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madashelltoo

(1,696 posts)
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:17 AM Nov 2014

Will someone please tell Darren Wilson

Nobody in the midst of a life threatening confrontation pauses to ask themselves, "Is it lawful for me to shoot this man?" And gets the response from themselves, "Yes." Officer, you lost me with that lie. I couldn't make myself listen to another word. Stephanoplis kept a straight face through your Zimmermanesk ramblings and he should get an Emmy for it.

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Will someone please tell Darren Wilson (Original Post) madashelltoo Nov 2014 OP
So true my opinion of him was actually lowered by that statement Kalidurga Nov 2014 #1
An Emmy? 99th_Monkey Nov 2014 #2
So true, but Steph is a POS Carolina Nov 2014 #45
I Can't Imagine Being A Parent Of A Child That Was Killed By This Guy And How They..... global1 Nov 2014 #3
Not just a forum, but reportedly a big wad of cash too. bluesbassman Nov 2014 #4
I agree. Delphinus Nov 2014 #28
Great point. And why is that the thing you ask yourself rather than, "Is there a way I can handle Dark n Stormy Knight Nov 2014 #5
So Totally Agree With You. dballance Nov 2014 #6
So you've been in that situation? I have Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #7
So you think Wilson was truthful? Just this statement or throughout? Scuba Nov 2014 #10
I'm still pouring over all that was released. Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #11
Well I certainly hope nothing makes you uncomfortable. Scuba Nov 2014 #13
Lots of things do Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #14
Well, that's one way to make sure you never have to face hard decisions. Scuba Nov 2014 #19
It's also the best way to make decisions mythology Nov 2014 #74
This message was self-deleted by its author Rex Nov 2014 #83
ROFL alcibiades_mystery Nov 2014 #20
IOW, "let's wait for all the evidence against the victim." Rex Nov 2014 #84
My theory is he shouldn't have had the gun treestar Nov 2014 #18
Are you asking if cops train for when people try to take their guns Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #21
It is so ironic to me that an officer, in his car, with his gun treestar Nov 2014 #25
Are you saying it's impossible to hurt a person in a car from outside Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #26
Why did Wilson have his gun out of it's holster? bluesbassman Nov 2014 #40
Sorry, not buying it. madashelltoo Nov 2014 #42
Except that Wilson escalated things by going after Brown when he was walking away. Ykcutnek Nov 2014 #44
What??? You think people should be able to assault cops and then just "walk away" Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #50
Then my question to you, Lee-Lee Carolina Nov 2014 #49
Why get out of the car and pursue someone who just committed a violent felony? Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #52
Oh puhleeze Carolina Nov 2014 #53
omfg! You can't be for real. You call for back-up. R B Garr Nov 2014 #78
Anyone can pretend to have any profession on the WWW. Rex Nov 2014 #85
Exactly right. R B Garr Nov 2014 #88
Furthermore, how could Wilson chase someone with his supposed injuries? R B Garr Nov 2014 #80
I just want to say you've done a fantastic job in this thread. LostInAnomie Nov 2014 #70
Seconded. N.T. Donald Ian Rankin Nov 2014 #75
Yes, because most gun experts recommend firing your weapon 12 times R B Garr Nov 2014 #76
Jaywalking? Is that how his blood got on the inside of the police car LostInAnomie Nov 2014 #81
Do you think the blood got in Wilson's car before or after he stopped R B Garr Nov 2014 #87
You're the one that seems to think Wilson shot at him for jaywalking. LostInAnomie Nov 2014 #89
omg, he stopped him for jaywalking. R B Garr Nov 2014 #90
Right... you don't imply it at all. LostInAnomie Nov 2014 #91
omfg, here's what you wrote: R B Garr Nov 2014 #92
Kewl story bro! Rex Nov 2014 #72
If he had paused, he would of remembered he had a billy club. B Calm Nov 2014 #8
+1 Cha Nov 2014 #9
Used from inside a car? Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #12
Why would that be impossible? B Calm Nov 2014 #15
Like I said, try it and get back to me Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #16
Yes, I can swing a billy club from the inside of a vehicle. B Calm Nov 2014 #17
I call bullshit Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #23
Have you noticed that no one believess you're being honest? DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2014 #31
Then tell me how it's done? Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #32
I'm not talking about a hypothetical baton DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2014 #34
+1 Couldn't agree more! B Calm Nov 2014 #38
+1000 noiretextatique Nov 2014 #46
Yes the excuses have grown incredibly lame. Rex Nov 2014 #86
I believe him trekbiker Nov 2014 #57
I've noticed that; I think it reflects badly on you and DU, not on them. Donald Ian Rankin Nov 2014 #59
Works for me. DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2014 #62
Well I guess I'm full of bullshit for having a billy bat in B Calm Nov 2014 #36
it not useful against "hulking, grunting black demons" noiretextatique Nov 2014 #47
LOL B Calm Nov 2014 #51
"somebody come up and start hitting you." Maybe you shouldn't park your police car in such R B Garr Nov 2014 #35
Wilson was pretty stupid. B Calm Nov 2014 #41
right trekbiker Nov 2014 #58
Nobody ever said Brown was smart, he just didn't deserve to be murdered B Calm Nov 2014 #63
no wilson's gun made him smarter noiretextatique Nov 2014 #64
Thank you, RB Garr. Dorian's story makes perfect sense Carolina Nov 2014 #54
it only makes sense noiretextatique Nov 2014 #65
Thx, Carolina. I agree with everything you said. Dorian's account R B Garr Nov 2014 #77
Not buying it. It takes less effort to turn a key, slam the gear into drive haele Nov 2014 #43
Brown (Demonic Black Hulk Hogan) can strike fatal blows to Wilson's right cheek from outside the car alcibiades_mystery Nov 2014 #22
Or some of us had done it, trained for it, and tried it Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #24
Oh lawd! alcibiades_mystery Nov 2014 #27
Wallow in your ignorance then, and be happy about it Lee-Lee Nov 2014 #29
And you can be welcome to alcibiades_mystery Nov 2014 #33
owie trekbiker Nov 2014 #60
You sound like the one inventing "reality". R B Garr Nov 2014 #37
K&R Excellent response Carolina Nov 2014 #56
Fatal blows to him, terrifyingly strong blows Bettie Nov 2014 #30
isn't it amazing that his injuries do not support his story? noiretextatique Nov 2014 #48
It shows me that Bettie Nov 2014 #55
i agree noiretextatique Nov 2014 #61
I know Bettie Nov 2014 #66
nothing liberal about those attitudes noiretextatique Nov 2014 #67
Maybe it is a desire to belive Bettie Nov 2014 #68
i think that is a part of it noiretextatique Nov 2014 #69
I actually read that account only a few mintues ago Bettie Nov 2014 #71
it makes perfect sense, actually noiretextatique Nov 2014 #79
He had mace and an ASP, he chose to kill Brown instead of easily hitting Rex Nov 2014 #73
I was disappointed that Big Ed and Chris Hayes were using this interview on their shows. I muted the jwirr Nov 2014 #39
Will someone please tell Darren Wilson to just STFU csziggy Nov 2014 #82

