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Why does the media want Zimmerman to be found not guilty? (Original Post) brettdale May 2012 OP
hmmm I owe a May 2012 #1
Do you get that sense? MrSlayer May 2012 #2
If the defense can get the witnesses to testify that was Zimmerman screaming dkf May 2012 #4
We already know of an eyewitness who says it was Trayvon was screaming for help pinboy3niner May 2012 #5
The two in the released info both said it was Zimmerman. dkf May 2012 #6
Electronically.. sendero May 2012 #7
I tend to agree... KansDem May 2012 #22
Perhaps you haven't been following closely... pinboy3niner May 2012 #8
"...I still do feel..." randome May 2012 #9
Thanks for your concern... pinboy3niner May 2012 #11
Just going by her statement so far. randome May 2012 #24
That isn't listed as part of the evidence released. dkf May 2012 #28
Better question... pinboy3niner May 2012 #33
That is where the explanations of interpretation of the law are leading me. dkf May 2012 #37
You glom onto anything pro-Z, and profess to be ignorant about any pro-Trayvon points pinboy3niner May 2012 #41
independant voice analysis has already determined the screaming wasn't from zimmerman frylock May 2012 #51
Your Zimmerman is an adult who was stalking an unarmed child. TBF May 2012 #18
None of which is illegal. randome May 2012 #26
There are stalking laws and hate crime laws - TBF May 2012 #42
Manslaughter or not, Zimmerman will be in fear of his own life for some time to come. randome May 2012 #44
How Can You Claim Self-Defense When You Started The Fight? Yavin4 May 2012 #27
He claims Martin started the fight. That is what the prosecution needs to prove. dkf May 2012 #29
Martin was walking home with his iced tea and skittles. He didn't start crap. nt TBF May 2012 #43
Tempering the reaction to the inevitable verdict.... Junkdrawer May 2012 #3
It's a more interesting story? randome May 2012 #10
If Zimmie is found "not guilty", that will encourage more SYG killings, SDjack May 2012 #12
If Zimmerman is found not guilty, it's going to be like the jury Arkana May 2012 #20
I don't think they are even using SYG as a defense, are they? razorman May 2012 #21
There is to be a hearing on SYG from what I understand. dkf May 2012 #30
I see. Sounds like the defense may not have decided whether SYG is useful to them. razorman May 2012 #38
i do not consider faux as part of the media spanone May 2012 #13
Because riots make for great video. Iggo May 2012 #14
+1 ScreamingMeemie May 2012 #17
There may be riots either way. razorman May 2012 #32
Blood = Gold DonCoquixote May 2012 #15
1) maintenance of class/race relations; 2) social violence has entertainment value leveymg May 2012 #16
+1 - TBF May 2012 #19
You're probably closer to the bullseye than you think Blue_Tires May 2012 #25
I'm way 'out there' on this and am probably wrong, but Blue_Tires May 2012 #23
The President and the media execs work for the same power structure. leveymg May 2012 #34
yeah, i liked yours better Blue_Tires May 2012 #40
Researching his book about the Americian media EFerrari May 2012 #48
Bogus premise. The media don't give a flying fuck about that. The media exist to make money. slackmaster May 2012 #31
I disagree with that. The corporate media have an ideology and agenda. leveymg May 2012 #35
Every person and every organization have those. The difference is that the main purpose of... slackmaster May 2012 #36
MSNBC also creates boundaries and frames, and Keith couldn't stay within them, so he's gone. leveymg May 2012 #39
Keith has behavior issues. Rachel's behavior is almost always impeccable. She is free to say... slackmaster May 2012 #46
Its all about the benjamins...not an agenda ProgressiveProfessor May 2012 #45
Can't keep making money if you don't maintain social control. That requires violence, and lots of leveymg May 2012 #49
The ability for just about anyone to publish these days took a serious whack out of big media ProgressiveProfessor May 2012 #50
Unfortunately, the increasing number of guns and police powers more than compensate. leveymg May 2012 #52
Does "the media" want Zimmerman to be found not guilty? I refuse to coalition_unwilling May 2012 #47
 

MrSlayer

(22,143 posts)
2. Do you get that sense?
Fri May 18, 2012, 06:03 AM
May 2012

I don't know that I do. I have only seen one tv report on it amazingly and it seemed fair. I still see it as a 50/50 situation in court.

