General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDid the American people request a new trade agreement? Why is this on the agenda at all?
I just don't understand why this is needed and why anyone is pushing it.
Why is this the last thing Obama needs accomplished?
America has plenty of problems, and needing a new trade agreement isn't one of them.
mmonk
(52,589 posts)Kablooie
(18,625 posts)The rest of us aren't supposed to matter.
That's why a secret trade agreement is Americas #1 priority right now.
Populist_Prole
(5,364 posts)The 99 percent/working class are far far below the radar of the beltway, the media and intelligensia. Their bubble is so big it has become reality. I've come to realize this over time by carefully thinking through their mantras vis-vis events. Sure, their are some ( plutocrats ) with utter contempt for us, but what I've found is that it's not so much a matter of them liking policies because they harm us....that is, they don't go out of their way to screw us; it's just how they see the world.
RKP5637
(67,102 posts)a mirage. Only money and large corporatiosn count in USA. Inc. We the people are in the way.
Cleita
(75,480 posts)It's a mystery to me as to why Obama wants this so we can fill our shelves with cheaply made goods that haven't created a single living wage job over here.
bigwillq
(72,790 posts)840high
(17,196 posts)bigwillq
(72,790 posts)Autumn
(45,046 posts)Obviously they wanted it and since they are the only people who count... Well there you go.
corkhead
(6,119 posts)almost verbatim
cali
(114,904 posts)on the agenda in every administration and this one has been cooking since the bush administration. There are 17 trade agreements in the USTR pipeline.
I don't reflexively oppose trade agreements, but we need a new template moving forward.
Lint Head
(15,064 posts)The "People" no longer matter in our country. We are "marks" for political scam artists. Nothing more. Money is The Supreme Being that we bow down to.
RKP5637
(67,102 posts)randome
(34,845 posts)If we're going to let our representatives get away with setting the agenda, then they will do whatever appeals to them.
This country is running on automatic. The GOP is toothless, our infrastructure is crumbling, climate change is getting worse and the electorate is disengaged.
Under these conditions, why not a trade agreement?
[hr][font color="blue"][center]"If you're bored then you're boring." -Harvey Danger[/center][/font][hr]
Cleita
(75,480 posts)coats yesterday. Among them my Senator DiFi. God damn her.
TheNutcracker
(2,104 posts)Her record sucks!
jeff47
(26,549 posts)Helms and Feinstein.
TheNutcracker
(2,104 posts)great question!
pinboy3niner
(53,339 posts)Populist_Prole
(5,364 posts)Heard Noam Chomsky say this of policy making in the US. I hope I have the words right to his poem:
"The poor complain, they always will; but that's just idle chatter. The system works, for all of us; or at least those of us that matter".
TheHardWay
(6 posts)I hate to say it but I too have no idea why the things happen as they do.
In times like these I can refer back to the constitution, in those first few lines I find the common republican basis for all that they do...
" We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."
They impose what their will is on the world as they see fit to impose it according to their expression of a "more perfect union". They have the funds and everybody is watching them.
We all have the power to do the same.
mmonk
(52,589 posts)Why wasn't it our idea?
SamKnause
(13,091 posts)I wasn't consulted.
No one ask if I was for, or against a new trade agreement.
I did not get to vote for, or against any of the disastrous trade
agreements we have already been forced into.
My government does not care about my opinions.
My government does not represent the needs or wants of the people.
My government takes its marching orders from global corporations, Wall Street,
and The Military Industrial Complex.
My government is corrupt.
My government is destroying this country.
My government sold we the people to the highest bidders.
My government is deceitful and dishonest.
My government sold all its power and control to entities they can
no longer control !!!!!!
840high
(17,196 posts)a D after their name - that's all that's important.
Bucky
(53,987 posts)China's size makes it a potential trade agreement bully. The TPP allows its trade partners to use US trade as a counterweight.
jeff47
(26,549 posts)That argument is predicated on the US being the "essential" market. That all these countries will only trade with the US because....um....reasons. But it is the argument many neoliberals hang their hat on.
There's nothing in the TPP that prevents any agreements with China. And there's no particular reason to think the US is the only market. In fact, the TPP makes it much easier for US capital to build factories in Vietnam to sell goods to China.
Bucky
(53,987 posts)The Vietnamese would far rather have US capital (which is really international capital) building their factories than investments from China... which would come with far more geopolitical strings attached. Vietnam fears trade domination from China for a host of geopolitical and history reasons.
I never said the TPP is about preventing sales to China. It's about keeping trade options open to countries that fear domination by China in trade agreements.
I'm not a fan of TPP either, but the motivations for it are a little bit more complicated that screwing over the American middle class and small businesses.
GeorgeGist
(25,318 posts)the 'we're not as bad as them' meme is growing tiresome.
jwirr
(39,215 posts)pampango
(24,692 posts)At least some were unhappy about the lack of labor and environmental standards in trading rules.
I tend to agree. Trade affects about 23% of the economy. Our regressive tax system, anti-labor legislation and weakened safety net affects 100% of our economy and our lives. FDR pursued expanded trade and progressive trading agreements but it was after he had dealt with taxes, union empowerment and the safety net.
Elwood P Dowd
(11,443 posts)that created an avenue for them to close 50,000 American factories and locate them thousands of miles away in order to take advantage of slave wages and lack of environmental/labor laws.
As far as the social safety net goes, the repukes and fake dems are slowing destroying it rather than improving it, so now we have a double whammy. Our future is bleak, and the free trade hits only make it much worse.
pampango
(24,692 posts)other issues. That would have lifted wages in other countries. His ITO would have regulated corporations as a part of trade rules.
Our future is 'bleak' due to our regressive policies on taxes, union support and the safety net. Trade has little to do with it.
Countries with progressive taxes, support for unions and strong safety nets have strong middle classes. And they have much more 'free trade' than we have. If 'free trade' hurt workers and the middle class, those countries would be worse off than the U.S. They are not.
whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)Does anyone think that this dynamic would change under another Clinton administration?
randys1
(16,286 posts)But this trade deal likely isnt it.
What we need is drastic investment in manufacturing here while slowly raising tariffs so that we can make some of the shit we buy
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)At some point people have to realize that most of these congress people do not work for us and nor do they give a shit what happens to us. They won't leave congress poor.
swilton
(5,069 posts)other than a trade agreement that disadvantages the working people who pay the taxes.......
Health care
Education
Gun control
Green jobs
nuclear disarmament
Environmental clean-up
The list is endless....