General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsMandatory 25 years for raping a 3-yr-old toddler too harsh? A California judge thinks so.
Last edited Tue Apr 7, 2015, 10:58 AM - Edit history (1)
LOS ANGELES A man convicted of sexually assaulting a 3-year-old girl will see 10 years in prison down from at least 25 after a judge decided the minimum mandatory sentence was too much, and should be considered cruel and unusual punishment.
{snip}
The judge felt that the circumstances surrounding the incident merited a different sentence.
Although serious and despicable, this does not compare to a situation where a pedophiliac child predator preys on an innocent child, Kelly told the Orange County Register. There was no violence or callous disregard for (the victims) well-being.
Kelly contined with the Register:
In looking at the facts of Mr. Rojanos case, the manner in which this offense was committed is not typical of a predatory, violent brutal sodomy of a child case, Kelly said. Mr. Rojano did not seek out or stalk (the victim). He was playing video games and she wandered into the garage. He inexplicably became sexually aroused but did not appear to consciously intend to harm (the victim) when he sexually assaulted her, the newspaper reported.
http://q13fox.com/2015/04/06/judge-says-mandatory-sentence-for-man-convicted-of-raping-toddler-too-harsh-cuts-prison-time/
The judge in this case, M. Marc Kelly, basically says a grown man having sexual intercourse with a toddler isn't harmful, in and of itself, and that it's the child's fault, really, for wandering into the garage. Was she wearing some sexy toddler clothes that was too revealing? Maybe she flirted with the guy or had too much milk to drink before "coming" on to him...
What the fuck is wrong with people in positions of authority? There's a reason there are mandatory sentences and this case screams the need for 25 years to life mandatory sentencing.
Update: Found a second story that gives slightly more detail (but not much)
http://ktla.com/2015/04/06/oc-judge-cuts-15-years-off-mandatory-sentence-of-man-convicted-of-sodomizing-toddler/
phantom power
(25,966 posts)Gormy Cuss
(30,884 posts)I guess the fact that he didn't stalk her or threaten her means she was asking for it.
Tom Ripley
(4,945 posts)Orrex
(63,168 posts)phantom power
(25,966 posts)Also, your body has to "shut it down," or it's a dead giveaway it wasn't legitimate.
Orrex
(63,168 posts)Thank goodness the GOP has its gifted educators to set us straight!
Glassunion
(10,201 posts)iandhr
(6,852 posts)hallucinating or imagining things. I really read those words.
Good god.
mercuryblues
(14,521 posts)that judge needs to be disbarred. He is as disgusting and vile as Rajono. Go ahead rape a 3 year old, no harm no foul = cutting 15 years off your sentence.
Erich Bloodaxe BSN
(14,733 posts)I'm not big on mandatory sentencing, but that whole excerpt is bile-inducing.
So it was an atypical predatory, violent brutal sodomy of a child and that makes it less than half as bad as if had been 'typical'?
This is a judge who needs to be removed from the bench immediately.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)they love them. I don't want to cast aspersions at the Judge's sexual tendencies but one has to wonder why the judge used this explanation to condone his actions.
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)gollygee
(22,336 posts)She wandered into the garge and "he inexplicably became sexually aroused" so it isn't his fault? I am stunned and horrified.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)by being too alluring.
But even those cultures don't allow adults to sexually abuse three year olds.
he'll have an "accident" while incarcerated. I understand that happens a lot to things like him.
irisblue
(32,916 posts)rainbobryte
(43 posts)....I'm talking about a short walk off the top tier or an assisted "suicide". Baby rapers have a deservedly low live expectancy in prison.
irisblue
(32,916 posts)diabeticman
(3,121 posts)BUT this SICK CREATURE is basically treated like a victim...
Orrex
(63,168 posts)Maybe the judge figured that Rojano wouldn't fare well in prison for 25 years?
diabeticman
(3,121 posts)gregcrawford
(2,382 posts)... and this piece-of-shit judge should be in a cell right next to him. Kelly has no business being a lawyer, never mind sitting on the bench. Disbar him immediately.