Kalidurga

(14,177 posts)
1. So true my opinion of him was actually lowered by that statement
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:20 AM
Nov 2014

and I had him down there with Zimmerman.

 

99th_Monkey

(19,326 posts)
2. An Emmy?
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:47 AM
Nov 2014

Hardly ... GS was there as a "journalist" ... and his soft-ball questions,
while keeping a straight face at the laughable answers was an insult to
his professed profession.

Carolina

(6,960 posts)
45. So true, but Steph is a POS
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 02:47 PM
Nov 2014

and to call any of these fluffed and puffed political hacks turned TV talk show personalities journalists is laughable.

global1

(25,241 posts)
3. I Can't Imagine Being A Parent Of A Child That Was Killed By This Guy And How They.....
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:54 AM
Nov 2014

must feel having him interviewed and talking about the incident as he did. This is the guy that killed my kid and he is being given a forum to talk about it. It is despicable. And it is also despicable for a network to give this guy the forum to do that as well.

bluesbassman

(19,370 posts)
4. Not just a forum, but reportedly a big wad of cash too.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 04:07 AM
Nov 2014

That they would pay him to spew his fabricated, rehearsed, and bullshit story sickens me.

Delphinus

(11,830 posts)
28. I agree.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:30 AM
Nov 2014

I was appalled when I received a text message from my local ABC news station to be sure and tune in.

