Why are white people scared of black people's rage at Mike Brown's death?

[loyalsister]

He nailed it in the first line, but there is so much more!

"Because ‘working together’ on Ferguson means nothing unless white privilege gets used for change – and defers to the black experience"
______

"I’m just black to them – and you’re white. You need to come for your own. Maybe start with the still existing New Empire Knights of the Ku Klux Klan, who are currently raising money in support of Darren Wilson, “a cop who shot a n*gger criminal”. But when black people’s anger is demonized, pathologized and criminalized – when it’s never seen as righteous, when we’re being gassed in the streets for it – don’t tell me you’re afraid of making black people angry by speaking up, or that my anger feels isolating to you. Because then I have to wonder if the people whose anger you really fear are white."

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/20/white-people-black-people-michael-brown-death-ferguson

[no_hypocrisy]

1. Fear that whites won't be in charge all over,

and not just Ferguson.

[Kalidurga]

2. Good question

I am going to ramble and see if I hit an answer. When white people are angry it's because they think they are going to lose something. When black people are angry it's because they are shut out of having something like freedom of movement, economic opportunities, or their children becoming strange fruit. They have real and tangible struggles and in too many cases it's life or death. White people can see this struggle, but for whatever reason they watch it from the comfort of knowing they are safe from it for the most part. It's hard to be in a position of assumed superiority you very identity is wrapped up in this position. So, you will fight to keep the people down that challenge your position of superiority. Even if that means shouting at frightened children, cheering on the police when they shoot "thugs", and denying people of color jobs and then calling them lazy. It's easy to direct hate to the powerless. Try challenging the people who are really in power and likely the cause of your hardships now that takes some courage, because the consequences are as real as jail and death. But, talk about people being welfare queens and dangerous "thugs" you get a pass and likely are praised for your views.

[AverageJoe90]

5. I can see where you're coming from.

But, as sad as it is, when some people think of "white privilege", they think that we liberal/progressives want to take their rights & freedoms away so they can be oppressed like blacks or Latinos in this country, etc. But that's not what our mission is about! All we're doing is trying to right social injustice, and build a better world for all. And it's time our rhetoric started reflecting that; no more fancy-schmancy metaphysical Cold War era academics.

[AverageJoe90]

3. Unfortunately.....I'm sorry to say, but this whole "white privilege" thing.....

.....was part of the whole problem in the first place, Rebecca. Don't believe me? Just go around the internet! Look at Tumblr, for instance. Or go dig up people like Aura Bogado, Flavia Dzodan, or that prejudiced(maybe even racist?) hypocrite who runs Gradient Lair. Look at that moronic #SolidarityForWhiteWomen tag. Stuff like this has actually not only made a laughingstock out of the activist left, but it's even ended up giving ammo to the very same people we've been trying to fight(including the Bob Whitaker acolytes.)!

Honestly, I get that you're a good person. I get that you want change. And believe me, so do I and many others. But this "privilege" stuff isn't the way to do it: the evidence is clear. It has already failed us. ALL of us.

We do need to take the African-American experience into complete account, yes, no doubt. But we should not totally defer to any one group, nor vice-versa, even more so. What we need is actual solidarity. We need to work together, and I mean, actually together, not just letting a single group dominate, but with true cooperation. Look at the Civil Rights Movement of the '50s and '60s for an example.

At this point, I dunno what else to say. We can't afford to lose our way, not now.

[JI7]

4. i'm sorry but if people see things like dead unarmed people and are offended by words

they do not care.

[AverageJoe90]

7. I'm sorry, but you are just plain clueless, frankly.

All you need to do is look around. There are so many people that would otherwise be willing to jump on board, but get turned off by the poor rhetoric....yes, some liberals included.

[Quayblue]

9. rhetoric should not be the issue at this point

[AverageJoe90]

10. I wish that were true. Believe me, I do.

And yet, it most certainly *IS*. A lot of middle-of-the-road people are still sitting on the fence, because even though they're not happy about stuff like this, they're hesitant to actually join the fray because of the small number of extremists(but highly vocal ones) spouting shit like "all white people are at fault for racism/all white people are racist because privilege", etc.

