Cornel West on the President

[ellenrr]

“He posed as a progressive and turned out to be counterfeit. We ended up with a Wall Street presidency, a drone presidency, a national security presidency. The torturers go free. The Wall Street executives go free. The war crimes in the Middle East, especially now in Gaza, the war criminals go free.

And yet, you know, he acted as if he was both a progressive and as if he was concerned about the issues of serious injustice and inequality and it turned out that he’s just another neoliberal centrist with a smile and with a nice rhetorical flair. And that’s a very sad moment in the history of the nation because we are—we’re an empire in decline. Our culture is in increasing decay. Our school systems are in deep trouble. Our political system is dysfunctional.

Our leaders are more and more bought off with legalized bribery and normalized corruption in Congress and too much of our civil life. You would think that we needed somebody—a Lincoln-like figure who could revive some democratic spirit and democratic possibility.

http://www.salon.com/2014/08/24/cornel_west_he_posed_as_a_progressive_and_turned_out_to_be_counterfeit_we_ended_up_with_a_wall_street

[conservaphobe]

1. If we ever have a president Cornel West likes, we're fucked. nt

[elleng]

2. Really.

[conservaphobe]

3. Yes, really.

His bitterness over President Obama's success has gotten the best of him.

Kind of feel sorry for him.

[cantbeserious]

5. Bitterness - What Bitterness

eom

[conservaphobe]

6. Touré explained it well:

West, currently a professor at Union Theological Seminary, seems to be speaking from a place of idealism rather than realism, which is his wont as a philosopher, but that does not make him a serious Obama critic. West speaks of presidents needing someone to push them to greatness, but does the inflammatory nature of his attacks make him eligible for that position? Many wonder if there is a tinge of jealousy fueling West’s perspective. A New York Magazine profile of West noted his relationship with Obama changed when West, who had campaigned for Obama during the 2008 election, was unable to secure tickets for the inauguration. The story notes that when West talks about Obama, he “uses the language of a jilted lover.” West told New York, “One of the reasons I was personally upset is that I did not get a phone call, ever, after 65 events. It just struck me that it was not decent.”

I still believe that West can and should be a critical American public intellectual. I wish that he would return from whatever emotional place he’s gone that has led to his critique of Obama being so venomous and thus inconsequential. West is more valuable when his critique is more sober, and America is better when West is a prophetic voice pushing us to be our best. I miss the West I love.

http://ideas.time.com/2012/11/15/what-behind-the-bad-blood-between-cornel-west-and-obama/

[elleng]

8. Good for Touré.

[tularetom]

9. Toure's opinion means as much to me

as Cher, Beyonce, Twiggy, Sting, Fabio, Beck, Bono, and any other pretentious asshole who believes they are so important that they need only one name.

Not defending West necessarily, but who gives a rats ass what Toure thinks.

[conservaphobe]

11. Toure's opinion means more to me than West's does.

He outshines West in both presentation and measure.

Which isn't really hard to do. But still.

[cantbeserious]

17. Self-Limiting Perspective - aka Also Called Cherry Picking

eom

[Marr]

35. I'd bet $10 you'd never heard of him before you read that article.

http://ideas.time.com/contributor/toure/

He's a media guy. Dime a dozen. But you agree with something he wrote, so he's a genius.

[conservaphobe]

163. I watch him on MSNBC all the time.

And I cringe through West's appearances on Maher's show from time to time.

[JustAnotherGen]

93. Michael Eric Dyson's opinion means a great deal to me

Michael Eric Dyson to Cornel West: You ain’t that important

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1187&pid=6485

That's for you. Happy Tuesday!

[woo me with science]

124. I don't need someone else's opinion to tell me what reality is,

when I have seen it with my own eyes and lived it for the past six years.

I've observed first-hand the pivot from lies about hope and change to deliberate, relentless enactment of a corporate agenda that is trashing our Constitution and empowering banks and corporations at the expense of the rest of us.

The record shows aggressive, proactive pursuit of a corporate agenda.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3202395

CUT THE CRAP! Your Month in Review from the most "progressive" administration ever.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/~woo%20me%20with%20science

Torturers are patriots. Spying is American. Let's head into Iraq and fund the bombing of Gaza. Monsanto and Comcast into the administration. Food stamp cut signed into law. Rinse and repeat.

[Vincardog]

177. What Woo said /////\\\\\\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ /\

[truth2power]

206. You absolutely said it, woo. This is the REALITY:

Torturers are patriots. Spying is American. Let's head into Iraq and fund the bombing of Gaza. Monsanto and Comcast into the administration. Food stamp cut signed into law. Rinse and repeat.

They can't make it go away by just putting their fingers in their ears and going, "Na na na na na".

[rhett o rick]

215. Well said Woo. nm

[Fantastic Anarchist]

161. I believe West to be way more accomplished than Toure ...

... and way more honest.

[grasswire]

27. damn straight

It means about as much to me as Luke Russert or Chuck Todd's, honestly. Just another NBC talking head.

[Cha]

105. Wow.. unreal.. you would discount someone because they only have one name..

now that's funny. You forgot Madonna. ROFL

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

223. To put Toure in the same sentence as Beyonce and those others is quite an insult to him.

To be sure, Toure is every bit as much as an intellectual. He and I went to college together, and he was one of the most brilliant scholars of our our class of students, outperforming many of his peers. He has always been very active in politics and the social conscious movement.

You need to learn more about Toure rather than badgering him because he critiqued West's feigned outrage directed at the president.

Please find out who Toure is because you talk out the side of your neck.

Thanks.

[Marrah_G]

39. who the heck is Toure?

[Major Hogwash]

64. Cornel West thought that by tying his wagon to Obama's star, it would elevate him . . . .

. . . to a higher status in the universe.
Unfortunately, many star-struck hangers-on have this same experience.
They call them "groupies".
And when they don't get what they want, like winding up getting married to the lead guitar player in the band, they lash out with the most vitriolic crap you've ever heard in your life.

However, it isn't idealism that West is engaging in, anymore.
It's fantasy-land bullshit!!
It's almost as if West thinks that right after Obama was first elected, that he could pull a peppermint stick out of the pocket of his suit jacket and wave it, and 350 years of racism would suddenly magically end . . just like that!

[Capt. Obvious]

103. LOL!!!!

[brush]

121. You nailed it, Major Hogwash

"that he could pull a peppermint stick out of the pocket of his suit jacket and wave it, and 350 years of racism would suddenly magically end . . just like that! "

No truer words were ever said — especially with all the repug and blue dog obstructionism.

Many of us on the left need to get realism grip on the political reality in this country.

Aircraft carriers on a 350 year-old course don't turn so easy.

[WinkyDink]

127. Perhaps Dr. West felt he was owed a ticket, if not a full Inaugural Presentation as had Jay-Z and

Beyonce'?

[elleng]

7. You're too kind,

I don't feel sorry for him.

[1StrongBlackMan]

21. I have told of my encounter with Dr. West on DU before; but ...

I think it's worth doing so, again.

I was at a "Meet and Greet" reception/Book Signing after one of Dr. West's talks.

I have had great respect for Dr. West, back in the 1980-1990s when he actually doing research and publishing ... I'm not big on folks talking about what others should be doing.

Well, Dr. West was holding court, regaling folks with how important the study of Black folks in America is. Well, I asked him:

"Dr. West. When someone seeks the definitive world on Mormons, whether the religion or the people, they can find it at Brigham Young, a Mormon institution; when someone seeks the definitive world on Catholics, whether the religion or the people, they can find it at Notre Dame, a Catholic institution; when someone seeks the definitive world on Jewish people or the religion, they can find it at the Yesheva (?), a Jewish institution ... so why is it when someone seeks the definitive world on Black folks, they have to go to Princeton, or Harvard, rather than Prairie View or Howard?"

Let me just say, Dr. West can have very expressive eyes.

[Number23]

36. Oh my word, how I would have PAID to see the expression in that hack's eyes

so why is it when someone seeks the definitive world on Black folks, they have to go to Princeton, or Harvard, rather than Prairie View or Howard?"

About 12 years ago, there was NOTHING Corny couldn't say or do that I didn't think was gospel. We've all talked about how disgusted we've become by the man over years in the AA forum so you know I've said this plenty of times before. I even forgave him for that tired and baffling cameo in The Matrix but I think that was the beginning of the end.

Now, I've got no use for the man and neither does anyone whose opinion I care about. And all I have to do is look at the folks on DU who still support him and I get all the confirmation I need that we've all made the right decision to write him off completely. He may one day redeem himself in my eyes but I'm not holding my breath.

