Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:01 AM
MannyGoldstein (34,589 posts)
Here's what will happen because of Ferguson:
Some protesters will be put in jail.
Some #%^*heads who yammer about black people needing to obey the law will be re-elected by other #%^*heads. Many black people will not be able to vote because of GOP voter supression; but, don't worry, there will be an investigation and stuff and a Friday afternoon press release enumerating a few ways to improve things in a bipartisan fashion. Officer Wilson will become a little bit wealthy. His fellow officers will smirk a bit more than before when they #%^* with the black locals. The swells in MO government will smirk over cocktails, and shake their heads in disbelief over the inability of "those people" to know their rightful place. The swells in DC will consider what Fox News would say, then do nothing. Followed by being showered by inconceivable wealth from their new jobs on Wall Street. And Michael Brown will molder in his grave, a candle snuffed so early by criminal stupidity or worse. I am so angry tonight... 'nuff said. (And no doubt I'll be called a racist for posting this, for some bizarre reason or another. Better Believe It!, eh Swarm?) We gotta get our #%^* together and do something. This all is very, very, very wrong, and cannot end well unless we get tough, and fast.
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84 replies, 9425 views
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Author | Time | Post |
![]() |
MannyGoldstein | Nov 2014 | OP |
Warpy | Nov 2014 | #1 | |
KingCharlemagne | Nov 2014 | #3 | |
Warpy | Nov 2014 | #4 | |
MannyGoldstein | Nov 2014 | #5 | |
BrotherIvan | Nov 2014 | #9 | |
Travis_0004 | Nov 2014 | #21 | |
Scuba | Nov 2014 | #26 | |
Travis_0004 | Nov 2014 | #33 | |
Scuba | Nov 2014 | #35 | |
lumberjack_jeff | Nov 2014 | #36 | |
REP | Nov 2014 | #48 | |
lumberjack_jeff | Nov 2014 | #49 | |
REP | Nov 2014 | #52 | |
ReRe | Nov 2014 | #61 | |
Travis_0004 | Nov 2014 | #20 | |
Post removed | Nov 2014 | #29 | |
ReRe | Nov 2014 | #62 | |
totodeinhere | Nov 2014 | #80 | |
ReRe | Nov 2014 | #83 | |
99th_Monkey | Nov 2014 | #14 | |
vlyons | Nov 2014 | #30 | |
Travis_0004 | Nov 2014 | #34 | |
ReRe | Nov 2014 | #68 | |
totodeinhere | Nov 2014 | #84 | |
cyberswede | Nov 2014 | #2 | |
MannyGoldstein | Nov 2014 | #7 | |
Kablooie | Nov 2014 | #6 | |
MannyGoldstein | Nov 2014 | #8 | |
Ykcutnek | Nov 2014 | #10 | |
mimi85 | Nov 2014 | #75 | |
KMOD | Nov 2014 | #11 | |
MannyGoldstein | Nov 2014 | #13 | |
vadermike | Nov 2014 | #12 | |
newfie11 | Nov 2014 | #19 | |
blkmusclmachine | Nov 2014 | #15 | |
littlewolf | Nov 2014 | #16 | |
csziggy | Nov 2014 | #38 | |
malthaussen | Nov 2014 | #50 | |
csziggy | Nov 2014 | #51 | |
ReRe | Nov 2014 | #67 | |
ucrdem | Nov 2014 | #17 | |
TheKentuckian | Nov 2014 | #41 | |
DisgustipatedinCA | Nov 2014 | #77 | |
ucrdem | Nov 2014 | #78 | |
AndyTiedye | Nov 2014 | #18 | |
csziggy | Nov 2014 | #39 | |
ladjf | Nov 2014 | #53 | |
bvar22 | Nov 2014 | #54 | |
ladjf | Nov 2014 | #58 | |
former9thward | Nov 2014 | #65 | |
csziggy | Nov 2014 | #59 | |
Vattel | Nov 2014 | #22 | |
FLPanhandle | Nov 2014 | #23 | |
madville | Nov 2014 | #24 | |
aspirant | Nov 2014 | #43 | |
DonCoquixote | Nov 2014 | #47 | |
madville | Nov 2014 | #25 | |
Mr.Bill | Nov 2014 | #55 | |
Skidmore | Nov 2014 | #27 | |
maced666 | Nov 2014 | #28 | |
woo me with science | Nov 2014 | #31 | |
99Forever | Nov 2014 | #32 | |
lumberjack_jeff | Nov 2014 | #37 | |
bettyellen | Nov 2014 | #40 | |
TheKentuckian | Nov 2014 | #42 | |
aspirant | Nov 2014 | #46 | |
KittyWampus | Nov 2014 | #44 | |
SidDithers | Nov 2014 | #56 | |
dionysus | Nov 2014 | #69 | |
JI7 | Nov 2014 | #63 | |
MannyGoldstein | Nov 2014 | #73 | |
indepat | Nov 2014 | #45 | |
gordianot | Nov 2014 | #57 | |
Voice for Peace | Nov 2014 | #60 | |
ReRe | Nov 2014 | #72 | |
Post removed | Nov 2014 | #64 | |
sadoldgirl | Nov 2014 | #66 | |
sheshe2 | Nov 2014 | #70 | |
ucrdem | Nov 2014 | #79 | |
sheshe2 | Nov 2014 | #81 | |
BeanMusical | Nov 2014 | #71 | |
marym625 | Nov 2014 | #74 | |
Kennah | Nov 2014 | #76 | |
