General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsOn Centralized Planning and Centralized Wealth (Original Content)
Centralized wealth and centralized planning have one thing in common. The power is concentrated in the hands of the few at the expense of the many. Whether it's the Comrade Party Leader or Corporate CEO, one thing holds true, they will extract the surplus value of your Labor, enrich themselves further, and pass laws that extract more wealth, and then tell you its for your own good. Soviet Union or United States, it makes no difference when you have little say in policy, nor enough time to try and say it because you're too busy feeding your family.
marym625
(17,997 posts)I was so inclined
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)And one of the points were that Bernie Sanders, regardless of calling himself a socialist, and implement a socialist society. Of course not! Bernie is a populist, and due to pragmatism, he is my choice! I don't hold any illusions that this will transform society radically. I only hope that he will change society for the better. And so, was one of my responses:
Depending on whom you speak with, whether anarchist or Marxist, socialism has an explicit meaning - which isn't compatible within a capitalist society. To the former, socialism is the end phase of a classless, stateless society, where the producers collectively own the means of production and the fruits of their labor (even the individualists and mutualists fall in this camp, just disagree to what means "private property" , and the latter, which is the intermediate stage between capitalism and communism, where the state is utilized to affect revolution, replacing the capitalists with a Party Vanguard towards a classless, stateless society. Of course, I'm with the former as the Bolsheviks have shown, that their dictatorship should be supported over the capitalist dictatorship; never mind that they were extractors of surplus value, and thus, capitalists in and of themselves.
marym625
(17,997 posts)Great response
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)vive la commune
(94 posts)Is that Bernie Sanders is a democratic socialist (his hero is Eugene Debs), running on a social democratic platform for president of the United States on the Democratic Party ticket. Hardly the death of global capitalism, but perhaps a chance at some real universal healthcare for the U.S. and some other decent things. I'm a pragmatist, too. Ideally, in my heart of hearts, I am an anarchist communist, but practically speaking, I'm for anything that puts the brake on austerity and oligarchy and lessens misery.
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)vive la commune
(94 posts)F4lconF16
(3,747 posts)Centralized power does not work.
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)jwirr
(39,215 posts)were local and let me tell you they did not work so well either.
A couple of examples might help. Before Medicaid was federalized my daughter who is severely disabled was refused care because 20 years before her father had one surgery at the state hospital where it was free. That kind of local control allowed favoritism. And it was not just us. When I went over their heads the social worker told me that our country had many cases that they were refusing to take care of.
The other example is food assistance. Prior to food stamps you saw the same kind of favoritism mentioned above.
I am somewhat afraid of this kind of decentralized control.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)Under Communism it's just the opposite." - John Kenneth Galbraith
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)Too bad he had a misconception of communism, because it would have fit perfectly.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)... and even according to Marx's own teachings, didn't quite fit the bill.
Of course, according to Marxist theory, the Soviet Union, didn't even achieve socialism. According to Trotsky, it was a degenerated Workers' state, and according to anarchists, was reactionary almost from the beginning of the revolution as soon as the Bolsheviks, here is a familiar word, gerry-mandered the soviets.
jwirr
(39,215 posts)structure stayed the same just different rulers.