Dark n Stormy Knight

(9,760 posts)
5. Great point. And why is that the thing you ask yourself rather than, "Is there a way I can handle
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 04:41 AM
Nov 2014

this situation without shooting this man?" That's what I'd like to know. He certainly should have, as Recursion explained very well in this post.

 

dballance

(5,756 posts)
6. So Totally Agree With You.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 07:27 AM
Nov 2014

That was certainly the point at which he made it clear he was lying and had spent the last 100 days or so in consultation with his attorneys to come up with that answer.

ON EDIT:

Even if one is a law enforcement officer I can't believe that in a time of such supposed stress about being killed that one would have time to consider the legality of one's actions. One would simply, reflexively defend one's self. If he'd said that he'd be a lot more believable.

I call total and utter BS!

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
7. So you've been in that situation? I have
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 07:48 AM
Nov 2014

As a police officer during your training you are extensively put through scenarios testing your judgement under stress- including "shoot/don't shoot" tests.

"Shoot/don't shoot" drills are done to make some get used to asking that exact same question. Because if you choose to shoot, you have to assume the worst case scenario will result- death. So when asking "am I justified to shoot" you are asking "am I justified in using deadly force".

It's done and it's drilled into your head that you are accountable to every decision and you had better be justified in making it, but you better make it without hesitation so that you take too long and you or a bystander gets hurt or killed.

I've been there. Every time my taser came out, the thought process going there was "is this the best tool, am I using it in a way that doesn't increase risk to me and the others involved, is there legal justification for this level of force." Every time my gun came out it was the same thought process- one standard for pulling the gun out, another for actually pulling the trigger.

The entire time you are in an encounter like that as an officer your mind is a balance of "what do I need to do, what can I do under the law"

I would love to take a bunch of you into a training facility and give you pistol with simunitions and put you into high-stress scenarios to show you just what it is like and give you some perspective.

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
11. I'm still pouring over all that was released.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 09:16 AM
Nov 2014

I'll be a lot more comfortable judging that once I've reviewed if all.

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
14. Lots of things do
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 09:28 AM
Nov 2014

Rushing to judgement does.

Not having as much information as I possibly can does.

I'm sure if your doctor said he wanted to review the latest studies before prescribing a new medication you would be thankful he didn't give you something based on less info than he could have utilized.

We should all strive to be as informed as possible.

 

mythology

(9,527 posts)
74. It's also the best way to make decisions
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 07:52 PM
Nov 2014

Jumping to conclusions, especially if they fit one's current understanding of the truth (regardless of the accuracy of that understanding), is fraught with errors.

There is plenty of research supporting the idea that waiting as long as you can before making a decision is the best way to get to the most advantageous outcome. Sort of like waiting for the autopsy before saying that Brown was shot in the back which was an early story.

Response to mythology (Reply #74)

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
84. IOW, "let's wait for all the evidence against the victim."
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 09:28 PM
Nov 2014

Seriously, the desperation here to defend Wilson gets so pathetic at times, you have to wonder if these are just bored kids playing with dads PC and internet connection.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
18. My theory is he shouldn't have had the gun
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:05 AM
Nov 2014

The reason he claims he was in danger was his own gun.

Is there training about using the gun that involves unarmed people taking it from you? This claim keeps coming up as the unarmed appear to be so brazen.

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
21. Are you asking if cops train for when people try to take their guns
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:08 AM
Nov 2014

The answer is of course.

Blaming the gun for Brown trying to take it? That's going a long way to find any way to blame anyone but Brown for that.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
25. It is so ironic to me that an officer, in his car, with his gun
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:18 AM
Nov 2014

is in danger from people outside the car and we are supposed to believe that.

Zimmerman had a far better story.

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
26. Are you saying it's impossible to hurt a person in a car from outside
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:19 AM
Nov 2014

Because I would be more than happy to send you as many examples of that happening as you wish.

bluesbassman

(19,370 posts)
40. Why did Wilson have his gun out of it's holster?
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 12:16 PM
Nov 2014

Or did Brown climb in through the window, reach down between the seat and center console, unhook the strap, and try to take Wilson's gun? The answer is he didn't and Wilson had his gun out to display what a badass cop he was long before he ever "asked" himself whether it was legal to shoot an unarmed man. That whole story of his is bullshit and you should be ashamed of yourself for defending it.

madashelltoo

(1,696 posts)
42. Sorry, not buying it.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 02:16 PM
Nov 2014

In a life or death situation no one, law enforcement or military, is running a laundry list tape on legality. Survival takes precedence over all of it.

