Freedom of Religion no longer a right in Pennsylvania

[appleannie1]

Nothing is sacred about your religion when it comes to getting a state identification card without a photo.

To get a nonphoto ID for religious reasons, applicants must answer a series of 18 questions that delve deeply into their faiths and other personal information.

The first item on PennDOT’s form asks applicants to “describe your religion.” It is followed by more questions that devout followers might struggle to answer, and some that inquire about the lives of family members.
How many members are there of your religion?
How many congregations?
What’s the process by which you came to the religion?
What religious practices do you observe?
Do other family members hold the same religious beliefs?
Submitting that form, once notarized, is not enough. Applicants must fill out another form.
If they lack proof of identification, yet another form must be completed before a nonphoto ID is issued. The ID is valid for four years, and the renewal process is simpler.
Going through this process is essential if those who hold religious objections to being photographed want to vote. Anyone who wants to vote must show identification in the November election.
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2012/04/religious_questions_for_pennsy.html

IMO they came up with the obscene denials to prevent Muslims from voting and never realized that the Amish and Mennonite communities would also be affected. Hopefully the above will be added to the lawsuit.

Here is a pdf of the complete new law: http://www.co.lancaster.pa.us/lanco/lib/lanco/voter_registration/act_18_of_2012_voter_id_law.pdf

[drm604]

1. Notice that the two state Senators in that Penn Live article are both Republicans?

When it impacts the Amish, who tend to vote Republican, suddenly Republicans have objections.

I don't recall any Republicans showing any sympathy when people complained about how this would impact demographics that tend to vote Democratic. One might almost be tempted to call them hypocrites!

[saras]

2. As long as there's no right answers, I don't see a problem

How many members? One. Each person must form their own.
How many congregations? An infinite number. All sentient beings participate, most unconsciously.
What's the process...? Psilocybin mushrooms and Aleister Crowley exercises.
What religious practices do you observe? Ahimsa, anti-corporate activism, randomness, daily worship through music, anonymous charity.
Do other family members...? Of course not, it is forbidden.
Does it have sacred texts or commandments? If so, please describe or provide them. All text is sacred, especially automatic writing.
Does it have ceremonies or meetings? Yes, the Game of Sink. And we do Christmas, except for the Christ part.
Describe three significant requirements or prohibitions of your religion.
1. The eating of banana slugs is forbidden. Kissing them is acceptable.
2. Willful stupidity is prohibited
3. We must partake once, joyfully, of a beef and pork hot dog on a Friday.
Describe the ways in which your religion affects your daily life. It allows me to laugh at the inferior unsaved and dismiss their concerns from my mind.

[rgbecker]

4. I'm in.

Send three boxes of mushrooms when you get a chance.

[saras]

5. Yeah, we should all move to Arizona...

...no, my religion REQUIRES me to do my grocery shopping in the nude...

[Jim Lane]

3. In these situations, there generally is no good alternative.

My impression from the linked article is that, even if the state dropped the requirement of a photo ID for voting, as it should, PennDOT would continue to issue photo ID's for other purposes, and would still face the problem of how to treat people who assert a religious objection to being photographed.

Possible solutions:

1. Make no exceptions for religious belief at all. No photo, no ID. This would impose a significant hardship on some people, because of their sincere religious beliefs, and would contradict the purpose of the Free Exercise Clause of the First Amendment.

2. Make an exception for anyone asserting a religious objection. This would grant a benefit to religious people that's not available to nonreligious people, thus contradicting the purpose of the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment. As a practical matter, it would also open a huge loophole in the state's ID procedure, as people intending to commit fraud would falsely claim the religious exemption.

3. Attempt to distinguish between genuine religious objectors and opportunistic liars. This would entail state inquiry into the content of the applicant's religious beliefs, along with inquiry into collateral matters to try to determine who's sincere. There would be a burden on free exercise, because religious objectors have to fill in a detailed form, AND there would be an undermining of the Establishment Clause, because the religious are still being favored over the non-religious, AND the whole idea of government assessing the sincerity of individuals' religious beliefs is repugnant. Nevertheless, in many instances this alternative is the best of a bad lot. It's why the Amish don't have to pay FICA taxes but the same consideration would not be extended to a bunch of right-wingers who announce a new religion with Ayn Rand as its prophetess.

[muriel_volestrangler]

6. So far, I can't work up a scintilla of care

Who really cares about the voting status of someone who thinks a photo is evil? Being ruthless but realistic, they are so fucking dumb that the world is better off if they don't vote. So they have to explicitly state that they are really, really dumb because they genuinely belong to a dumbfuck religion that thinks photos are the work of the devil, before they are allowed to vote anyway?

Boo-fucking-hoo.

[Marengo]

7. LOL! +1

[mr blur]

8. +10

[etherealtruth]

9. First and foremost, photographs are not forbidden in Islam

Yes, there are small groups or sects of Muslims that believe this to be true ... just as there are groups of Muslims that interpret the edict to "dress modestly" (directed at both men and women) as to mean women must wear a burka (most Muslim women don't, it's actually cultural and not religious).

Cameras and cell phones (with cameras) are sold in Muslim countries ... passports from Muslim countries have photographs ... ?

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Islam-947/misc-qs-2.htm

This impacts the Amish and Mennonites far more than Muslims

[Zax2me]

10. Banning photos isn't that widespread among Muslims where I work.

Our workplace is full of employees from varying sects of Islam.
All have company photo ID's.
If some do not, it is not to my knowledge.
We all wear them where they can be seen.