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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsMissouri lt. gov.: We need ‘Anglo-American’ justice in Ferguson
Those protesters are all just "crying out" for the leadership of "anglo-american jurisprudence tradition."
Wow. just... wow.
I dont understand an argument for not reinstating it, he insisted. I dont understand that. Im not trying to be overtly political. I am saying, the people of Ferguson, the people of the state of Missouri are crying out for leadership.
...
Kinder said there was no question that race was playing a role in what was happening in Ferguson.
We do not do justice in America in the streets though, he argued. We have legal processes that are set in motion, that are designed after centuries of Anglo-American jurisprudence tradition, theyre designed to protect the rights and liberties of everyone involved.
...
Thats one of the great advances of Anglo-American civilization, is that that we do not have politicized trials. We let the justice system work it out.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/08/19/missouri-lt-gov-we-need-anglo-american-justice-in-ferguson-not-racial-protests/
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)This guy is all kinds of ate up with the dumbass.
alp227
(32,015 posts)Rex
(65,616 posts)Are they not trying to hide it anymore...or are they just that fucking stupid/racist? I mean only my dumbest braincell is telling me he meant tort law/reform...but no, probably not.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)... but he sure is tone deaf, b/c it sounds like a racist dog whistle. He's pretty fucking stupid to go there, intended or not.
Rex
(65,616 posts)WTF are they doing? I guess the feds will have to handle this situation...it seems everyone else it trying to see how offensive they can be to the public.
You would THINK detaining reporters without reason, would be big news to some...and yet they remain completely silent. I find that interesting.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)...which explains the racist dog whistle. I had assumed he was a Dem like the Gov (albeit a really stupid one).... apparently in MO the Gov and Lt Gov are elected separately.
Rex
(65,616 posts)plus they got his name wrong! LOL. His website says Peter Kinder, not Kindler. Then again it is rawstory.
Thor_MN
(11,843 posts)billhicks76
(5,082 posts)But make no mistake. It's the same logic Israel used against the Palestinians in Gaza. And the National Guard had been asked before if they are willing to kill Americans. The first step is always to dehumanize them. This is getting ugly. We may end up with a little Hitler in the next few years if we don't clamp down on these racist scumbags now.
0rganism
(23,937 posts)usually a republican politician will claim that American jurisprudence is rooted in the Bible, specifically Old Testament edicts. but this time, he actually refers, more correctly imho, to the English common law tradition. i'm pretty sure this is meant for the straight-up racists, since it's not the standard right-wing bible thumping crap.
get the red out
(13,461 posts)Not very carefully coded.
phantom power
(25,966 posts)And that goes double if you combine it with his comments about "crying out for leadership"
hmm... where have we heard these two ideas together before? "Anglo American" (aka Great Britain) + "crying out for leadership" (aka lawless savages)...
sir pball
(4,741 posts)It reads just as well to me this way: "We have legal processes that are set in motion, that are designed after centuries of our jurisprudence tradition, theyre designed to protect the rights and liberties of everyone involved
Thats one of the great advances of our civilization, is that that we do not have politicized trials. We let the justice system work it out.
I do generally tend toward's Hanlon's Razor, never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity, but this one gets to where Stretch Armstrong would be hard-put to go with the latter..
tblue37
(65,273 posts)familiar and widely used label that it has its own commonly recognized initialism: WASP.
cyberswede
(26,117 posts)madashelltoo
(1,696 posts)I saw this interview yesterday and it made me sick. He repeated that Anglo-American line over and over and it means what? Who was he signaling? The Anglo-American judicial system is what has brought us to this point. They have no respect for anyone who is not Anglo-American (whatever the hell that means). Not many people in America are actually Anglo-American. No. Not even the ones who profess to be. That story ain't flying and the Mayflower sank in the ocean because it had millions of passengers.
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)slavery.
Divine Right of Kings.
Suffrage limited to white men of property.
The White Man's Burden. (Which, of course, was mostly carried by dark-skinned people.)
Etc.
tritsofme
(17,373 posts)was a direct challenge to the divine right of kings. Limited suffrage began to replace absolute rule. It was somewhere to start.