 

Ykcutnek

(1,305 posts)
44. Except that Wilson escalated things by going after Brown when he was walking away.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 02:41 PM
Nov 2014

The encounter was over. Wilson should have given up.

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
50. What??? You think people should be able to assault cops and then just "walk away"
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:11 PM
Nov 2014

What color is the sky in yor world?

If a person just committed a violent felony, such as assaulting a police officer, officers have a duty to pursue that person and take them into custody. Not "give up" and let them roam free afterwords.

Carolina

(6,960 posts)
49. Then my question to you, Lee-Lee
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:11 PM
Nov 2014

is quite simple. Why exit the car?

If MB was suck a hulk, such a demon... and you were sooooooooooo afraid, yet had (at least initially) the safety of the police car with backup en route, why the hell would you exit the vehicle to pursue this massive threat on foot? Especially since he'd already been wounded and was unarmed, why get out of the damn car!!!!

Wilson's supposedly a trained police officer, but he offers the same bullshit we heard from the untrained Zimmermann. Both were in vehicles, yet they were so fearful of the hooded, hulking black male, they got out of the protective shell offered by the vehicle. Really??????? It makes no damn sense.

Moreover, WTF led to the melee in/at the car? All reports start with Brown walking down the street and Wilson coming upon him and barking orders for him to get out of the street. I can likely imagine just how he said it, too. No one has yet explained what happened next. It makes no sense for MB to simply walk up to the cop car. Instead, it makes more likely sense that Wilson pulled along side Brown who was not immediately compliant to his ORDER (his fucking authority) and threatened to make him get out of the street, perhaps brandishing his gun. Then MB, in self defense, grabbed at it, and was shot, leaving his blood in the car and GSW residue on his hand(s). That's when MB fled and Wilson, the bully who couldn't stand the affront to his ego and his authority, literally hunted him down with an ultimate coup de grace kill shot to the top of the frigging head.

Good for you and all your training, but Wilson's story reeks; and if you're one of the good cops, you should recognize that.

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
52. Why get out of the car and pursue someone who just committed a violent felony?
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:16 PM
Nov 2014

Because it's exactly what a cops job is!

Even though risky, it was his job.

I can't belive you find fault with Wilson for getting out of his car and pursuing the person who committed a felony by assaulting him- when that was his job- instead of faulting the person who first assaulted him, then further broke the law fleeing.

Carolina

(6,960 posts)
53. Oh puhleeze
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:29 PM
Nov 2014

Did you read my post completely. Here, try again:

WTF led to the melee in/at the car? All reports start with Brown walking down the street and Wilson coming upon him and barking orders for him to get out of the street. I can likely imagine just how he said it, too. No one has yet explained what happened next. It makes no sense for MB to simply walk up to the cop car. Instead, it makes more likely sense that Wilson pulled along side Brown who was not immediately compliant to his ORDER (his fucking authority) and threatened to make him get out of the street, perhaps brandishing his gun. Then MB, in self defense, grabbed at it, and was shot, leaving his blood in the car and GSW residue on his hand(s). That's when MB fled and Wilson, the bully who couldn't stand the affront to his ego and his authority, literally hunted him down with an ultimate coup de grace kill shot to the top of the frigging head.


Wilson started this shit and you know, you're just towing the blue line. A cop is always right, of course. Ask Abner Louima, he's one of the few who didn't die! When someone (especially a black male) dares defend himself against cop aggression, it's assault. It justifies a a hale of gunfire and in Michael Brown's case, a volley of 12 shots.

Spare me I have come to fear cops more than crooks. Cops escalate situations, cause more harm and injure and kill people with impunity.

Exhibit A and B: treatment of peaceful Occupy Wall Street protestors and peaceful Ferguson protestors along with the media covering them back in August. Yet look how you guys back off from the Cliven Bundys of this nation

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
78. omfg! You can't be for real. You call for back-up.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 08:36 PM
Nov 2014

That's what every expert on this case has said, and that's what they've faulted Wilson for not doing. It's been all over the news on many channels. Then there's you. Hmmmm.