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
4. If the defense can get the witnesses to testify that was Zimmerman screaming
Fri May 18, 2012, 06:23 AM
May 2012

I think it will be hard to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he was not in fear of his life.

I guess the prosecution will have to prove Zimmerman illegally profiled Martin and therefore has no right to self defense?

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
5. We already know of an eyewitness who says it was Trayvon was screaming for help
Fri May 18, 2012, 06:39 AM
May 2012

The prosecution has more avenues than the one you suggest. They don't "have" to prove your point.

As much as you may try to constrain them, they have far more latitude than you suggest.

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
6. The two in the released info both said it was Zimmerman.
Fri May 18, 2012, 06:44 AM
May 2012

In the articles I've seen, there isn't a witness saying it was Martin. Martin's parents lawyers are relying on "ear witnesses" who say they thought it was a young person screaming, but I would think eye witnesses are better for ID.

Also Tracy Martin didn't ID the voice as being his son.

sendero

(28,552 posts)
7. Electronically..
Fri May 18, 2012, 06:59 AM
May 2012

.... I'm 99% sure it is ABSOLUTELY POSSIBLE to determine who was screaming.

And personally, as I have said all along, the entire case hinges on that fact.

KansDem

(28,498 posts)
22. I tend to agree...
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:33 AM
May 2012
...the entire case hinges on that fact.

Voice prints and filtering techniques have been around for decades. I'm surprised the media hasn't been reporting extensively on this, perhaps offering reports on past cases that were solved using this technology.

I know it was fiction but I was intrigued with the plot from "The Conversation" (1974) with Gene Hackman and how he was able to electronically manipulate a recorded conversation so that he could hear the words clearly that were originally muddled by distracting noise. Fiction? Yes, but the movie was made 38 years ago and I doubt if it strayed too far from what could have been done at the time.

And that was 38 years ago.

I tend to believe both sides of the Z-Man case know who it really was, but won't say in fear of tainting their trail strategies...

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
8. Perhaps you haven't been following closely...
Fri May 18, 2012, 07:03 AM
May 2012

By the CNN Wire Staff
updated 1:07 AM EDT, Sat April 7, 2012

...


Who yelled for help?

...


"From the very beginning and I still do feel that it was the young boy," the witness, who wants to remain anonymous, told CNN Friday.

The witness lives in the apartment complex where the shooting occurred and saw the incident through her window.

...


When pressed if she could determine who was yelling, the witness said "it was the younger, youthful voice (rather) than it was the deep voice I heard when they were arguing."

...


http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/07/us/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t3



The video of this CNN interview is here:
http://cnn.com/video/?/video/bestoftv/2012/04/07/ac-trayvon-martin-eyewitness.cnn


This has been posted here multiple times. Strange that you missed it...


pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
11. Thanks for your concern...
Fri May 18, 2012, 07:21 AM
May 2012

...but her eyewitness testimony on the witness stand is what will count, not her phrasing in a media interview.

How can you tell that her testimony won't "work at trial" when the trial hasn't begun and she hasn't yet testified?

 

randome

(34,845 posts)
24. Just going by her statement so far.
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:41 AM
May 2012

Even at trial, a good defense attorney will quote that statement to give doubt to the jury.

Zimmerman is going to get manslaughter at best. It's sad but that's how this is shaping up.

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
37. That is where the explanations of interpretation of the law are leading me.
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:15 AM
May 2012

If the law said what he did was manslaughter I would be arguing for that.

I am viewing this case as if I was on a jury.

Also, the recently released evidence seems to support Zimmerman's account which goes to his credibility.

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
41. You glom onto anything pro-Z, and profess to be ignorant about any pro-Trayvon points
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:33 AM
May 2012

Like this interview, which has been posted here multiple times. Why is that?