XemaSab
(60,212 posts)He should get life.
Brickbat
(19,339 posts)WAT.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)Have you forgotten?
I hope I don't need to add the sarcasm tag
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)XemaSab
(60,212 posts)n/t
Stellar
(5,644 posts)the death penalty.
MelungeonWoman
(502 posts)You should include the entire name of the judge in your OP. His name needs to be prominently displayed with this article and I do not feel like clicking on a Fox link to see it.
Also, damn.
Orrex
(63,168 posts)From the OP:
And I completely agree that the name [font size=5][font color="red"]M. Marc Kelly[/font][/font] should be broadcast far and wide as an advocate for rapists of children.
Tuesday Afternoon
(56,912 posts)I just wanted to see it again.
M. Marc Kelly, if you ever see this, know that I think you are a loathsome creature who has judged One Case Too Many.
I would consider retiring if I were you.
Orrex
(63,168 posts)[font size=5][font color="red"]M. Marc Kelly[/font][/font]
[font size=5][font color="red"]M. Marc Kelly[/font][/font]
[font size=5][font color="red"]M. Marc Kelly[/font][/font]
[font size=5][font color="red"]M. Marc Kelly[/font][/font]
Tuesday Afternoon
(56,912 posts)system and I hope this convicted child rapist gets some therapy and rehabilitation while he is in our system.
However, I do think this Judge has lost some perspective given his remarks about this case.
I think Judges burn out from sensory overload.
They see and hear too much. I would think, at some point, they just go numb from it all.
For their own self preservation, if for no other reason.
Orrex
(63,168 posts)I suppose that he might understandably suffer some kind of burnout along these lines, but when that happens it might be time for him to step down from the bench, at least temporarily.
Heck, I work in cubefarm customer service, for pity's sake, and I can be fired for failing to show appropriate empathy!
Tuesday Afternoon
(56,912 posts)Last edited Tue Apr 7, 2015, 01:49 PM - Edit history (1)
and yes, we peons have always been held to a higher standard.
Hell, I live in a right to work state.
I can be fired for no good reason at all.
good to see you. hope all is well with you and yours.
Orrex
(63,168 posts)LuvNewcastle
(16,834 posts)Lolitas can lead a man on. At least she was too young to trap the poor man with an unwanted pregnancy. Maybe she'll learn to keep her diapers up next time.
Bettie
(16,058 posts)There is something wrong with this judge.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)The sentence and judge may be wrong. Very wrong, so it appears from the limited information.... If so, it is only fair to use the judges words to criticize, not made up words attributed to the judge.
One of my pet peeves is how folks can read four paragraphs of a reporters story on a criminal sentence or trial, in possession of a fraction of the facts and a fraction of the law.....and then be instantly outraged....when you are looking at a few lines of a a very long legal decision.....why is it OK to be an armchair judge...but not an armchair surgeon?
Is there a link to the full decision transcript?
Are there exemptions to the mandatory minimum sentence laws - in which case the judge may have had to use the words he used, a repeat of statutory minimum sentence law factual requirements for the minimum sentence....eg the 25 year minimum required, by law, "predatory behavior" did not exist, as legally defined - or is there no discretion left to the judge no matter the facts of any offence or the background of any offender?
Are mandatory minimums, set by state legislatures, a good thing to begin with?
get the red out
(13,460 posts)And the fact that he has been given a sentence half of what the teachers who cheated on mandatory testing got, for instance..... I think outrage is a logical reaction.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)"predatory behavior" may be strictly legally defined by the law, as aggravating and raising the minimum sentence from 15 to 25 years for example, but the facts of this one case were not proven by the prosecution to have met that definition.
yardwork
(61,533 posts)The judge stated that there was "no violence." The three year old was sodomized in her anus, which tore her anus, while the rapist held his hand over her mouth after locking the door and ignoring the cries and knocks of the mother who was trying to get in. The judge stated that this caused no harm to the victim.
