we have no hope in hell of extracting him. He is poor you say, ha, there are several billionaire ayn rand types who would put him up in a lap of luxury just to tick black people off.