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Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:34 PM

God Damn This Country.

The fuckers who authorized and ordered the use of TORTURE still walk free. Every American should be ASHAMED.

31 replies, 3780 views

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Arrow 31 replies Author Time Post
Reply God Damn This Country. (Original post)
Odin2005 Dec 2014 OP
BubbaFett Dec 2014 #1
NoJusticeNoPeace Dec 2014 #2
KeepItReal Dec 2014 #3
Nye Bevan Dec 2014 #5
KingCharlemagne Dec 2014 #23
nichomachus Dec 2014 #26
KingCharlemagne Dec 2014 #27
Initech Dec 2014 #4
pinto Dec 2014 #6
randome Dec 2014 #7
Odin2005 Dec 2014 #8
snooper2 Dec 2014 #9
randome Dec 2014 #17
LanternWaste Dec 2014 #19
Odin2005 Dec 2014 #20
randome Dec 2014 #24
ChisolmTrailDem Dec 2014 #11
randome Dec 2014 #18
KingCharlemagne Dec 2014 #28
The2ndWheel Dec 2014 #22
hfojvt Dec 2014 #10
LanternWaste Dec 2014 #21
Matariki Dec 2014 #12
jwirr Dec 2014 #13
MrMickeysMom Dec 2014 #14
Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2014 #15
spanone Dec 2014 #16
aspirant Dec 2014 #30
KingCharlemagne Dec 2014 #25
progressoid Dec 2014 #29
True Blue Door Dec 2014 #31

Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:35 PM

1. Is it too far gone?

 

I've often (in my darker moments) have considered that this country isn't worth trying to save.

It just seems like one big sham/farce, all at taxpayer expense.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:37 PM

2. And the HONEST question is, can we name ONE current American politician who would bring

charges against the W terrorist organization?

If he or she were prez?

Would Bernie?

I have to be honest, nope, none of them would...

I can understand the reasons they wouldnt, but at the end of the day, what happened to this country and others when the SC stole that election, was horrible, from torture to the annihilation of our economy

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Response to NoJusticeNoPeace (Reply #2)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:45 PM

3. I think Janet Reno as AG would have nailed 'em back in the day

Post 9/11 and Anthrax attacks, I do not know.

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Response to NoJusticeNoPeace (Reply #2)


Response to NoJusticeNoPeace (Reply #2)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:43 PM

23. Sanders' Attorney General designee might, as might Russ Feingold's. - nt

 

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Response to KingCharlemagne (Reply #23)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 03:28 PM

26. Never say what politicians would do -- or wouldn't -- or wouldn't have done.

You don't know that. We all thought in 2004 that if Kerry had won, things would be different. I imagine that if you asked people in 2008, whether Mr. Hope and Change would continue torturing and murdering people, an awful lot would have bet their home that he wouldn't.

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Response to nichomachus (Reply #26)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 03:34 PM

27. President Obama can and should be criticized for many things. But one of his first acts upon

 

taking office in 2009 was an Executive Order banning the use of torture by any U.S. personnel.

I understand that force-feeding the hunger strikers at Gitmo may qualify as 'torture' under some definitions of the word. But the practices outlined in the Senate Summary came to a shrieking halt as of Jan 20, 2009. (I actually think they ended in practice back in 2006 after the Dems took office and RummyDummy resigned, so Obama's EO was something of a formality.)

Now, having written that, there's simply no excuse for our gross abrogation of our obligations under the Geneva Convention on Torture to investigate and prosecute credible allegations of torture. That failure can and should be laid firmly at Obama's feet and one can argue that is almost as bad as ordering torture itself. But a refusal to prosecute torturers from the ancien regime is not the same thing as actually ordering torture.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:48 PM

4. And yet we might be in for another 4 years of that horrible family back in charge.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:50 PM

6. I'd add kudos to the Senate Intelligence Committee for releasing the brutal overview of the programs

Whatever the outcome of the report, public transparency has at least been given some credence. By elected officials of that same government. I think the report is a forceful, damning recount of what happened in our name during that period, 2001- 2008. Don't discount that.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:51 PM

7. Statements like this only serve to strengthen the GOP, though.

 

I'm glad the report is out and I think we should take our lumps for what occurred. But is it any worse than forced genital mutilation? Any worse than beheading strangers?

I keep hearing how America is not so special, after all. And I agree. This only confirms it. But to think that our travesties are worse than anyone else's still seems to play into the narrative that America is somehow 'above' everyone else.