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
80. Furthermore, how could Wilson chase someone with his supposed injuries?
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 09:06 PM
Nov 2014

With his blown-out eye socket and other injuries, how was he in any condition for a foot chase. So he should have called for back-up in any of those events.

But, Oh. Wait. He wasn't injured. He still should have called for back-up.

Pfffffffffft.

LostInAnomie

(14,428 posts)
70. I just want to say you've done a fantastic job in this thread.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 07:13 PM
Nov 2014

You are dealing with a lot of weapons grade ignorance and vitriol like a champ. A lot of DU has concocted an impervious barrier against non-echo-chamber thoughts and you are doing a great job smashing it.

It's a sisyphean feat, but keep it up.

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
76. Yes, because most gun experts recommend firing your weapon 12 times
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 08:18 PM
Nov 2014

at unarmed people you stop for jaywalking. There is no other way.

"Non-echo-chamber thoughts" must be the secret handshake that let's you in the Good Ol' Boys Network. We all know what that is.

LostInAnomie

(14,428 posts)
81. Jaywalking? Is that how his blood got on the inside of the police car
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 09:18 PM
Nov 2014

... and on Wilson's gun? Inside the driver's side of a police car is an awful strange place to be jaywalking to.

Let's pretend I don't get your innuendo. What Good Ol' Boys Network am I in? You know, since "we all know what that is".

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
87. Do you think the blood got in Wilson's car before or after he stopped
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:23 PM
Nov 2014

Brown? Did he stop Brown because his blood was in his car?

I don't think your questions are serious.

LostInAnomie

(14,428 posts)
89. You're the one that seems to think Wilson shot at him for jaywalking.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:32 PM
Nov 2014

So, either you are woefully ignorant of the case or being incredibly intellectually dishonest. Which is it?

How do you think MB's blood got in the drivers side of Wilson's car and on his gun? Sure wasn't from jaywalking.

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
90. omg, he stopped him for jaywalking.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:33 PM
Nov 2014

I've never said or implied he shot at him for jaywalking. How ridiculous.

LostInAnomie

(14,428 posts)
91. Right... you don't imply it at all.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:49 PM
Nov 2014

"Yes, because most gun experts recommend firing your weapon 12 times at unarmed people you stop for jaywalking."




What you did was try to be clever/snarky and it didn't work out for you. Instead it just made you look ignorant/dishonest.

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
92. omfg, here's what you wrote:
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 11:00 PM
Nov 2014

"You are dealing with a lot of weapons grade ignorance and vitriol like a champ. A lot of DU has concocted an impervious barrier against non-echo-chamber thoughts and you are doing a great job smashing it."

I wrote a sarcastic response to what you wrote. There is no weapons grade ignorance. There are phony arguments about the chain of events that lead to the initial contact between Wilson and Brown, which was jaywalking.

Weapons grade ignorance =








 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
16. Like I said, try it and get back to me
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:01 AM
Nov 2014

Take any stick, sit in your car with the window down, have somebody come up and start hitting you- and try to use that stick to stop them.

And now add a new twist- put a gun on your hip. Know that in more than 90% of cases where an offocers gun is taken theu end up killed with it. Have that person start trying to take your gun, so you have to focus your effort first on retaining positive control of your gun so at a minimum your right hand must stay firmly on it.

While doing all that use your left hand to grab a baton and get enough swing on it through a car window to have any effect.

Can you? Try and get back to me.

Here is a hint- for a baton to have any effect it has to be swung with pretty good force- that takes room to swing. With a person up against your car window hitting you how will you swing it from inside the car?

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
23. I call bullshit
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:10 AM
Nov 2014

Describe to me just how you can swing a baton from inside a vehicle and strike a person outside with enough force to make them stop what they are doing- while what they are doing is reaching in and assaulting you.

 

DisgustipatedinCA

(12,530 posts)
34. I'm not talking about a hypothetical baton
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 11:10 AM
Nov 2014

I'm talking about the dishonest gymnastics you're using to try to defend a murderer.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
46. +1000
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 02:52 PM
Nov 2014

and he is not the only one of these apologists i was just commenting on this yesterday: the mental gymnastics some go through to defend Wilson.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
86. Yes the excuses have grown incredibly lame.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 09:33 PM
Nov 2014

Now people are actually expected to believe you cannot swing in a car. I for one hate it when someone thinks I will believe what the a freeper eats up all day long as the truth.

