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Thu Sep 25, 2014, 08:35 PM

 

I sure as hell won't miss the Holder Doctrine

I just hope it goes away, but I doubt it will.

A story I've told on DU before, but it's so striking that it's worth another turn: A few months ago I met up with an old friend who's reasonably high up in the DOJ. Since we were drinking, and I don't know when to shut my mouth even while sober, I asked him what was up with tons of bank execs getting jailed in the S&L meltdown a couple of decades ago, but none getting jailed from the far-larger bank meltdown in 2008.

To summarize what he told me:

- The banks likely committed serious crimes.
- But only the people at the top committed crimes. The lower-level folks likely did little that was illegal in itself, only when one puts the parts together is it illegal.
- Remember Enron? Prosecuting Enron's top brass destroyed it, and destroyed Arthur Andersen. Lots of innocent people lost jobs. This was an important lesson for really, really smart people.
- It would be bad for the innocent people at banks to lose their jobs.
- Ergo, hands off the execs. It's only to help the little people, you see.

(I responded with many naughty words, of course.)

It seems to me that Holder, like everyone in the Obama administration, always has some ludicrous excuse for why helping the wealthiest is really helping the 99%. Call it the Holder Doctrine, if you will.

"Hey! We're just helpin' you little folks! If you want [strike]justice for[/strike] revenge on the shrewd businessmen, you're just begrudging their success!"

We need to cut government jobs to create jobs. We need to make 82% of the Bush tax cuts permanent to create jobs. We need free trade agreements so that even-more cheap imports from outsourced jobs will create more jobs. We need to double H1B visas to create jobs.

Oh, brother.

Meanwhile, jobs aren't coming back. And they won't, until the people running our country cut the crap and start working for us. We need to make this clear to our fellow Americans, and we must come together to make it happen, or what's left of the American Dream will take one more short swirl and gurgle inexorably to the sewer.

117 replies, 16006 views

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Reply I sure as hell won't miss the Holder Doctrine (Original post)
MannyGoldstein Sep 2014 OP
cheapdate Sep 2014 #1
sheshe2 Sep 2014 #4
MannyGoldstein Sep 2014 #7
cheapdate Sep 2014 #10
woo me with science Sep 2014 #15
reddread Sep 2014 #17
woo me with science Sep 2014 #25
cheapdate Sep 2014 #27
delrem Sep 2014 #34
Jeff Rosenzweig Sep 2014 #57
cheapdate Sep 2014 #83
RussBLib Sep 2014 #79
MannyGoldstein Sep 2014 #30
Jeff Rosenzweig Sep 2014 #58
GeorgeGist Sep 2014 #8
cheapdate Sep 2014 #12
Dustlawyer Sep 2014 #9
cheapdate Sep 2014 #13
rhett o rick Sep 2014 #49
cheapdate Sep 2014 #67
rhett o rick Sep 2014 #78
cheapdate Sep 2014 #86
rhett o rick Sep 2014 #91
cheapdate Sep 2014 #94
A Simple Game Sep 2014 #98
cheapdate Sep 2014 #109
A Simple Game Sep 2014 #110
cheapdate Sep 2014 #111
A Simple Game Sep 2014 #113
cheapdate Sep 2014 #114
A Simple Game Sep 2014 #115
woo me with science Sep 2014 #18
woo me with science Sep 2014 #21
woo me with science Sep 2014 #20
woo me with science Sep 2014 #24
LondonReign2 Sep 2014 #87
Post removed Sep 2014 #31
delrem Sep 2014 #36
1StrongBlackMan Sep 2014 #40
delrem Sep 2014 #41
1StrongBlackMan Sep 2014 #62
SunSeeker Sep 2014 #48
rhett o rick Sep 2014 #50
MannyGoldstein Sep 2014 #53
bahrbearian Sep 2014 #59
jeff47 Sep 2014 #85
QC Sep 2014 #97
QC Sep 2014 #66
sabrina 1 Sep 2014 #35
rhett o rick Sep 2014 #46
roguevalley Sep 2014 #81
cheapdate Sep 2014 #82
freshwest Oct 2014 #117
woo me with science Sep 2014 #2
Maven Sep 2014 #3
SomethingFishy Sep 2014 #16
reddread Sep 2014 #26
adirondacker Sep 2014 #5
SomethingFishy Sep 2014 #19
madinmaryland Sep 2014 #6
cheapdate Sep 2014 #14
1StrongBlackMan Sep 2014 #33
Caretha Sep 2014 #69
Hissyspit Sep 2014 #71
Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2014 #11
ucrdem Sep 2014 #22
MannyGoldstein Sep 2014 #32
ucrdem Sep 2014 #44
99Forever Sep 2014 #23
whereisjustice Sep 2014 #28
woo me with science Sep 2014 #54
whereisjustice Sep 2014 #92
FlatStanley Sep 2014 #29
Jack Rabbit Sep 2014 #37
1StrongBlackMan Sep 2014 #38
joshcryer Sep 2014 #43
1StrongBlackMan Sep 2014 #64
MannyGoldstein Sep 2014 #47
OilemFirchen Sep 2014 #39
MannyGoldstein Sep 2014 #55
OilemFirchen Sep 2014 #56
MannyGoldstein Sep 2014 #61
OilemFirchen Sep 2014 #72
bobduca Sep 2014 #63
OilemFirchen Sep 2014 #73
bobduca Sep 2014 #74
Bobbie Jo Sep 2014 #76
bobduca Sep 2014 #99
Bobbie Jo Sep 2014 #108
OilemFirchen Sep 2014 #77
bobduca Sep 2014 #104
OilemFirchen Sep 2014 #105
villager Sep 2014 #88
OilemFirchen Sep 2014 #93
villager Sep 2014 #96
OilemFirchen Sep 2014 #103
msanthrope Sep 2014 #112
joshcryer Sep 2014 #42
pbmus Sep 2014 #45
Major Hogwash Sep 2014 #51
sheshe2 Sep 2014 #52
bobduca Sep 2014 #75
bahrbearian Sep 2014 #60
bobduca Sep 2014 #65
KoKo Sep 2014 #68
randome Sep 2014 #70
Jamastiene Sep 2014 #80
Enthusiast Sep 2014 #84
99Forever Sep 2014 #89
IkeRepublican Sep 2014 #90
Dr. Xavier Sep 2014 #95
pscot Sep 2014 #100
blkmusclmachine Sep 2014 #101
raindaddy Sep 2014 #102
Utopian Leftist Sep 2014 #106
ozone_man Sep 2014 #107
woo me with science Sep 2014 #116

Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 08:58 PM

1. Eric Holder's Justice Department intervened in a civil rights case

in my little hometown in Tennessee. Bigots were fighting to deny the local Muslim community the right to build a new worship and community center, even while huge new Christian churches have been built all over town. The bigots had major outside support. The actions of the Justice Department played an important role in upholding the civil rights of our Muslim neighbors.