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)tritsofme
(17,373 posts)Not sure what the distinctly "Anglo" legal tradition was prior to that, being but 150 years removed from William the Conqueror, I don't suspect much. We might not judge the Magna Carta's accomplishments as much by today's standards, but it served as the cradle of constitutionalism in the Anglosphere.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)... based on remnants of Roman Law. The Magna Carta sought to limit the King's power, and increase the Earls' power. It was nullified with blessings of the Pope, then reinstated, and struggled over back and forth until a defined Parliment was established, with control over the checkbook.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Nixon, and this dumbshit,... they aren't helping.
alp227
(32,015 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Okay, him being a repuke explains the racist dog whistles.
Louisiana1976
(3,962 posts)all Democrats.
Louisiana1976
(3,962 posts)atreides1
(16,070 posts)Maybe they're just racist...and this man reflects their beliefs!
tblue37
(65,273 posts)the Democratic governor he serves under.
Laelth
(32,017 posts)Kinder makes the Republican Party look worse.
-Laelth
bullwinkle428
(20,629 posts)Louisiana1976
(3,962 posts)Brigid
(17,621 posts)God, I miss him.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Or Olbermann, anti-war Phil Donohue and Cenk.
grasswire
(50,130 posts)They canned him, too.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)I didn't always agree with Martin, but more often than not his opinion was similar to my own. Not that I expect TV journalists to agree with me on everythingthat would be unrealistic.
There is no remaining free and fair media in the USA. The bad guys® could never have accomplished their aims, as they have, if we had protected our media.
eShirl
(18,490 posts)leftstreet
(36,103 posts)Did he fail to explain himself, or was that just a soundbite dog whistle?
phantom power
(25,966 posts)leftstreet
(36,103 posts)I don't what he meant, but he's a moron for using that term in an interview
calimary
(81,192 posts)Especially with the changing demographics in this country.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)calimary
(81,192 posts)UNOPPOSED? There was NO ONE to run against him? I would love to see someone of the majority community step forward as a candidate. The citizens of Ferguson are NOT well-served OR well-represented by the team in place now.
phantom power
(25,966 posts)toddwv
(2,830 posts)That whole system is dirty and it's going to be nearly impossible to clean...
derby378
(30,252 posts)Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)American Justice
kwolf68
(7,365 posts)'Merican (Descendents)
we flipped our finger to the king of england
stole our country from the indians
with god on our side and guns in our hands
we took it for our own
a nation dedicated to liberty
justice and equality
does it look that way to you
it doesn't look that way to me
sickest joke i know
[chorus]
listen up man, i'll tell you who i am
just another stupid american
you don't wanna listen
you don't wanna understand
so finish up your drink and go home
i come from the land of ben franklin,
twain and poe and walt whitman
otis redding, ellington
the country that i love
but it's a land of the slaves and the ku klux klan
haymarket riot and the great depression
joe mccarthy vietnam
sickest joke i know
[chorus]
i'm proud and ashamed
every fourth of july
you've got to know the truth
before you say that you've got pride
now the cops got tanks but the kids got guns
shrinks pushin' pills on everyone
cancer from the ocean
cancer from the sun
straight to hell we go
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)aint_no_life_nowhere
(21,925 posts)and teach them the meaning of Anglo-American law and order.
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)The United States got its court system and rights in court based on the English law. Especially in real property, you have to read English cases from the 1200s about basic rights of landholders. A few tort cases are quite old as well.
If that's what he meant, it's going to get misinterpreted.
Or maybe it was a dog whistle.
It means criminal defendants have rights like: the presumption of innocence, the right to not take the stand and thereby not incriminate yourself, the right to confront your accusers, the right to counsel if you cannot afford counsel in a criminal case (Gideon v. Wainwright) and others. It is the whole judicial process starting with the filing of a criminal complaint and the convening of a grand jury and presenting evidence to a grand jury.
janlyn
(735 posts)My dad was from KC my aunt and uncle still live there. I went to visit them last year after my dad passed away. I live in northwest Arkansas
and the farther north I went the more uncomfortable I became. Clearly anti democratic and blatant racist billboards whereever l went. I did not see a single person who was not white during my visit. What astounded me was that there was no mingling of races like in Arkansas and other places in the south. It scared the shit out of me!! All I could think was, thank goodness I rented a car and didn't bring my own. I truly believe my bumper stickers woukd have made me a target.
They REALLY. DON'T. CARE!!
