It was a "thrill-killing"

[PCIntern]

Pistol-packin', mean shootin' hardass tough-guy is driving around and sees a black guy. Almost no one around. He calls 911 to cover himself, deliberately and willfully ignores the pleas of the dispatcher to stay away from the 'suspect', gets out of the car and pursues the guy with the full intent of killing him no matter what and dispatches him with aplomb and stone-cold sociopathy, no nervousness or interest in anything but the doing of the deed. He is Arnold in the first Terminator film, he is Charles Bronson in the Death Wish films, he is Samuel L. Jackson in Pulp Fiction. He is God, he is Justice, he is Executioner. It is that simple. All other narratives are the projection of the author onto this sociopath.

How do I know this? I saw his eyes in the bail hearing. Expressionless and dead. Like his unfortunate victim's are now.

[ithinkmyliverhurts]

1. Hmmm, this would have never crossed my mind.

I never could have imagined such a psychological disposition. What sort of mind does this Zimmerman have that he could construct such a narrative?

Fascinating.

[PCIntern]

3. homicidal sociopath

Previous history is indicative...who knows what else he did that was never accounted for or reported. No guilt, no conscience, no anxiety.

[11 Bravo]

82. Holy shit! You scare me more than Zimmerman does!

I think he's a trigger-happy punk who needs to go away for a very long time, but where do you get "homicidal" from his previous history? And "who knows what else he did that was never accounted for or reported" is just fucking nuts! (By the way, the answer is NOBODY, so what penalty would you impose?)
Finally, you appear to dislike his eyes. An old girlfriend once told me, "Sweetheart, you have the most beautiful blue eyes I've ever seen, and if I didn't know what was behind them they would scare the shit out of me!" How long would you put me away for?

[CJCRANE]

7. The human mind can construct many different types of narrative.

Just look at that guy in Norway, who carried out that massacre. He constructed a very detailed (and in his mind) consistent narrative for his actions.

[ithinkmyliverhurts]

14. Yeah.

I've watched all the movies in the OP and have played video games, but what the OP presents would still never have occurred to me. I suppose there are a couple of lines to be drawn here: line 1--the ability to think of such things; line 2--the ability to carry them out. I'm so unsophisticated that I can't even think of such things. I guess there are advantages to being a dullard, dumb. And I'm easily fascinated by a feather floating.

[PCIntern]

16. No, you're not a sociopath

who extrapolates these types of situations to himself. You enjoy fantasy film and games without being a killer or James bond for that matter. When you leave the theater you go back to your reality, when these people leave the theater, it gives them ideas for what to do after dark.

[HangOnKids]

19. Nice Little Piece Of Fiction

[ithinkmyliverhurts]

21. Because the same scenario is true to you and you can imagine it?

O.K.

Perhaps I may lie to myself or be deluded. Perhaps I am more insane because I am so deluded as not to be able to imagine such a scenario. I suppose that may be true.

Or perhaps I'm simply lying under an alias because the lying somehow protects me. I guess that could also be true.

[HangOnKids]

23. Whatever Gets You Through The Night

No beef with you, just chatting.

[ithinkmyliverhurts]

25. Hey, I take no offense here.

Thanks for the wave.

And I really do get your objection. I too would claim bullshit if it weren't me making the claim. Oh, but wait . . .

I wish more people on DU could receive an honest "bullshit" call without being offended. Good call. No offense.

[HangOnKids]

28. Cheers! I Like You!

[CJCRANE]

26. Are you related to Boojatta?

You have an interesting way of looking at things. That's not necessarily a bad thing.

[ithinkmyliverhurts]

29. No relation.

"Interesting" in my neck of the woods usually means "incomprehensible" and/or f**ing re*****ed." Both of which are probably about right.

[Electric Monk]

18. Interesting point. I hadn't thought of it that way.

Breivik's defense is he was "defending his country" similar to how Zimmerman was first "defending his neighborhood" and then "defending himself".

Anders Behring Breivik, 33, admits killing eight people with a car bomb at government headquarters in Oslo, then gunning down 69 people, most of them teenagers, at a Labour Party summer camp on Utoeya island.