Eric Holder's Justice Department championed civil rights in scores of cases that received little or no media attention. They fought long and hard over voting rights. They challenged GOP led anti-democratic restrictive voting practices all over the country. They were successful in many instances.

The Justice Department's Civil Rights Division was virtually dismantled under eight years of Bush-Cheney. Over the eight long years of the Bush administration, they methodically and deliberately replaced the division's personnel with right-wing ideologues with degrees from places like Liberty University. The same was true throughout the Justice Department and the rest of the federal bureaucracy. Holder has worked just as hard to restore the Justice Department and undo the damage done by the previous administration.

So, you're all "good riddance!" over Eric Holder because he didn't jail some "bank execs"? You've got company. The right-wing hated him with a searing intensity.

Eric Holder did an outstanding job as Attorney General. I will miss him.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:17 PM

4. Thank you cheapdate, excellent post.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:25 PM

7. Help me understand this.

 

Do you believe that I'm right wing?
Do you believe that Holder did the right thing with regard to bankers?
Is "better than Bush" your threshold for excellence?

Thanks.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #7)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:47 PM

10. No, I know that you're not right-wing.

Your disagreements over Holder's record are from a left perspective and are different from the right-wing's disagreements.

But it's all of the things that cause the right-wing's intense hatred of Attorney General Holder that should give you some reasons to grant Holder some measure of respect, if you were reasonable about it.

I happen to agree that seeing bankers in handcuffs would bring me enormous pleasure. Obama and Holder came into office during the nadir of the "Great Recession". The credit market was frozen and banking, housing, and employment were in complete free-fall. It wasn't a crime to buy or sell mortgage backed securities. It wasn't a crime to buy or sell credit default swaps. It wasn't a crime for credit ratings agencies to overvalue subprime backed mortgage bonds. Under the laws of our country, it's exceedingly hard to prove these crimes.

I'm not excusing Holder. I just don't really know. He's a good man and he was an excellent Attorney General.

Nobody gets everything they want.



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Response to cheapdate (Reply #10)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:06 PM

15. "He was an excellent attorney general"?! Good fucking god.

This administration with Holder defended and extended the MOST malignant and antidemocratic of Bush policies, shredded multiple Constitutional amendments, and have assaulted the very foundations of our democratic system. This is NOT a partisan issue. We're talking about the murder of democracy itself.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025585163

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-w-whitehead/attorney-general-eric-hol_b_2900647.html

Attorney General Eric Holder: If the President Does It, It’s Legal
John W. Whitehead
Attorney, President of The Rutherford Institute, and author of 'A Government of Wolves'

.....
The military can detain anyone, including American citizens, it deems a threat to the country. Not only has the DOJ persisted in defending a provision of the National Defense Authorization Act that sanctions indefinite detentions of Americans, but it has also blasted the federal judge who ruled the NDAA to be vague and chilling as overstepping the court’s authority and infringing on Obama’s power to act as Commander in Chief.

Presidential kill lists and drone killings are fine as long as the president thinks someone might have terrorist connections. Holder has gone to great lengths to defend Obama’s use of drones to target and kill American citizens, even on U.S. soil, as legally justifiable. In fact, a leaked DOJ memo suggests that the President has the power to murder any American citizen the world over, so long as he has a feeling that they might, at some point in the future, pose a threat to the United States.

The federal government has the right to seize the private property—cash, real estate, cars and other assets—of those suspected of being “connected” to criminal activity, whether or not the suspect is actually guilty. The government actually collects billions of dollars every year through this asset-forfeiture system, which it frequently divvies up with local law enforcement officials, a practice fully supported by the DOJ and a clear incentive for the government to carry out more of these “takings.”

Warrantless electronic surveillance of Americans’ telephone, email and Facebook accounts is not only permissible but legal. According to court documents, more Americans have had their electronic communications spied on as a result of DOJ orders for phone, email and Internet information—40,000 people alone in 2011—and that doesn’t even begin to take into account agencies outside Holder’s purview, terrorism investigations or requests by state and local law enforcement officials.
....

Much, much more at link, including:

* Judicial review is far from necessary.
* Due process and judicial process are not the same.
* Government whistleblowers will be bankrupted, blacklisted, blackballed and in some cases
banished.
* Government transparency is important unless government officials are busy,
can stonewall, redact, obfuscate or lie about the details,
are able to make the case that they are exempt from disclosure
or that it interferes with national security.
* When it comes to Wall Street, justice is not blind.
* Not all suspects should have the right to remain silent.





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Response to woo me with science (Reply #15)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:11 PM

17. nobody in the DLC platform is going to miss the Bill of Rights

 

inalienable. until this century.

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Response to reddread (Reply #17)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:20 PM

25. Just a goddamn piece of paper.

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #15)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:24 PM

27. I'm not going point by point with John W. Whitehead.

Eric Holder was a United State Attorney General, serving at the pleasure of the president. I positively abhor the recent NDAAs, the Patriot Act and its extensions, the FISA reform laws, the 1980s forfeiture laws, NSA "fusion" centers, etc. Holder presided over it all and didn't fundamentally change the course of the nation in this.

I abhor all of these things and yet I don't loathe Eric Holder or Barack Obama. Our ethics are worlds apart in many places but I don't loathe them. In fact, I respect them.

