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icymist

(15,888 posts)
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 06:09 PM Sep 2015

60,000 Antelope Died in Four Days and No One Knows Why

It started in late May. When geoecologist Steffen Zuther and his colleagues arrived in central Kazakhstan to monitor the calving of one herd of saigas, a critically endangered, steppe-dwelling antelope, veterinarians in the area had already reported dead animals on the ground.

"But since there happened to be die-offs of limited extent during the last years, at first we were not really alarmed," Zuther, the international coordinator of the Altyn Dala Conservation Initiative, told Live Science.

But within four days, the entire herd — 60,000 saiga — had died. As veterinarians and conservationists tried to stem the die-off, they also got word of similar population crashes in other herds across Kazakhstan. By early June, the mass dying was over.


In May 2015, nearly half of all the saigas, a critically endangered antelope that roams the steppe of Kazakhstan, died off. Albert Salemgareyev

http://www.nbcnews.com/science/environment/60-000-antelope-died-four-days-no-one-knows-why-n421056?cid=sm_fb

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60,000 Antelope Died in Four Days and No One Knows Why (Original Post) icymist Sep 2015 OP
What the hell??? arcane1 Sep 2015 #1
Freaky to say the least. riversedge Sep 2015 #2
Paranoia Old Codger Sep 2015 #3
They'll probably find some weird toxin building up in the food supply Warpy Sep 2015 #4
My bad, thats on me. bvar22 Sep 2015 #5
Very, very sad... joeybee12 Sep 2015 #6
Uzbekistan catapults, probably AngryAmish Sep 2015 #7
What beef does General Borat have with antelope? nt msanthrope Sep 2015 #56
That is profoundly depressing. n/t Matariki Sep 2015 #8
Damn. Baitball Blogger Sep 2015 #9
Well, they'll have to change the song, then KamaAina Sep 2015 #10
Actually Flying Squirrel Sep 2015 #21
The song does not expressly state where that range is jberryhill Sep 2015 #34
True, however Flying Squirrel Sep 2015 #39
So? jberryhill Sep 2015 #40
Again Flying Squirrel Sep 2015 #42
And what is this supposed to mean? jberryhill Sep 2015 #41
You're so amazing. Flying Squirrel Sep 2015 #43
Stolen... jberryhill Sep 2015 #44
Where do the buffalo roam? fadedrose Sep 2015 #51
Either they ate a common food source that was tainted with something toxic, or a virulent contagious 4lbs Sep 2015 #11
Why is a geoecologist monitoring herds of animals? Boudica the Lyoness Sep 2015 #12
I would think that part of what geoecologists do. Xipe Totec Sep 2015 #16
I thought I read geologist. Boudica the Lyoness Sep 2015 #48
Because they study the ecology of a/many species. Rex Sep 2015 #23
Maybe they were due for their pap smears jberryhill Sep 2015 #46
wtf n/t retrowire Sep 2015 #13
Bizarre sarisataka Sep 2015 #14
Oh this is sad and scary. DawgHouse Sep 2015 #15
TL;DR: It's happened before, and they're pretty sure it's a bacteria that for some reason the saigas Brickbat Sep 2015 #17
I'm sure Republicans are somehow responsible, they're the reason we can't have nice things. ToxMarz Sep 2015 #18
OMG, how awful. City Lights Sep 2015 #19
My first thought is a contagious virus or something poisonus in their diet. Marrah_G Sep 2015 #20
It's happened before, and they're pretty sure it's a bacteria that for some reason the saigas Brickbat Sep 2015 #26
I read something about it being warmer and wetter then usual which produced more bacteria Marrah_G Sep 2015 #55
We are in Earth's 6th mass extinction cycle. Rex Sep 2015 #22
This is a fascinating line of thought Fairgo Sep 2015 #25
Yeap, preliminary analysis is it's climate change related... uponit7771 Sep 2015 #24
This is horrible! BeanMusical Sep 2015 #27
Likely poisoned by their water or food source. blackspade Sep 2015 #28
Doubtful. Pasturage is one thing Kazakhstan isn't short of Recursion Sep 2015 #37
Saigas have mass die-offs alternating with explosive growth. closeupready Sep 2015 #29
^^^THIS^^^ mike_c Sep 2015 #35
If you go tothe link Milliesmom Sep 2015 #30
Get used to this... deathrind Sep 2015 #31
Do you have links to substantiate? Snobblevitch Sep 2015 #38
OMG Really?!!!!!! Dont call me Shirley Sep 2015 #49
I'm not a climate change denier. Snobblevitch Sep 2015 #54
Here read this... Dont call me Shirley Sep 2015 #57
Thanks Obama! Taitertots Sep 2015 #32
Has anyone seen that dentist? jberryhill Sep 2015 #33
Bwahahaha! valerief Sep 2015 #53
Dugway sheep incident. Makes me think of that. mainer Sep 2015 #36
Bhopal but for animals elehhhhna Sep 2015 #52
This is horrible. And the not-funny jokes about it in this thread are creepy beyond words. Squinch Sep 2015 #45
As long as they dont rise from the dead as GummyBearz Sep 2015 #47
Sagas... Dont call me Shirley Sep 2015 #50