[JustAnotherGen]

78. He won't redeem himself

He won't. He's still holding onto old narratives that made him successful.

Funny - a lot of white Americans hold their nose when Sharpton walks by. To me - he's genuine. Because he speaks to everyone and understands nuance. And he never gets angry for himself - he gets angry for other people.

[Quayblue]

37. ha

[sheshe2]

46. I stopped listening to NPR...

When Cornell and Tavis started in on Obama.

I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall when you said that to Dr West. The expression would have been priceless.

You know something, 1SBM? I have a bucket list, I would love to shake hands with PBO and hug Michelle, okay I would love a hug from PBO too. You know what? You are also on my list. Yes, I know it will probably never happen, however your name is there.

[1StrongBlackMan]

102. Hand shake or Hug? eom

[sheshe2]

183. Hug :)

if it's okay with Mrs 1StrongBlackMan.

[1StrongBlackMan]

185. I'm sure it would be okay ...

as long as it's one of these hugs ...

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSYA9oYkPxK9FAtHjT67uFmJvBScD5dMpgt86tSy0PylANS6QUklg

Or, these ...

[sheshe2]

186. LOL~

Love the pic.

[bravenak]

48. Oh boy!!

I bet he had expressive eyes on that!!

[JustAnotherGen]

77. I missed that - but it's classic!

I would give anything for a time machine and a cell phone to go back and record that! You know my thoughts on him.

And I'm of the same mindset - do - don't talk.

[1StrongBlackMan]

104. I think Dr. West learned ...

that talking pays much better ... with a lot less work ... than doing, or even writing.

[brush]

125. And also that Princeton and Harvard . . .

pay a lot better than Howard or Prairie View.

[1StrongBlackMan]

138. I don't know about that ...

Most Universities pay about the same for professorships ... the differences are found in what the professor brings with them, in terms of research grants.

But there are "job responsibility" differences ... for example, HBCUs tend to have higher classroom teaching responsibilities across the board, and regardless of the professor's external expert status. At HBCUs, professors are required to actually teach coursework, along with publishing; whereas, at "prominent" Universities, it is not unusual for high status professors to have no classroom teaching load.

[elleng]

165. Thanks for this, Man.

[conservaphobe]

15. If liking Cornel West is required to be a Democrat,

I'll hand over my party membership card right now and let you cut it up.

[AverageJoe90]

191. I agree. Same thing for believing in white privilege or supporting Eddie Snowden, too, IMHO.

I mean, come on now. I thought we were supposed to be the all-inclusive party?

[3rdwaydem]

18. I usually enjoy listening to Professor West but, I have to agree with your point here.

[gopiscrap]

135. Welcome to DU

[3rdwaydem]

166. Thank you

[gopiscrap]

171. You're welcome!!!

[cantbeserious]

4. West Nails Obama IMHO

eom

[orpupilofnature57]

84. + 1000 !!!

[still_one]

87. so you have no problem that West always makes references to the President's color when he critisizes

him?

[LWolf]

109. criticizes nt

[brush]

126. A little history on West and Smiley v Obama

Both Cornell West and his sidekick Tavis Smiley seem to have staked out a vendetta against the President over a so-called personal affront.

West seems upset over not getting an invite to the 2013 Inauguration even though he'd been bashing Obama for much of his first term. Imagine that!

Smiley, a well-entrenched Clintonista, got his knickers in a bunch in '08 because the busily campaigning candidate Obama couldn't make one of his televised "State of Black America" panel discussions (he offered to send Michelle, no slouch herself, but that wasn't good enough for Smiley). Smiley soon lost his popularity in black America when the word got out of his nose being out of joint over such silliness. I personally think Smiley also was upset when Obama got the nomination over Hillary because he saw his imagined ambassadorship, cabinet post or other high position in the Hillary administration go up in smoke.

There's a method to both West's and Smiley's madness — they've been nudged out of their "leading black voice in America" positions by someone who is not just the leading black voice but the leader of America, who just happens to be black.

[cantbeserious]

134. Redirection Through Character Assassination

eom

[brush]

137. You mean what West and Smiley are doing? nt

[cantbeserious]

140. No - The Logical Fallacy Used By You In Redirecting Away From The OP

eom

[brush]

142. Get serious

Have you not read any of the other posts?

Most people know of the vendetta that West and Smiley have carried on against Obama but were silent under W Bush.

On a post like the OP the facts going to come out — call it redirection if you like.

[cantbeserious]

144. Back At You - Logical Fallacies Are To Be Avoided In Debates

eom

[brush]

146. Maybe so, but facts about the issue — no. nt

[cantbeserious]

148. All Redirection - While Avoiding The OP Topic - Classic Logical Fallacy Debate Tactics

eom

[brush]

149. West vendetta against Obama is central to the OP

Like I said before, open your eyes and get off your illogical fallacy about misdirection.

[cantbeserious]

150. Ever More Redirection - Always Avoiding The OP

eom

[brush]

151. All your posts are about alleged misdirection and avoidance

Post something of significance so people know where you stand on this.

Stop with the little potshot nt comments and come with what your opinions are.

I certainly expressed mine. West is all in against Obama but never said a peep against Bush. That's called being direct, not misdirection.

Try it yourself.

[cantbeserious]

155. Yet More Misdirection

eom

[brush]

159. Ok. I get it — a one-trick pony. nt

[cantbeserious]

160. Ad Hominem Attack - Another Logical Fallacy

eom

[BainsBane]

193. LOL

I've never seen so many posts in succession that say absolutely nothing.

[cantbeserious]

200. Try Reading Them Again

eom

[JustAnotherGen]

152. I'm sorry but brush is true

There is a 'personal history' there where West was completely a drama llama over the inauguration. He acted like President Obama was supposed to do anything and everything he told him to in office - and basically wanted him to ignore every issue other than black issues.

He's also highly featured at a web site (will not link to here) that is extremely racists towards all non blacks. . . but extra special hate for white folks.

I think it's funny - how everyone jumps all over and gets all up in arms over the words 'white privilege' - but when confronted by someone who is applauded by black people who hate white people- it's okay to hold him up.


What's next - David Duke gets applauded for saying the same things?

Not trying to give you a hard time - but he's really alienated a lot of us younger black folks who have grown up criss crossing color lines with his rhetoric and showmanship.

[cantbeserious]

157. Brush Used A Logical Fallacy To Redirect The OP Topic Off-Topic

eom

[BainsBane]

194. Why don't you tell us what the point of the OP is?

Do you know? You haven't advanced a single point of substance here. Is there anything to say other than Obama bad. People who no like Obama good. People who defend Obama bad.

[cantbeserious]

199. Because You Can Read For Yourself

eom

[brush]

164. Thanks for the support, JustAnotherGen

Looks like Cantbeserious can't be serious about anything but sniping nt posts of no content.

[JustAnotherGen]

173. Yeah - see the response to me above

Totally entrenched in the West and West memes about President Obama being a fraud - without pointing the same critical finger at Corny as he does the Allen version.

Totally denying who in the black community carries water for West.

Well - wait until West turns against those who support him - which he will - when he ONLY has to cater to extremists in the black community. He's going to turn against that poster.

Just watch . . .

[cantbeserious]

179. More Ad Hominem Attack - Yet Again A Logical Debating Fallacy

eom

[BainsBane]

195. Do you have a computer program

That generates the same post thirty times in a row regardless of content? It sure reads like that.

[cantbeserious]

198. When One Is Non-Reponsive To The The OP - One Gets The Same Reply

eom

[AverageJoe90]

190. " it's okay to hold him up." Well, not in my eyes.

how everyone jumps all over and gets all up in arms over the words 'white privilege' -

And frankly, we should, at least when it's used to advance an unscrupulous agenda, which, unfortunately, isn't all that uncommon these days(it's even happened here on DU, too.).

He's also highly featured at a web site (will not link to here) that is extremely racists towards all non blacks. . . but extra special hate for white folks.

You know, that kinda reminds me of Gradient Lair.....only her hate is mainly turned towards feminists who don't think like her(but she does have extra hate for white women, though), and not towards non-black PoC. The main thing is, though, unlike Trudy, Dr. West isn't really malicious, just a little offbeat(okay, more than a little).

[BainsBane]

192. You're pissed off that someone is engaging in character assassination

that challenges the people assassinating Obama's character. Yeah, that's real logical.

