WTF Obama Siding W/ The Enemy To Fuck Workers.

[TheMastersNemesis]

TPP is a disaster in waiting for the American work force. I worked at DOL and NAFTA was a complete disaster for US workers. And it continues to be a disaster. TPP will turn the labor work force into rubble. Why the fuck get a degree when you must compete against someone global who makes PENNIES ON THE DOLLAR for the same degree.

Fuck Obama's legacy. He is selling out our work force and the country on TPP. I watched our work force get gutted after NAFTA passed. These trade agreements are POS. And wages will plummet after TPP. You cannot compete with 50 cents a day where some jobs will go on the planet. And there are places where 50 cents a day is a lot of money.

TPP IS DAMNED INSANE for US.

Obama is being a fool on this matter. Why would you help people who have been bashing you continually.

Sorry for the language. But TPP is so bad and reasons to pass it are just plain lies.

[Jackpine Radical]

1. Obama is anything but a fool.

If there is white privilege, there is also rich privilege. Either can blind you to reality. But I don't think that's enough of an explanatory mechanism in this case.

There is something else, something worse, going on here.

It certainly feels like a sellout.

[hifiguy]

7. I first learned about "rich privilege" from an African-American pal in law school.

We were discussing where we would be in ten years. He said to me "you're gonna have a far harder time in life than me." I asked, "Seriously, Tony?? (not his real name) - this is the US and black people have been on the shitty end of the deal since forever" or words to that effect.

He said "Damn right. But I was raised in the upper-class. The decision makers look at me and they KNOW I am one of them even though I am a Black man. They look at you and all they will see is a working-class guy that somehow made it to Harvard. You are obviously not one of them and you never will be and they can tell within ten seconds. You are gonna have a hard time of it. They don't let people like you into the club no matter how smart you are." Let me add that Tony is very handsome, spoke five languages and when he entered a room women wanted to be with him and men wanted to be him. I am absolutely none of those things in any minimal way. I hide in the corner in part because I am on the autism spectrum, which I didn't know in law school.

He's now a senior partner at a major SoCal law firm and makes millions each year. I have never been able to hold a job for more than about two years before getting fired and have been unemployed for the last 2 1/2 years.

That, folks, is rich privilege.

[Skittles]

11. I agree we could never accepted as one of them

but who the fuck wants to be around such snobby pieces of clueless shit? They live in a bubble.

[hifiguy]

12. I never wanted or had any desire to be at the top of the pile in BigLaw

like a lot of people in my class did. A guy I was in a study group with first year is the lead attorney at Skadden Arps for Rupert Murdoch's mergers and acquisitions. I'd gouge my own eyes out with a screwdriver before I'd work for Murdoch, but I suppose the $10-12 million he makes each year eases any pangs of conscience he may have. Another classmate said "I intend to be extremely rich and I don't care how many bodies I leave behind me on the way." He went into investment banking and is now an Imperial Grand Poobah at some big NYC investment bank, Probably makes $20 million per year.

I wanted to eventually land a nice, medium-sized firm, have an interesting practice and make a nice, upper-middle class income. I knew I couldn't do the kinds of things you have to do to get really rich and never had the slightest inclination to be fabulously wealthy. But the first question every firm in my hometown asked me - as a Harvard Law School student - was "where did you go to high school?" The suburb I grew up in was exclusively working class and lower-middle class. Redlining by zipcode. The Harvard credential meant nothing to them. You can take the boy out of the working class but you can't take the working class out of the boy. So long, sucker. They slammed the door, bolted it and then dumped the Greek Fire on my from the top of the wall.

[Skittles]

13. am curious if law was really your forte

is that what you had always wanted to do?

hey, I went to high schools in England and two states - moved all the time, always thought the high school cliques were ridiculous

[hifiguy]

14. I didn't actually even go to high school.

I dropped out at 16 and spent the next six years smoking a lot of dope, drinking beer, playing bass in bands, delivering pizzas, working in a car wash for a summer and generally being a bum. I was working at a dry cleaning shop and the boss's sister-in-law said I seemed like a smart guy and told me I should try going to college. I'd wanted to be a lawyer but thought it wasn't possible any longer. Got my high-school equivalency certificate, enrolled and eventually graduated summa cum laude and Phi Beta Kappa in four years from my first-tier state university.