Warpy

(111,249 posts)
4. They'll probably find some weird toxin building up in the food supply
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 06:37 PM
Sep 2015

thanks to a weird El Nino winter. Even an infectious agent generally leaves a few of the hardier animals alive.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
5. My bad, thats on me.
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 06:44 PM
Sep 2015

I won't do it again.
I couldn't find the parking brake on my rental Range Rover, and...well,
they just kept getting in the way.


(I realize the above response is flippant in the face of a tragedy of this magnitude,
but left it up anyway)
I hope there is a simple explanation for this Mass Die-Offs , and we are not looking at the New Normal of Global Climate Change.

 

joeybee12

(56,177 posts)
6. Very, very sad...
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 06:44 PM
Sep 2015

And quite frankly I think we'll hear more such cases...we've really phucked this planet over.

 

KamaAina

(78,249 posts)
10. Well, they'll have to change the song, then
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 07:09 PM
Sep 2015

"Where seldom is heard/A discouraging word/And the deer and the other deer play."

 

Flying Squirrel

(3,041 posts)
21. Actually
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 08:03 PM
Sep 2015

There have never been antelope in North America. We do have the pronghorn which is often colloquially known as a pronghorn antelope, but is in fact not an antelope.

(Trivia note)

 

Flying Squirrel

(3,041 posts)
39. True, however
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 11:59 PM
Sep 2015

It was written by a Kansas native in the 1870's and has been long been considered the "unofficial anthem of the American West"...

But really, what this proves is that some DUers will take intellectual dishonesty to absurd lengths!


 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
40. So?
Fri Sep 4, 2015, 12:12 AM
Sep 2015

Shakespeare wrote Hamlet without ever visiting Denmark.

The song does not describe an existing home on the range, wherever that range might be, but a desired, or aspirational, home.

It is "Oh give me a home..." Not "I have a home.."

In fact that sort of proves then point. Clearly the composer WANTED a home where the deer and the antelope play.

Most likely, he did not have one, for the very reason you cite.

However, perhaps he wanted a menagerie of some sort that would have required the importation of antelope. But, give the the expense, then maybe he wanted to get the fuck out of Kansas and go to Kazakhstan (either taking some buffalo with him, or simply accepting water buffalo under a broader notion of "buffalo&quot .

Well, the plan is screwed now because the deer don't have any antelope to play with. But ungulates can be fickle in their play as, for example, the reindeer who would not let poor Rudolph join in any reindeer games.

So maybe Rudolph decided "I'll show them" and since they wouldn't play with Rudolph, he went on a murderous ungulate rampage and made it so they couldn't play with the antelope.
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
41. And what is this supposed to mean?
Fri Sep 4, 2015, 12:19 AM
Sep 2015

"We do have the pronghorn which is often colloquially known as a pronghorn antelope, but is in fact not an antelope."

Isn't an animal, in fact, what we call it?

That's like saying "Guinea pigs aren't really pigs."

Well of course they are pigs if that's what we call them. They are guinea pigs.

fadedrose

(10,044 posts)
51. Where do the buffalo roam?
Fri Sep 4, 2015, 06:47 PM
Sep 2015

where the deer and the other deer lay?

Are there buffalo in the other continents where they can watch deer and antelope play?

We've all been taken for fools all this time?