[cantbeserious]

201. I Am Not Pissed At Anyone - The Poster That Did Not Read The OP Is Pissed

eom

[elleng]

167. As you yourself say, you 'cantbeserious.'

[cantbeserious]

168. Ad Hominem Attack - A Logical Fallacy

eom

[woo me with science]

170. All over the page.

Divert and smear. Divert and smear.

[cantbeserious]

174. Agreed - Blatantly Obvious

eom

[BklnDem75]

227. Did you just agree with your own post?

eom

[Ikonoklast]

228. Hack coughs up bitter hairball of envy.

n/t

[cantbeserious]

229. Envy Of Whom?

eom

[Ikonoklast]

230. Those whom he feels have slighted him, done him a personal injury by not being properly obsequious.

West is his own worst enemy, an Ivory Tower dweller who hates those who dwell in Ivory Towers.

[cantbeserious]

231. Seems That Much Projection Is Speculated Without Corroboration

eom

[Ikonoklast]

232. I've read what he's written, listened to the words from his own mouth.

He didn't get an invite.

He feels that without the Great Dr. West, President Barack Obama would never had happened.


Such conceit is laughable.

[JaneyVee]

10. West doesn't want a president, he wants a king.

[brentspeak]

13. After reading the article

I couldn't find a single sentence where West states or suggests he would like to be ruled by a monarch rather than governed by a president.

[Octafish]

14. That's gonna leave a mark.

He had a mandate and the backing of every Democrat and more than a few repukes.

[woo me with science]

24. What a tragic waste

of unity and resolve. What a con job.

[sheshe2]

43. Wow! Just Wow!

Your hatred of this President is unbelievable on a Democratic board.

I sure as hell wish I used the ignore tab on DU.

[Octafish]

141. The righteous indignation doesn't seem fitting.

woo me with science is entitled to an opinion without being labeled.

Regarding this thread: What part of what Cornel West wrote that is not true?

My question to you: Why are no traitors, war criminals, or banksters in jail?

[Number23]

180. You're not saying anything that hasn't been noted over and over and over again

by the vast majority of this board.

That one's not worth even a second of your time except perhaps to just be glad that they are not in a position of ANY authority.

[Egnever]

213. I don't know what you are talking about.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5443648

[woo me with science]

218. Oh my word!

"by the vast majority of this board"! The VAST MAJORITY!

ROFL! And here I thought I was just another poster on the board...

Thank you Number23...and I mean this *completely* sincerely...Thank you for the most inadvertently hilarious gratuitous heckling post EVER.

[Number23]

233. Oh, you most definitely ARE just another member

Nothing special about you but your incessant "heckling" of Democrats. And yes, if you think that hasn't been noticed by every single person here it just shows that you are blind to much more than just reality, political and otherwise.

And seeing your use of the emoticon that you deride and malign at every opportunity when it's used by others just makes your really obviously fake "hilarity" that much delicious. Yum.

[Tommymac]

220. +1 woo me

[hughee99]

16. He just hates that the president is black. n/t

[ellenrr]

79. Cornell West hates that the president is black?

[JustAnotherGen]

112. No - that he doesn't kiss

His ass.

Which is a problem he has with what is referenced to as the 'New Blacks' among black folks. I've been meaning to do a post about it in the A.A. Group - as it touches on Colorism which is not a suitable discussion for G.D. at all.

I'm of the mindset - if there is a 'New Black' - count me in.

Stop with the 'brother', the preaching, the hustling - and get with reaching a hand out to pull people up with you. He has a Gen X and Millennial Problem - we don't like to be spoken at or down to. He's still doing that. Talk is cheap - hiring someone to 'back fill' you is not.

I'll take the community organizer over the community rabble rouser any day. See 1strongblackman's experience with him on this thread . . .

If you get a deer in the headlights look at a question that Corey Booker or Melissa Harris Perry would have given a slam dunk to - then you've got a problem with relevance to those in the black community that have the financial ability, time, connections, and bandwidth to support change at the grass root level.

He's so high up in his ivory tower - he doesn't even realize that people side eye him and give him a look like - "Uh uh! He's on Bill Maher again. Trying to sell something."

You probably didn't expect this push back - but if you were to post a poll in the AA (African American) Group asking about favorable vs unfavorable opinions of West . . . you would probably be shocked. And - it's probably more towards how he relates to the New Black Intellectuals (Perry, Coates) than anything else. It's just an old tired diatribe from this guy.

We kind of showed up on your thread - because he creates such a viscerable reaction amongst the 50 and younger AA Crowd. And to some degree - those pushing well into the Boomer generation.

[ellenrr]

119. I wouldn't be surprised at any reactions. Black people are no more monolithic than

anyone else. I don't expect that all Black people love Cornell West.
I like some of what he says and disagree with other things he says.

also bec I post an article doesn't mean that I agree with every word. It may be that I agree/disagree in equal parts, but that I find it interesting, and worthy of discussion. Or sometimes it maybe a post expressing a point of view I haven't seen expressed. Or it may be that I hope the post will generate critical thoughtful conversation.

[JustAnotherGen]

123. I got ya!

Hope I helped you to understand where the 'brouhaha' was coming from.

I'm obviously one that has zero patience for the 'old school' ways - which to me he represents. Reverend Al has been around a long time too - but he 'gets' the 'New black' and definitely the Gen X'ers. He partners with us in thought - whereas West tends to try and put us in our place - as he sees it.

I bet after the Obama Presidency - he focuses entirely on issues of class and moves away from race completely.

[hughee99]

147. Isn't that the standard defense of the president?

It's handy because people don't have to spend a whole lot of time thinking about any actual issues that were mentioned.

[aikoaiko]

19. Cornell, don't hate the player, hate the game.

[tularetom]

20. "The torturers go free. The Wall Street executives go free. The war crimes in the Middle East,

especially now in Gaza, the war criminals go free."

What part of this statement is untrue? Name one torturer, Wall Street executive, or Middle East was criminal that has been imprisoned by this administration.

Mr. West can be sort of a gasbag, and he has an ongoing love affair with the sound of his own voice but he's pretty much on the mark here.

[AtomicKitten]

25. finding it difficult

to disagree with you

[sendero]

26. Nothing he said..

.... is untrue, but like a hoard of Republican pundits, the masses here will rush to defend the president, at all costs.

[ellenrr]

83. I think if it were a matter of defending the president, that's one thing,

People could try to find something to refute facts...

but what I see here is:
a) delusion -
"we wanted to believe this, and we refuse to countenance any facts which refute our belief."
b) the savior complex,
"I'm certainly not going to get involved in improving the world, so I'll hold up as a savior someone who I can somehow inexplicably portray as a savior.
Otherwise I might have to get involved."

Naturally, the idea that the man is a flawed human being, not a savior - brings out panic fear and craziness.

[ProfessorGAC]

94. Huh?

Your post was gibberish. And, if i actually interpreted any of it from my gibberish to english dictionary, it's kind of pompous as well, since it presumes a superiority of opinion that doesn't exist for anyone.

[ellenrr]

115. If you could be specific about what in the post you don't understand,

I could break it down for you.
Is it the vocabulary? You do know what delusion means, what savior means?

Deluded means a person believes what is not true. So for a person who thinks drone attacks on civilians (to take one example) are a good thing, then it is not delusional to find Obama a president in line with their beliefs and ideology.
But for a person who does NOT favor drone attacks on civilians (my assumption is that this is true for most on DU, I could be wrong), then to support a chief executive who carries this out, and say that that person is a progressive is delusional thinking.

Really, this is not rocket science here.

Likewise the savior complex is that once people elect a leader, he or she is going to save them. This is a thot I disagree with. That is not pompous, nor superiority, that is my opinion.Other people have different opinions- they think that having elected a Black person, in whose background they can find some strands of progressive thinking, is all they have to do, now they sit back and wait for him to save them.

What part do you not understand?

btw, opinions are not superior or inferior- they just are.

[Chathamization]

30. This part: "He posed as a progressive and turned out to be counterfeit."

Many of us pointed out that Obama wasn't a progressive champion (for instance, supporting Lieberman against Lamont in the primary). Like the "no one could have known" statements about the Iraq War, the lack of self reflection about progressive excitement for Obama makes me a bit uncomfortable.

[deathrind]

59. None of it is untrue...

Obama has been a disappointment on many levels. Letting Wall Street go free was his second biggest mistake. The first was "looking forward"...