But he has pleaded not guilty, insisting he was defending the country against waves of Muslim immigration facilitated by the political left.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/04/20/norway-mass-killer-anders-behring-breivik-tells-terror-trial-he-was-a-normal-nice-person/

[orpupilofnature57]

8. The kind people make excuses for

on until it's too late .Not fascinating a wacko racist a gun ,unfortunately there are tons more where he came from.

[orpupilofnature57]

2. It's the reason why people who

facilitated him should be held accountable ,what neighborhood watch gave this idiot the nod?

[PCIntern]

4. Exactly: it's the neighborhood watch, not

the neighborhood shooter, or the neighborhood excutioner.

on edit: he is no more a part of neighborhood watch than George W Bush was a member of the Trilateral Commission. He just acted a part in a play: a play in his own head.

[peacebird]

5. He is NOT a member of Neighborhood Watch.

No associationwith the national group at all.

[Demoiselle]

6. "Travis Bickel."

...That's how Curtis Sliwa identified him in a PBS interview a few weeks ago. I haven't ever seen Taxi Driver, I don't think I could stand it....but from what I know about the movie and the DeNiro character, that sounds about right to me.. Indeed, who would ever want to give this guy a gun!

[dionysus]

74. yeah, but travis bickel killed actual scumbags, not unarmed children...

[Demoiselle]

89. Oh wow, sorry! That will teach me to cite a movie I've never seen!

[dionysus]

90. it's a disturbing movie, but very, very good...

[perimedik]

9. fair trial will never happen.

So you can pick out a guilty person just like that?

You can judge him just like 99% of America already has.

Justice will not be served in this case, because not only was a man killed but the person who killed him WILL NOT receive a fair trial.
The press has crucified him, the people have eaten it up and in no wat shape or form will any justice come out of this trial.
No one will be happy, no one will be satisfied with either outcome.

I am by no means defending Zimmerman or Trayvon.
NONE OF US have facts - yet we dissect every little crumb that is thrown at us like it's the Zapruder film.

[PCIntern]

11. yes, I can and yes, you are.

Fact of the matter is that this guy shot him...an unarmed man. He may be found technically innocent, but the facts are that he shot an unarmed man after he was told by the police to stay away and let them handle it.

[laundry_queen]

91. I have to ask

do you have a history of abuse? I find that people who have a history of abuse are extremely perceptive when it comes to those who lack empathy. I got the same feeling from GZ. Nothing there. People who haven't been through it sometimes don't know what to look for, you know?

[enough]

15. In what possible way would Trayvon need to be "defended" at this point? He was the victim.

You're not defending Zimmerman or Trayvon? How could those two be equated that way, that one might chose to defend one or the other. One of them killed someone, and the other one is who is killed. There's no equation.

[fascisthunter]

31. who shot who?

[glowing]

68. Actually, I have served on 2 different juries.... And yes, I could leave all the

chatter at the door and do my job of listening to the facts and the evidence that the state presents. Zimmerman is still "innocent" until the state proves its case. Most people who are selected will do the job they are supposed to do.

What the prosecutors and the defense and the judge will have to watch for are sleuth juror who want to be on the case to make a buck, make sure he goes free or make sure he goes to jail.

Of course, they cannot find a jury that hasn't heard something of this case. They can find citizens who will take their instructions to listen to the facts and base their decision on what was presented in the trial and only at the trial. The jury will also be sequestered, like in the Anthony case, and they will not see or hear all the chatter and press and details that the outside world will be privy to.

I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't call a jury in from another county like they did with Anthony. And I can't imagine that the trial would last more than a week... Its not exactly as if the defense has to prove that Zimmerman was the one who shot Martin... Its presenting the facts as to why he is guilty of Murder.

[MoonRiver]

10. This has always been my take on Zimmerman.

And if he gets off he will undoubtedly seek that "high" again.

[knowbody0]

12. and immediately after "the kill"

he slammed his head on the pavement to insure the self defense bs

[FiveGoodMen]

33. No, that was photoshopped in much more recently

Watch the cop station video.

[joeybee12]

13. Not sure...but your theory is bolstered by him saying...

"Fucking coons" and something like, "He's not going to get away with it...they always get away with it."

[fascisthunter]

17. indeed it was... and his defenders probably fantasize of doing the same thing

real psychopath losers just itching for a justification, and now this new laws does just that.