I'm not bothered by the obvious conflict, or "cognitive dissonance" in being favorably disposed toward people I don't agree with in all matters.

Holder took aggressive stands against infringements of the basic right to vote. He's spoken passionately and taken what steps he can, within the framework of being a U.S. Attorney General, to address this country's incarceration problems.

Call him the devil incarnate if you will. I won't be joining you.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #27)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:55 PM

34. So, you "positively abhor" X, Y and Z, but, of those who *enabled* X, Y and Z,

you "respect them".

You follow with your main line of argument:
"I'm not bothered by the obvious conflict, or "cognitive dissonance" in being favorably disposed toward people I don't agree with in all matters."

And that's *it*. The entirety of your argument, such as it is.

wow.


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Response to delrem (Reply #34)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 12:23 AM

57. Actually, the "entirety" of his or her argument,

or at least as much as he or she has decided to present here, can be found in several longish responses upthread, which can be read by anyone, or at least by those who don't have the poster on ignore.

As opposed to your cheap and weightless 66-word gloss on his or her argument.

I say that as someone who would hardly qualify as an Eric Holder admirer. In fact, unusually enough, I largely agree with the OP (and I hardly qualify as an admirer of his either). But the person you're sneering at, whose opinion differs from mine, and presumably yours, deserves a lot better than what you seem to believe passes for adequate rebuttal.

So wow, yourself.

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Response to delrem (Reply #34)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 02:29 PM

83. Yeah. Wow. I can respect, like, or even admire people I don't agree with. Wow. Amazing.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #27)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 10:52 AM

79. +1000

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #10)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:35 PM

30. The right wing is *furious* that Obama's a Kenyan-born Islamic Marxist

 

The right wing has become fairly detached from reality. I'm not sure that we want to take their anger as a sign of success.

The point of my post - if you believe my anecdote - is that DOJ pretty well knows that stuff happened that they have a good shot at prosecuting successfully. But they are choosing not to. Heck, even in instances when the banks are totally busted laundering billions in drug cartel money, they're allowed to pay a comparatively small fine and have criminal charges waived, as we know:

http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2012/12/10/hsbc-said-to-near-1-9-billion-settlement-over-money-laundering/?_php=true&_type=blogs&_r=0

But if you or I get caught laundering, we'll get 4+ years in the slammer. As Elizabeth Warren said:

“If you’re caught with an ounce of cocaine, the chances are good you’re going to jail….Evidently, if you launder nearly a billion dollars for drug cartels and violate our international sanctions, your company pays a fine and you go home and sleep in your own bed at night.”

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #30)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 12:37 AM

58. You make some very good points here.

I can't presume to know for certain if the DOJ "pretty well knows that stuff happened that they have a good shot at prosecuting successfully," but it doesn't seem at all far-fetched.

I think you overstate your case, as is your wont, but it's a pretty good case in this instance.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:26 PM

8. George Bush fought aids in Africa.

The left-wing hated him with a searing intensity.

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Response to GeorgeGist (Reply #8)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:49 PM

12. George Bush also spoke eloquently about Islam.

And he created the Pacific Marine Sanctuary. Props for that. He was a dumbass and an asshole, but props for that.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:43 PM

9. The Attorney General has responsibility for a whole lot more than just civil rights.

You have your story, now here is mine:
When BP blew up the Deepwater Horizon in 2010 killing 11, they were still on probation for a felony that they pled to that our law firm discovered during the litigation from the 2005, Texas City, Texas plant explosion that killed 15 and injured thousands. We met with Eric Holder and gave him the underlying documents related to the explosion and subsequent felony plea bargain. We asked that he revoke BP's probation as this incident clearly violated their probation, instead, HE LET THEM OFF PROBATION EARLY!!!
In Eric Holder's America, corporations and their executives never go to jail. BP is in fact drilling in deep waters in the Gulf again and have not compensated most of the victims yet!
I am happy he did what was right for civil rights, but over all he clearly was working for the 1% and only occasionally did "Pro Bono" work for the American people!

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Response to Dustlawyer (Reply #9)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:58 PM

13. That fucking sucks.

Civil rights don't suck. That's life. I don't get everything I want, you don't get everything you want.

The whole shitty system of "civilization" sucks. What are you gonna you? You're born into it.

Eric Holder and Barack Obama didn't sweep into office and overturn the entire rotten edifice of western civilization.

The struggle continues.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #13)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:29 PM

49. Your argument is weak. No one expected them to solve all problems. That's called a

 

strawman argument. He did a lot of damage to this country and not from inability, but from intention. Watch him get his rewards from Wall Street.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #49)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:58 AM

67. Sure its a strawman. So what? My argument is fine.

Is there anything positive about Attorney General Holder? Was there ANYTHING about him that was admirable? Because I haven't heard a single positive word about him from a number of people here.

I've mentioned some things I support about him. I've heard that everything is shit and Holder is evil incarnate.

I''m not blind but Holder was a good Attorney General and I won't join in the incessant cynicism.

If Holder is such a dishonorable piece of shit, what does that make Barack Obama?

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #67)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 10:47 AM

78. He watched as millions of Americans lost their homes and he stood by as the Banks

 

were bailed out. No investigations. No one held responsible. We bailed out banks while letting millions and millions lose their homes. I personally know people that lost their homes. Now he will get his high-fives from the Banks for a job well done. It's corruption at its worst.

Pointing out corruption isn't cynicism.

And to make things worse, instead of investigating Wall Street corruption, he was hauling marijuana users to prison as fast as he could, sending medical marijuana dispensers to prison for 20 years and at a time when the country clearly favors decriminalizing marijuana use.

He does have a nice smile, and apparently for some, that's the most important thing.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #78)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 04:23 PM

86. Holder agressively challenged GOP assualts to voting rights

in Ohio, Wisconsin, Florida, North Carolina, etc. Holy crap, he fought Texas all the way to the Supreme Court.

The right absolutely despised him for it.

The left is like, 'so what? Who cares? Doesn't mean shit.'