We aren't.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Birds are territorial creatures.
The lyrics to the songbird's melodious trill go something like this:
"Stay out of my territory or I'll PECK YOUR GODDAMNED EYES OUT!"
[/center][/font][hr]

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Response to randome (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:53 PM

8. Are you seriously using the "HE DID IT FIRST!!!" argument?

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Response to Odin2005 (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:57 PM

9. how about the "he is still doing it" argument

 

President greatness Obama put a stop to the evils of Cheney the asshole who should die soon

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Response to Odin2005 (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:17 PM

17. Hardly.

 

We should be ashamed of what was done. But 'God damn this country' seems a bit too much, IMO. Do we hear other countries say that when they show their own travesties?

America is not special and so God's wrath (whatever that is) is not reserved for us alone.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.
[/center][/font][hr]

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Response to randome (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:24 PM

19. No... it seems rather tame given the actions of a nation that holds itself as an example

 

"But 'God damn this country' seems a bit too much..."

No... it seems rather tame given the actions of a nation that holds itself as an example, a beacon and a refuge. It also seems a rather appropriate visceral reaction to the actions, regardless of one wrings their hands in prognostication of its assistance in "only help the GOP"

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Response to randome (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:25 PM

20. Oh, so now you are nit-picking over a figure of speech? I'm an Atheist, FFS.

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Response to Odin2005 (Reply #20)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:49 PM

24. Again, I've never heard another country say "Goddamn us" when their own travesties are revealed.

 

It seems to be a peculiarly American trait to see ourselves as 'more worthy'. Sure, I'm quibbling but 'God damn this country' does not apply to you nor to my daughters nor to anyone else I know.

The blame -and the damnation- is solely on Bush, Jr. and his minions.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Treat your body like a machine. Your mind like a castle.[/center][/font][hr]

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Response to randome (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:01 PM

11. It is worse than 'anyone else's", because we're America, we're not supposed to do that. We have

 

sacrificed any moral high ground we had.

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #11)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:18 PM

18. That ship sailed decades ago.

 

[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.
[/center][/font][hr]

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Response to randome (Reply #18)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 03:41 PM

28. I think the ship foundered in the Mekong Delta ca. 1954. But the world forgave us Vietnam. This, not

 

so much!

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Response to ChisolmTrailDem (Reply #11)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:32 PM

22. It was by default if we had any moral high ground in the first place

Now with no other superpower to be compared to, here we are. There's a reason empires/centers of power do bad shit. A) Because of course they can if they want to, B) there is no objective truth, and C) it's not easy running the show. Morals are subject to time and place. They can change slowly, or on a whim.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 12:59 PM

10. and to think

some people thought that releasing this report would encourage people to hate America.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #10)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:26 PM

21. They would then be the same dogmatic half-wits who rationalized the original actions

 

"and to think some people thought..."

They would then be the same dogmatic half-wits who rationalized the original actions, yet criticize its new-found transparency.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:09 PM

12. Not only free, but allowed to twist the public conversation to normalize torture

Anyone who can talk about torture as a necessary 'technique' or call it anything but what it is, i.e. TORTURE, not 'enhance questioning' or any other BS - should be ashamed of themselves.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:14 PM

13. Once upon a time I would have firmly believed that it they did not pay here in this life they would

most definitely pay in the next. But it is hard to believe in anything now so I do not know.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:15 PM

14. How'djah like them Lindsay Graham remarks, Odin?

I mind like that won't hold up to how pissed off all of us are. He was the first to try to spin it. FAIL.

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:16 PM

15. Not to mention the ones who actually did the torture...the Patriots under a lot of pressure.

 

And a lot of those folks were working hard under enormous pressure and are real patriots. Obama

“We’re fortunate to have men and women who work hard at the CIA serving on our behalf. These are patriots and whatever the report says, if it diminishes their contributions to our country, it is way off base.”

G.W. Bush


There is no error so monstrous that it fails to find defenders among the ablest men. Lord Acton

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:16 PM

16. marco rubio (asshole-F) says it's all just to embarrass the bu$h adm....

what a dumbfuck.

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Response to spanone (Reply #16)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 04:00 PM

30. Didn't the Bush admin. try and convict Scooter Libby

without embarrassing themselves

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 01:55 PM

25. Torture is as American as cherry pie (with apologies to H. Rap Brown) - nt

 

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 03:46 PM

29. Oh, you libruls.

It's God Bless America®

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Response to Odin2005 (Original post)

Tue Dec 9, 2014, 05:01 PM

31. My anger comes from the distance between our claims and our actions.

But your condemnation of this country is totally out of historical and global context.

It's extraordinarily rare for criminal leaders to face accountability, and gets rarer the more powerful the country involved is.

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