[ecstatic]

20. I think he killed because he has a temper and anger

management issues. His past record confirms that.

[Major Hogwash]

22. That's a very insightful comment.

And I agree.
Zimmerman went hunting, looking for someone to shoot that night.
Probably like he did on many other nights before that very night.

[RebelOne]

24. He is like a hunter who enjoys the thrill of the kill. n/t

[Solomon]

27. The thought that he called the cops for cover

crossed my mind long ago, bolstered by the statement and tone of voice, "they always get away".

[Dont call me Shirley]

30. Trigger happy, sportin a new 9mm w/permit to carry, skinhead racist,

a daddy who can get him out of trouble. Scenario for the perfect crime.

[WinniSkipper]

83. The skinheads are recruiting

...half Latino half Jewish men now? Shirley you jest.

Recruiting must be difficult, so at least that's a good sign

I do think Zimmerman is a danger to society. Even if he is found not guilty.

Non related question - anyone can answer - What time of day did this happen? I can never seem to find that part

[Little Star]

84. About 7:10 pm Zimmerman called police and by..

about 7:25 pm Trayvon was dead.

[WinniSkipper]

85. Thanks for the reply

Right at dinner time - when people are most likely to be home. The time when someone is probably least likely to break in somewhere.

[Little Star]

86. Yes, it was a least likely time for a break in. I agree.

[RZM]

32. You can determine his intent on the night in question from looking at his eyes now?

That's kind of a stretch.

Blank expressions are pretty common in courtrooms. I imagine lawyers would advise their clients to show little emotion at a bond hearing. I suspect a blank expression is also partly natural when your whole world has been turned upside down and you future hangs in the balance. Also, I believe such expressions are common because it's in the defendant's best interests to give the impression that they acknowledge the gravity of the situation and are not taking the charges, court, or the family of the victim lightly. Smiling or looking pissed are probably bad moves in such situations, as would be appearing overly emotional, which could be construed as obvious acting.

[Solomon]

34. LOL. Totally ignoring the evidence.

We know what both states of mind were. Because both had engaged in conversations. It is clear that Trayvon was fearful and trying to get away from Zimmerman, and that's why he went where a car could not go.

On the other hand, we know Zimmermans state of mind from the police call. He was not fearful of Trayvon, that much is clear. You don't chase a person you're fearful of. He saw enough of Trayvon to tell the cops that he was a teenager. He clearly went after him with ill intent as witnessed by his statements, fucking coons and all that, they always get away.

You can't leave out the evidence and claim the op is basing opinion merely on Zimmerman's eyes.

[RZM]

36. I'd say it's pretty tough to argue

That he had the 'full intent of killing him' from the evidence we have now. Not being afraid of him and intending to kill are different things. That could be the case, BTW, but I don't see it yet from the evidence available.

'Fucking coons' has been disputed. Not that 'fucking punks' is a whole lot better, but still. But let's say he did say 'fucking coons' for the sake of argument. Neither that nor 'they always get away' is evidence of intent to kill. It's evidence of racism and profiling, but again, those aren't the same as intent to kill.

Personally, I don't think he was out looking to kill somebody. I think he spotted somebody he believed to be suspicious, followed and accosted this person (against the dispatcher's instructions), and that's where it gets murky. Whatever happened next, the end result was Trayvon's death.

My personal opinion is that a physical struggle of some kind occurred and in the course of this struggle, Zimmerman shot Trayvon. What started it I don't know. Could be Trayvon attempted to run, could be he attacked Zimmerman, could be Zimmerman attacked him. Combat could have begun by accident as well, resulting solely from the mutual hostility and tension, with both parties simultaneously initiating it. Could be there was no combat, though I find it unlikely Zimmerman simply whipped out his piece and shot a cowering Trayvon in cold blood. It's not impossible, but I find that scenario unlikely.

I don't think the evidence supports that he was the terminator and out for blood. I certainly don't think his eyes at the bail hearing tell us much of anything. I think he was out to be a hero and take credit for apprehending a person he believed to be suspicious, based on his dress and skin color. That's a bad thing, but it's not the same as a killing machine on the hunt.