I could honestly spend hours trying to write a more detailed explanation, but the point is, a lot of what we've been doing over these past few years hasn't worked.

[Quayblue]

16. why should that matter?

there's plenty of issues white folks stand up against regardless of the opposition's voice. Revolution is not safe or comfortable for anyone.

[AverageJoe90]

19. "why should that matter?" In an ideal world, it wouldn't. But in reality, it does.

there's plenty of issues white folks stand up against regardless of the opposition's voice.

With some, yes, especially the 'Baggers and the other reactionary rightists. But there are many others out there, that, if you can put the message in just the right tone, and use the right words, even if not always perfectly, who will be open to listening to you. MLK knew this, and he won the hearts of many people in this country.

[brush]

34. Ignore those people and get involved

What do you care what the "highly vocal" ones are spouting?

If you are sincere and want to really contribute to ending racism, get off the fence and join the fight — because it is a fight, a fight against not just individual racists but against institutional racism and even against people on the fence who contribute to allowing the status quo of racism to continue by doing nothing because they're turned off by the "highly vocal" ones who don't speak in just the right tones.

Give me a break!

[JI7]

11. i do look around and i see some white people who really really hate black people

and other minorities .

i mean HATE .

[AverageJoe90]

12. I've seen that as well.

But you haven't disproved my point. Not one bit.

[JI7]

13. you haven't proved your point

[AverageJoe90]

14. The evidence speaks for itself, if you'd even bother to look. nt

[JI7]

15. funny you don't say the same to the racist whites

[AverageJoe90]

18. What are you saying, exactly?

[nomorenomore08]

24. Perhaps meaning, why are you lecturing "us" instead of them?

[AverageJoe90]

27. I've been lecturing white supremacists on how wrong they are, since even before.....

I became a bonafide Democrat.

[treestar]

31. Lecturing white conservatives that they are privileged does not work

I think that's the point.

They've already got a whole set of defenses and Rushsplanations to counter that.

It's not working. White liberals get it but it doesn't work on the rest.

[loyalsister]

17. It kind of sounds like

you proved the point the author was making. Fear of alienating friends an family is what drives liberals to reject the notion of white privilege.
But but.. Don't I do enough by silently disagreeing or speaking up occasionally? Doesn't that make me a good liberal taking a stand against racism?
Making racists mad closes the door to progress.... are all excuses that allow racism to fester and prevail.

[AverageJoe90]

20. I don't have any fear of alienating anybody myself, to be honest.

I've already managed to do that anyway, as is, including on here.

And frankly, I'm not talking about the racist right, anyway; forget them, most of them are lost. My concerns, as I have even *openly* stated in other comments, are those in the middle, who COULD be educated.

are all excuses that allow racism to fester and prevail.

So, too, does telling otherwise open-minded people that they possess extra-normal privileges, and implying that they should be ashamed(which ends up happening anyway, in 99% of cases, even if the intention is the complete opposite). Especially those who have had a harder than normal life.....it's called empathy, and frankly, I really wish some on our side didn't have such a problem with not exerting enough of it.

[nomorenomore08]

26. "...that they possess extra-normal privileges." Disingenuous nonsense.

Unless one has an eight-year-old's grasp of linguistic nuance, they should be able to understand what "privilege" means in a sociological context, as opposed to the dictionary definition of the word.

No, what it really is is people who either don't give a damn about racism or are simply too uncomfortable to discuss it, coming up with convenient excuses for dismissing progressive activism. And if you think your personal feelings are more important than murdered human beings, then you're a pretty shitty excuse for a person.

[betsuni]

33. YES!

[gollygee]

21. Racist people are going to be racist

and using different words wouldn't make them less racist. The truth is uncomfortable, apparently for you as well. I mean, I get that you're a good person. I get that you want change. Believe me, so do I and many others. But you are not God. You are not all-knowing. You are not the determiner of what is honest, or true, or real, or what words are the best to use.

Your third paragraph is rude, dismissive of African Americans, and so full of white privilege and entitlement and inflated ego that it's hard to get through it.

I'm glad you don't know what else to say. That's a good start.