[ellenrr]

80. now tularetom...don't confuse people with facts. nt

[NCTraveler]

116. Charles Graner. There are others but you just asked for one. nt.

[tularetom]

158. Literally, you are correct, many people at the bottom of the food chain went to jail

However, I think we both understand that West was referring to those who devised, implemented and ordered the torture, the Cheneys, Rumsfelds, Rices, Wolfowitzes, and Yoos of the world.

[NCTraveler]

162. Numerous tortures went to jail. Numerous people on Wall Street went to jail.

Though I do get your point and understand where you are coming from. I just don't think the thought process works in todays or yesterdays reality. It does work as a great argument for how we do things at the executive level in this country. I also don't think the argument is rubbish in any way. Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Wolfowitz, and Yoo are not going to be charged in the US or sent to jail in any way under any administration.

[bigtree]

22. I've tried to be polite in this DU community

. . .but he so much echoes my own thoughts . . . and I love Cornel West like a brother. I don't think I recognize the president anymore - don't know if I ever really knew him as well as I did his rhetoric. Brother West speaks for me.

[G_j]

32. interesting way to put it

I certainly feel like I know Cornel West a lot better through his contributions through the years. I've always respected him. He has to say, what he feels he has to say.

[woo me with science]

23. Professor West speaks the truth.

K&R

[sheshe2]

53. ...

[woo me with science]

54. You must stop following me around, sheshe.

I'm flattered, but...People will say we're in love.

[sheshe2]

58. Nope~

No love here. Save your flattery, it's so ... cute. I must admit I am shocked, I have never seen you make a joke. You are always focused on your Obama sucks posts and blue links.

Wow, is this a side of your that I have never seen? Woo you made a joke. Congratulations, you are human.

[woo me with science]

117. Yes, some of us are actually human.

I guess that can come as a real shock to those accustomed to dealing in personas:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5237529

The other aspect of posting from your real human self is that it tends to keep your conscience and political moral compass functioning. Most good human beings I know would never accept occupation that required them to deliberately pollute political discussion boards with harassment and propaganda on behalf of a corporate agenda that is dismantling the very foundations of our democratic system and driving millions of actual human beings into poverty and despair.

[tblue37]

205. You are not supposed to call other DUers trolls or sock puppets without proof. nt

[MohRokTah]

28. Is he STILL pissed off about not getting special treatment at the inauguration?

Wow.

Just wow.

[stevenleser]

38. Yep. Ego very easily bruised that one. nt

[JustAnotherGen]

81. Exactly

I seem to recall a lot of white Americans voting for President Obama. He wasn't elected to hold West's water bucket.

And where is West's call to GOTV? The voter registration drive? The PSA?

His primary audience is black Americans - yet his message is lost on so many of our ears because it comes across as whining - not action.

[ellenrr]

88. Right, I'm sure this public intellectual bases everything he says on what happened at the

inauguration. This post is a great example of the lengths to which people will go to maintain their illusion.

[MohRokTah]

100. He started going off on Obama the day after the inauguration.

So yeah, he does,

[Go Vols]

169. Yep

Dr.West wasn't real fond of Barack Obama before he was elected.

From '07: Princeton professor not pleased about Obama's snub of Covenant With Black America conference

[apples and oranges]

29. Yep. It's election time

You can always tell when we're within a couple months of an election. The 1% will protect their money by any means necessary, even if it means pretending to be one of the 99%.

[JEB]

31. Cornel West speaks the truth.

I doubt the jealousy motive for his speaking the truth. Attacking the messenger is unseemly and an act desperation. Some seem to be fine with torturers going, with Wall Street executives going free, with ongoing war crimes in the Middle East.

[Peregrine Took]

176. + 1,000,000,000.00 n/t

[bigwillq]

33. Spot on. (nt)

[Marr]

34. He's spot on. /nt

[Cha]

40. "Where The Hell Were These Blackademics Before 2008?" Or 2009?

Barack Obama in 1992 as director of Project Vote; which achieved its goal of registering 150,000 African American Voters

They damn sure didn’t help the black farmers get their money, they damn sure didn’t get black people health insurance, and they damn sure didn’t help our black gay brothers and sisters from getting kicked out of the military.

So where the hell were they?

I’ll tell you where they were, they were at each other’s schools sitting on some fucking panel theorizing about how to end racism or make it better for African Americans.

But do you know where President Obama was?

He was out in the streets registering people to vote, he was condemning an unjust war before it became fashionable to do so.

We got pictures of Barack Obama fresh out of college walking in poor black neighborhoods registering people to vote.

We got pictures of a young Barack Obama helping black folk.

We got pictures of a young Barack Obama sitting in a village in Kenya breaking bread with his grandmother.

And these same motherfuckers want to question his blackness

****

Illinois State Senator Barack Obama at a community meeting in his district with his state representative (second from right) House Majority Leader Barbara Flynn Currie


Barack Obama in his first year at Harvard Law School after working at Developing Communities Project as a community organizer from 1985 – 1988 where he set up a tenants rights organization, job training program, and college preparatory program. He enrolled at Harvard Law School in the fall of 1988 so as to better help his community


This photo released by Obama for America shows Barack Obama teaching at the University of Chicago Law School. After Harvard Law School, Obama returned to Chicago, joined a small civil rights firm, ran a voter registration drive, and lectured on constitutional law at the University of Chicago Law School


Barack Obama with his grandmother Sarah Hussein Obama in her home in the village of Nyagoma-Kogelo, western Kenya, 1987




After his graduation from Harvard Law School, working on a voter registration drive in Chicago

The rest of the story..
The Obama Diary http://theobamadiary.com/2014/08/23/where-the-hell-were-these-blackademics-before-2008-2/

[sheshe2]

44. I stopped listening to NPR a long time ago.

I use to love what they said...then Cornell and Tavis started their song and dance on how this President was a sell out.

Cornel West and the Black War Over Obama

snip

Never mind the slings and arrows of Tea Partiers. The most politically problematic criticism of Obama these days is coming from his base. And there’s no question that there is a deep reservoir of frustration, confusion, and even rage among many in the African-American community for West to tap into. With unemployment hovering near 17 percent for African-Americans (the national average rate is 9 percent) and 11 percent of black homeowners facing imminent foreclosure, African-Americans have ample reason for anxiety about the coming budget cuts that Obama reluctantly signed into law this month. The Congressional Black Caucus chairman called the recent debt deal “a sugar-coated satan sandwich” that will do little to help communities already struggling.

West and his longtime friend, radio host Tavis Smiley, have taken their criticism of Obama to the streets, launching a two-week, 15-city “poverty tour,” aimed at forcing the powers that be to once again focus on the “least among us” and getting the president to “wake up.” Their efforts are increasingly stoking fears among some African-American leaders that West and Smiley could discourage black voters from turning out when the nation’s first African-American president stands for reelection in 2012.

snip

Lately, Obama’s supporters in the black community are fighting back. As West and Smiley pulled up aboard their “Call to Conscience” bus in Detroit in early August, a crowd of hecklers awaited them outside the Coleman A. Young Municipal Center. “We will not stand silent as Smiley and West criticize the man who brought us health-care reform, one of the greatest accomplishments for the poor in this country’s history,” says a spokesperson for Detroiters for Better Government.

The pushback is not just coming from community organizers. “The poor did horribly under every president before Obama, and yet there wasn’t this level of outcry toward them by these men,” says Michael Eric Dyson, professor of sociology at Georgetown. “That makes folks skeptical about the intent.”

So much more here: http://www.newsweek.com/cornel-west-and-black-war-over-obama-67285

Cornell and Tavis make me sick Cha!

Great post Cha! Yes, where were they?

[Cha]

45. Thank you for reading the research done by Don on what the President was doing

Last edited Tue Aug 26, 2014, 01:37 AM - Edit history (1)

for Black People while the Blackademics were silent on bush but now come out Whining about this Man in the Arena..

"I’ll tell you where they were, they were at each other’s schools sitting on some fucking panel theorizing about how to end racism or make it better for African Americans."



Thank for the link, she.. it highlights how the whiners conveniently disregard what President Obama has accomplished so they can get their damn whine on.

"Lately, Obama’s supporters in the black community are fighting back. As West and Smiley pulled up aboard their “Call to Conscience” bus in Detroit in early August, a crowd of hecklers awaited them outside the Coleman A. Young Municipal Center. “We will not stand silent as Smiley and West criticize the man who brought us health-care reform, one of the greatest accomplishments for the poor in this country’s history,” says a spokesperson for Detroiters for Better Government.

