CSM - Why did those Oregon protesters pick a wildlife refuge to make their stand?

[Quixote1818]

Before it represented conflict and armed anti-government sentiment, conservationists say Malheur Wildlife Refuge was a beacon of collaboration.


By Story Hinckley, Staff January 5, 2016


Snip>

“The best possible outcome is that the ranchers that have been kicked out of the area, then they will come back and reclaim their land, and the wildlife refuge will be shut down forever and the federal government will relinquish such control,” Ryan told OregonLive.

But Sallinger says the land didn't originally belong to ranchers.

“When the militia talks about giving [the land] back to original owners, they were not ranchers. They were tribes,” he explains. “If they are really interested in returning [the land] to the original owners, it would be the Paiute tribe.”

And Malheur enthusiasts say the Bundys and their sympathizers are a minority.

“Obviously the community hasn’t received them well, and they haven’t endorsed their actions,” says Salligner. “[Malheur] is one of the crown jewels of the National Wildlife Refuge System and belongs to all Americans… The occupiers are serving nobody’s interests except their own.”



http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/USA-Update/2016/0105/Why-did-those-Oregon-protesters-pick-a-wildlife-refuge-to-make-their-stand

[Human101948]

1. Because it is a bird sanctuary and they are a bunch of loons?

Best explanation I can come up with.

[joeybee12]

2. Thread win right off the bat!

I was going to say they did it because they're dumber than a bag of rocks.

[Bluenorthwest]

3. It is in part because of their religious views, in which that area is the northern edge of Deseret,

the Mormon nation state. It's also very remote, sparsely populated and a 26 year Sheriff's term was ending on Jan 1st, so it would be the middle of nowhere, poorly equipped law enforcement on the day of a quarter century shift of leadership, making it a convenient target for making a swift foothold without much to stop them.

[MohRokTah]

5. It was originally included in the lines of Deseret because of the fresh water and grazing land. eom

[Bluenorthwest]

6. Exactly.

nt

[Lizzie Poppet]

13. They have really misjudged the new sheriff.

I've been impressed with Sheriff Ward's performance. He didn't rush in and start a battle (one he couldn't have won, given the militants' numbers and defensible position), yet he made it clear from the get-go that the occupation was unacceptable, that it turned a perfectly legal protest into an illegal one. He behaved in a sober-minded, calm fashion that helped ensure that there's been no bloodshed so far. Professionalism: too many police departments could learn a thing or two from this guy.

[fredamae]

4. I think we all missed the point-and the hypocrisy

Regarding Malheur:
"Under Agent Rinehart, hostile settlers continued to invade reservation land and appropriations dwindled. Chief Egan gave an eloquent speech against Rinehart and the taking of the reservation by Whites. He said,


"Did the government tell you to come here and drive us off this reservation? Did the Big Father say, go and kill us all off, so you can have our land? Did he tell you to pull our children's ears off, and put handcuffs on them, and carry a pistol to shoot us with? We want to know how the government came by this land. Is the government mightier than our Spirit-Father, or is he our Spirit-Father? Oh, what have we done that he is to take all from us that he has given us? His white children have come and taken all our mountains, and all our valleys, and all our rivers; and now, because he has given us this little place without our asking him for it, he sends you here to tell us to go away. Do you see that high mountain away off there? There is nothing but rocks there. Is that where the Big Father wants me to go? If you scattered your seed and it should fall there, it would not grow, for it is all rocks there." (Hopkins, Life Among the Piutes, pages 133-34.)"


http://www.burnspaiute-nsn.gov/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=58%3Atreaties-and-reservations-created-&catid=37%3Ahistory&Itemid=57

[TeeYiYi]

8. Life Among the Piutes was originally published in 1883...

Sarah Winnemucca dedicated her life to improving the living and social conditions for her people. She gave more than 400 speeches across the United States and Europe to gain support for the Paiutes. She died of tuberculosis in 1891. Life Among the Piutes was originally published in 1883.
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1058879.Life_Among_The_Piutes

Thank you fredamae and thank you Sarah Winnemucca.

TYY

[Lizzie Poppet]

7. I've become convinced the occupation wasn't part of the original plan.

I was fooled before because the refuge HQ is such a perfect location for people who are prepared and equipped to hold it in the face of a blockade and the cutting off of their electricity. It's a small compound of stone buildings (great cover against small arms fire) surrounded by very open countryside (open fields of fire). There's a big fireplace in one of the buildings, almost certainly a well (and there's a holding pond adjacent, plus a spring a few hundred feet away). There's even a watchtower.

But now we come to find out that they seem to be very poorly supplied, for all that those trailers of theirs are asserted to contain generators, etc. I'm thinking that no one was planning for this occupation to take place at this time. It only happened after about half of the group split away from the larger, peaceful demonstration in Burns. I think someone knew about the refuge HQ, knew that it was defensible, and (unsurprisingly) no one acted as the voice of reason when it was suggested that they occupy the place.

"Amateurs study tactics, professionals study logistics."

[Wellstone ruled]

10. Is this a 1930's Conservation Corps facility?

By the photos,it appears to be. All one has to know here is. This group is so indoctrinated with the Bircher/Nazi doctrine,they refuse to accept what is real and unreal. Their whole life seems to be reinforced by hate media.

[Lizzie Poppet]

11. Yes.

I've been there a good many times (about a dozen, I'd estimate). It's one of the more beautiful projects made by that wonderful program here in Oregon. I'd really hate to see it damaged, for itself, and because so much of the work done on the refuge originates from that facility.

[Wellstone ruled]

14. Thanks,typical

architecture of the CC Corps. Had hoped to be in that area for several weeks this summer. Got to check out a few Claims that are available just down the road. Never ever had any issues with the BLM when it comes to Mineral Claims,have to remember,one only rents the land and when you are done you have a obligation to leave it in the same or better shape than it was before. If you want to see miss use,check out Gold Butte on the Arizona Strip. Yes that is the same land that the Bundy Clan thinks they own.

[L. Coyote]

9. Because Oregon has better prisons with fewer minorities?

[center]

[2naSalit]

12. This gang, ifthey should see the inside

of any prison, it will be a federal one.

[L. Coyote]

16. Exactly. Sheridan, Oregon.

[Blue_Tires]

15. Because it's undefended, easy to take over

and allows the media to treat them with kids gloves and keep them in a positive light as opposed to had they taken over say, an elementary school or the governor's mansion??

[L. Coyote]

17. They needed a political prop, a stage for their circus. This is happening in the the media, not OR.

It is just a way to force yourself into the limelight whether or not anyone wants you there. Without attention, this would never have happened. they can only be as serious as someone takes them, that is why they are derision targets. Everyone sees right through them, laughs every time they try a new bark.