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)Jesse James is glorified with a museum in Liberty and a yearly parade in Kearney.
LordGlenconner
(1,348 posts)The asshole is probably gearing up for a run for Governor after Nixon, who is term limited.
Romulox
(25,960 posts)in English common law, specifically including the jury system and the "innocent until proven guilty" standard.
I don't vouch for the speaker in any way, but this lawschool 101 stuff.
Rex
(65,616 posts)An accident or on purpose, I dunno.
Romulox
(25,960 posts)I understand where you're coming from, but there is no reason to double down on a mistake. I'm not going to argue about it with you though.
Rex
(65,616 posts)SO really fighting about it would be pointless if we both agree on something. YOU might know what it means and I might know what it means...but that doesn't mean he DID!
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)including those who know the alternative phrasing, would have blinked.
Rex
(65,616 posts)I just have a hard time giving the GOP the benefit of the doubt. English Common Law. Common Law. So many better ways to say it!
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)... misunderstood as well.
leftstreet
(36,103 posts)He's a tone deaf moron
phantom power
(25,966 posts)Yes, our legal system has an Anglo American heritage. But we generally get by just fine by saying "our legal system" or some such. Because it's not like there's some other legal system under consideration. Like we say "numbers" and not "numerals of Arabic heritage."
When you say "Ferguson is crying out for leadership" from "Anglo-American jurisprudence" that is - literally - synonyms for "protestors crying out for leadership from Great Britiain."
White Man's Burden.
Romulox
(25,960 posts)It doesn't mean "protestors crying out for leadership from Great Britain." It means the system of trial by a jury of one's peers that developed from English common law.
xocet
(3,871 posts)One of the important sources of information which we have about Indian numerals comes from al-Biruni. During the 1020s al-Biruni made several visits to India. Before he went there al-Biruni already knew of Indian astronomy and mathematics from Arabic translations of some Sanskrit texts. In India he made a detailed study of Hindu philosophy and he also studied several branches of Indian science and mathematics. Al-Biruni wrote 27 works on India and on different areas of the Indian sciences. In particular his account of Indian astronomy and mathematics is a valuable contribution to the study of the history of Indian science. Referring to the Indian numerals in a famous book written about 1030 he wrote:-
Whilst we use letters for calculation according to their numerical value, the Indians do not use letters at all for arithmetic. And just as the shape of the letters that they use for writing is different in different regions of their country, so the numerical symbols vary.
It is reasonable to ask where the various symbols for numerals which al-Biruni saw originated. Historians trace them all back to the Brahmi numerals which came into being around the middle of the third century BC. Now these Brahmi numerals were not just symbols for the numbers between 1 and 9. The situation is much more complicated for it was not a place-value system so there were symbols for many more numbers. Also there were no special symbols for 2 and 3, both numbers being constructed from the symbol for 1.
...
http://www-history.mcs.st-and.ac.uk/HistTopics/Indian_numerals.html
mac56
(17,566 posts)it won't be perceived that way. Tone-deaf, at the VERY least.
jtuck004
(15,882 posts)Sounds like something white guys would laugh at in a locker room.
And while I realize it may be law school 101, I am guessing it used to be law school 101 that no black people could not sit in that school either.
Things change and they need to. Maybe this is one.
Chan790
(20,176 posts)Not that it's not an awesome song...but Langston Hughes' Let America be America Again is so damning of his mindset that its inclusion struck me as necessary as-well.
Let America be America again.
Let it be the dream it used to be.
Let it be the pioneer on the plain
Seeking a home where he himself is free.
(America never was America to me.)
Let America be the dream the dreamers dreamed--
Let it be that great strong land of love
Where never kings connive nor tyrants scheme
That any man be crushed by one above.
(It never was America to me.)
O, let my land be a land where Liberty
Is crowned with no false patriotic wreath,
But opportunity is real, and life is free,
Equality is in the air we breathe.
(There's never been equality for me,
Nor freedom in this "homeland of the free."
Say, who are you that mumbles in the dark?
And who are you that draws your veil across the stars?
I am the poor white, fooled and pushed apart,
I am the Negro bearing slavery's scars.
I am the red man driven from the land,
I am the immigrant clutching the hope I seek--
And finding only the same old stupid plan
Of dog eat dog, of mighty crush the weak.