davidthegnome | Nov 2014 | #82 |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:10 AM
Warpy (105,836 posts)
1. I want all cops who lose it on people tested for steroid abuse
I saw so much of it as a nurse and recognize that kind of rage.
Any cop found on steroids needs to be fired. Period. And blacklisted for guns. |
Response to Warpy (Reply #1)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:16 AM
KingCharlemagne (7,908 posts)
3. If you read Dorian Johnson's testimony in Volume 4, you'll find
reason to believe Wilson was either on steroids or speed. There's just no other explanation for his erratic and reckless behavior as suggested by Johnson's testimony. It's positively creepy.
http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/1371051-grand-jury-volume-4.html |
Response to KingCharlemagne (Reply #3)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:18 AM
Warpy (105,836 posts)
4. Exactly. I've seen enough steroid abusers lose it
to recognize it.
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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:19 AM
MannyGoldstein (34,589 posts)
5. He didn't take a wizz quizz after the killing?
Another criminal act.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #5)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:53 AM
BrotherIvan (9,126 posts)
9. Not that I know of
There was no toxicology report for Wilson, but there was for Brown. Where the hell is it?
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Response to BrotherIvan (Reply #9)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 06:52 AM
Travis_0004 (5,417 posts)
21. he was tested. results were negative.
Response to Travis_0004 (Reply #33)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 10:16 AM
Scuba (53,475 posts)
35. No test for steriods, eh?
Response to Scuba (Reply #35)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 10:22 AM
lumberjack_jeff (33,224 posts)
36. What is the purpose of a urine creatinine test in this context?
Is it a byproduct of drug use?
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Response to lumberjack_jeff (Reply #36)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 04:21 PM
REP (21,691 posts)
48. Creatinine is present is everyone's urine; elevated/depressed clearance indicates different things
Response to REP (Reply #48)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 04:24 PM
lumberjack_jeff (33,224 posts)
49. why test for it in a post-accident/incident situation? n/t
Response to lumberjack_jeff (Reply #49)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 04:38 PM
REP (21,691 posts)
52. Verify urine is being tested; check for severe dehydration
I only saw the drug screen, not the other labs so without knowing what other tests were done, I can't say with certainty. Since creatinine is present is everyone's urine, it could be to make sure it's urine. A very high Cr with any otherwise unremarkable renal panel can indicate dehydration. A urine Cr is usually done with serum creatinine as a random urine creatinine is kind of meaningless on its own (unless it's a Cr : P).
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #5)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 07:24 PM
ReRe (10,597 posts)
61. That's right...
... more missing evidence. They damn sure did toxicology on Michael Brown, though. The murderer was NOT tested, and the dead man was.
"Land of Laws" my arse. There is NO LAW in Missouri, and evidently in the USA if this whole debacle of injustice is allowed to stand. |
Response to KingCharlemagne (Reply #3)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 06:52 AM
Travis_0004 (5,417 posts)
20. Wilson was tested. Results were negative.
Response to Travis_0004 (Reply #20)
Post removed
Response to Travis_0004 (Reply #20)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 07:45 PM
ReRe (10,597 posts)
62. Travis...
... do you honestly believe that? There has been so many lies & such a miscarriage of justice, how can you believe anything that the local and county PD's or the PA's said or did since the tragic moment Wilson gunned that boy down? Honestly. Come on.