As more evidence emerges, we'll hopefully get a better picture of exactly how this all went down. But the picture I have right now does not support the OP's argument. That's fine of course. Nothing wrong with differing interpretations here.

[PCIntern]

38. Ed Zachary. n/t

[cherokeeprogressive]

42. "We know what both states of mind were."

One conversation was recorded, the other was not.

You have no fucking idea what the other conversation was. No fucking idea. Do you understand that? NO FUCKING IDEA. What you have in regards to the unrecorded conversation is the word of the wronged party.

My goodness... I fucking PRAY you never sit in judgment of ME in a court of law...

[Solomon]

49. Here we go again. See, this is what I'm talking about.

Notice how you discount the statements of Trayvon's girlfriend, as though its not evidence. This is a phenomenon among Zimmerman defenders that is astonishing. Sorry to break it to you, but Trayvon's girlfriend is a witness. She was talking with Trayvon during the incident. The phone records confirm the time of the conversations, and his girlfriend knows what she said to him and why she said them.

Now what is the possible reason you are so willing to discount such a crucial piece of evidence?

I'm afraid we do know Trayvon's state of mind, whether you like it or not. Deal with it.

[cherokeeprogressive]

57. I'm from Missouri. SHOW ME what the conversation between Trayvon and his GF was...

PROVE to me what words they traded. Zimmerman's words between he and the 911 operator were recorded.

Trayvon's words between he and his girlfriend were not.

PROVE what you know... PROVE it to the extent that it could be considered anything other than heresay in a court of law.

Can you?

I didn't think so.

[Solomon]

78. Lol. You're being absurd. By your logic, neither Zimmerman nor

any other witness can testify unless what they said heard or saw was taped. You are ignorant of the way trials work. Very amusing. Sorry, but Trayvon's girlfriend is a WITNESS even if she is black. Get over it.

[4th law of robotics]

70. Obviously you can't tell all that *just* by the eyes

you also need to measure various aspects of their skull to see if he has the cranial features of a killer.

[Control-Z]

35. And without an ounce of remorse

he calmly makes the emotionless non-apology.

Yeah I saw it too. But I had already come to the same conclusions. Imo, he planned and waited patiently for the perfect conditions, out every night, armed for that moment. He may have had conversations with himself, knowing he shouldn't but unable to stop himself. Probably told himself it was just another test run, unless the conditions were perfect.

And the comment he wanted passed on to his wife. Paraphrasing, "Tell her I just shot a guy". Like he'd been on a hunting trip. No, "oh my gawd, what have I done". No tears or remorse. Not even, "I was attacked. He tried to kill me. I had to shoot the guy."

Sick, sick, sick. Have you seen the movie Mr. Brooks?

[cherokeeprogressive]

37. "How do I know this? I saw his eyes..."

So who are you... Senator Frist?

Are you fucking kidding me? You know from the look in someone's eyes what was in their mind two months ago?

This kind of hyperbole needs to stop.

[PCIntern]

39. you're missing the point entirely

and that is that we have a lot of facts and his lack of emotionality coupled with his behaviors led me to that conclusion. I is not "hyperbole"...it is a conclusion based upon the evidence and the demeanor of the defendant. and you know what else: I'm not on the jury...I'm entitled to my opinion a priori last I looked.

[cherokeeprogressive]

43. Nowhere in your all knowing post did you state that you were voicing an "opinion".

"emotionality"? I didn't even know that was a word.

And, since this case hasn't been tried in a court of law, there is NO "evidence" that can be considered anything other than "opinion".

I pray to god you never sit in judgment of me should I ever commit a crime worthy of a jury trial.

[zappaman]

61. +100 Props for adding some sanity to the lynch mob mind set.

Now we have people saying they know he's guilty and a cold-blooded murderer by his eyes?
How about we just wait for the trial and see the evidence?

[4th law of robotics]

72. I think it's absolutely barbaric that we still rely on trials and juries to make decisions

when you can easily and reliably just look someone in the eye and determine their guilt.

This is a serious crime, why leave it up to chance*?

*a combination of evidence, legal arguments and the summed judgement of 12 of his peers.

[Union Scribe]

88. Indeed.

I expect a thread soon to use computer images to measure Zimmerman's head and analyze him via phrenology.