Everyone I have worked with in the legal profession loves my work, and that includes clerking for two judges, and I have a natural feel and understanding for legal argument; I love the work. But I never stick; they don't like my work enough to have "spooky", quiet, nerdy, working class me around to do it. Asperger's and being working class were one too many obstacles to overcome.

I should have looked for work somewhere other than my hometown. Nobody in Chicago ir LA knows or cares anything about which Minneapolis suburbs are "elite" or working class.

[TBF]

17. We did move -

it was my spouse who went to Harvard and then law school. He didn't go to the private schools but dresses and looks the part. We moved to a new city after law school so people wouldn't know he had worked as staff before going to law school. Like you he is quiet (not on the spectrum officially but I wouldn't be surprised) and made it to partnership in a firm. Not the high-flying level though, he's a lower-level worker bee (and we both had a lot of student loans after law/grad school). The higher level as I call them really live on a different level. Millions per year for the top people in top firms - and many are dual earner couples (I've known some who employ 2-3 people at a time just to work as nannies for them). My husband will occasionally have lunch with "colleagues" who talk about flying their private planes on the weekend. I'm sure he becomes even quieter in those situations. It's something else.

[HereSince1628]

19. I agree, he's not a fool, and there is something going on...and he's emotional about it.

Which is outside of his public character. I also think speculation that its about money after his presidency should be low on the list of speculative possibilities.

I have no idea really. But I note something that may be a clue... He's mentioned China and how he must move TPP or China will control trade rules in the far east additionally during his administration the US military has taken a pivot to be ready to confront China.
That China comes up as an economic and geopolitical threat makes me think it should be included on the list of speculation.

Who of his advisers would be pushing containment of China? It sounds like a cold war rerun, and I can't give it much credibility as speculation because I don't know the answer to what neocon/cold warrior would have both Obama's ear and trust on such a thing?

[Jackpine Radical]

23. Interesting thoughts.

[Joe Turner]

27. "he's emotional about it"

Unlike universal health care where he had to be dragged kicking and screaming into making good on his campaign pledge only to compromise on an plan written by the health insurance lobby. If Obama is emotional about TPP it's because unlike all the progressive issues he campaigned on he truly wants this passed. And given his lack of interest on social issues I have to believe he works for the other side of the street and likes their money and power. Sorry I think that is as far as it goes.

[Art_from_Ark]

28. I think that dragging "Big, Bad China" into this

may just be a way to get public support for this mangy, flea-bitten dog.

[HereSince1628]

32. Maybe, but fear as a political tactic isn't common on the left

even among DLC/Third Way types. The other part of his argument is basically 'trust me', which is an appeal to authority.

As Jost et al demonstrated in their meta-analysis of what motivates conservative behavior, fear as motivation is a core feature and appeal to authority is common.

I realize it's trying to sleuth between the lines, but this looks much more like the approach of the Cheney-administration. And I'm left to wonder if some holdover in the intelligence complex, maybe even the director--who has done political interference before, is trying to manipulate national politics...again.

[Art_from_Ark]

33. Obama isn't exactly "on the left"

[HereSince1628]

34. Yes, IMO he's a pretty typical of 'centrist'/neoliberal originating from the left...

Obama's Blairism usually out Blairs Tony Blair.

On TAA/TPA/TPP the usual disarming charm didn't work, and it's been replaced by something much more coarse.

[Jackpine Radical]

36. Incidentally, there is a good summary paper from the Jost group online:

http://www.psych.nyu.edu/jost/Carney,%20Jost,%20&%20Gosling%20%282008%29%20The%20secret%20lives%20of%20liberals%20.pdf

Worth looking at for anybody into political psychology.

[hedda_foil]

35. This administration has been talking about a "pivot to China" for a long time.

Alternatively, they've called it a "pivot to Asia" with the same meaning. I've been thinking it's a major part of their foreign policy, which could (by some) be considered a legacy achievement. I believe the idea was to make this pivot as soon as the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were wrapped up. It didn't quite work out that way once the Arab Spring© got going. (And was that CIA inspired?)