The pushback is not just coming from community organizers. “The poor did horribly under every president before Obama, and yet there wasn’t this level of outcry toward them by these men,” says Michael Eric Dyson, professor of sociology at Georgetown. “That makes folks skeptical about the intent.”

Folks on the ground are Not fooled by Cornel West, Tavis, and their traveling circus of whine and Cheeze.

[sheshe2]

51. and...

" if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who have never known victory nor defeat."

Bravo! Damn it Bravo! So well said.

Thanks Cha! Great quote.

[Cha]

56. Thank you, she~ "It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man

stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done them better."

Yes, Teddy Roosevelt evidently had experience with this.. and his quote is as relevant today as it was back in his day.

There are issues to disagree with President Obama about.. but, don't disrespect by making up shit to fit their agenda as they go along.

[sheshe2]

61. Bingo! eom

[JustAnotherGen]

86. Some of us were right here

At DU. Six years into this Admin and it is clearly apparent that the issue of blackness in this country is greater than one man. I'm still waiting for Smiley and Corny to say something about that.

Maybe when they have a real leftist like Paul in office they will address it? I don't know? Seems to be there's more money for them to make with the House looking like it does today - and the three branches looking like they did in 2004.

[Cha]

95. Yes, you were, Gen.. the President intiated My Brothers Keeper to help start a whole new generation

of Black and Hispanic Academics.. While Smiley and West are just whining about him.

Mr. Obama’s promising My Brother’s Keeper initiative

snip//

THESE ARE the depressing facts about boys and young men of color: They are more likely to drop out of school, more likely to be in prison, more likely to be unemployed and more likely to die at an earlier age. That minority men are at disproportionate risk throughout their lives has largely been seen as unavoidable. The beauty of President Obama’s public-private initiative to create better futures for them is its refusal to accept these outcomes as inevitable.

My Brother’s Keeper, a five-year, $200 million effort focused on improving opportunities for black and Hispanic youth, was launched in February. It got a boost this week with the announcement of new commitments from the private sector. Equally important is the decision by 60 of the nation’s largest school districts to join the effort by implementing evidence-based strategies to improve outcomes.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/president-obamas-promising-my-brothers-keeper-initiative/2014/07/25/d2d62378-11cd-11e4-98ee-daea85133bc9_story.html


President Barack Obama signing an executive memorandum for the My Brother’s Keeper Initiative

http://theobamadiary.com/tag/my-brothers-keeper/

21Jul14

The President Participates In A My Brother’s Keeper Town Hall

[JustAnotherGen]

110. Yep!

And I posted about that when it happened too!

[Cha]

111. I did too, Gen~ A brilliant Initiative from the President to pass down through time for

our Black and Hispanic youth(brothers) and academics to be.

[JustAnotherGen]

113. I'm trying to explain to the OP - I feel bad for her

What the pushback is coming from.

It's not hero worship of Obama.


He was a punk ass to Melissa Harris Perry too - and that punk assery was for me? The final straw.

He wants to play the 'new black game' - then bring it.

I'm with my peer - he can go play in a sandbox with John McCain.

[Cha]

120. That's their ol standby.. "hero worship of Obama" when they can't

understand why the President is supported.. and in this case against the jealous weasely relentless attacks from Cornel West. It must be hero worship.. no one could possibly support the President for all he has done for our Country.. because they don't. And, it's all about them, right?

[questionseverything]

145. when civil rights are violated by goverments

minorities usually bare the worst of the treatment

so why doesn't the widespread spying on American citizens bother you?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025441301

this is just one of the many things cornell speaks out against

cornell is speaking out for mike brown ,for you and me

[bigtree]

47. that's a curious standard, considering we needed to vote to make him president

. . . he didn't elect himself.

Where was Dr. King? Henry Louis Gates? Michael Eric Dyson? Julianne Malveaux? Imani Perry?

Is their opinion less than the president's? How did he achieve the office? Through his own brilliance, or through our votes? Does that make him omnipotent, inviolable?

Cornel Ronald West is an American philosopher, academic, activist, author, public intellectual, and prominent member of the Democratic Socialists of America. The son of a Baptist minister, West received his undergraduate education at Harvard University, graduating with a bachelor's degree in 1973, and received a Ph.D at Princeton University in 1980, becoming the first African American to graduate from Princeton with a Ph.D in philosophy. He was formerly The Class of 1943 Professor of African American Studies at Princeton before leaving the school in 2011 to become Professor of Philosophy and Christian Practice at the Union Theological Seminary in New York City. He previously taught at Harvard before leaving the school after a highly publicized dispute with then-president Lawrence Summers, and has also spent time teaching at the University of Paris.

The bulk of West's work focuses on the role of race, gender, and class in American society and the means by which people act and react to their "radical conditionedness." West draws intellectual contributions from multiple traditions, including Christianity, the black church, Marxism, neopragmatism, and transcendentalism. Among his most influential books are Race Matters (1994) and Democracy Matters (2004).

As a young man, West marched in civil rights demonstrations and organized protests demanding black studies courses at his high school, where he was class president. He later wrote that, in his youth, he admired "the sincere black militancy of Malcolm X, the defiant rage of the Black Panther Party [...] and the livid black theology of James Cone."

In 1970, after graduating from high school, he enrolled at Harvard College and took classes from philosophers Robert Nozick and Stanley Cavell. In 1973, he graduated magna cum laude in Near Eastern Languages and Civilization. West credited Harvard with exposing him to a broader range of ideas, influenced by his professors as well as the Black Panther Party. West says his Christianity prevented him from joining the BPP, instead choosing to work in local breakfast, prison, and church programs.

In 1980, West earned a Ph.D. from Princeton, where he was influenced by Richard Rorty's neopragmatism. The title of his dissertation was Ethics, historicism and the Marxist tradition, which was later revised and published under the title The Ethical Dimensions of Marxist Thought.

In his mid-20s, he returned to Harvard as a W. E. B. Du Bois Fellow before becoming an Assistant Professor at Union Theological Seminary in the City of New York. In 1984, he went to Yale Divinity School in what eventually became a joint appointment in American Studies. While at Yale, he participated in campus protests for a clerical labor union and divestment from apartheid South Africa. One of the protests resulted in his being arrested and jailed. As punishment, the University administration canceled his leave for the spring term in 1987, leading him to commute from Yale in New Haven, Connecticut, where he was teaching two classes, across the Atlantic Ocean to the University of Paris.

He then returned to Union for one year before going to Princeton to become a Professor of Religion and Director of the Program in African-American Studies from 1988 to 1994. After Princeton, he accepted an appointment as Professor of African-American Studies at Harvard University, with a joint appointment at the Harvard Divinity School. West taught one of the University's most popular courses, an introductory class on African-American Studies. In 1998, he was appointed the first Alphonse Fletcher University Professor. West utilized this new position to teach in not only African-American studies, but also Divinity, Religion, and Philosophy.[19] West left Harvard after a widely publicized dispute with then-President Lawrence Summers in 2002. That year, West returned to Princeton, where he helped created “one of the world’s leading centers for African-American studies” according to Shirley Tilghman, Princeton's president in 2011. In 2012, West left Princeton and returned to the seminary where he began his teaching career, Union Theological Seminary. His departure from Princeton, unlike his departure from Harvard, was on good terms and he remains an emeritus professor at Princeton.

The recipient of more than 20 honorary degrees and an American Book Award, he has written or contributed to over twenty published books. West is a long-time member of the Democratic Socialists of America, for which he now serves as Honorary Chair. He is also a co-founder of the Network of Spiritual Progressives. West is on the Advisory Board of the International Bridges to Justice.

In 2008, he received a special recognition from the World Cultural Council. West is also a member of Alpha Phi Alpha fraternity and its World Policy Council, a think tank whose purpose is to expand Alpha Phi Alpha's involvement in politics and social and current policy to encompass international concerns.


I had the pleasure and privilege of walking in a D.C. anti-war march where I ended up beside this man - he was walking alone, just months after treatment for his prostate cancer . . . what was your point again?

[villager]

52. +1

[deutsey]

99. I also met Dr. West at an anti-war march in DC

Just like you say, he was walking alone. I couldn't believe it was him. I went over to him and shook his hand and told him how much I admired his work.

I still admire his work and, while I may not agree with everything he says, I agree with a lot of what he says, including many of his critiques of Obama.

[brush]

128. All of those accomplishments . . .

and he seems to have his knickers in a bunch over not getting a 2013 Inauguration invite!

Imagine that — especially after bashing Obama for much of his first term!

And we sure didn't get all the "personal" bashing of W, now did we.