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)procedure.
Words have meaning, way more meaning in law than on Internet comment boards....the jury convicts, but it is only the judge that can sentence...and has to go through the process of determining if the facts meets the minimum sentencing standard criteria...there is a criteria and the judge was going throught the mandated legal criteria....that is all this is. "Predatory behavior" has a legal meaning, that was the issue. Do you know it's legal definition in the context of a sentencing hearing and state mimimum law statutes? Because they are all written down in excruciating detail and complexity.
Implying the jurist "must be a pedophile" for doing his job of having to go through those detailed criteria, having to compare them to the facts of the individual case, is the judge's job. Great job, isn't it?
Again, folks are misinterpreting the comments - the very few reported in newspapers - the judge is NOT disputing the horror of the crime, it has to do with criminal procedure...which is, like it or not, not a job for the layman.
At least liberals should understand criminal law is complex and should not comment so certainly and reflexively when not in possession of the legal and factuak expertise required.
Flame away.
yardwork
(61,533 posts)You're also ignoring what the judge actually said.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)I will agree the story is short on facts but if you read further down, one of our fellow DU'ers knows more about the case (of which I tried finding more information but couldn't). The offender in this case held the girl "captive" when the mother came looking for her because he wasn't done yet.
I think when it comes to sex crimes, where often the offender doesn't get near enough time and then most often reoffends upon release (whether caught or not--true stats are inconclusive because of the low reportage of sex crimes), then, yes, I believe mandatory minimums are a good thing--rape is not a non-violent crime not matter how "nicely" someone rapes someone else.
Sexual assault often has life-long effects on the victim too. It can inform future behavior from sexual promiscuity, depression, drug use, even to the extreme of prostitution (most prostitutes will tell you they were sexually abused as children). Why not take that into account when sentencing--when a murder is committed victim impact statements are often considered in sentencing. What would this toddler tell the judge if she could formulate the complexity of her feelings at her age?
lark
(23,059 posts)Why not knock off 1 year instead of more than 1/2?
Actually, rereading your post, I'm rather disgusted. A child is raped, sodomized, and you bring up minimum sentencing? That's what you care about in this situation? OMG
get the red out
(13,460 posts)In 10 years this guy will be released to inadvertently, sexually assault a child again. Will it be his fault then?
dolphinsandtuna
(231 posts)Doesn't belong on the bench. Probably belongs in prison himself.
Response to justiceischeap (Original post)
seabeyond This message was self-deleted by its author.
Panich52
(5,829 posts)role in opponent's campaign.
dr.strangelove
(4,851 posts)This case appears to have facts that support the maximum sentence. I have read a few news stories and this man locked the garage he was in with the 3 year old, proceeded to anally rape her, when her mom came looking for her he quieted the child by placing his hand over her mouth, then had her finish by masturbating him. These actions justify the 25 year to life sentence. I don't think it needs to be mandatory, but the facts justify the resulting sentence. While I feel for his difficult upbringing and mental problems, he clearly is a danger to those society has the highest duty to protect. He must be kept away from children, probably forever. 25 years to life will allow him to seek treatment and there is at least the potential for him to show in the future to his mental health professionals that he can end the danger he poses to children. Maybe in the intervening years, some effective treatment will develop for this behavior. If so, there is the possibility of release. Personally, I doubt it. I find this crime to be the most abhorrent acts a human being can commit. As a progressive, I think the system should be in place to allow for treatment and release, but I personally think he will, and should, be locked away from children for life.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)davidpdx
(22,000 posts)Oregon tried it with Measure 11 and it didn't work out well. They also took away most of the rehabilitation programs due to budget cuts. The fact is that a high percentage of people in prison will be released and do need to better themselves when they are put back on the street. Without rehabilitation programs you are going to see a higher return rate (among all crimes) and a higher cost of returning people through the system and keeping them there.