I am the young man, full of strength and hope,
Tangled in that ancient endless chain
Of profit, power, gain, of grab the land!
Of grab the gold! Of grab the ways of satisfying need!
Of work the men! Of take the pay!
Of owning everything for one's own greed!
I am the farmer, bondsman to the soil.
I am the worker sold to the machine.
I am the Negro, servant to you all.
I am the people, humble, hungry, mean--
Hungry yet today despite the dream.
Beaten yet today--O, Pioneers!
I am the man who never got ahead,
The poorest worker bartered through the years.
Yet I'm the one who dreamt our basic dream
In the Old World while still a serf of kings,
Who dreamt a dream so strong, so brave, so true,
That even yet its mighty daring sings
In every brick and stone, in every furrow turned
That's made America the land it has become.
O, I'm the man who sailed those early seas
In search of what I meant to be my home--
For I'm the one who left dark Ireland's shore,
And Poland's plain, and England's grassy lea,
And torn from Black Africa's strand I came
To build a "homeland of the free."
The free?
Who said the free? Not me?
Surely not me? The millions on relief today?
The millions shot down when we strike?
The millions who have nothing for our pay?
For all the dreams we've dreamed
And all the songs we've sung
And all the hopes we've held
And all the flags we've hung,
The millions who have nothing for our pay--
Except the dream that's almost dead today.
O, let America be America again--
The land that never has been yet--
And yet must be--the land where every man is free.
The land that's mine--the poor man's, Indian's, Negro's, ME--
Who made America,
Whose sweat and blood, whose faith and pain,
Whose hand at the foundry, whose plow in the rain,
Must bring back our mighty dream again.
Sure, call me any ugly name you choose--
The steel of freedom does not stain.
From those who live like leeches on the people's lives,
We must take back our land again,
America!
O, yes,
I say it plain,
America never was America to me,
And yet I swear this oath--
America will be!
Out of the rack and ruin of our gangster death,
The rape and rot of graft, and stealth, and lies,
We, the people, must redeem
The land, the mines, the plants, the rivers.
The mountains and the endless plain--
All, all the stretch of these great green states--
And make America again!
wandy
(3,539 posts)TeamPooka
(24,218 posts)Baitball Blogger
(46,698 posts)which just happens to be the source of the inequality in our criminal and court system.
heaven05
(18,124 posts)951-Riverside
(7,234 posts)Is he for real?
1. They're asking for justice
2. They have a 1st amendment right to do so
3. His goon squad have no problem being judge, jury and execution on the streets which is why people are protesting to begin with.
What a sack of crap but I shouldnt expect much from a "Nixon".
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)although Nixon does appear to be a clueless moron... at least so far. It appears that in addition to voter registration drives and gotv efforts, MO also needs some good Dem cadidates to vote for.
951-Riverside
(7,234 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)jberryhill
(62,444 posts)rwheeler31
(6,242 posts)Missouri has an awful republican legislature, this Lt. Gov. is representative of the rural areas. The state is a victim of severe gerr
ymandering.
randys1
(16,286 posts)HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)VA_Jill
(9,962 posts)someone to put a dirty sweat sock in this asshat's mouth!
burnsei sensei
(1,820 posts)The authorities in Missouri have been corrupted by power.
They should be treated as all corrupt regimes are treated-- they should be overthrown by a vote of no-confidence.
MrModerate
(9,753 posts)"How low can they go?"
And useful input to the corollary, "How stupid are these people?"
Android3.14
(5,402 posts)What an awful thing.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)tritsofme
(17,373 posts)But using the term "Anglo-American" to describe the structure and root of our system of law, is well...correct.
leftstreet
(36,103 posts)Whatever
He makes it sound like a desperate appeal to return to a system of law that's...uh, already in place. If he wasn't such a moron he'd realize the protestors want JUSTICE within the Anglo-American legal framework
albino65
(484 posts)mcar
(42,296 posts)Dude sounds a bit loony.
merrily
(45,251 posts)TheDebbieDee
(11,119 posts)He needs to grow his campaign egg-nest so he says something styoo-pid that will appeal to the teabaggers.
toddwv
(2,830 posts)I thought "Woowwww..." between him, the Police Chief, and Ferguson Mayor Thurston Howell III, you get the vibe that the only thing wrong in Ferguson is that there are too many "colored" people and not enough jail cells.