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Response to ReRe (Reply #62)
Fri Nov 28, 2014, 12:35 AM
totodeinhere (12,718 posts)
80. The suggestion was to test police officers for steroids. But if we can't believe the
test results what good would that do?
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Response to totodeinhere (Reply #80)
Fri Nov 28, 2014, 01:39 AM
ReRe (10,597 posts)
83. Well, you're right.
What good is anything? Because nothing was taken serious from start to finish. And as for the DOJ involvement, justice delayed is justice denied. This injustice of police brutality against our black citizens is abhorrent and must not be allowed to continue on unabated.
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Response to Warpy (Reply #1)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 09:32 AM
vlyons (9,399 posts)
30. How about testing for alcohol too?
Lot of fearful people drink to give themselves "courage." Alcohol has proven over and over to cause some people to get mean and violent.
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Response to vlyons (Reply #30)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 10:11 AM
Travis_0004 (5,417 posts)
34. He was tested. His BAC was 0.00
The test was 4 hours after the shooting, so it could have been above 0 then, but he certainly wasnt drunk.
http://www.scribd.com/mobile/doc/248136137/embed |
Response to Travis_0004 (Reply #34)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:32 PM
ReRe (10,597 posts)
68. What is a BAC?
Assume toxicological (drug) testing and/or alcohol testing. He should have been taken to a hospital immediately and tested, rather than 4 hrs past the incident! All I can figure is that police are above the law and presumed innocent in all instances. What other inference could be surmised?
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Response to ReRe (Reply #68)
Fri Nov 28, 2014, 04:50 PM
totodeinhere (12,718 posts)
84. I think that the contract that the police union has with the city probably addresses
issue like this. I'm not sure if the authorities had the right to take him right in for testing. I'm just speculating here.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:15 AM
cyberswede (26,117 posts)
2. When you're right, you're right. nt
Response to cyberswede (Reply #2)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:32 AM
MannyGoldstein (34,589 posts)
7. I'm hoping to get my ass kicked, but good
Sadly, not seeing pushback.
I guess we all know how utterly #%^*ed this is, even the Defenders. |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:29 AM
Kablooie (18,031 posts)
6. And it will al be repeated in several years.
Ever since the 60s the same thing explodes every decade or so because nothing seems to change.
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Response to Kablooie (Reply #6)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 01:34 AM
MannyGoldstein (34,589 posts)
8. Every day, it seems like
Every once in a while it catches the light at just the right angle and the glitter attracts attention.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 02:00 AM
Ykcutnek (1,305 posts)
10. America has erectile dysfunction.
There's always these brief glimmers of hope about us standing up tall, strong and proud...
Then it suddenly fades... and back we go to monotony. |
Response to Ykcutnek (Reply #10)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 11:28 PM
mimi85 (1,805 posts)
75. Yeah, but does it last 4 hours or longer?
Didn't reference that right. But hopeful you all know what i meant. I hope.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 02:04 AM
KMOD (7,906 posts)
11. We have to get our stuff together and do something!
Absolutely, Manny.
I hope you have a loved one to share thanks with tomorrow, or at this hour, today. ![]() It's kind of a regroup day. We have to do something. But for one day, find your peace, share your love, share your time for those in need, and share your thanks. It will build your strength for tomorrow's fight. ![]() |
Response to KMOD (Reply #11)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 02:27 AM
MannyGoldstein (34,589 posts)
13. Unfortunately, tomorrow looks to be a mess
Big family feud. Likely a day-long airing of grievances.