In terms of this case, what the guy did was awful and I agree the guy needs to be locked away for a long time. I'm going to be in the minority and say that he should be provided treatment and a chance to rehabilitate himself. Not automatic release, but a chance at it maybe in 25 years.
I have seen people rehabilitate themselves and become productive members of society. It is a long steep climb though.
dr.strangelove
(4,851 posts)I lived in Oregon for a large part of the 90s, I recall Measure 11. I worked as a defense attorney at that time and had to deal with the results. Young kids making dumb mistakes locked up for 10 years because the sentencing guidelines were removed. It made me sick.
As for this case, I am hopeful that we can make strides in treating this criminal illness, but nothing has been successful to date. Its a sad reality that some criminals can not be rehabilitated, and its why for these most severe crimes, yo have to have the option of lifetime incarceration. Thanks for the thoughtful comment!
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)I believe M 11 was one of a handful that passed, though that was the worst one. The state needs to go back to the point where more training is provided within the prisons so that when they get out, they have a shot at getting a job.
dr.strangelove
(4,851 posts)instead of a health matter. Many of my clients were not criminals, but people who needed help. I had a number of repeat offenders at minor crimes who were not bad people, but were in real need of mental health counseling. Oregon was progressive with its drug court and alcohol treatment programs, but it has ignored mental health.
There are some good post-prison programs in Oregon, like Better People. Oregon has a state Senator named Chip Shields, who has done a lot on this issue, but more needs to be done.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)malthaussen
(17,175 posts)"Lenient," now, that would do. But then, unlike a lot of DUers, I think capital punishment has its good points.
-- Mal
Trillo
(9,154 posts)justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)and the production and abuse of children involved in child pornography.
Trillo
(9,154 posts)There does appear a wide range of penalties. Here's one paragraph that may apply,
another person to engage in a sexual act by threatening or placing that other person in fear (other
than that proscribed in the aggravated sexual abuse statute) or (2) engage in a sexual act with
another person who is (a) incapable of appraising the nature of the conduct or (b) physically
incapable of declining participation in, or communicating an unwillingness to engage in, the sexual
act. Attempts to commit any of these acts is also prohibited. Sexual abuse is punished by a fine
and up to 20 years imprisonment.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)Plus, and because I couldn't find more on the case, I wonder if he was also charged with holding a minor captive since when the mom came looking for her, the guy covered her mouth so she couldn't call out--and then made her masturbate him once the mother went away (I can't even begin to imagine how you make a 3 year old masturbate someone).
See this post for more info: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6469404
Trillo
(9,154 posts)kcr
(15,313 posts)Federal sentencing guidelines are non-binding policy for federal judges to consider. He isn't a federal court judge. And it doesn't matter. He arbitrarily decided to reduce a sentence that had already been passed.
riqster
(13,986 posts)historylovr
(1,557 posts)That pos judge needs to go. And the perp needs to be in prison for life.
valerief
(53,235 posts)It would have been different had the toddler been a boy.
One can only conclude that either (1) the defendant was rich and bought the judge or (2) the judge is a pedo himself.
ejbr
(5,856 posts)when judge "clarified" his position.
"Excuse me, your honor, but have you lost your fucking mind?!"
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)It's things like this that send the message to girls and women (and men) that they aren't worth anything or worth less than others. Is it not cruel and unusual to look at a toddler and become sexually aroused and then act out on that arousal?
Bettie
(16,058 posts)a 3 year old wandering into the garage prompts a response of "Hey, little one, where's your mama?" and then, you take her hand and go find Mama.
For the vast majority of humans, raping the tiny child isn't even on the list of possible responses.
WTF is wrong with people?
tclambert
(11,084 posts)How do we know she didn't strut into the neighbor's garage, flaunting her sexuality, intentionally seducing him? Maybe she told him she was 18, and he didn't check her ID. (There has got to be a way to blame the victim. It's an American tradition.)
cleduc
(653 posts)going to be more harmful to this girl growing up:
what this bastard did to this 3 year old girl?
or
the judge's words about what this bastard did to this 3 year old?
