I cannot believe this is happening in an American city

[spinbaby]

No words. Just no words.

[Travis_0004]

1. the issue is the violence

During the daay the protest are peaceful with a smaller police presence. During the night it all goes to shit. Even at night the vast majority of protestors are peaceful, so I guess the question is what to do about the small number of violent protestors.

[ret5hd]

3. Maybe we shouldn't be shooting unarmed people to begin with.

[truth2power]

62. That is the crux of the matter...

AN UNARMED MAN WAS KILLED BY A POLICEMAN.

[woo me with science]

5. No, the issue is militarized police in the USA, who abuse and even murder citizens.

Shelve the propaganda spin and talking points.

[Tom Ripley]

25. +1000

[AgingAmerican]

34. When the rocks and bottles fly

They win

Had the rocks and bottles flown, MLKJ would not have had the moral high ground.

Had the rocks and bottles flown, Ghandi would not have kept the moral high ground.

When you take control of the moral high ground, first they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.

[woo me with science]

41. When attention is diverted from the militarization and abuse of citizens, they win.

That's why there is a long history by police of infiltrating protests and creating violence, so as to try to divert the discussion in the way you just attempted.

Police behavior last night was designed to TRY to incite violence, and there should be a national outcry today condemning their tactics. The protesters deserve great credit for their overall restraint.

[AgingAmerican]

43. "Divert attention"

??

Is what I said incorrect? Obviously the activists on the ground there agree with me.

The hater cops are putting the attention on themselves. The infiltrators need to be shunned and weeded out.

[woo me with science]

47. The protesters don't need lectures about the moral high ground. They are already

conducting themselves well, and overwhelmingly so.

What needs attention is the brutal, manipulative, and indefensible behavior of the militarized police, and the scandal of that militarization, created by a corrupt system and purchased politicians.

[AgingAmerican]

51. I am not 'lecturing' anyone

I am stating my opinion. Don't take it as an attack, which it isn't.

See post #50.

[jwirr]

49. Exactly. Last night (before midnight) I was watching live feed. The police were not doing crowd

control. The preachers and other community leaders from the black community were doing a very good job of it. Even the media at one point stepped in between the police and the people to stop the police from using overbearing force. At least up to that time the protesters had the high ground.

The State Patrol did arrest several people. I do not know why they arrested the first man but I had been watching the woman they arrested for some time because she was instigating violence. When they arrested her the rest of the crowd once again started listening to the community leaders.

The most impressive thing I saw was the moment when the crowd had moved back and it was obviously the police who were pushing it. The community leaders got the police to listen to them and as we watched the police slowly moved back to their original site and quit pushing. After that the crowd was fine and soon dispersed.


The feed I was watching did see the heavy equipment move to the other end of the site and I do not know what they or the crowd were doing at that point because the media was caged in one area.

[AgingAmerican]

54. I thought the protesters did a good job of shunning the infiltrators

The protesters kept the moral high ground, which put the onus on the cops. The cops reacted by threatening and trying to intimidate the media, live on national (and world) TV. Most of the media attention turned onto the police overkill, which is wherein the problem lies.

Phasers on SHUN!

[jwirr]

59. Exactly.

[TheKentuckian]

60. Bullshit, that is the thought of an excuse maker for real criminals and a primary desire

to maintain the oppression.

Mouthing silly platitudes and eternally pretending that all situations have the same formula for a cure while misreading history to pretend the magic of a philosophy.

Gandhi achieved little other than Indian faces for his people's overseers, poor folks are still sleeping get under their fucking sewing machines when they are lucky and living a life of day labor serfs for the benefit of the same western capitalist.

Power never surrenders, with sufficient threat to that power occasionally a new deal is cut that turns down the temperature temporarily.

[cvoogt]

7. Indeed

The police should stop being disproportionately violent.

[AgingAmerican]

50. Last night the crowds of protesters were very calm

There were a few instigators, but they were a tiny minority. The instigators and infiltrators were being shunned. This put the onus on the cops, who looked like they were itching to start WWIII. The calmer the crowds, the stupider the cops look.

Because the crowds were very calm, the media focused on the police overkill. Because the protesters were not playing their game, the cops were attempting to threaten the media, live on national TV. All of the media focus, and ensuing world attention, was on the police violence overkill, which is what this whole thing is about in the first place.

[Horse with no Name]

28. I watched this live last night

who the aggressors were was perfectly clear.

[VanGoghRocks]

32. The issue IS the violence, specifically the violence that left Mr. Brown dead on the street.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

39. Only if your entire focus is on security and not justice.

[ljm2002]

53. Compared to historical events...

...the level of violence in Ferguson from the demonstrators / hangers-on has been pretty minimal. Yet it is met with lines of officers with their rifles trained on the crowd, the loud noise weapon, the tank-like vehicles, tear gas thrown at the slightest or even no provocation...