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #86)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:43 PM

91. Show me where the left says that fighting for voting rights "doesn't mean shit".

 

Sorry but I want more. A hell of a lot more. He persecuted medical marijuana users when he didn't have to. While the country is overwhelmingly showing support not only for medical marijuana use but also for casual use. Yet he made it his priority to send people to prison for long stretches. Hurting those in need of pain relief from marijuana. Of course these people were all part of the 99%. He gave the corrupt banksters a pass as they stole a trillion dollars and turned his back on the millions that lost their homes to the corruption of Wall Street. He worked for Wall Street before and he will go back to work for them again. The revolving door of corruption.

Working for voting rights doesn't clean his corrupt hands.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #91)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:58 PM

94. By ommission.

I've raised the point eight or nine times in the past 24 hours with different posters. Your reply of "Sorry but I want more", as slight and indirect as it is, is the closet thing to even an acknowledgement from anyone of even having heard the proposition.

Fighting for voting rights doesn't wash him clean, nor does failing to indict bankers erase his positive record on voting and minority rights or sentencing reform.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #13)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:36 PM

98. Why do you think "The whole shitty system of civilization sucks."?

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I think you are at least partially right although I would more likely say capitalism is what sucks. You want to know why I think you are right? Because people like Holder are in a position to do something about it and don't.

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Response to A Simple Game (Reply #98)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 08:31 PM

109. Because it's insane. It rewards destruction and oppression.

It systematically destroys the living world. It separates the people from the land and puts them into boxes, fenced off from shaded running water and living earth that thieves have claimed for themselves.

I don't like it. I didn't create it. I was born into it.

I'm part of it and Eric Holder is part of it. I don't hate Eric Holder. Maybe I should, but I don't.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #109)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 09:30 PM

110. Civilization isn't what is destroying the living world.

Many places and peoples embrace the living world and try to maintain if not repair and improve it. The Scandinavian countries come to mind. Where I live I see it every day. Things are changing slowly but the good will win out in the end because it is the logical thing to do and most people see that.

Even in America most people want to maintain the environment and do what is best for long term survival of all species. The problem is people still profit from what is harmful to the environment and people like Holder allow a few to steal from the many with no fear of reprisal.

As for living in boxes, well most of us do, I do, but my box comes with four acres and a spring fed stream which is a water source for my house. I have raised some of my own food, and buy much from the Amish community that maintains their lands very well. I do claim my own little corner of the earth but I am however not a thief. Being born into a city culture is not a death sentence, it is how the majority in this country live and is nothing to be ashamed of.

No, you shouldn't hate Holder, I don't hate him and don't want anyone to waste energy hating anyone or anything. Hating in the long run usually hurts the hater more than the hated.

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Response to A Simple Game (Reply #110)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 10:07 PM

111. The desire of "most people" to "do what is best for long term survival of all species"

is hard to see hereabouts. A new interstate "outer ring" was bulldozed for about 50 miles through here. The cruelly named "Cool Springs Mall" buried the actual cool springs. The Elk River hasn't seen an Elk in anyone's lifetime, the Buffalo River hasn't seen a buffalo, and the Wolf River (straightened and channelized for most of it's course) hasn't seen a wolf. The fields are doused in herbicides (brought to you by Swedish chemical giant Akzo Nobel) and our municipal landfill is leaching chemicals into the Stones River, which is our drinking water supply, and no one knows what to do about it.

It sounds beautiful where you are, but the world around you is closing in. It might be far away from where you are, but outside there's less and less to save. Patches and fragments.

All brought to you by civilization. That's what I think.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #111)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 10:26 PM

113. It's nice where I live but far from perfect.

I live in St. Lawrence County in Northern New York. This is a cancer hot spot, meaning we have higher than normal cancer rates. The dairy industry is concentrating on fewer but larger farms, a trend that sadly I think supports your view of the world. Some of our industries such as paper mills are high polluters but are getting better. GM was a big polluter necessitating a large cleanup then they closed up shop a few years ago.

I do live in a very rural area but make it to the "cities" once in awhile, yesterday in fact, and yes development is still going on and will and has to until we stabilize our population.

The world is still far from perfect but cheer up and do whatever little you can to help. If we all do a little, and a lot from those that are able and willing, then it may be enough. We can at least start a trend.

Cheer up and go for a walk in the park if you can. Remember smiles are non-polluting.

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Response to A Simple Game (Reply #113)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 10:35 PM

114. I'm not dour. I'm gregarious and engaged.

But thank you for the cheer.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #114)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 10:44 PM

115. Your welcome, we may not have much else but we can have a positive attitude.

Have a good night and enjoy the trip because you may never reach the destination.

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Response to Dustlawyer (Reply #9)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:11 PM

18. DOJ goes all the way to the Supreme Court to argue FOR allowing strip searches for traffic stops.



Police State: SCOTUS: Strip searches ok for minor traffic offenses
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002507343

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #18)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:17 PM

21. Holder/Obama administration seeks to legalize LYING in response to Freedom of Information requests.

Holder/Obama administration seeks to legalize LYING in response to Freedom of Information requests.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2185303

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Response to Dustlawyer (Reply #9)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:14 PM

20. DOJ goes all the way to the SC to argue for warrantless GPS tracking on cars


DOJ goes all the way to the SC to argue for warrantless GPS tracking on cars
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=429274

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Response to Dustlawyer (Reply #9)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:19 PM

24. The Obama administration/DOJ war on whistleblowers, federal union protections

Last edited Fri Sep 26, 2014, 03:04 AM - Edit history (1)


The Obama administration's legal battle against whistleblowers, federal unions.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022672473

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Response to Dustlawyer (Reply #9)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 04:38 PM

87. Holder pretty well aligned with Obama

Decent to good on civil rights while simultaneously backing corporations heavily.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)


Response to Post removed (Reply #31)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:01 PM

36. That's not true. Nor is it fair.

It is reductive.

eta: in spite of the potential "hide" bait, I also say that your general offensiveness against a discernible group of DUers, those who identify more or less with some general sense of what it is to be a "progressive DUer" doesn't sit well with me. I don't take kindly to that kind of language, to that kind of offensiveness.