But I appreciate the thought, thanks! |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 02:20 AM
vadermike (1,410 posts)
12. IF THIS KEEPS HAPPENING
my dad has been around a long time.. he has seen it all , he is 76 years old.. he cant believe we are going backwards like this but he always says this country takes many steps forward and then many many back unfortunately.. but he said this crap will not end well.. if nothing is done and more incidents happen , you could see watts riots x 10 or worse.. this shit keeps happening and this is the fing 21st century.. you could see arab spring type stuff ..hopefully it will be peaceful but i think alot people have had enough of this.. i see it on alot of my friends facebook feeds (african americans) and i don't blame them one bit.. its getting out of control...that combines with people's anxiety in general and you have the crazy rwers now buying guns in record numbers , this may not end well.. i just get this sense that our fellow countrymen have gone off the deep end.. especially since President Obama has been POTUS... its total BS... but i dont know what it is going to take to stop this crazy crap!!! rant off. just my .02...
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Response to vadermike (Reply #12)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 06:05 AM
newfie11 (8,159 posts)
19. I was in LA during the Watts Riots
Walking my dog down the street when a Molotov cocktail was thrown into a store and exploded.
I was a bridesmaid for a wedding held in Watts. The only white person there. The destruction there looked like a war zone. I understand the total frustration of year after year being treated as a second class citizen and the anger that produces. I had hopes things were changing and the bigotry in this country was going away. Then Pres. Obama was elected and OMG it's all out in the open. I am ashamed to be called an American! I'm old enough to remember the "whites only" signs in public places. How long before congress puts those up. My country has many problems, from being a war monger to apartheid ( though not obvious)! We as a country are in trouble and if it doesn't change we will destroy it from within! |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 02:34 AM
blkmusclmachine (16,149 posts)
15. Be careful, because the Fed's "eyes in the sky" (drones) will be watching you. And recording you.
I have seen the enemy. And he is us.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 02:37 AM
littlewolf (3,661 posts)
16. what is that quote
those that refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
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Response to littlewolf (Reply #16)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 12:18 PM
csziggy (33,784 posts)
38. The original quote is from George Santayana "The Life of Reason" (1905-1906)
Vol. I, Reason in Common Sense
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." This famous statement has produced many paraphrases and variants:
Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Those who do not remember their past are condemned to repeat their mistakes. Those who do not read history are doomed to repeat it. Those who fail to learn from the mistakes of their predecessors are destined to repeat them. Those who do not know history's mistakes are doomed to repeat them. There is a similar quote by Edmund Burke that often leads to misattribution, "People will not look forward to posterity, who never look backward to their ancestors." http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/George_Santayana#Vol._I.2C_Reason_in_Common_Sense |
Response to csziggy (Reply #38)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 04:26 PM
malthaussen (15,783 posts)
50. Burke also said
"He who doesn't understand history is doomed to repeat it." This is rather similar to Santayana's sentiment.
But as Kurt Vonnegut pointed out, to be alive is to relive the past. I think it is human nature to put old wine in new bottles. -- Mal |
Response to malthaussen (Reply #50)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 04:37 PM
csziggy (33,784 posts)
51. My post included Burke's actual quote
There is a similar quote by Edmund Burke that often leads to misattribution, "People will not look forward to posterity, who never look backward to their ancestors."
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/George_Santayana#Vol._I.2C_Reason_in_Common_Sense |
Response to csziggy (Reply #51)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:19 PM
ReRe (10,597 posts)
67. Another derivitive, maybe:
"How can you know where you're going if you don't know where you've been?"
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 02:39 AM
ucrdem (15,502 posts)
17. Here's what happened as a result of the 1992 Rodney King uprising in L.A:
It took eight years, three mayors, and five police chiefs, including L.A.'s first and second African-American police chiefs, to get there, but these reforms were all carried out and only after nine years of DOJ oversight was the consent decree lifted in 2009 and control of the LAPD returned to the police commission:
http://www.lapdonline.org/assets/pdf/final_consent_decree.pdf Short answer: a lot. But it took several years, not a few days. ................................ ![]() Willie L. Williams, LA Police Chief June 30, 1992 – May 17, 1997 ![]() Bernard C. Parks, LA Police Chief August 12, 1997 - May 4, 2002 |
Response to ucrdem (Reply #17)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 12:44 PM
TheKentuckian (23,947 posts)
41. and they are still fucked up.