What's that saying about crabs in a barrel and one trying to get out?

Petty, petty!

[bigtree]

139. I don't recall him wearing knickers

. . . sounds like the same silly rhetoric folks are decrying in this thread.

All of those accomplishments . . .brushed aside with the back of your hand. At least he's specific in the issues he expects the man he supported twice to office to address. This DU ridicule of West seems to be all about political protection of Barack Obama, rather than an actual response to the issues he's raised.

That's a sad reflection of how fealty to politicians has been elevated by some here over support, defense, and advocacy of actual issues; concerns which West and others echoing those want the president to do more than paper over or give little more than lip service.

It's almost like being dressed down by campaign aides and public affairs officers of the president. One interesting thing is that there's an attempt to equate 'accomplishments,' that Congress have achieved through their efforts and votes, as accomplishments of the president.

Moreover, unrelated issues are being raised in the president's defense in an attempt to drown out concerns about drones, torture prosecutions, support of Israelis committing war crimes against Palestinian civilians, meaningful wall street prosecutions (as West said, "Eric Holder won’t touch the Wall Street executives; they’re his friends. He might charge them some money. They want to celebrate. This money is just a tax write-off for these people. There’s no accountability.&quot

No direct response here to his concerns about the president's failure to speak out forcefully about issues like stop and frisk in New York, arbitrary police force in Ferguson, the prison-industrial complex - about his failure to do something concrete regarding the killing of Trayvon Martin, national surveillance, corruption of our national legislature . . .

All of those concerns dismissed by pointing to unrelated and tangential, at best, 'accomplishments' which were the same product of votes like the ones which elected the president.

Most progressives want more than those moderate compromises on issues that need and deserve direct and complete action. With incremental policies and initiatives there's a natural and inherent expectation and demand for the rest of the remedy. It shouldn't be celebrated as a panacea to concerns which persist and deepen like a virus adapting to an insufficient course of treatment and growing even stronger and more resistant to change or eradication. That's what progressives like Dr. West are asking for from the President; the rest of the fight.

[TheKentuckian]

203. The tired tactics of these folks are transparent, bigtree.

The buck does not even hover wantingly before moving along, for some people. For them it is no debit, no cash, no checks, only credit.

Issues raised ignored and messenger attacked, aka weak shit.

[blackspade]

212. +1000

[truth2power]

207. Thank you, bigtree. I'm a little late to this thread...

as I recently read that you had decided to lave DU. I'm sorry.

I have the greatest respect for Cornell West, notwithstanding those who try to smear his name with drive-by epithets which have no substance whatsoever. It indicates how panic-stricken they are that the truth he speaks might get a hearing.

A pox on them!

[xocet]

216. Thank you for that information on Dr. West. n/t

[ucrdem]

50. Perfect riposte Cha.

[Cha]

57. Yes, the President has history actually helping people.. Black, White, and all shades and you

know what? It's really good to see you back on DU, ucr!

[ucrdem]

63. Thanks Cha . . .

I can resist a lot of interesting things but it turns out that DU is not one of them.

[Cha]

68. It's our Political board to interact, ucr.. and Everything is Politics now.. Air, Water, Food,

Money,Helping People.. coming together when sadness occurs(so often these days).



Sorry about the "smiley overload" as pinboy joiner calls it.

[Major Hogwash]

55. You know what I'd like to see?

I'd like to see a debate between Cornel West and Allen West.
But, the problem is, they'd both wind up as best friends!
I bet they'd both agree with each other, moreso than disagreeing, saying what a fraud they think that Obama is.

Yet, Allen West is . . a die-hard Republican!!!!!!!

*dunn, dunn, dunnnnn*
(deep bass chord on the piano)

[Cha]

60. "..they'd both wind up as best friends!".. Hellfire's Yes.. they'd bond over

fucking ODS!

Major.. thank you!

[sheshe2]

62. OMG! Perfect!

Allen West and Cornell West in a debate!





They be bros and best buds when it is said and done.

Thanks for the laugh Major Hogwash.

[JustAnotherGen]

90. So true!

I follow Allrn West on FB and respectfully troll his page.

He has made the "Fraud" arguments more times than . . . Oh bother!

If your comments cause people to preface their responses with - "I'm not a racist . . ." then there's a good chance you are pandering to the wrong things.

[lovemydog]

75. Thank you.

Spot on.

I'm not against academics. I'm not against most of what Mr. West says.

I just don't like when people take what he says on the matter of President Obama overly seriously.

There's a role for academics. There's a role for activists. I believe the President has proven his credentials time after time.

The sincere criticisms of him, I don't mind. I just think they don't take into full account the enormous difficulties the President has faced, with a Congress that sucks, with forces of corporatism as powerful as any time since the gilded age, with a general public that has the attention span of a gnat, and with a commitment to him from the left that appears to blow with the wind.

[Cha]

76. Hi lovemydog.. I absolutely love academics.. all that studying and

and brain power when it's put to good use.

But, not this.. the pattern over the years.. this from 2012..

Viewpoint: What’s Behind Cornel West’s Attacks on Obama

When Princeton professor Cornel West called Obama a "Republican in blackface," he's speaking from a place that's too emotional and idealistic

".. But it’s sad how he’s damaged his image as an important thinker because of a series of attacks on President Obama and on other black intellectuals who have not been as critical of Obama such as Michael Eric Dyson and Melissa Harris-Perry and Reverend Sharpton. West’s critique is draped in rhetoric so inflammatory that it almost disqualifies itself from being taken seriously and risks him sounding like a rapper enmeshed in a battle. In his latest salvo earlier this week, he called the President a “Rockefeller Republican in blackface.”

There’s nothing wrong with critiquing the President, but the reference to blackface is a verbal Molotov cocktail. And it doesn’t even make sense: if Obama’s in blackface then he’s performing a grotesque caricature of blackness that is a white fantasy of a harmless, docile black person. Is that what he’s doing? Is Obama not the opposite of that as a calm, dignified, intellectual alpha male? I’m not really sure why blackface was mentioned or what it’s supposed to mean unless it’s a way of calling Obama an Oreo—black on the outside and white on the inside. But that’s just a guess. Earlier this year, West told TruthDig that Obama is “a black mascot of Wall Street oligarchs and a black puppet of corporate plutocrats.” I’m not sure why race is even injected into that critique.

The rest of the story..
http://ideas.time.com/2012/11/15/what-behind-the-bad-blood-between-cornel-west-and-obama/

[lovemydog]

91. I hear ya Cha

Hope you enjoy a great day.

[Cha]

96. Hope you have a great Tuesday, lmd.. and speaking of Academics.. :)

Mr. Obama’s promising My Brother’s Keeper initiative

snip//

THESE ARE the depressing facts about boys and young men of color: They are more likely to drop out of school, more likely to be in prison, more likely to be unemployed and more likely to die at an earlier age. That minority men are at disproportionate risk throughout their lives has largely been seen as unavoidable. The beauty of President Obama’s public-private initiative to create better futures for them is its refusal to accept these outcomes as inevitable.

My Brother’s Keeper, a five-year, $200 million effort focused on improving opportunities for black and Hispanic youth, was launched in February. It got a boost this week with the announcement of new commitments from the private sector. Equally important is the decision by 60 of the nation’s largest school districts to join the effort by implementing evidence-based strategies to improve outcomes.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/president-obamas-promising-my-brothers-keeper-initiative/2014/07/25/d2d62378-11cd-11e4-98ee-daea85133bc9_story.html


President Barack Obama signing an executive memorandum for the My Brother’s Keeper Initiative

http://theobamadiary.com/tag/my-brothers-keeper/

21Jul14

The President Participates In A My Brother’s Keeper Town Hall

[1StrongBlackMan]

114. I love that TR quote ...

it speaks directly to critics, everywhere ... and make clear the point, your criticism is whining when you are not engaged ... and being on the speaker's circuit, or posting daily dismissive on an anonymous, though politically named, internet message boards, are not being engaged.

But to your question ... I cannot speak to Tavis, as I know virtually nothing about him, other than his pulling together the Black State of the Union (with the help of Wells Fargo and then went out a pimped toxic WB mortgages in the Black community) and his couple self-congratulatory books.

But when Dr. West started out ... he did some great research and writing on policy impacts in the Black community, but that was wonky journal stuff, not fit for commercial publication (i.e., best selling books, because in academia (at the time), the conclusions must be drawn directly from the research and failing to do so, was quickly pointed out and consider much worse than NOT publishing).