Yes the issue is the violence: the police violence. And as others have noted, this is directly correlated with the militarization of our police forces.

Knowing that in the town of Ferguson, with 21,000 people, there are 24,000 arrests per year; knowing that the arrests in Ferguson provide it with its second largest source of income... that should tell us all something.

I know you are not trying to say the people of Ferguson have nothing to be mad about, and you are not saying they are all violent. I'm just saying that if the issue is the violence, one side of this equation is bearing down with orders of magnitude more violence and firepower than the other side is.

[TBF]

4. I can believe it -

remember how they reacted when Occupy gathered in Zuccotti Park? They are quick to shoot black men and women for sure, but don't be mistaken in thinking they won't shoot poor white folks. I think the only folks who have any sort of actual freedom in this country are rich white males.

[SammyWinstonJack]

16. Zuccotti Park and where ever else Occupy was marching or camped, this action by a militarized

police force was there harassing intimidating brutalizing.....

[HereSince1628]

6. But, then, it doesn't need to be imagined...it's happened, it's happening

People of a certain age can see this not as aberration but as an historic pattern of government behavior.

[aikoaiko]

8. For what it's worth those are rubber bullet shooting rifles

... And shotguns

[trumad]

11. All held by white people.

[jtuck004]

18. Whips are so 1865. This is where we have progressed to. n/t

[aikoaiko]

27. And ordered there by Missouri Highway Patrol Captain Ron Johnson

[ColesCountyDem]

9. I'm old enough to remember the '60s, and this is a repetition.

Same fundamental reasons for the flames, regardless of what caused the 'match' to be lit.

[HereSince1628]

14. It does seem like history repeating itself.

But that's redundant. Whether we remember it or not, history is a litany of the repetition of acts and reactions.

The names change and the weapons evolve...but it's a remake of an old plot

[humanityisfree]

10. Make this photo black and white

and you'd think it was from the 1960's. We have a real problem here in America and have since our inception. It's called RACISM and it hasn't gone away or improved a whole lot in the last 50 years of the civil rights movement. In many ways I think it is worse.

[socialist_n_TN]

22. I'll disagree somewhat. The REAL problem is called CAPITALISM, but........

of course, RACISM is a very large part of capitalism. You can tell the difference when you see black capitalists oppressing the working class, black and white. Because of the racism, it doesn't happen very often, but it inevitably happens even when the oppressor is black.

[ctsnowman]

56. Nailed it.

[Garion_55]

29. here ya go!

[VanGoghRocks]

33. Which side are you on, now, which side are

on?

They say in Ferguson Town
There are no neutrals then
You'll either be a rebel son
Or a thug for 'Culloch's men.

Which side are you on?
Which side are you on?
Which side are you on?
Which side are you on?

RIP Pete Seeger.

Your B&W rendition is like a punch in the gut.

If you made their uniforms scarlet red, why then, they'd be just like Cornwallis' men in 1776-83. Not that I'm suggesting you do, but . . .

[lisby]

36. I agree

And all it took a half-black president to finally bring this, scalding, to the surface.

[Dustlawyer]

12. I picture a little old lady shaking a cane just off to the left of the picture!

Funny how they arrest anyone else right off the bat and charge them!

[lunasun]

37. It sorta already did happen...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/18/hedy-epstein-arrested-ferguson-holocaust-_n_5689822.html
Hedy Epstein, 90-Year-Old Holocaust Survivor, Arrested During Michael Brown Protest

[logosoco]

13. The world is watching.

In an email from my son last week, he said he has heard of this. He is in Tanzania with very limited internet.

I don't know how to explain what is happening (we live about 45 miles from Ferguson).

The constitution is taking a major beating. And I am heartbroken to see the people come out and side with the police. I want to yell and say "what if this was our kids? what if this was our community?". I would be out in the streets, too.

[sarge43]

15. Detroit 1943. It always happens

[VanGoghRocks]

42. Washington, D.C. 1933 - Thanks a lot, MacArthur and Eisenhower

[hootinholler]

63. Hoover sent the army

Roosevelt sent his wife.

[VanGoghRocks]

65. True that. MacArthur and Eisenhower were only 'following orders.' Now where

have I heard that one before??

I was not aware that FDR had dispatched Eleanor. What was her ostensible mission?

[hootinholler]

66. Basically to calm them

From wikipedia:

During the presidential campaign of 1932, Franklin D. Roosevelt opposed the veterans' bonus demands.[23] When they organized a second demonstration in May 1933, he provided the marchers with a campsite in Virginia and provided them three meals a day. Administration officials, led by presidential confidant Louis Howe, tried to negotiate an end to the protest. Roosevelt arranged for his wife Eleanor to visit the site unaccompanied. She lunched with the veterans and listened to them perform songs. She reminisced about her memories of seeing troops off to World War I and welcoming them home. The most she could offer was a promise of positions in the newly created Civilian Conservation Corps (CCC).[22] One veteran commented: "Hoover sent the army, Roosevelt sent his wife". In a press conference following her visit, the First Lady described her reception as courteous and praised the marchers, highlighting how comfortable she felt despite critics of the marchers who described them as Communists and criminals.[22]

[VanGoghRocks]

67. Thanks. Learned something new today (always a good thing :)

[Demeter]

17. Then you must have been born after the last round of riots

[Javaman]

19. +1. nt

[spinbaby]

40. Sadly, no

I'm an old lady and I'm shocked anew every time this happens.