Response to ucrdem (Reply #17)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 11:47 PM
DisgustipatedinCA (12,530 posts)
77. The LAPD is in no way fixed, reapaired, or rehabilitated. nt
Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #77)
Fri Nov 28, 2014, 12:07 AM
ucrdem (15,502 posts)
78. It's reformed. In 1992, it was 59% white. Today, it's 37% white.
source: http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2012/0425/Los-Angeles-riots-20-years-later-has-LAPD-reformed
The point is that the Rodney King unrest led to significant, systematic reform including 8 years of DOJ oversight consequent to federal charges brought in 2000, eight years after RK but stemming from it. DOJ investigations take time and the DOJ is actively investigating Ferguson. But if it's instant gratification you're after, L.A. got its first African-American police chief less than 2 months after RK, and it wouldn't surprise me if Ferguson gets a new chief very soon. You heard it here first. p.s. from LBN: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014953765 |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 03:58 AM
AndyTiedye (23,499 posts)
18. "Do Something" but WHAT?
We gotta get our #%^* together and do something. This all is very, very, very wrong, and cannot end well unless we get tough, and fast.
What CAN we do? As you have observed, protests accomplish little or nothing. Riots and vandalism accomplish less than nothing (which is why provocateurs instigate them). Our influence over the political process is at an all-time low and dropping fast. Revolutions always get hijacked by religious fundamentalists these days, we'd get Christian Dominionists instead of Islamists, but that's not really any consolation at all. |
Response to AndyTiedye (Reply #18)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 12:26 PM
csziggy (33,784 posts)
39. The most productive thing to do is to register people to vote
And get them to get out and vote.
We can also work towards restoring felon's rights so more of the disenfranchised are eligible to vote. Many state laws need to be changed so people's rights are not permanently removed - that happened in Florida under Charlie Crist but Rick Scott rolled it back. Aside from those efforts, we HAVE to get people to actually VOTE. As we see by this last election, when the majority of registered voters don't get out to vote, we (liberals, progressives, Democrats, minorities) LOSE. The Republicans know this - that is why they do everything possible to suppress not only voters' rights, but to suppress voting. The Democratic Party will not do it - so "we" (the "royal" we) have to. That is why ACORN was so dangerous - they were getting people registered, getting people's rights restored, and getting people to the polls. That is why ACORN was destroyed. We need a new ACORN! |
Response to csziggy (Reply #39)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 04:41 PM
ladjf (17,320 posts)
53. Your idea to get people register and vote is the obvious next best move.
and it's definitely doable. Only 10% of the black citizens of Ferguson voted in the last election. Get that number up to 80% and the political picture would change immediately.
Screw all of that "horse crap" about "We've all got to get together and work out our differences." That's a hollow recipe. Cast the most votes and take steps to insure that they will ALL be counted will turn things around. By the way, eliminating the fraud will be the most difficult task. The people in power are skilled and relentless in "rigging" the elections. |
Response to ladjf (Reply #53)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 05:09 PM
bvar22 (39,909 posts)
54. That is why the Democratic Party Leadership torpedoed ACORN as fast as they could.
They dropped ACORN and ran like it was a radioactive hot potato.
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Response to bvar22 (Reply #54)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 05:53 PM
ladjf (17,320 posts)
58. My recollection was that the Republicans run ACORN out of business. So, if you are correct,
are you saying that the Democratic Party didn't want ACORN to register voters? And if so, why?
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Response to ladjf (Reply #58)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 07:47 PM
former9thward (28,199 posts)
65. It wasn't just the GOP.
Democrats Run Away from Embattled ACORN
WASHINGTON — Democrats in Congress are abandoning an embattled community organizing group after Republicans stepped up attacks on the liberal-leaning ACORN and the federal funding it receives. Majorities of Senate and House Democrats voted Thursday in favor of separate Republican proposals to block federal funding for the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now. The group has come under heavy criticism following the release Monday of a video showing ACORN employees apparently advising a couple, posing as a prostitute accompanied by her pimp, about how to conceal their line of work, evade taxes and handle undocumented, under-age sex workers. In the Senate, 45 Democrats and Joseph I. Lieberman, I-Conn., backed an amendment — offered by Nebraska Republican Mike Johanns — to bar any funds provided under the fiscal 2010 Interior Appropriations bill (HR 2996) to go to ACORN. http://www.nbcnews.com/id/32917270/ns/politics-cq_politics/t/democrats-run-away-embattled-acorn/#.VHfFRPnESPs |
Response to ladjf (Reply #53)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 06:11 PM
csziggy (33,784 posts)
59. Voting fraud by the people running the elections is a concern
I don't worry much about individual voter fraud - there is so little of it and not much incentive.