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Response to delrem (Reply #36)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:05 PM

40. It is true ...

 

and it is what has been said in this thread and repeatedly on DU.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #40)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:08 PM

41. Prove that racial issues have no effect on the lives of progressive DUers.

Prove it.

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Response to delrem (Reply #41)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:06 AM

62. That's just plain silly ...

 

Prove a stone tossed into a pond in Florida does not affect the tide in San Diego.

Yes ... Racism makes DU progressives feel bad ... but not as much as having their money messed with.

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Response to Post removed (Reply #31)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:28 PM

48. I do believe you've nailed it. nt

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Response to Post removed (Reply #31)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:31 PM

50. Sad argument. Progressives support civil rights and you cant prove otherwise.

 

Progressives see that there are other issues that also need to be attended to. Holder's priorities were to throw medical marijuana users and dispensers in prison for long prison terms and turn a blind eye toward Wall Street corruption. But the Conservatives here in DU support Wall Street.

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Response to Post removed (Reply #31)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:45 PM

53. What would you count as Holder's top three

 

civil rights victories?

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #53)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:29 AM

59. Crickets

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Response to bahrbearian (Reply #59)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 03:05 PM

85. A jury hid hist post. He can't reply.

But good on you for calling him out for it.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #85)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:36 PM

97. You might want to double check the times

on bahrbearian's post and that hide.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #53)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:45 AM

66. I would like to know that myself.n/t

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:56 PM

35. That doesn't answer the question as to why there were no prosecutions of massive crimes

against the people of this country. THAT is a Civil Rights issue also. No War Criminals even investigated, no Wall St. Even investigated. The Civil Rights of many, many innocent people were brutally violated in Iraq by the US, represented by Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Woflowitz, Condi Rice, Michael Ledeen among others. Torture is a Human Rights issue. Many of those victims attempted to get some justice in US Courts. Not one succeeded always having their cases thrown out of court for 'National Security' reasons. Some were women, raped, tortured and abused.



And I will never forgive him for overturning the conviction of Sen. Stevens, Republican due to corruption of the process in his case, even though he WAS guilty. I agree with his decision however because corruption of a trial SHOULD have consequences, while refusing to do the same for Democrat, Don Siegelman whose trial was an example of corruption on the part of Republicans, with Karl Rove in the background.

I am glad he is going, but don't have much hope that his replacement will be any more concerned about prosecuting some of the worst crimes in US history than he was.

But I hope I am wrong. 'Justice delayed is justice denied' and there are literally millions of people still waiting for that justice including Don Siegelman.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:24 PM

46. Eric Holder is a tool of Wall Street. Watch the revolving door swing. Not to mention all the

 

damage he did to honest medical marijuana users.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 01:16 PM

81. I am not aware that all of the votiing rights blockings were ever challenged. I also don't like that

he didn't go after goldman saks and the others. He didn't kick wall street in the balls. He didn't save mortgages and keep people from getting screwed. He was ineffective in the extreme to me and I won't miss him. I am glad for the things he did but the massive amounts of things he didn't do disqualify him for me as a force to be missed. IMO.

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Response to roguevalley (Reply #81)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 02:09 PM

82. Holder's DOJ has gone to court over GOP led voting restrictions

in Wisconsin, Ohio, North Carolina, Texas, Florida, etc. Holy crap, Holder took his fight against Texas all the way to the Supreme Court.

The right positively hates him over this. The left is like, so?

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 6, 2014, 02:11 AM

117. So will I.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 08:59 PM

2. Interesting doctrine for PR use. The administration just let Credit Suisse off the hook,

(one of the *only* cases in which the DOJ disallowed making the penalties tax deductible as part of the negotiated settlement).

marmar's post:



Now they are letting them off the hook, and their excuse for doing it is that "if the anti-criminal provisions were enforced, the bank would lose its ability to offer investment products to pension funds."

Why is the Obama administration reducing sanctions on Credit Suisse? The administration says it is a decision based on pragmatism, not favoritism.

The Federal Register announcement, for instance, notes that Credit Suisse has assets of nearly $1 trillion, and argues that if the anti-criminal provisions were enforced, the bank would lose its ability to offer investment products to pension funds. The announcement also argues that the Credit Suisse entities that specifically conduct pension business "are independent of" and "not influenced by Credit Suisse AG's management and business activities."


The article goes on:

What the administration did not mention, of course, is that according to data compiled by the Sunlight Foundation, employees of Credit Suisse have given President Obama's campaigns more than $376,000. That's particularly relevant in light of an April study of SEC data from London Business School professor Maria M. Correia. That analysis showed that "politically connected firms are on average less likely to be involved in ... enforcement action and face lower penalties if they are prosecuted."


Holder Doctrine, indeed.


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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:07 PM

3. Hands off banks, hands on dispensaries.

Gotta catch the real criminals who undercut big pharma's profits.

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Response to Maven (Reply #3)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:09 PM

16. I posted this in an earlier thread.. a list of some of Holders "accomplishments"

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Response to Maven (Reply #3)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:21 PM

26. plus a thousand

 

pitchforks, torches.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:20 PM

5. Anita Hill for Attorney General !!!

brought up by a Brilliant DUer on another thread....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025585916#post5

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Response to adirondacker (Reply #5)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:11 PM

19. Brilliant... I just kicked that thread...

Thanks!

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:21 PM

6. I don't miss the Ashcroft/Gonzales Doctrines either. I am not sure what

exactly the Holder Doctrine was or still is.

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Response to madinmaryland (Reply #6)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:00 PM

14. I think it means that Holder wasn't very different from his predcessors

in some areas. And that's unacceptable.

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Response to cheapdate (Reply #14)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:47 PM

33. You are being too delicate ...

 

Holder accomplished stuff on civil rights but did nothing to satisfy my blood lust against bankers.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #33)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 08:00 AM

69. Here's what your "civil rights" hero

 

accomplished. I dare you to read this article & continue to defend his policies and accuse other DUers of not caring about civil rights issues.

http://www.thenation.com/article/176915/scandal-racist-marijuana-arrests-and-what-do-about-it?page=0,0

The Scandal of Racist Marijuana Arrests—and What To Do About It

The federal government has subsidized the criminalization of millions of young people simply for having a small amount of pot.