[notadmblnd]

40. I agree. I posted this on April 11. We were talking about pre-meditation.

"He may not have planned on killing Trayvon specifically, but he was looking for an opportunity to kill someone. He took advantage of that opportunity when he approached Trayvon Martin that night."

[cherokeeprogressive]

44. "...he was looking for an opportunity to kill someone."

Are you fucking KIDDING me? You know this HOW?

Maybe you need to learn about the legal definition of "pre-meditation".

[notadmblnd]

52. Maybe you need to relax?

[cherokeeprogressive]

53. Relax about an uniformed opinion claiming one human was LOOKING for someone to kill...

Nah.

Sorry.

[notadmblnd]

55. then you're just looking for a fight because you want something to be outraged about

And if my opinion is nothing but total nonsense, then why would it bother you? Why would you bother to become enraged and post such a berating post?

[cherokeeprogressive]

59. I don't believe I've been "enraged" about anything in my entire 50 years on this planet.

I guess I'm lucky.

Doesn't keep me from believing you're wrong though.

[notadmblnd]

76. "Are you fucking KIDDING me? You know this HOW?"

you're saying that the above rude statement wasn't said out of anger? Caps and all, because I certainly spelled and used the word "enraged" correctly.


Enrage | Define Enrage at Dictionary.com
dictionary.reference.com/browse/enrage
/ɛnˈreɪdʒ/ Show Spelled[en-reyj] Show IPA. verb (used with object), en·raged, en·rag·ing. to make extremely angry; put into a rage; infuriate:


What People Think When You Type in All Caps • People think a message in all caps means that the writer is yelling at them. (this along with the word "fucking" is what I thought your reply to me was, hence the use of the word "enraged". If I'm wrong, I guess these other reasons could apply)
• People assume that the writer is trying to demand attention.
• People may assume that you have a lack of skill with technology.
• People may assume that you are an immature writer.
• People may assume that you are lazy.

I would like to add that I am just as entitled to my opinion and expressing it in this forum as you are to yours. I stated what I think. Your nasty reply will not succeed in shutting me down. So do yourself a favor and just put me on ignore- it is apparent that what I think bothers you.

[libodem]

69. Taking that gun out of his waist band states intent to kill

If it is a hand gun that equals a gun designed to kill other human beings. You brandish you are demonstrating intent. You point that Fucker at someone you show intent. He had intent!

[zappaman]

62. "he was looking for an opportunity to kill someone"

Wow, so you read his mind that night?
Amazing abilities you have.

[mojitojoe]

41. I don't know if Zimmerman set out to kill Martin...

...but the long and the short of it is that he did kill him. Walking through a neighborhood while black is not a capital offense, even in Florida. The standard for using deadly force under this law has to be clearly defined or else it'll be open season on anyone that somebody doesn't like the looks of. I don't know if second degree murder is called for but clearly this is a manslaughter offense at the very least. Zimmerman should be charged, he should be tried, and when convicted should go to jail.

[snagglepuss]

45. Thrill-killing absolutely nails it. It expalins why that POS wasn't moved by his victims screams.

[oneshooter]

50. So you have judged him guilty.

Does he get an appeal? Or it straight to the gallows?

[oneshooter]

51. So you have judged him guilty.

Does he get an appeal? Or it straight to the gallows?

[shraby]

46. With the law as it stands on the books, John Wayne Gacy or Ted Bundy could have claimed

that they felt threatened and in fear of their life. At least until it came out that there were many victims. Eileen Warner would have been justified even.

[kitt6]

47. Thank you for your perception.

This is a very dark and evil case. Even the new lawyer.

[HereSince1628]

48. Maybe

I don't know how many DNA tests have proven men innocent of murder whose eyes were apparently misinterpreted by a juror who found them guilty, but I'd bet that number isn't zero.

I wouldn't even trust the therapist I've had for the past year to be able to read my past intent from my eyes.

Maybe, he'd do better if he combined the look in my eyes with the bumps on my head, but still that's only a maybe.

Which is to say, I think the Court has a job to do, and it's proper to leave conviction to the sworn servants of said Court.

[Skip Intro]

54. You got all that from looking into his eyes through a monitor?

Wasn't Bill Frist laughed off the public stage, in part, due to this kind of idiocy?