[newfie11]

46. +1. Nt

[alcibiades_mystery]

20. My generation's version of this

Make no mistake: what we're watching unfold on teevee and Twitter is historical. Folks have had it.

[BumRushDaShow]

21. Philadelphia - 1844 anti-Irish ("Nativist Riots")

It's been happening for centuries in the U.S.

[heaven05]

23. one word

Selma

[newfie11]

48. Los Angeles, Washington DC. In the 60s. Nt

[ReRe]

24. K&R

You all need to go check out http://www.DemocracyNow.org after while. Amy had some great interviews with some native historians who have come back to participate in the protest. Whole program is dedicated to Ferguson, MO and what's happening there right now.

[Cheviteau]

26. How old are you?

You shouldda been around in the 60s. It was coast-to-coast. It's bad now and I understand that...but we'll muddle through somehow. Our entire history is one continuous turmoil. Some are searching for a way in and some for a way out. Just hang in there until the next uprising.

[AgingAmerican]

30. When the rocks and bottles fly

...they win

[Garion_55]

31. 1960s alabama or 2014 missouri?

[VanGoghRocks]

45. Or 1775 Bunker Hill?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

35. All of these idiots are guilty of assault with a deadly weapon.

[workinclasszero]

38. Its not the first time OP

I'm old enough to remember the Detroit riots back in the 60's. Watts etc.

America the most exceptional country...the shining city on a hill...God bless America!

Unfortunately built on horrible slavery, genocide against Native Americans and massive exploitation of the working class. Funny they didn't dwell on that too much in HS and college!

Whats happening in Ferguson MO was a 24/7 way of life down south from the end of the civil war to the 1970's at least.

And don't forget just a few years ago militarized cops busting heads and basically having police riots against peaceful unarmed occupy folks.

Why do you think every two bit town in America outfits its police force with armored tanks and full on military gear and weapons?

The 1% that own and operate this Randian capitalist paradise are going to make damn sure they got their foot planted firmly on our throats as it becomes more and more clear that they will destroy the whole fucking world to protect their fucking obscene oceans of money!

When the coasts are drowning, the ice caps melting and heat waves are frying the interior parts of the country the 1%ers will live in luxury on tops of mountains watching us suffer and laughing.

But hey ..God bless the good old USA!

[classof56]

57. You nailed it, workinclasszero

I'm old, tired and cynical beyond measure, and every word you say is exactly what I've been thinking for far too long. Can anything change to make me feel at all positive about the future my grandchildren are left to deal with? Anything's possible, as they say, but I seriously doubt it.

Peace.

[Rex]

44. An out of control PD has caused all of this and it seems a certain group of people

relish in the violence.

[newfie11]

52. +1. Nt

[Little Star]

69. Yep!

[maddiemom]

55. I would have loved seeing this sort of police response to the ARMED "protesters"

at the Bundy ranch a few months back!

[locks]

58. Deja vu all over again

Looks like Chicago, Kent State, 68 Dem Convention, walk to Birmingham, Freedom rides, and hundreds of cities, college campuses, and streets all over our nation for more than 50 years. When will they ever learn? When you use military tactics against your own children, your own neighbors, to "make peace and order" you haven't won the war, let alone the battle.

[libodem]

61. Revenge of Afghanistan and Iraq

They brought war back to the states with them. You don't do dirty without getting some on you.

It doesn't quite make up for Faluja but somewhere the dead are laughing.

[PasadenaTrudy]

64. I can, sadly

You should have seen it here after the Rodney King beating verdicts! I'm 50 and all of this is no surprise to me. I'm sure it will continue long after I'm dead

[Corruption Inc]

68. Why not? We support torture, institutionalized criminal banks, drone murders, etc...

We're a criminal nation and we're told by our supposed political leaders to just look ahead and forget about the worst crimes committed by American politicians in history.

Criminal nations characteristically have criminal police too, all the crimes big and small go hand in hand. Our corrupt military/industrial complex isn't some separate entity, it's our citizens, our police, our corporations -- us.

It's what the U.S. is now, a predatory, criminal, murderous nation.

[niyad]

70. for the first time, I caught a little bit of chris hayes' coverage--and the above image made

me want to cry.

the sheer hatred and ugliness I saw in some of the officers' faces was frightening.

[woo me with science]

71. kick