I wonder. For me, its not a slam dunk.
I find the judge's remarks repugnant.
lark
(23,059 posts)think the verdict would have been WAY different. Don't get me wrong, it's despicable that any person is raped, child, woman or man, just think this guy would not have been this callous if his own family was involved. What in the hell is wrong with him that he doesn't think butt fucking a 3 year old is violent? Is he just insane or paid off? This should be easy to win on appeal.
robbob
(3,522 posts)Why don't judges use "cruel and unusual" to prevent 3rd strike offenders from going to jail for 20 years over a minor drug offence or theft of a candy bar? I was under the impression that mandatory minimum sentencing meant the judge had no say in the matter?
And then to see a sentence reduced in a case like this is beyond sickening.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)but can't find much. It's almost like the legal profession doesn't want the general public well-informed.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)BlueJazz
(25,348 posts)....to masturbate him?) ..That's a scary thought.
No answers from me, only questions.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)Anybody who commits sexual molestation against a toddler is displaying callous disregard for the victim's welfare.
IMO, the judge is a sicko.
OLDMADAM
(82 posts)This entire story is beyond normal comprehension.. The only thing that could make this episode even more abhorrent, is what the judge did.. I'm sorry, but times have changed, and not for the better.. My 2 cents..
These things, the act of child rape and the like, happened in the ole days, but it would have made the feature front page story in the local headlines.. But what the judge did would have escalated the story to national prominence.. This judges' actions may never have occurred by the known, anticipated, visceral reaction, and backlash by the general public.. We have lost, the code of decent behavior, MORAL JUDGEMENT, and SHAME..
prayin4rain
(2,065 posts)Telcontar
(660 posts)In six weeks they can air out his cot and put someone else in it.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)However, this story doesn't help the offender's, or the judges, case much. The offender showed remorse for raping a toddler and stopped almost immediately after recognizing it was wrong... but didn't stop soon enough to not cause harm to the child. Oh, and he locked the door and quieted the child and then had the child finish him off ('cause, apparently, that's not wrong) before letting her go.
Yep, that makes me feel remorseful for the offender... /sarcasm
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)no no no no.
i mean. she was being gang raped. he started it up. she said no. he pulled out. she continued to be raped. he did nothing. and he got no time cause
he did pull out eventually
Laffy Kat
(16,366 posts)So he was sleeping-walking or in a coma at the time? How do you unconsciously hold your hand over a child's mouth, rape her, and force her to masturbate you? Sounds like a lot of conscious decision-making was going on to me.
Rex
(65,616 posts)To me it says the judge needs to be investigated. 25 years was not harsh enough imo. That poor baby tried to scream out and he silenced her, then continued to rape her when he thought the coast was clear.
IMO, the judge must have something in his background to give this kind of sentence or knows the perp will be stuck in general population. Prisoners are not to nice to people that they find out rape children. Still, a life sentence would work for me too.
10 years is nothing.
What an insult to all rape victims.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)of our children being dismissed cause the grown man is not at fault
Dont call me Shirley
(10,998 posts)NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)Logical
(22,457 posts)NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)you hold value for an animal that rapes an infant, I don't.
it's humane to put down a rabid dog that is uncontrollable, and cannot help itself from maiming other animals, ....an infant raper is lower than a rabid dog.
Logical
(22,457 posts)wrong place?
Read about the innocence project. If you don't understand it let me know.
NM_Birder
(1,591 posts)even on a liberal website, TWO people have different opinions, it's amazing isn't it ? I have an opinion,.....and don't care what you think of it...... some quantum shit huh ? One person thinks rapist of a 3 year old child should be executed, one thinks ....what ? what exactly is your opinion ?