[betsuni]

22. "I dunno what else to say"

If only it were true! They say there are no atheists in foxholes during wars. Well, these threads filled with pronouncements and lectures and insults from Our Lord of There Is No White Privilege To Be Honest You Are Clueless have turned me religious. I pray, I plead, I burn incense and sacrifice lamb chops -- I beg the gods of every land and culture in this wide world and beyond -- MAKE IT STOP. Amen.

[betsuni]

38. Changed my mind, witchcraft-type spells might be better.

Plenty of bullfrogs and salamanders in the stream near my apartment. Bats are extremely hard to catch but substituting dead cicadas would probably be okay, now that it's late summer they're all over the place. Spiders -- no problem. I have a broom. Now looking up MAKE IT STOP BEGONE spells on the computer machine. Hope it works.

[betsuni]

40. TBH:

After the "We do need to take the African-American experience into complete account" ["complete"!!!!!] blah blah, "we should not totally defer to any one group, NOR VICE-VERSA. EVEN MORE SO" [ha ha ha ha ha ha ha WUT?] there is only one response:

[handmade34]

6. "white people scared of black people's rage"

because although they do not want to admit it... they know, consciously or not, that rage is righteously directed at them...

good essay, but there are a lot of vile comments to it

[AverageJoe90]

8. "that rage is righteously directed at them..." You don't mean ALL of us, I hope. nt

[Recursion]

23. Why not?

Why would rage at every beneficiary of injustice out of line?

[AverageJoe90]

29. Most white people don't benefit from institutional injustice, Recursion.

If you take an objective look at this country's history, you'll find that institutional prejudice has collectively harmed everyone much more than it's ever helped more than a few willing beneficiaries.

[treestar]

32. I think it would be

At least it is ineffective. And easy to use against the rag-er.

I could be enraged at the Kennedys or other rich people having all that money, I suppose. But it's not going to do anything.

[Recursion]

37. I never said it was effective

I've just never understood my fellow white-people's need to morally shield themselves from that...

[nomorenomore08]

25. If white people (as a whole, not every one individually) see black people as a monolithic negative

stereotype, I don't see how you can expect black people to be much different in turn.

[AverageJoe90]

30. The problem is, neither version of collective prejudice is justified.

BTW, though, to be truthful with you, I honestly do not believe that most PoC are angry at whites as a whole. In fact, I think they recognize that there are white people out there who are indeed on their side, who aren't racist, or even really prejudiced to begin with.

My point is, really, is that nobody should be engaging in that kind of prejudice. White or otherwise.

[nomorenomore08]

35. I agree with you. Both that prejudice is unjustified, and that not all PoC are "angry."

Just saying that none of this stuff surprises me, the ugliness on either "side."

[betsuni]

28. No, just you.

"We've traced the call, it's coming from inside the house ... just get out of that house!" (dramatic music and then screaming)

[HereSince1628]

36. I suppose I'm one of those radical far-left progressive elements

But, I have no fear of black people's rage against racial bias in police brutality or anger about racial bias in law enforcement in general.

In fact, I am totally empathetic of their righteous anger and express my solidarity with them.

If that means saying I defer my privilege to their rights, so be it.

When it comes to racial bias in policing and police brutality it's long past time to be intolerant of this aspect of law enforcement.

[Ikonoklast]

39. I can't be. What has always been done to minorities in this country will soon see no color barrier.

White people are just starting to take notice that on the periphery, how police see Black people is how they are also starting to see them, as the 'enemy'.


The police are agents of the State.

Go against those interests deemed righteous by the State, and you will suffer the consequences.

[polly7]

41. I just hope white people take it seriously and really think and talk about it.

We have the same problems here with our First Nation people in many areas, they're severely discriminated against, and more than anything I wish they were more vocal about it and never let up - or maybe our own news just ignore those stories. I honestly don't know how people who are made to feel second class citizens handle it ... I'd be so frustrated, sad and very, very angry that I don't trust I'd be able to live with it peacefully. The amount of restraint blacks in the U.S. have shown in the last few weeks with these terrible deaths fascinates me - in my opinion it was handled by the majority with a lot of class - I'm positive it wouldn't have been were the shoe on the other foot.