TBF

(31,990 posts)
18. Your Zimmerman is an adult who was stalking an unarmed child.
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:02 AM
May 2012

Spin, spin, spin ... but you can not change that fact. If he had stayed in his vehicle like 911 told him to none of this would've happened.

 

randome

(34,845 posts)
26. None of which is illegal.
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:43 AM
May 2012

At least not from the standpoint of a murder charge.

Not staying in his vehicle is not a crime.

Hopefully, causing a kid's death will still be viewed as a crime and Zimmerman will get at least manslaughter.

TBF

(31,990 posts)
42. There are stalking laws and hate crime laws -
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:35 AM
May 2012

I hope you're prepared for the riots if this is manslaughter or less.

Junkdrawer

(27,993 posts)
3. Tempering the reaction to the inevitable verdict....
Fri May 18, 2012, 06:09 AM
May 2012

Between police foul ups, the prosecution's unwillingness to look in to official misconduct, and the nature of the district where the trial will be held, I don't see much hope for a conviction.

 

randome

(34,845 posts)
10. It's a more interesting story?
Fri May 18, 2012, 07:11 AM
May 2012

From the standpoint of reporting on something that viewers will want to hear more and more about if only to be outraged.

But I don't think the media has been that biased in this case so far.

SDjack

(1,448 posts)
12. If Zimmie is found "not guilty", that will encourage more SYG killings,
Fri May 18, 2012, 08:29 AM
May 2012

and those stories increase sales of newspapers and TV time.

Arkana

(24,347 posts)
20. If Zimmerman is found not guilty, it's going to be like the jury
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:05 AM
May 2012

found OJ Simpson not guilty.

Legally he was exonerated, but everyone will know he did it.

razorman

(1,644 posts)
21. I don't think they are even using SYG as a defense, are they?
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:33 AM
May 2012

When this incident first came to light, there was talk of 'Stand Your Ground' as a factor, but I haven't actually heard of it being officially used. I could be wrong, though. Does it really have any bearing here?

razorman

(1,644 posts)
32. There may be riots either way.
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:55 AM
May 2012

I am concerned that the Martin/Zimmerman incident might inflame the already-touchy relations between the African-American and Hispanic communities in Florida. No matter which way the verdict goes, one group or the other will likely feel cheated. I just hope it doesn't lead to violence.

DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
15. Blood = Gold
Fri May 18, 2012, 08:36 AM
May 2012

It's why the media has done nothing to slow down the war machine. No offense meant to Jews, Armenians, or any other genocide victims, but if the media found way to make money off of concentration camps, they would.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
16. 1) maintenance of class/race relations; 2) social violence has entertainment value
Fri May 18, 2012, 08:57 AM
May 2012

That can only happen on terms acceptable to a conservative institution, such as corporate-owned media, if white men with guns are allowed to continue shooting black youths in hoodies with impunity.

Armed vigilantes, such as Zimmerman, are characters in an eternal morality play that is supposed to teach us lowly consumers of TV news how to maintain our proper place in society - that includes obedience to men with guns. Note the central role of ABC in releasing exculpatory evidence. A conviction would undermine that narrative, and might deter future spontaneous violence against lower-class Black youths. Programmed acts of social violence not only "sells newspapers", it keeps money and power in the hands of the One Percent, and many reporters seem to relish working these racially-tinged crime stories to death. Look at the OJ Simpson spectacle.

As for race/class, and the role of individuals that's become more complex, and more difficult to handle in recent decades. There is still racial avarice at work in this narrative ("F-cking coons), but it is no longer acceptable to attack an adult black man wearing a suit or in uniform, as it was in the '50s in many parts of the US. There's a reason that Obama is rarely seen in public without his trademark power suit. That signifies his elevated status as a non-target, which maintains the existing power structure, despite his race.

I know that's very dry and academic, but it's also the answer that fits your question.

Blue_Tires

(55,445 posts)
23. I'm way 'out there' on this and am probably wrong, but
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:40 AM
May 2012

I think at least some of the higher-up media execs want to troll the president...Once he gave an opinion on this, it was open season...