Wow, just when I think DU can't jump the shark again, just wow.

On edit - 30 recs? Oh My God.

[RZM]

66. Don't knock it

Bush looked into Putin's soul that way. And they remained the best of friends for the rest of his presidency, ensuring wonderful relations with Russia that have lasted right up to today.

[ZombieHorde]

56. I think Zimmerman's mother had an affair with a black teenage boy,

and he shot Martin to avenge his father's feelings. That is why he called his dad afterwards.

After the shooting, I am absolutely certain Zimmerman whispered to himself, "I hope a 3-D version of Rambo comes out soon. I don't really enjoy 3-D movies, but seeing the Italian Stallion in 3-D would be pretty sweet. I wish I could just use the glasses I got from the other 3-D movies I have seen. I have like six pair cluttering up my house."

[Skip Intro]

58. Exactly! Thank You!

[cherokeeprogressive]

60. Nailed it.

[zappaman]

63. +1 Exactly. nt

[TorchTheWitch]

64. Amazing

All just because you looked at his eyes. No reading of tea leaves or consulting a crystal ball or examining the entrails of a goat and a pigeon. Just looked at his eyes. Wow, that is some incredible talent you got there.

[shimonitanegi]

65. I regret that I have no evidence to debunk your assertion.

He pretty much may be a psycho killer, or not.

[Meiko]

67. Well

I guess that settles it then.

[libodem]

71. I'll go ya one better

It was a thrill killing and a hate crime. This should be prosecuted with the full extent of any enhanced penalties for the blatent hate involved. Pure racism.

[PCIntern]

73. Absolutely...

he did it and he did it because he wanted to do it to a black male. And he thought, possibly correctly, that there would be enough law AND liberal apologists on his side. As far as he was concerned, that would be enough.

and judging by the response here, he was absolutely correct in his assumptions, at least so far.

[libodem]

75. That's for sure

I'm stunned by these apologists. And offended. Can we ban this behavior, like the naughty word lists.

Attention. Cough, cough, I'm offended.

[ZombieHorde]

77. There is no naughty word list on DU.

There is a naughty context list.

[libodem]

79. I just want to get my way

So I'm going to cry foul, about people who defend GZ. I find it intolerable, it hurts my liberal outlook on life. It conflicts with my worldview. All must bend to my will because it hurts my feelings.

I alerted on a low count defender of GZ so Mirt could see it and basically got told to fuck off, it's an opinion. I hate that opinion. So I'm here bitching about it.

[ZombieHorde]

80. I like to get my way too, so I can relate to that. nt

[PCIntern]

81. I'm with you libodem

as they say in the game of bridge, "Let's review the bidding":

We're on a supposedly liberal website, at least supposedly populated by liberals, and so this white guy, and this is UNDISPUTED, mind you, shoots a black kid who is unarmed, who has committed no crime, who was walking with a pack of skittles and something to drink; the shooter was warned not to approach by the police dispatcher, and I'm supposed to give him the benefit of the doubt because...because...there's a law on the books which states that he can do this in the State of Florida?

I'm sure he'll get a fair trial and I'm sure he'll get adequate representation and I'm sure he'll get an impartial jury. I've been on two juries and one thing I can tell you is that you really try to hear the arguments and that if the law states that he would be not guilty, I'd vote that way. But not happily that this miscreant is returned to the population so that he can do it again if he is so moved.

But since when is it OK for this to be legal and since when do I have to act as though I'm a juror when I'm not/ I and everyone else here is entitled to an opinion...if some don't like others' opinions then say so civilly or say nothing. I noted in the OP that his demeanor was that of a cold, vicious killer. So it is now up to the lawyer, if I WERE on the jury, to convince me that he should be found Not Guilty by reason of the Law, and I would vote that way...but I wouldn't have to like it...or would I? is that the meme of some members now? Do it my way or to quote cherokeeprogressive, well, I won't, since the F-word is not part of rational discussion. that's my oopinion, if I'm still entitled to have one, that is.

[Union Scribe]

87. While that's a theory

and maybe even correct, I think it's completely absurd to say on one hand that you figured all of that out by looking in his eyes, then on the other have the audacity to call any other notion "projection." Because "projection" is less logical than some medieval-sounding eye reading?