It's as if someone thinks we don't have critical thinking skills.

 

trekbiker

(768 posts)
57. I believe him
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:56 PM
Nov 2014

and I'm sorry to see a reasoned and rational poster like Lee-Lee running headlong into DU Stupid

Donald Ian Rankin

(13,598 posts)
59. I've noticed that; I think it reflects badly on you and DU, not on them.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 04:01 PM
Nov 2014

Someone who clearly knows what they are talking about better than you do is explaining something you don't want to hear to you, and you're responding by desperately attacking them.

 

DisgustipatedinCA

(12,530 posts)
62. Works for me.
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 04:25 PM
Nov 2014

If you're into people spinning unlikely scenarios in order to justify murder, far be it from me to try to dissuade you from that. If you share the view that unarmed black men have tendency to try to steal a cop's gun while the cop is sitting in his car, and for no discernible reason, then you and I aren't going to agree on much. I'm guessing you see loads more people "reaching for their waistbands" than I ever will.

 

B Calm

(28,762 posts)
36. Well I guess I'm full of bullshit for having a billy bat in
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 11:22 AM
Nov 2014

my truck for the past 30 years. And to think how I risked my life delivering auto parts to the now burned down Auto Zone store in Ferguson, Missouri.

Someone needs to inform the millions of truck drivers out there that Lee-Lee has determined that a billy club under their seat is a useless weapon.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
47. it not useful against "hulking, grunting black demons"
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 02:54 PM
Nov 2014

intent on murdering a poor, scared, armed white police officer. i believe that is his point. otherwise...it probably works fine.

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
35. "somebody come up and start hitting you." Maybe you shouldn't park your police car in such
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 11:19 AM
Nov 2014

a way that you can't exit your vehicle without physically making contacting with someone who is standing there. That's where the stupidity started in this case. It started with the officer. According to Dorian Johnson, Wilson backed his car up to try and trap them, but he then couldn't exit his vehicle without hitting them with his door. Duh.

So "somebody come up and start hitting you".

Carolina

(6,960 posts)
54. Thank you, RB Garr. Dorian's story makes perfect sense
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:44 PM
Nov 2014

As I said up-thread: WTF led to the melee in/at the car? All reports start with Brown walking down the street and Wilson coming upon him and barking orders for him to get out of the street. I can likely imagine just how he said it, too. No one has yet explained what happened next. But it makes no sense for MB to simply walk up to the cop car and start a fight. Instead, it makes more likely sense that Wilson pulled along side Brown who was not immediately compliant to his ORDER (his fucking authority) and threatened to make him get out of the street, perhaps by brandishing his gun. Then Brown, in self defense, grabbed at it, and was shot, leaving his blood in the car and GSW residue on his hand(s). That's when Brown fled and Wilson, the bully who couldn't stand the affront to his ego and his authority, got out of the car and literally hunted him down with an ultimate coup de grace kill shot to the top of the frigging head.

Wilson's story reeks; he was the aggressor, he started this shit and made sure that the other side of the story would be silenced!
He concocted a story which to anyone with a functioning neuron makes no sense. If, Brown was such a hulk, such a demon... and he was sooooooooooo afraid, why the hell would he exit the vehicle to pursue this massive threat on foot?

Wilson's supposedly a trained police officer, but he offers the same bullshit we heard from the untrained Zimmermann. Both were in vehicles, yet they were so fearful of the hooded, hulking black male, they got out of the protective shell offered by the vehicle. Really??????? It makes no damn sense.


noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
65. it only makes sense
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 04:53 PM
Nov 2014

if you buy the "hulking demon with superhuman strength" stereotype. how can armed men claim to be so afraid of unarmed teenagers that they have to shoot to kill? absolute bullshit, but it still sells easily in America. and as you mention...why in the fuck did they get out the cars? there is only one logical conclusion.

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
77. Thx, Carolina. I agree with everything you said. Dorian's account
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 08:31 PM
Nov 2014

did make perfect sense by explaining how Wilson got in such close proximity to start an altercation so randomly. I can see Brown saying the "don't shoot" line given that Wilson himself was showing his gun and Brown may have instinctively started have reaching in to his car imploring him not to shoot.