I think he remains a brilliant, though much too wordy/using of fancy words/forcing of word usage, speaker; but, as with so many, important people ... he became aware of his importance and that became the mission.

That is the primary difference between Dr. West and President Obama, how they handle(d) the recognition of their own importance.

[Cha]

129. Good point, 1StrongBlackMan..

"That is the primary difference between Dr. West and President Obama, how they handle(d) the recognition of their own importance."

And, this in regards to Teddy Roosevelt's quote..

"it speaks directly to critics, everywhere ... and make clear the point, your criticism is whining when you are not engaged ... and being on the speaker's circuit, or posting daily dismissive on an anonymous, though politically named, internet message boards, are not being engaged."

Dr West is the epitome of Whine and Sleaze(calling Obama a "blackface republican).. going on the whine circuit while President Obama is actually out there doing some very positive action for the people. I don't care how much they ignore it.. it's still happening.

What were these academics doing when bush was in office.. We know what the President was doing for People in the South Side of Chicago.

As for Tavis Smiley he got himself in a twist over Obama not being able to come to his Black State of the Union in 2008..

Cornel West and Tavis Smiley do a disservice to African Americans

I used to revere these two prominent black intellectuals. But lately, their critical voices have turned to crude Obama-bashing

. Smiley threw a tantrum in 2008 when President Obama couldn't make his State of the Black Union event (also saying "no thanks" to a proposal to have Michelle Obama come in his place).

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/jul/26/cornel-west-tavis-smiley-disservice-african-americans

Oh, and Dr West doesn't leave First Lady Michelle out of his obnoxious rants, either..

A lesson for Cornel West

IT WAS not enough for Cornel West to ridicule the first African-American president as a “black mascot .’’ The loquacious professor also fired his blunderbuss at Michelle Obama. In the process, he splattered a generation of black people freeing itself from narrow identities and stereotypes.

The Princeton African-American studies professor belittled the First Lady’s causes of child obesity and assisting military families, by scornfully asking on the website Truthdig: “Why doesn’t she visit a prison? Why doesn’t she spend some time in the hood?’’

The down-with-the-people professor clearly has spent too much time in the ivory tower to see the many ways to be “in the hood.’’ It escapes him that 42 percent of African-American women are now obese, putting them on the leading edge of a crisis that is shortening the lifespan of US citizens.

West’s dismissal of Ms. Obama’s work with military families is even more peculiar. In a nation 13 percent black, African-Americans comprise 20 percent of the active-duty Army. More than a third of Army women are black. Retired Brigadier General Wilma Vaught, president of the national foundation that recognizes women’s military service, said Michelle Obama “is following in the footsteps of First Lady Eleanor Roosevelt’s World War II fame.’’

http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2011/05/28/a_lesson_for_cornel_west/

[Egnever]

214. Holy cow

That was an awesome post.

[Cha]

217. Mahalo, Egnever~

Give my credit to Don @ the Obama Diary~ I just brought it over to DU where it needed to be in answer to Dr West's racial attacks on President Obama.

[CakeGrrl]

41. I wonder...

How many of the people furiously nodding their heads in agreement to this (bitterness-infused) lament think Hillary - ex-Goldwater Repub and IWR voter - is the progressive antidote to this perceived problem?

[eridani]

97. Most of the people who think Obama is not progressive enough think that

--Hillary is even worse. I certainly prefer his foreign policy to hers.

[MurrayDelph]

42. I admit I didn't read the article

I've found "Brother West" to be unbearably condescending.

(Part of which is his affectation of calling everyone "Brother&quot

[ucrdem]

49. I took a look and there's no there there.

Sadly but predictably. It reads like Mr West hasn't browsed a newspaper in six years, which wouldn't surprise me, because a lot of local Obama-bashers seem stuck in a permanent 2008 where some perceived betrayal permitted them to construct a cartoon Obama and ignore all subsequent accomplishments.

[sheshe2]

65. Daayumm!

Well said ucrdem!

[ucrdem]

67. Thanks sheshe! Holder is about the only current cabinet member he can name

and he thinks "Holder’s going to be gone by December." I wouldn't bet the farm on it, Cornel. He also hates Al Sharpton, shocker eh?

[sheshe2]

70. Holy Shit!

I can only find Cornell West on RW sites! WTF!

The man has lost it long ago...and no, Holder isn't going anywhere.

and here ya go~ oldie but goodie

Cornel West: “Sharpton Is The Bonafide House Negro Of The Obama Plantation” [OPINION]

http://newsone.com/2705580/cornel-west-al-sharpton/

Love ya ucrdem.

[ucrdem]

72. Pretty awful.

Even if his criticisms were justified, and they aren't, the way he expresses them is not fit for broadcast. And if it was a live interview, Amy Goodman shouldn't have put the transcript on her site, and if it wasn't live, she should never have broadcast it. But that no longer surprises me either.

p.s. thanks sheshe, it's mutual!

[sheshe2]

73. ...

He is an Ass now. No matter where he was before, he lost it. Sadly he lost all of it.

Gotta go, 3 AM here...

Gotta work tomorrow~

[ucrdem]

74. ..

Night sheshe! I think we're finished here so I'd better do the same . . . hasta mañana!

[Number23]

181. The hatefullness of Cornel's rhetoric matches that of quite a few of the head nodders

in this thread. No wonder they get on so well.

To paraphrase, ignorance loves company.

[sheshe2]

184. Yes, I noticed that Number23.

I went to look at some of Cornel's quotes. I have seen them almost verbatim here.

[Cha]

89. Yeah, ucr.. West hates this guy.. "Our National Treasure"..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025440918

AG Holder: "The DOJ is standing with the People of Ferguson MO"

[Cha]

66. Quite conveniently they do ignore all of the President's Accomplishment which are

our Accomplishments, too, ucr.

Cornel West has an agenda and that is to whine about President Obama.. This is Cornel West back in 2012

Viewpoint: What’s Behind Cornel West’s Attacks on Obama

When Princeton professor Cornel West called Obama a "Republican in blackface," he's speaking from a place that's too emotional and idealistic

".. But it’s sad how he’s damaged his image as an important thinker because of a series of attacks on President Obama and on other black intellectuals who have not been as critical of Obama such as Michael Eric Dyson and Melissa Harris-Perry and Reverend Sharpton. West’s critique is draped in rhetoric so inflammatory that it almost disqualifies itself from being taken seriously and risks him sounding like a rapper enmeshed in a battle. In his latest salvo earlier this week, he called the President a “Rockefeller Republican in blackface.”

There’s nothing wrong with critiquing the President, but the reference to blackface is a verbal Molotov cocktail. And it doesn’t even make sense: if Obama’s in blackface then he’s performing a grotesque caricature of blackness that is a white fantasy of a harmless, docile black person. Is that what he’s doing? Is Obama not the opposite of that as a calm, dignified, intellectual alpha male? I’m not really sure why blackface was mentioned or what it’s supposed to mean unless it’s a way of calling Obama an Oreo—black on the outside and white on the inside. But that’s just a guess. Earlier this year, West told TruthDig that Obama is “a black mascot of Wall Street oligarchs and a black puppet of corporate plutocrats.” I’m not sure why race is even injected into that critique.

The rest of the story..
http://ideas.time.com/2012/11/15/what-behind-the-bad-blood-between-cornel-west-and-obama/

[ucrdem]

69. Cornel hasn't exactly showered himself with glory has he.

Which is a shame because he had a good rep before he took up with Tavis.

[still_one]

85. The jerk can't criticize the president without making a reference about the presidents race. To me

that says volumes about West, and it is NOT complimentary

[JustAnotherGen]

92. Times 1000

[grahamhgreen]

71. Sad to kick this one.

[still_one]

82. If Cornel West just criticized the President and his policies that would be understandable, but the

jerk always brings race and color in characterizing the President in derogatory ways. The latest being:

"...we ended up with a brown-faced Clinton."

What a hyperbolic blow hard. If anyone else said that he would be called a racist

He can't criticize the president without adding some racial slur? and yes, saying a "brown-faced Clinton", is a racal slur.

What the fuck does the color of a persons skin have to do with his policies

Gee, it would not have been too difficult for him to say instead, we have another Clinton, but no, he brings color into the picture, as though Mr. West is now the appointed person to speak for all people of color

A real ignoramus with a PHD

[Cha]

130. So agree, still_one. The more research on this guy the

more fucking obnoxious he is.