Whites Smoke Pot, but Blacks Are Arrested.” That was the headline of a column by Jim Dwyer, the great Metro desk reporter for The New York Times, in December 2009. Although Dwyer was writing about New York City, he summed up perfectly two central and enduring facts about marijuana use and arrests across the country: whites and blacks use marijuana equally, but the police do not arrest them equally. A third important fact: the vast majority (76 percent) of those arrested and charged with the crime of marijuana possession are young people in their teens and 20s.

Sources for the information in this article can be found at thenation.com/marijuana and at the site of the Marijuana Arrest Research Project, which is run by author Harry Levine and civil liberties attorney Loren Siegel.

Over the last fifteen years, police departments in the United States made 10 million arrests for marijuana possession—an average of almost 700,000 arrests a year. Police arrest blacks for marijuana possession at higher rates than whites in every state and nearly every city and county—as FBI Uniform Crime Reports and state databases indisputably show. States with the largest racial disparities arrest blacks at six times the rate of whites. This list includes Alabama, Illinois, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Minnesota, Pennsylvania, Nebraska, Nevada, New York and Wisconsin.

Big city police departments are among the worst offenders. Police in Los Angeles, Chicago and New York have arrested blacks for marijuana possession at more than seven times the rate of whites. Since 1997, New York City alone has arrested and jailed more than 600,000 people for possessing marijuana; about 87 percent of the arrests are of blacks and Latinos. For years, police in New York and Chicago have arrested more young blacks and Latinos for simple marijuana possession than for any other criminal offense whatsoever.


Now for the reason why

* * *

The national crusade against marijuana can be traced to the early 1990s, as the “war on drugs” shifted its focus from crack cocaine to marijuana under Bill Clinton. Since then, Congress has regularly allocated billions in federal funding to local police and prosecutors under the Justice Department’s anti-drug and police programs. Grantees often report their drug possession arrests as evidence of their accomplishments using these funds—and as proof that they should receive more. Federal money has thus subsidized the arrests of millions of young people for possessing marijuana, disproportionately young people of color. Prominent blue-state Democrats like Joe Biden, Dianne Feinstein, Charles Schumer, Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama have strongly supported these grants over the years; in 2009, the fiscal stimulus actually doubled the anti-drug funding for local law enforcement agencies.

With this federal support and encouragement, arrests for marijuana possession climbed from a crack-era low of 260,000 in 1990, to 500,000 in 1995, to 640,000 in 2000, to 690,000 in 2005, to 750,000 in 2010. The ACLU calculates that these arrests have cost taxpayers at least $3.6 billion a year. And there is absolutely no evidence that they reduce serious or violent crime—or even drug use.





Always follow the money & you will have your answers. Many want to blame "Big Pharma" for these laws, but the truth is "Big Pharma" will profit when legalization occurs.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #33)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 08:47 AM

71. "blood lust against bankers???"

Accountability is just "lust."

Right.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:49 PM

11. Goes back to the myth that the top people are indespensible....

 

I say they're a bunch of frauds. With the really BIG firms they have ZIP to do with the daily operations. The place isn't going to shut down without them.

They are there for only ONE reason, they are celebrities of the investor class. That's why Apple spent a fortune to get the CEO of Pepsi back in 83.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:18 PM

22. Laying the 2008 meltdown at Holder's feet is utterly ridiculous.

He wasn't there when it happened. No one promised to hold bank-industry tribunals and there never was much public interest in the idea beyond the usual demagoguery. Holder has been working on much more important and compelling issues and taking heat big time for goring a few sacred oxes like RW news outfits and their funny phones. Surprise, treason is illegal, and Holder called them on it. In any case he didn't vote for Reagan-Bush or Bush-Quayle so perhaps your righteous indignation is misdirected?

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Response to ucrdem (Reply #22)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:41 PM

32. I don't think I did that.

 

I laid the lack of prosecution at his feet - or at least that was my intent. Sorry if it was confusing.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #32)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:13 PM

44. You're saying Holder protected the perps and preserved their policies, right?

Hence the "Holder Doctrine"? which is identical to Bush-Cheney policy? That's how I read your OP. Effectively you're saying that Holder is responsible for the 2008 meltdown because he collaborated with and protected those who caused it. Right? Well that's garden-variety Demwashing, i.e. blame transferring, which is what we've been arguing about for as long as we've been arguing. I don't agree with any of it.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:19 PM

23. K&R

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:24 PM

28. Between Libor, Goldman and HSBC fraud, minorites suffered greatly. There should have been hell

to pay. These banks violated the civil rights of millions via fraud and deception. The fake title and forgery business illegally repossessing homes should have sent hundreds to prison. Instead, the crooks walked away with zero percent loans as bailouts paid back with other near zero percent loans from the Govt. The result was record poverty and minority opportunity set back decades and a irrevocable recklessness that continues to endanger us all. Generations will pay for the Dept. of Justice's indifference to equal rights and justice.



Child Poverty Remains at Record High Levels
By The Admin | September 18, 2013
0 Comment

21.8 Percent of Children Poor – including over one-third of Black and Hispanic Children

U.S. Census Bureau data released today reveals 46.5 million poor people in America in 2012, including 16.1 million children, essentially unchanged from 2011. Children remain the poorest age group in the country with a poverty rate 21 percent higher than before the Great Recession. There are 2.75 million more children living in poverty today than there were in 2007 at a time when large corporations are experiencing record high profits and the wealthiest Americans’ net worth has increased, poor children have not had any relief.
http://blackpoliticsontheweb.com/2013/09/18/child-poverty-remains-at-record-high-levels/





Blacks Having Tougher Time Recovering from Recession
By The Admin | September 8, 2014
0 Comment

The unemployment rate for Blacks (11.4 percent) and Whites (5.3 percent) remained unchanged from July to August, but the fact that Black unemployment is 2.4 percent higher than when the recession began five years ago is an indication that Blacks have the farthest to go to get back to pre-recession levels, according to Center on Budget and Policy Priorities.