I worry a lot about the high percentage of disenfranchised citizens. Too many people have been convicted of things that should not permanently cost them their rights. Why should those people care about how this country is run when they have no say - it should be a cry equivalent to the "No taxation without representation!" Restore people's rights, let them vote, get them involved and they will have a bigger stake in their communities. As for stopping election rigging: We need paper ballots - I don't mind having scanners for quick results, but with paper ballots there should ALWAYS be hand counts to verify the results. If that is done with proper supervision - representatives from each party and/or from each candidate - we can trust our elections |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 07:17 AM
Vattel (9,289 posts)
22. It's not time to give up on getting justice for Michael Brown.
There should be demands for a new Grand Jury. The process was a joke. The prosecutor should have focused the Grand Jury's attention on the relevance of whether Wilson was shooting at Brown as Brown fled. They should have been told that in 1985 the Supreme Court ruled that the Fourth Amendment prohibits shooting a fleeing suspect who poses no immediate danger to anyone. Instead the grand jury was handed an outdated statute saying that officers could shoot at a fleeing suspect.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:13 AM
FLPanhandle (7,107 posts)
23. IMO, nothing will happen until you get a majority of the country to emotionally feel the problem.
I look at successful efforts at change for models.
Vietnam: Lots of protests and fights but those did little to change the overall population's mind. When the media like Time magazine started publishing pictures of "this weeks dead", and Life magazine started following and showing daily pictures, and the TV news started broadcasting field reports, then "the average Joe" began to be emotionally involved. Civil Rights Act: Riots and fights just hardened and polarized opinions, but the image of peaceful well dressed black people trying to eat at a counter, ride a bus, or register to vote being attacked, struck a chord in folks. Ferguson: Riots, fires, looting, and protesting isn't going to do anything but harden people's opinions. I live in a very conservative area, and there is absolutely NO sympathy for Brown around here. These aren't bad people, they just get their news from Fox, and Brown is not a good example for most people to rally around (stealing & fighting with police are non-starters for a sympathetic response). They can have their minds changed though. It's going to take a shot at the publics heart to get things to change. Something along the lines of Time magazine of innocent people killed by police this week done week after week until it sinks in. |
Response to FLPanhandle (Reply #23)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:34 AM
madville (7,029 posts)
24. I'm seeing the same thing in my area
Zero sympathy on Tuesday at the government office building I work at, the opinion almost completely across the board was that Brown was ultimately responsible for creating the situation by robbing the store and allegedly assaulting the officer/supposedly going for the officer's gun.
It's bright red around here, can't change anyone's mind, they already "know" everything anyway. The maddening part is that we will never know what really happened. Anything anyone says or thinks is simply an opinion and their interpretation, the "facts" can't be pinned down. |
Response to FLPanhandle (Reply #23)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 02:59 PM
aspirant (3,533 posts)
43. Pictures are devastating
Posting on the internet would be a start. We need to organize boycotts nationally and globally. Cutting into their bottom line, it's the only thing these filthy corporations understand. The Saudi's maintaining their levels of oil production has the USA fracking industry starting to raise their voices. We the people of this planet have this much power, if not more.
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Response to FLPanhandle (Reply #23)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 03:16 PM
DonCoquixote (13,475 posts)
47. and that is why
the first thign we need to do,possiboly even more so than voting itself, is to undermine the media empires, beucase the media is the engine that keeps the people fromunderstandign anything. Yes, Bill Clinton, you are very much to blame, thanks to your murder of the telecommuncations act.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:47 AM
madville (7,029 posts)
25. One thing that will come from this
Many more departments already have or will outfit their vehicles and officers with cameras and microphones.
Video evidence would have immediately clarified this particular incident, whatever it may have shown, could have led to charges against Wilson or exonerated him completely, we'll never know for sure. I used to work for a company that sold, installed, and repaired vehicular camera systems for the police. Most officers liked the cameras once they got used to it being there and understood that it being there could be to their advantage, many had stories about the recordings saving their bacon so to speak. Saw several officers severely reprimanded and some fired for stuff caught on video as well, it goes both ways. |
Response to madville (Reply #25)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 05:10 PM
Mr.Bill (19,649 posts)
55. The Sheriff's department where I live
has no cameras in their cars nor do they want them. The cameras would show too many things not in their favor.