[still_one]

131. That actually is a different issue, his personality, which is subjective. When he was on Bill Maher

he would just pontificate and talk and not let any of the other guests get a word in edge wise, so I can understand why many would think him obnoxious, or just plain rude

[Cha]

133. Oh, I've been seeing a lot of articles come up with his quotes since this OP.. and

his history of attacking the President with crude names and calling out Michelle Obama for her work on obesity and the Military families. I just find that obnoxious.

I haven't seen him on tv nor do I want to.. he sounds just like he reads in print.

[still_one]

136. I feel the same way

[Enthusiast]

101. Kicked and recommended a whole bunch!

Well said, Cornel West!

[Capt. Obvious]

106. West is still just pissed

that he had to sit behind Aretha Franklin during Obama's first inauguration and couldn't see around her hat.

His hatred for our first black President consumes him.

Take nothing he says seriously.

[Stellar]

107. Cornell West and Tavis Smiley

have been on the Presidents case for several years now, since 2008. And looking for way to make other find fault with the President. Check out an earlier video about West and Smiley, by Steve Harvey.

[Hotler]

108. Now is not the time to point fingers

[SidDithers]

118. Cornel West is a fucking joke...

He's become a parody of himself.

Anyone remember the Million Muslim March? Put on by anti-Semite nutcase and 9/11 Truther Kevin Barrett?

All of 25 people showed up to march on Washington, on Sept 11 2013.

But Cornel was there.




http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023654889


Sid

[JustAnotherGen]

154. Wish I could rec

Just this post!

Yeah - me an anti semites - we don't mix.

[maced666]

122. Brown faced Clinton...pimp?

Excuse me, sir. You do not speak about him in such terms...This is rw pig talk I don't care what follows. Disgusting. My god what have black men ever done to be targets of such slurs. Sickening.

[Shivering Jemmy]

132. Cornel West is a fraud

He peddles popular leftism as some kind of scholarship.

Other professors laugh at his academic non-productivity.

[woo me with science]

143. Oh, there's definitely a fraud being perpetrated here,

but it's not coming from Cornel West:

The rise of the Third Way agenda in our party was never a grass roots phenomenon, but rather a deliberately orchestrated and corporate-bankrolled one, ...just like the propaganda supporting it.

When the DLC connections to the Koch Bros. became well known, they just rebranded the infiltration
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4165556

When you hear "Third Way", think INVESTMENT BANKERS
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024127432

GOP Donors and K Street Fuel Third Way’s Advice for the Democratic Party
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101680116

The Rightwing Koch Brothers fund the DLC
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x498414

Same companies behind the GOP are behind the DLC
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1481121

.

[bigtree]

156. love the attack on 'leftism'

. . . and the attempt to disassociate 'leftist' sentiment from scholarship (in the same breath proffering the image of 'other professors with 'opposing views laughing at his academic non-productivity.'

Social history has traditionally been regarded as the refuge of conservative thought; used to define American democracy through a rigid and non-empathetic lens which supposes that government was designed to sustain itself above the desires and impetus of the masses. Liberal scholars have adopted that same intellectual adaptation of history to emphasize the intention of our democracy to elevate more of a concern for the progress of our people, rather than a strict adherence and focus on process.

Dr. West's academic history has been marked by efforts to demonstrate the efficacy and primacy of bottom-up political action; versus the top-down politics which does little more than protect and defend the political process and the pols who operate it.

Academics may well wish that Dr. West adhered to some sort of validation of a history which didn't really afford folks like him legitimacy in action or thought. Progressive activism and advocacy, as practiced by West threatens their status quo and forces them to reexamine all of their doctrine and academia which formed its conclusions without considering that much of what they were excluding deserved recognition.

Dr. West, likely, laughs back at the lack of societal productivity in their academic practice. It raises the question: What are they 'peddling?'

[JEB]

188. Exactly correct!

Thanks for writing this:
West threatens their status quo and forces them to reexamine all of their doctrine and academia which formed its conclusions without considering that much of what they were excluding deserved recognition.

[JTFrog]

153. Folks will dump anything on DU as long

as it's hyperbolic and gets a good swipe in there against "Obama's cheerleaders".

I would say I can't believe that folks would gum up DU's bandwidth with the rantings of an obviously bitter dude, but I'm not surprised at those embracing it.

“He pimped us.”

What a major asshat.

[NYC Liberal]

172. Unrec. n/t

[Yavin4]

178. If Obama did everything that Cornel West wanted him to do....

The Dem. establishment would have primaried him in 2012 with Sen. Evan Bayh who would have had big pharma money behind him.

[JEB]

182. So I take it that all the West bashers are just fine with

Wall Street executives going unpunished, with spying on American Citizens, with drone attacks, with ongoing ME war crimes, with torturers going unpunished. I thought this was the point and concern, not whether Cornell West had his knickers in a bunch. I've got mine in a bunch and not because Cornell West said something I agree with, and not because I was not invited to the inauguration. I am honestly disappointed that tortures are walking free, that Wall Street crooks are walking free and that war crimes are just fine with my government. Maybe Obama can or can't do anything about this stuff, but I'm still disappointed.

[ellenrr]

196. ++

[truth2power]

208. Amen, JEB. thanks. n/t

[AverageJoe90]

189. I hate to say this, but.....Cornell West is a bit of an idiot.

Does he even realize, firstly, just how bad RepubliCON obstructionism has been? I don't wanna be harsh, but he needs a clue.

[uppityperson]

197. I wish Obama had a decent congress that would not block everything good. eom

[Tommymac]

221. He Had one for 2 years and squandered it away.

Or maybe he really didn't care.

[uppityperson]

222. No, he didn't. The Party of No had enough to block most everything.

Not a majority, but enough to block everything mostly.

[Tommymac]

224. Funny how Reagan and Bush got things done...

Your excuse is nothing but a tired talking point. Obama is a corporate sellout in sheeps clothing.

Have a good day.

[uppityperson]

225. Funny how people criticized the dictatorial policies of bush and seek the same from Obama.

[Tommymac]

226. Whatever. Not what I said. But facts speak for themselves.

[MrMickeysMom]

202. I couldn't find one thing wrong with Dr. West's complaint...

The only thing was the "posing" part. Actually, he showed his penchant for Wall Street and conservatism prior to be elected. I ignored it and my SO did not.

So, now we're left with what we voted for. The only difference is that he has disappointed in fostering all the "hope".

It's up to the American people to get up off their asses. Looks like we're doing this one post at a time on the DU!

K&R

[ucrdem]

210. He's free to complain but he's poorly informed. Specifically:

Most of his complaints are tired talking points taking Obama to task for ill-defined or false issues: "We ended up with a Wall Street presidency, a drone presidency, a national security presidency." Okay but what is he objecting to exactly? Others are pure demagoguery:

And we ended up with a brown-faced Clinton. Another opportunist. Another neoliberal opportunist. It’s like, “Oh, no, don’t tell me that!” I tell you this, because I got hit hard years ago, but everywhere I go now, it’s “Brother West, I see what you were saying. Brother West, you were right. Your language was harsh and it was difficult to take, but you turned out to be absolutely right.”

"Absolutely right" about what? And in the few places he gets down to brass tacks, he gets his facts wrong:

You go straight to the establishment and reassure them that you’re not too radical, and try to convince them that you are very much one of them so you end up with a John Brennan, architect of torture. . . .

In fact, Brennan was not an "architect of torture," wasn't connected with that operation, and per Reuters went on record objecting to it.* So basically West is talking out of his ass.
.......................

*

But other former officials say Brennan was among agency officials who were uncomfortable with the use of physically coercive tactics, despite the legal opinions that supported their use. He expressed concern, according to these officials, that if details of the program became public, it would be CIA officers who would face criticism, rather than the politicians and lawyers who approved them.

"If John says he expressed reservations about some techniques, I believe him because he's an honest guy," said John McLaughlin, who was deputy CIA director at the time.

"Mr. Brennan had significant concerns and personal objections to many elements of the EIT (enhanced interrogation techniques) program while it was under way," a senior administration official said in response to Reuters' inquiries. "He voiced those objections privately with colleagues at the agency."

from: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/01/30/us-obama-nominations-brennan-idUSBRE90T07I20130130

[treestar]

209. Complete exaggeration

Inability to deal with reality typical of this part of the left. All presidents will give a shit about national security. Making the usual impossible demands.

[ucrdem]

211. Exactamundo.

[Cha]

219. "Complete exaggeration".. Yes, and of course that's why so Recs from those who can "find nothing

wrong with it".. they don't care. Reality isn't their strong suit.

Mahalo treestar~