I advocate the death penalty for ANY adult, that purposely, or even by freak accident, allows his dick to be inserted into a 3 year olds body, REGARDLESS his intention or "emotional" state. I don't care the circumstances, the reasons, the intention, ......and especially don't give a crap about your self indulgent petty little feeling of self importance. I believe in a trial, and if he didn't have, as he is accused......have INTERCOURSE with a 3 year old child then let it be known, if he did have INTERCOURSE with a 3 year old child then there is absolutely NO reason for that sack of meat to continue to live, my opinion...and you're not changing it.
There would be little difficulty in finding volunteers to "flip the switch", "pull the trigger", "insert the needle", "tie the knot", or whatever form he wanted to die by. That is the extent of the my personal mercy to a child rapist, they can choose how to die. The kid has to live with the trauma, the rapist doesn't get to....in my opinion.
pansypoo53219
(20,950 posts)old thinking. 'boys will be boys' who grow up to be rapists & pediphiles.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)violent. I'd say it's pretty violent to stick an adult penis in the anus of a toddler--no matter how long or short a time the "insertion" was.
This Judge needs a visit from the Bar Assoc.
irisblue
(32,916 posts)and the local bar association members paid this 'judge' a visit and let him know there will never be another dime from the Rs &Ds lawyers....please please please
raging moderate
(4,292 posts)We all need to remember this guy's name, in case he gets out in ten years, or maybe even sooner. Especially if the whole story is true, about what he did when the little darling's mother came looking for her.
Matrosov
(1,098 posts)Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)Rojano was playing video games in the garage of his Santa Ana home on June 4, 2014, when a 3-year-old girl, to whom he is related, wandered in to hang around, said Deputy District Attorney Whitney Bokosky. Rojano, who became sexually aroused by the child, pulled her pants down and assaulted her, Bokosky said.
The girl's mother, meanwhile, tried to get into the garage as she looked for the child but realizing it was locked, started looking at a neighbor's home, Bokosky said. This prompted the defendant, who had put his hands over the girl's mouth to keep her from yelling for her mother, to have the child fondle him, Bokosky said.
Rojano then unlocked the garage door and when the mother returned, she took the girl, who appeared unharmed, into the home, Bokosky said. The crime came to light moments later when the girl complained of pain and her mother noticed that she was hurt, Bokosky said.
Blue_In_AK
(46,436 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)This simply does not compute in any way. 25 years is entirely justifiable and appropriate.
AZ Progressive
(3,411 posts)election day nears for him. See how many people would vote for a pedophile and rapist sympathizer.
Skittles
(153,104 posts)hunter
(38,301 posts)But guys like this should be entirely removed from ordinary civil society.
Give him a comfortable prison cell, maybe for life, and full time supervision.
God forgive me, I'm the sort who would have gone berserker.
He and his balls would be separated.
shanti
(21,675 posts)mr. kelly's first bad decision:
http://laist.com/2015/04/07/judge_m_marc_kelly.php
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)And I agree with the article, you'd think the guy being a law officer would bring harsher sentencing because he should have none better.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)their feelings?
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)shenmue
(38,506 posts)for how bad this is.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)This is a WTF moment.
I am aware of people busted for using psychedelics at dead shows in the 80s, who are still serving sentences twice that long.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)Particularly, as you mentioned, when non-violent offenders get more time than rapists, murderers, etc.
Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)Save prison for folks like this guy.
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)Such fine character building
Lancero
(3,002 posts)In all honestly his guy deserves far worse then a cell for his actions, but we've got two groups - The bleeding heart 'Rehab not prison!" crowd and the rape apologist crowd - who would take heavy offense to the suggestion that this waste of air should be given a harsher punishment.
Ah well. The justice system failed to deliver a punishment for this persons actions, but criminals have a 'justice' of their own - It is harsh and it is cruel, far more then any crime deserves, but it always delivers.
fadedrose
(10,044 posts)3-year olds and let them have at him.
Bet he comes up short with body parts....