You can ask any RN who works in the ER in our hospital and she can name the cops who regularly beat the shit out of people. This is known in my county as "resisting arrest". |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 09:03 AM
Skidmore (37,364 posts)
27. How many more prosecutors will be emboldened to use the grand jury system
in place of a trial based on actual charges to try a case? This abuse of the system is egregious and is a violation of both the rights of the accuser and the accused, as far as I'm concerned.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 09:09 AM
maced666 (771 posts)
28. You are exactly right, nothing will come of this.
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 09:37 AM
woo me with science (32,139 posts)
31. Amen. You will know the corporate Third Way by their refusal to demand real change here.
We need an end to the militarization of our police, which is federally driven. We need real accountability, including a national database of police violence and relentless DOJ attention to police abuses.
Yet when the CRITICAL role of purchased, corporate politicians in the creation of this police state America is becoming is mentioned, the Third Way circles the wagons and refuses to demand accountability from our politicians. No, we are to cheer pretty speeches instead, even though they come with no intent for real change. The militarization continues. Exactly what we have come to expect from our corporate government when it comes to outrages like this. Nothing ever gets better anymore. We get cynical, pretty speeches and cheering propaganda voices, and nothing more. No one is ever serious about actual change for the better. In fact, the corporate politicians making pretty speeches are relentlessly making things worse: ____________________________________________________________________________ The entire Democratic leadership opposed Grayson amendment to stop arming cops with DOD weapons
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025390424 Police Militarization (including the Obama administration's role)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/06/aclu-police-militarization-swat_n_2813334.html It's almost certain that if the police agencies cooperate, the ACLU will find that the militarization trend has accelerated since Kraska's studies more than a decade ago. All of the policies, incentives and funding mechanisms that were driving the trend then are still in effect now. And most of them have grown in size and scope. It's united oligarchy, not divided democracy. And it's united oligarchy with a relentless propaganda machine to try to obscure the truth. |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 09:39 AM
99Forever (14,524 posts)
32. The pot is about to boil over.
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
John F. Kennedy, In a speech at the White House, 1962 |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 10:36 AM
lumberjack_jeff (33,224 posts)
37. I've almost always lived in small towns.
I concede that I am, to a degree, naive.
But when I have an issue with something generally (e.g. not related to a specific crime experience) I've contacted the chief of police or the Sheriff and asked him to meet me over a cup of coffee. I'm not suggesting that this is a panacea everywhere, but the more that cops see the merits of community policing the better for us all. Successful communities have bidirectional personal relationships with the police officers and administrators working there. |
Response to lumberjack_jeff (Reply #37)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 12:37 PM
bettyellen (47,209 posts)
40. in larger communities there has been a change of mission- statistics compiled are used to give pcts
targets to "correct" those stats by whatever means needed to give the appearance of "improvement" usually in some quality of life index that those much higher up demand to see improved. I watched it happen in NYC, where they spent a lot of time trying to get victims NOT to press for an investigation of charges on any violent crime. The cops I knew were disgusted. If they don't report it, NYC real estate gets more valuable.
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Response to lumberjack_jeff (Reply #37)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 12:54 PM
TheKentuckian (23,947 posts)
42. No, the more the police understand there will be dire consequences to blasting folks
the better things will eventually be.
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Response to TheKentuckian (Reply #42)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 03:06 PM
aspirant (3,533 posts)
46. Just 2 or 3 convictions and we will see change quickly.
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 03:02 PM
KittyWampus (55,894 posts)
44. WOW! You finally get around to talking about the racial problem after two tasteless & disgusting
posts that used Brown's tragic death as your fodder.
And this is all you can come up with? Thin gruel. And trying to minimize how ugly your previous two threads were by brushing off well deserved criticism as "eh, swarm" indicates you don't get it. This particular OP seems more like ass-covering for your previous two insults. |
Response to KittyWampus (Reply #44)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 05:11 PM
SidDithers (44,228 posts)
56. BTW. Someone alerted on your post...
Will post results when they come in.