The CBPP reported that the unemployment rate for Whites is about one point higher than it was at the start of the recession and for Hispanics it is 1.2 percent higher.

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Response to whereisjustice (Reply #28)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 12:05 AM

54. Thank you. We hear ad nauseum that the massive Third Way betrayals

are not important or can be compensated for by the "fact" that the corporatists are on the side of racial or gender equality. What a disgusting lie.

Minority groups have suffered more than anyone else from the corporate assaults on the 99 percent. I don't know how the Third Way crew expects to sell the idea that their politicians are defenders of women and minorities, when they are actively and systematically destroying both the economic and democratic systems that are necessary for the empowerment of these groups.

Just wait to see the status of women and minorities in this country when we are all working for Third World wages, Obama's and Hillary's trade agreements have allowed corporations to override our democratic protections, and dissent has been smashed through the police state that Holder helped enable.

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #54)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:48 PM

92. Agree. We cannot can't deny the inconvenient truth that economic decay is corporate made.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:32 PM

29. I agree with you.

 

How is it that you can still post here? All I have to do to be labelled a troll is to state that Democrats support our bombing in Syria and Iraq.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:03 PM

37. Thank you, Manny

If Holder was an excellent AG, then I'm a retired kamikaze pilot. "Better than Bush" isn't a valid standard of excellence, it's a left handed compliment. After, six years of failure to prosecute banksters or war criminals, I still cringe every time I hear a Third War lemming talk about how we should be so appreciative of the Obama administration because they are better than the Bushies.

But, to paraphrase Voltaire, we must forgive Holder for all the good he didn't do.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:03 PM

38. I seem to recall the story being a little different ...

 

The last time you told the tale ... didn't you say your friend told you that the Feds could prove the case against the underlings but not necessarily the folks at the top?

I can't recall, nor can I find the original post. How about a little help.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #38)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:13 PM

43. Tens of thousands in the robosigning scandal.

Paper pushers tend to be the most culpable and easiest to prosecute: their signatures are on the paper. It's going to be damn impossible to get the bankers without a whistleblower willing to testify, sitting on a lot of paperwork that proves their case, and with a verifable paper trail that fingers the top executives.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #43)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:17 AM

64. No ... er

 

The fingers point, at best, to a (low level) supervisor/manager ... someone far below the C-Suite, under press to get the hundreds of thousands of documents signed ... or the named lawyer of the firm or CEO of the start-up boiler-room operation contracted to do the signing ... er, processing of mortgage documents.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #38)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:27 PM

47. Anyone can have an off day creating search terms that work

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025245120

But accusing someone of wrongdoing, based on memory rather than evidence... not excellent..

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:04 PM

39. Kewl story, brah.

And to think, you have John Whitehead on your side as well!

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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #39)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 12:06 AM

55. Who is John Whitehead

 

And why is he on my side?

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #55)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 12:20 AM

56. Maybe your DOJ buddy can fill you in.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025586013#post15

The Rutherford Institute - John W. Whitehead

In Facing the Wrath: Confronting the Right in Dangerous Times, sociologist Sara Diamond describes the political activism of the Rutherford Institute:

"Active since 1982, the Rutherford Institute represents a variety of Christian `civil liberties' litigants, anti-abortion demonstrators, students asked not to read Bibles at public schools, parents whose home school facilities fail to meet government regulations. No doubt, Christians deserve as much legal protection as anyone else. But with much of the ACLJ and Rutherford case load, there's a fine line between defending the interests of clients and stepping on the rights of other people.

In a...commentary sent to Christian radio stations, Rutherford Institute president John Whitehead argues that workplace seminars on gay rights are a form of `religious discrimination' against employees who are `told to rid themselves of stereotypes about gays and to accept homosexuality as a valid lifestyle choice.'

In an odd assertion of victim status, Whitehead claims Christian military personnel may jeopardize their careers if they `speak out against homosexuality....The immediate remedy is for the military to exempt religious people from compelled personal acceptance of homosexuality.'

Paula Jones ring a bell? Oh, that's right. You were on Whitehead's side then, as well. Amiright?

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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #56)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:13 AM

61. Is this like a "vegetarians are mass murderers" thing?

 

Hitler was a vegetarian, therefore vegetarians are mass murderers?

Seems like it.

When Clinton was President, I thought he was notably-corrupt right-winger. But would anyone listen when us Liberals said "Bank deregulation and free trade with corrupt microwage countries? Really?"

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #61)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 09:41 AM

72. Actually, no.

This is more like a "Hitler who"? WooMeWithEverything cited Whitehead in defense of your post, wherein you had the opportunity to distance yourself and refute the ridiculous content. You didn't. Rather, you feigned ignorance.

And again, kewl story. I don't believe a word of that one either.

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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #39)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:08 AM

63. This is the best defense your side can use, Mr Roffle Waffles

Pathetic Smears by Association. Why not actually discuss the matter? Oh that's right because you've got nothing.

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Response to bobduca (Reply #63)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 09:43 AM

73. Absolutely not.

I never use my "best defense" on a MannyGram. My time is valuable, so mere derision is apropos.

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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #73)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 09:55 AM

74. Derision, Mockery etc.,

Nice, not honest argumentation but the tactics of bullies on a playground.

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Response to Bobbie Jo (Reply #76)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:36 PM

99. yap yap yap

Is that a lapdog nipping at my heels?

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Response to bobduca (Reply #99)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 08:05 PM

108. LOL

More honest "argumentation?"

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Response to bobduca (Reply #74)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 10:30 AM

77. Maybe so.

But not really.

Thanks for the trope, anyway. Very "honest argumentation"-ish.

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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #77)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:07 PM

104. tropes and memes are kewl brah

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Response to bobduca (Reply #104)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:15 PM

105. Work on your inflection.

Otherwise, good first attempt.

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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #73)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:07 PM

88. Nice dodge, since your "valuable time" didn't keep you from posting in this thread

 

The real waste is having to read your "contributions" to the "discussion..."

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Response to villager (Reply #88)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:54 PM

93. Valuable. Not priceless.

Definitely not precious.