So it's later than planned, with lots of pushing and shoving the TPP "partnership of the willing or bullied" along the way. And now, when there's little time left for Obama to get the job done, it's his own Democrats standing noisily in the way. Why it's enough to make even a mild mannered lame duck president mad!**

**

[Sobax]

31. TPP is a total betrayal

[JaneyVee]

2. We already compete with countries making 50 cents a day...

Wouldn't raising their labor and environmental standards be a good thing? Look, I haven't read the tpp (I definitely will) so I'm in no position to defend it or not, but as someone who has economic degrees and dabbled in FOREX trading, I can say this; if this trade deal has a currency manipulation clause, it will most definitely create millions of new US jobs.

[TBF]

18. You haven't read the tpp because very little has been released -

and that is one of the big problems. It is all being done in secrecy. If Obama can release it and it has things like this "manipulation clause" that can be explained, well then you might not be getting so much push back. Why all the secrecy? If it's so awesome why not release it?

[zipplewrath]

21. It doesn't

Such a feature is considered the "poison pill" and in fact is one of the many complaints coming from both sides of the aisle.

[RiverLover]

22. Manufacturing in China is almost as $$$ as paying American workers these days...can't have that.

Time to exploit workers in Vietnam et al.

How can anyone be against slavery & for the TPP?

In fact, by 2015, the cost for U.S. companies to manufacture goods in China is likely to approach that of staying at home, according to Southfield, Mich.-based consulting firm AlixPartners LLP. The calculation assumes continuation of historical wage inflation rates, strengthening of Chinese currency by 5 percent per year and single-digit increases in ocean-freight costs.



Vietnam, by comparison, can look like a bargain. Factory workers in Vietnam might make a third to half of the $300 a month that is typical in China, according to experts. And there are reasons beyond lower wages to invest in Vietnam, said Robert Brown, a partner with the law firm Bingham Greenebaum Doll in Louisville, Ky. “If I have someone who wants to set up factory, I can meet with ministers,” said Brown, author of Doing Business in Vietnam, published by Thomson Reuters/West. “It’s easier to get access to the right people. They’re eagerly looking forward to getting more Americans in.”



Still, Vietnam is experiencing skill shortages from the factory floor to the C-suite, and many workers lack even basic workforce readiness — let alone experience meeting the production-quality standards of American consumers. Companies that decide to manufacture in Vietnam can expect to invest in training. Perhaps that’s one reason Vietnam is handing out tax incentives to foreign firms. In one prominent example, Seoul-based Samsung Electronics was granted four tax-free years and 12 half-price years for a $2 billion plant in northern Vietnam.



The country has drawn other big names, including Oregon-based Nike Inc....

https://globalconnections.hsbc.com/us/en/articles/manufacturinginvietnam

[darkangel218]

3. He knows what hes doing.

And he doesn't care.

[dixiegrrrrl]

4. And you HAVE told your Congress people how you feel, right? n/t

[AzDar]

5. Stop The TPP!!

[PADemD]

6. Maybe he's playing the Devil's Advocate

[Jackpine Radical]

9. Literally, not in the Church Law sense, I'd say. (nt)

[PADemD]

15. I was thinking about the Scottish legend

mentioned in Taylor Caldwell's The Devil's Advocate, 1952.

[Jackpine Radical]

16. I don't remember the Scottish legend, but

iirc the Caldwell book seemed to come from the John Birch mentality, fearing a "liberal takeover" of America, accomplished by seducing people to give up their freedom in exchange for the blandishments of the Welfare State.

[appalachiablue]

10. It is what it is. Cui bono?

[hifiguy]

8. He has watched the Clintons making millions in Bill's post-presidential years.

They were richly rewarded for their services to the plutocracy. He wants a part of that gravy train after he leaves office. No TPP, no donut. Why do you think he is fighting harder for this - and against his own party, yet - than anything else in his presidency? Simple as can be.

[WillyT]

20. Did You Catch THIS:

DULInk: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026692131

[obliviously]

24. I thought I was on a right wing site for a moment

With all this racism.

[840high]

26. I don't see any racist posts. Where?

[Andy823]

25. Wow

The doom and gloom crowd is getting really "crazy" these days. You guys sound like you should be posting on the conspiracy theory boards!

[freshwest]

29. Too many people now live in Libertarian/Tea Land. n/t

[Hoyt]

30. Oh hell yeah, let's make screwing the poor in other countries a national priority.