General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNew York Court to Decide if Chimps Are People Too
This case is the first of its kind and raises the issue of whether high-order animals non-human primates, dolphins, elephants, and orcas are people and entitled to certain rights as people.
Tommy the chimpanzee, 26, is at the center of the case. He is owned by a human and spends his days watching television in upstate New York, where disagreements have arisen about his living conditions
I know at first look this may tempt people to make light of the issue, but consider this, further down the article:
Dr. Alasdair Cochrane, an animal rights expert at the University of Sheffield, UK, told the London Evening Standard that he sees the divide that separates human rights and animal rights shrinking.
"As the advanced powers of other animals, such as chimpanzees, becomes better understood, it is little surprise that the legal wall that divides humans from other animals is being chipped away. It is my view that it is just a matter of time until it crumbles," he said.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)I feel like they are needed and they should have rights.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)bravenak
(34,648 posts)Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)So they are not mistreated? If they were people they would be allowed to go anywhere, which would be a huge mistake.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)I just remember those disgusting people who had one of our primate cousins working in a brothel. I want those people, people who do things like that, prosecuted for rape and torture and kidnapping. I don't want them running around in the city ripping peoples faces off, though.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)Although maybe different words for rape and kidnapping....but the same penalties.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)But they would need censoring. I never knew that people did things like that. But I should have guessed.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)Oktober
(1,488 posts)If they have the same rights as a human will we bring up an orca whale that eats one in the wild on charges for murder?
Idiotic.. On so many levels...
meow2u3
(24,759 posts)Chimps are intelligent primates, but do not have the reasoning capacity of a human. Chimps still behave according to their instincts; just ask the lady in Connecticut who was mauled by her chimp.
hunter
(38,302 posts)The big difference between us and chimps is we tell very intricate stories about what we do. When we created oral history, stories passed down from generation to generation, maybe 50-100,000 years ago, human civilization began to evolve rapidly. And then, when we created writing, that's when the modern technological revolutions began. There's simply too much human history and technology now to hold it all inside the heads of our bards.
I don't know why we feel "alone" and wonder about intelligent life in outer space when we share this planet with a large variety of very intelligent beings similar to ourselves. A shocking majority haven't recognized these intelligent beings yet.
I think it's time we did.
Some animals are not so different than we were not long ago by nature's long measure of time, and it's not so clear yet that the developmental pathway we followed will assure a positive outcome. I suspect the human race will be remembered only as a freakish layer of trash in the geologic record.
For now we ought to be protecting the cultures of our intellectual kin on this planet, the great apes, the cetaceans, the elephants, many of the birds, etc., in much more sophisticated ways than we "humanely" treat other animals of lesser intellectual and cultural complexity.
A chimpanzee deserves to live as a chimpanzee, with many of the same rights of self-determination as we demand for our own selves. And an orca deserves to live as an orca, and an elephant as an elephant.
dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)The ego driven feeling of superiority to anything but our own has really done a lot of harm.
rogerashton
(3,920 posts)That's not the same thing as "being a person" or having rights. A legal person has the legal ability to own property and enter into contracts. Neither that, nor freedom of speech, would seem to have any application to chimps and orcas. But these complex, incompletely understood creatures should be protected from arbitrary human use.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)Not that it would make him human, but it does make him smarter than people who complain about what is on one of the 299 channels they are not watching.
AverageJoe90
(10,745 posts)Come on now. Is this even really serious? What has me worried is that many of the worst RWNJ agitprop mouthpieces will no doubt take this and try to run with it, as an excuse to attack marriage equality(and not just same-sex marriage, either!), amongst other things.
hunter
(38,302 posts)Our quarterbacks suck and our coaches are leaving the best players on the benches.
Response to AverageJoe90 (Reply #5)
1000words This message was self-deleted by its author.
AverageJoe90
(10,745 posts)dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)and they do not even have a heart!
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)Give them protections, but don't try to call them a human.
Response to dixiegrrrrl (Original post)
1000words This message was self-deleted by its author.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)Louisiana1976
(3,962 posts)Beringia
(4,316 posts)Thanks to the Nonhuman Rights Project
UglyGreed
(7,661 posts)people aren't treated like humans, I feel the chimps must wait in line.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)If you make them people, then you are saying they are responsible for their actions by human standards. That does not mean they should not be protected, but you would be doing any animal a diservice by making them "people".
aikoaiko
(34,162 posts)valerief
(53,235 posts)how to live your life," then how can corporations be persons?
dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)before I saw your comment.
Excellent point, I agree.
( We don't even want to start in about the fetus's, do we?)
valerief
(53,235 posts)Something to ponder...
dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)Sheesh.
valerief
(53,235 posts)flvegan
(64,404 posts)Film at 11.
dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)Changes in awareness usually starts with something like this case.
Over time, more people might be revising their ideas of what we and the "higher" mammals have in common.
yuiyoshida
(41,818 posts)the rules in my house...All shrimps R His....
scarystuffyo
(733 posts)I would like to see the environment the owner is keeping this chimp in