But I digress...

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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #93)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:29 PM

96. Digressions, indeed. But I appreciate the time you put in to keeping Manny's thread kicked

 

Thanks!

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Response to villager (Reply #96)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:06 PM

103. You're welcome.

And thank you for the engrossing discussion.

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Response to OilemFirchen (Reply #73)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 10:15 PM

112. Yeah....but be careful. I quoted Spinal Tap to Manny...got hid. Quoted

 

Caddyshack.....and got hid.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:08 PM

42. Holder needs whistleblowers.

Birkenfeld was the only one to come forward, mainly because it was an IRS case and he got $100 million for doing it (IRS rewards whistleblowers a huge chunk of whatever money is collected in tax evasion cases). Otherwise the rewards are small and few find it in their interest to come forward, since it likely means jail time. The current reward for blowing the whistle on the bankers is $1.6 million. What banker or high level guy is going to come forward for that? It's nothing.

The DOJ is still currently investigating the bankers but as time goes on the evidence becomes more diffuse. Then there's the fact that most of the judges currently around are Bush appointees. So Holder has a huge uphill battle. We're talking about a court case that would last a decade or more (look at how long Enron took to prosecute, and there was ample evidence in that case).

Basically it's a diversion.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:24 PM

45. There are so many decisions that he avoided that the decisions

he made that the left is touting, like sentencing, pot, doma, doj rebuilding ... are all still sitting on the table needing a lot more work ... like sentencing for street drugs, pot legalization and the continued insane laws on all drugs, like doma which will be enforced while the law is still on the books, and the doj is still a very weak looking arm of our legal system.

I think that Holder was a lukewarm attorney general at best ... certainly not as good as the left is now stating ...

and I am personally exhausted hearing that its all Republicans fault that nothing gets done...

we all know its not just Republicans or Democrats, the real people running this country are the 1%ers and the corporations ...

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:36 PM

51. Great to see you happy, Manny!

Now we all get popcorn, right?

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Response to Major Hogwash (Reply #51)

Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:43 PM

52. lOl~

The show is on..

here ya go

oh and a brew~

Wow...the hate fest is alive and well in GD. Bless there little hearts, Major.

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Response to Major Hogwash (Reply #51)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 09:56 AM

75. Pom Poms

or Ponies, those are your two choices clearly.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:33 AM

60. Rec for Major Hogwash and sheshe2 since they won't.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:45 AM

65. "Better than Gonzalez"

When that's all his defenders got, it's clear that DU's loyalty brigade are in "revise recent history" mode.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 08:00 AM

68. Thought this article summed up Holder's term as "AJ" nicely:

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 08:13 AM

70. I always enjoy your posts, Manny.

 

The intelligent responses of differing views are always full of useful information.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]A 90% chance of rain means the same as a 10% chance:
It might rain and it might not.
[/center][/font][hr]

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 12:09 PM

80. Well said, as always.

K&R

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 02:49 PM

84. K&R! This post deserves hundreds of recommendations!

Every word is true.

Thanks, Manny.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:21 PM

89. Great post Manny.

It saddens me to watch people claiming to be "Democrats" defend that tool.

It's embarrassing, actually.



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Response to 99Forever (Reply #89)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 05:37 PM

90. Absolutely

I read you big time there, 99.

Personally, I am beyond fatigued at the civil rights excuse. Holder could have easily assigned many underlings with lots of legal dynamite to handle those cases and instead, he'd shine ass with it to keep the focus off of his handing out happy endings to Wall Street that do more damage to the working poor irrelevant of ethnicity.

Notice how he cherry picked his civil rights "interventions" too. If justice is to be blind, he did a shitty job and it was deliberate.

Got his foot in the door via Saint Ronnie, so I guess we shouldn't be surprised. Chock up another son of a bitch we're still dealing with thanks to that pissant D-level "actor".

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:13 PM

95. We can continue to fight over Holder or simply ask:

Would you rather have Antonio Gonzalez and his boss still around?

Both the President and the Attorney General could have done a lot more. But when you have a big mess to clean up and the rest of your cohorts are worried about re-election, you ain't going to get much done.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:44 PM

100. The Holder Doctrine

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:47 PM

101. The White House says "Savvy businessmen don't do time. Only medical marijuana users get busted."

 

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 06:58 PM

102. I won't miss it either

Economic policy is the sacred cow.. Parties disagree over social issues but when it comes to maintaining who controls the economy i.e , trade agreements, tax breaks for the rich, endless war, two tier justice system both parties seem to find a way to ignore the needs of poor and middle class.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:16 PM

106. If I remember correctly,

Obama was not in favor of keeping the Bush tax cuts. He campaigned on ending them. But somehow the Republican Congress badgered him and if I remember correctly, the way they badgered him was they said that if he raised the taxes on the wealthy, the Republicans would effectively force him to also raise taxes on the middle class. They threatened that if he did not make the Bush tax cuts on the wealthy permanent, that they would prevent him from making the (necessary) Bush tax cuts on the middle class permanent, too. So maybe he chose what he thought was the lesser of two evils--not raising the taxes at all rather than dragging down what was left of our middle class in order to raise them on the wealthy? When the obvious solution (the one too complicated to sell to the public, apparently) was that we needed to raise that taxes on the wealthy and lower them on the middle class. But then, Republicons can't whistle Dixie and chew gum at the same time. Democrats should be POUNDING this point right now! That the Democratic position is to raise taxes on the wealthy. Why is that not on everyone's lips? It's a proven winner, the American people agree that it is time to make the wealthy pay their fare share. Even Obama is on our side of that argument. If only he were President...{sarcasm}.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)

Fri Sep 26, 2014, 07:19 PM

107. How many Wall Street banks did he prosecute?

I was flabbergasted when the NPR market news guy asked that question yesterday, to the response of crickets. Once in a while they (NPR) do the right thing.

He was a lacky for Wall Street and Obama, same thing apparently.

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Response to ozone_man (Reply #107)

Sat Sep 27, 2014, 04:59 AM

116. He did a very good job for the One Percent

and will be handsomely rewarded.

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