I can also see how Brown thought about fleeing after being shot, but then turning around and deciding to give up. All of this, of course, is filtered through Wilson's ego (i.e., authority). Such a travesty.

haele

(12,647 posts)
43. Not buying it. It takes less effort to turn a key, slam the gear into drive
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 02:33 PM
Nov 2014

And hit the gas pedal than it does to reach down by your waist band, fiddle with the strap, and clear your weapon so you won't shoot yourself in the leg as you're pulling it up to shoot the person reaching through your window.

Heck, the police constantly advise the public that this it the best tactic to save yourself from a car-jacking whenever there's gang activity, which is much the same scenario that Wilson supposedly found himself in. When someone is coming through the window of your car, hit the gas and get out of danger.

Wilson could pull forward a few dozen yards, stop, call for back-up, then get out and be clear if he wanted to pursue the issue on his own. If not, he had a good description, and there's another warrant that they could hang on someone.

He's also less likely to hit an innocent bystander by using his car rather than his gun.

That is, if things went down the way Officer Wilson says they did. Even if Wilson was telling the truth, he didn't follow basic common sense safety procedures and his impaired (through basic stupidity, roids, anger, fear or whatever) actions directly lead to his pulling the trigger as many times as he did and killing Micheal Brown in this incident.

Criminal Stupidity/Manslaughter at least.

Look, I went through basic police training (military) back in the late 1970's/early 1980's as part of my duty requirements. The first thing they told me was to be proactive rather than reactive. To think, observe, and plan your moves before you engage with someone.
The gun remains holstered until you decided there might be a need to kill someone with it. As my instructor said "You never, ever waive it around like a D**k extender to assert your authority. Some bigger d**k will take it from you before your shorts get stained."

Haele

 

alcibiades_mystery

(36,437 posts)
22. Brown (Demonic Black Hulk Hogan) can strike fatal blows to Wilson's right cheek from outside the car
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:09 AM
Nov 2014

But Wilson was powerless from inside the car without his firearm, which was a totally safe choice at those close quarters.

Don't you understand cop fetishist physics?


 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
24. Or some of us had done it, trained for it, and tried it
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:12 AM
Nov 2014

And the rest of you are talking from a point of ignorant speculation shaded by irrational bigotry against all cops.

 

alcibiades_mystery

(36,437 posts)
27. Oh lawd!
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:28 AM
Nov 2014

In that case, we should leave all adjudication of police behaviors to a board of other police, since they're the only ones with the proper training to make sense of basic physics and ordinary experience. Also, police are very well known for being totally rational and impartial arbiters of possible misdeeds by other police.

Haha! Just kidding. Police almost pathologically defend even the worst of their cohorts to the bitter end. There are probably still NYPD who think Justin Volpe got a raw deal.

If your "experience" led to authentic judgments, it would sometimes show police to be in the right, and sometimes in the wrong. But it doesn't. It always shows police to be in the right. So, at that point, I'm not really that interested in the relevance of your "experience." It is just a dishonest and lame argumentative trump card for your opinion.

 

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)
29. Wallow in your ignorance then, and be happy about it
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 10:48 AM
Nov 2014

It's the same reason I quit bothering to respond to the "why didn't he shoot him in the leg" nonsense from people who have never shot a gun- people are happier when they can invent their own reality instead of listening to people who have done it or going out and actually trying it.

 

alcibiades_mystery

(36,437 posts)
33. And you can be welcome to
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 11:09 AM
Nov 2014

wallow in your blinkered bullshit.

Rest assured that I won't bother responding to it either.

R B Garr

(16,950 posts)
37. You sound like the one inventing "reality".
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 11:25 AM
Nov 2014

I'm not saying that cops aren't in dangerous situations. Of course they are. But that doesn't justify firing 12 shots at someone when you had other options.

Carolina

(6,960 posts)
56. K&R Excellent response
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:49 PM
Nov 2014

They cover their crimes and their travesties and maintain that blue line at all costs.

I have come to fear cops more than crooks, and defenses of Wilson like the pathetic ones expressed by Lee-Lee are just one of the reasons why.

Bettie

(16,089 posts)
30. Fatal blows to him, terrifyingly strong blows
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 11:01 AM
Nov 2014

that left not even a mark on him.