Must have been a republican's all I kin say...oh, maybe not, it doesn't say anything about shooting them..

4lbs

(6,855 posts)
11. Either they ate a common food source that was tainted with something toxic, or a virulent contagious
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 07:15 PM
Sep 2015

disease spread quickly through the population in that area.

sarisataka

(18,612 posts)
14. Bizarre
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 07:21 PM
Sep 2015

I would wonder if there was an old Soviet chemical weapons facility in the area, but if the die off is in more than one area that doesn't seem a likely explanation.

Brickbat

(19,339 posts)
17. TL;DR: It's happened before, and they're pretty sure it's a bacteria that for some reason the saigas
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 07:36 PM
Sep 2015

are occasionally vulnerable to when usually they aren't.

Brickbat

(19,339 posts)
26. It's happened before, and they're pretty sure it's a bacteria that for some reason the saigas
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 08:56 PM
Sep 2015

are occasionally vulnerable to when usually they aren't.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
22. We are in Earth's 6th mass extinction cycle.
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 08:06 PM
Sep 2015

Maybe this is just a taste of what is to come from climate change? Seems like something common shared among the species did them in somehow. Strange.

Fairgo

(1,571 posts)
25. This is a fascinating line of thought
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 08:55 PM
Sep 2015

Complex systems yield mysterious phenomenon...in this case, perhaps a change in weather changed foraging behaviour, while encouraging bacterial growth, and stressing the herd...viola, mass die offf, a cascade of events may have lead to this. Look for other die offs in other parts of the ecological web...as the ecology simplifies through attrition, look for the collapse at the top of the pyramid. Whales, bears, human beings...in humans collapse will start in the social, creating tsunami waves of refugees, pushing outward into yet another cascade...wait, isn't this already happening? Hmmm, maybe it's all connected....

uponit7771

(90,335 posts)
24. Yeap, preliminary analysis is it's climate change related...
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 08:41 PM
Sep 2015
Tissue samples revealed that toxins, produced by Pasteurella and possibly Clostridia bacteria, caused extensive bleeding in most of the animals' organs. But Pasteurella is found normally in the bodies of ruminants like the saigas, and it usually doesn't cause harm unless the animals have weakened immune systems.

So far, the only possible environmental cause was that there was a cold, hard winter followed by a wet spring, with lots of lush vegetation and standing water on the ground that could enable bacteria to spread more easily, Zuther said. That by itself doesn't seem so unusual, though, he said.v

blackspade

(10,056 posts)
28. Likely poisoned by their water or food source.
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 09:14 PM
Sep 2015

I'll be curious if it was intentional to free up grazing lands or water resources for ranching or other exploitive land use....

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
37. Doubtful. Pasturage is one thing Kazakhstan isn't short of
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 11:03 PM
Sep 2015

And the existence of saiga gives the wolves (Kz has the largest wolf population in the world) something other than cows to eat.

 

closeupready

(29,503 posts)
29. Saigas have mass die-offs alternating with explosive growth.
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 09:28 PM
Sep 2015

There was a documentary about it either on Nature or Youtube.

Long-term, yes, they have declined precipitously, but I'm not sure in the short-term that this is out of the ordinary in terms of population patterns.

deathrind

(1,786 posts)
31. Get used to this...
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 09:51 PM
Sep 2015

...over the next few years/decades this type of event will become common. Everything on this planet is connected to everything else...and the planet is changing in ways we cannot fathom nor imagine. We think a few degrees change in climate temp is manageable but it is not. It has taken thousands if not millions of years for the planet to stabilize to the point where life could flourish as we know it today...but in just the last 150-200yrs we have pumped millions of tons of elements back into the atmosphere that the planet spent thousands / millions of years getting rid of thru various processes of plant life or other life forms now extinct to get rid of. We are by far our own worst enemy...

Snobblevitch

(1,958 posts)
54. I'm not a climate change denier.
Fri Sep 4, 2015, 10:03 PM
Sep 2015

It's just when I read a post with claims that seem quite substantial, I like to read more about that information and make my own conclusions. Is there something wrong with that?

mainer

(12,022 posts)
36. Dugway sheep incident. Makes me think of that.
Thu Sep 3, 2015, 10:54 PM
Sep 2015

3,000 sheep dead overnight in Utah. Nerve gas accident.

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