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
34. The President and the media execs work for the same power structure.
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:05 AM
May 2012

Any "trolling" would be superficial turf-marking - little more meaningful than dogs peeing on trees.

One second thought, perhaps you are right. The takedown of Murdoch is a significant event (even though the authorities seem to be publicly ignoring the larger crimes of Murdoch and NewsCorp -- political influence-buying in the UK, Australia and US as a corporate agent of Saudi Arabia and its chief propagandist in the west).

But, I don't really think this is so much directed at Obama as it is a way to reaffirm the traditional narrative of social control over poor minorities. Can't allow a heroic "Neighborhood Watch Captain" to be fed to the rabble. Better to uphold him as a National Hero and protector of all that is good and safe in Florida.

EFerrari

(163,986 posts)
48. Researching his book about the Americian media
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:58 AM
May 2012

which spans from the pre-history of the country to today, Juan Gonzalez found that the media has always taken a leading role in reaffirming the narrative of social control over poor minorities, even to the point of organizing violence.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
31. Bogus premise. The media don't give a flying fuck about that. The media exist to make money.
Fri May 18, 2012, 09:55 AM
May 2012

They want to sell advertising space so that other companies can sell shit. They'll respond to ANY outcome of the case in whatever manner they believe will make them the most money.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
36. Every person and every organization have those. The difference is that the main purpose of...
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:08 AM
May 2012

...a for-profit enterprise is to make money.

They media will publish things that run counter to the politics of their masters when it suits them. That's why people like Rachel Maddow can get long-running shows at the most prime times.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
39. MSNBC also creates boundaries and frames, and Keith couldn't stay within them, so he's gone.
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:19 AM
May 2012

I don't think that Rachel runs counter to the acceptable lines of political discourse in America today. She helps define them for one market segment. The fact that she's still working, and won't touch certain subjects, should tell you that.

If it were all about ratings, Olbermann would still be on Countdown five nights each week.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
46. Keith has behavior issues. Rachel's behavior is almost always impeccable. She is free to say...
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:43 AM
May 2012

...exactly what she believes.

I believe that if significant restrictions were put on what she could say, she would quit.

If it were all about ratings, Olbermann would still be on Countdown five nights each week.

Sometimes working with a person becomes so much of a PITA that bosses just can't take it any more.

ProgressiveProfessor

(22,144 posts)
45. Its all about the benjamins...not an agenda
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:38 AM
May 2012

The media needs to get you to read their site, buy their papers, etc. I don't think there is a real agenda here so much as a drive for sensationalism to make profits. For example, every media outlet yesterday and today are doing Donna Summers retrospectives. Tomorrow it will be the next shiny thing.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
49. Can't keep making money if you don't maintain social control. That requires violence, and lots of
Fri May 18, 2012, 11:14 AM
May 2012

it in a country with the diversity and growing inequality of America, today. The agenda is property, and those with most of it holding onto what they have by any means necessary. Always has been.

You're trying to deny the obvious, I'm afraid.

ProgressiveProfessor

(22,144 posts)
50. The ability for just about anyone to publish these days took a serious whack out of big media
Fri May 18, 2012, 11:18 AM
May 2012

control and profits. That "property" has lost a lot of its clout

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
52. Unfortunately, the increasing number of guns and police powers more than compensate.
Fri May 18, 2012, 07:32 PM
May 2012

Shift from soft to use of hard power domestically is a leading indicator of our loss of world power and the breakdown of gov't legitimacy.

 

coalition_unwilling

(14,180 posts)
47. Does "the media" want Zimmerman to be found not guilty? I refuse to
Fri May 18, 2012, 10:48 AM
May 2012

watch or read MSM after Operation Shocking and Awful (other than rare link outs from DU or DailyKos), so I honestly have very little idea how MSM is spinning the story.

This is the self-same MSM that pretty much signed on wholesale (McClatchy chain excepted) to the idea of WMD in Iraq.

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