Edit: 5-2 Leave. Sid |
Response to SidDithers (Reply #56)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:40 PM
dionysus (26,467 posts)
69. Manny is just all about attention seeking... vhat? vaz you saying something about attention...
seeking.. to meee? vhat?
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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #44)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 07:46 PM
JI7 (87,644 posts)
63. you have to admit there are some things that don't change
including those who try to make everything about themselves including using other people's tragedy to ridicule and then try to make themselves out to be the victim when called out on it.
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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #44)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 09:14 PM
MannyGoldstein (34,589 posts)
73. Happy Thanksgiving!
If you'd like to point out the specific parts of my posts that were ugly or insulting, I'd love to know. Otherwise, please apologize for spraying diarrhea all over DU.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 03:06 PM
indepat (20,899 posts)
45. The right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness has been unconstitutionally
and shamefully shit upon by TPTB.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 05:49 PM
gordianot (14,970 posts)
57. Something might happen if conventions are cancelled in St.Louis.
When the bottom line $$ is considered maybe there will be movement for justice.
Considering that Governmemt cannot legislate background checks for firearms after multiple massacres when kindergarteners are slaughtered by unidentified strangers I do not hold out much hope when unarmed 18 year old is slaughtered by a policeman that anything will be either legislated or done to correct the situation. Even obvious charges of racism carry little weight to these people without a shred of conscience or empathy. |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 06:46 PM
Voice for Peace (13,141 posts)
60. Can the US Government not establish a Police Oversight Commission?
Whereby all shootings by cops if questionable go immediately
to a higher authority than the local boys? |
Response to Voice for Peace (Reply #60)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:59 PM
ReRe (10,597 posts)
72. No.
Makes too much sense.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Post removed
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:18 PM
sadoldgirl (3,431 posts)
66. The cameras are a good idea,
but only if they cannot be turned off or fiddled with in other ways.
I would also like to see a special prosecutor for every police caused killing, although I am not sure how that person can be chosen without running into the difficulty we have observed in Ferguson. |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:44 PM
sheshe2 (77,706 posts)
70. You make me so sad Manny.
Your faux concern says it all. You don't give a damn about Michael, you never have. Your concern was blaming a black man for not taking on the banks. Before you alert on me, I lost another loved one last night. I am grieving in a way that you cannot understand, yes different from Michaels family grief. It was not violence, it was due to Monsanto and asbestos.
Please stop making fun of this, it is an insult. |
Response to ucrdem (Reply #79)
Fri Nov 28, 2014, 12:51 AM
sheshe2 (77,706 posts)
81. Sigh~
I thank you.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 08:56 PM
BeanMusical (4,389 posts)
71. This is really depressing.
The more things change... etc.
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Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 09:52 PM
marym625 (17,997 posts)
74. I felt hopeless on Tuesday
But watching the protests across the country, the #stoptheparade movement and the solidarity with people across the country, has given me a little hope. A little.
However, if the killing of Tamir Rice goes the way of Michael Brown, John Crawford and countless others, as far as I am concerned, all bets are off. Burn it down. It's the only thing that the government, the 1% and the cops care about, property |
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Thu Nov 27, 2014, 11:42 PM
Kennah (9,941 posts)
76. Damn you, Manny Goldstein. Damn you for speaking the cold, hard, concise, honest truth.
Response to MannyGoldstein (Original post)
Fri Nov 28, 2014, 01:03 AM
davidthegnome (2,983 posts)
82. In the short term, perhaps
Long term, I'm afraid it's going to get much, much worse. I've known some good cops, but the idiots and jerks I've known who were cops unfortunately greatly outnumber them. Of course, it's not just cops, either. It's the racial outlook of Americans in general. For so long, there has been this little act as if racial prejudice did not exist, or was not harmful - particularly among white, clueless conservatives.
Then a black man was elected President - and suddenly the level of hatred, racism, bigotry, stupidity... the threats, the insults, they were right out there in the open. I once knew a young man from South Carolina who told me that the South would rise again, that the civil war had not truly ended, that it was just a long damned truce. Some times, I wonder if perhaps he was right. I don't think that it's going to go well for quite some time, Manny. I have faith that, in time, it will end well - that things will change for the better. It's time to pull out that ugly old racism, drag it's ass into the open - and confront it. As long as we have so many shmucks denying it's very existence, I fear we'll see more Michael Browns. |