OK, he did have a little bit of chafing at the back of his neck and a monster zit getting ready to pop out on his cheek, but no injuries indicating the terrible beating he claimed.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
48. isn't it amazing that his injuries do not support his story?
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 02:56 PM
Nov 2014

yet people are still peddling as gospel? same thing with the murderer zimmerman.

Bettie

(16,089 posts)
55. It shows me that
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 03:45 PM
Nov 2014

more people than we'd think stand firmly on the side of authoritarianism.

If a cop/wanna-be cop says it, then it must be true.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
61. i agree
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 04:20 PM
Nov 2014

i notice the authoritarian tones when they post about "facts" vs. emotion. and of course, "the facts" always favors the cop.

Bettie

(16,089 posts)
66. I know
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 06:39 PM
Nov 2014

It is so sad that people who are otherwise quite liberal are so stuck in the mindset that the cop is always in the right.

Many of the same people were on Zimmerman's side too and he wasn't even a cop, just a guy who wanted to pretend he was one.

They also tend to forget one fact: a human being is dead.

They try to explain how the victim was really, really bad and deserved to die, as if summary execution by cop is the penalty for any crime.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
67. nothing liberal about those attitudes
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 06:55 PM
Nov 2014

it seems some people need to do some "inner" work to get rid of the grunting demons within.

Bettie

(16,089 posts)
68. Maybe it is a desire to belive
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 06:59 PM
Nov 2014

that they are actually there to protect and serve us (the people in the communities they work in) instead of only protecting and serving themselves, which appears to be the rule rather than the exception these days.

It seems that not-a-cop people are the enemy these days; we're insurgents to our militarized police force.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
69. i think that is a part of it
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 07:11 PM
Nov 2014

but the eagerness to swallow whole these fantastical self-serving tales? i am not sure what that is about. i think stereotypes about black men run deep, and are independent of political affiliation. i just posted about my very first encounter with The Police when i was 7. it was during the watts riots, and my family lived nearby. The authorities must have issued some sort of edict, because all of the kids in the neighborhood were called into our houses. And then the cops came...all white cops in cruisers, with shotguns hanging out of the windows. in our area, The Police were an occupying force of white strangers who didn't live anywhere near us. i learned to mistrust and fear The Police. i know others here have different experiences that shape their views...but that was my introduction to The Police. of course that was almost 50 years ago, and i have had good and bad experiences with police since then. but that was MY introduction to The Police. i am sure people who lived in predominantly minority areas...or poor areas have similar experiences.

Bettie

(16,089 posts)
71. I actually read that account only a few mintues ago
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 07:19 PM
Nov 2014

My experiences with police have been so different, as a white woman.

It illustrates perfectly how being a suburban white woman gives me a privileged position. I may have my own problems, but I don't have to be afraid of cops in most situations, since I'm generally not going to be seen as a threat.

I can't even begin to imagine how terrifying that must have been for a seven year old.

Police should live in the communities they work in. It would go a long way toward relations in both directions, simply by making cops recognize that the communities they work in are populated by HUMAN BEINGS!

Oh, this makes me so angry. I hope I'm making sense...I'm tired enough that it all seems like word salad at this point!

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
79. it makes perfect sense, actually
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 08:40 PM
Nov 2014

thank you for sharing. i know how you feel. i think i am going to take a break for Thanksgiving. Nice chatting with you, Bettie Have a great Thanksgiving.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
73. He had mace and an ASP, he chose to kill Brown instead of easily hitting
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 07:27 PM
Nov 2014

the accelerator or using the ASP. It is funny watching pretend cops defend this guy to the bitter end. Well, funny and sad at the same time.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
39. I was disappointed that Big Ed and Chris Hayes were using this interview on their shows. I muted the
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 11:58 AM
Nov 2014

whole segment. I am not going to listen to that ass. He is guilty. I would not be listening to Zimmerman either.

We should not be awarding him.

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
82. Will someone please tell Darren Wilson to just STFU
Wed Nov 26, 2014, 09:22 PM
Nov 2014

Every half hour every "news" channel has run at least part of Wilson's interview. So all day I watched old Law & Order Episodes where I can pretend that cops really do their jobs and the justice system tries to catch the bad guys. It's a fantasy world, but even with the Special Victims Unit, their reality is more pleasant than reality.

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