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Coventina

(27,057 posts)
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 10:25 PM Jan 2016

A few days ago, I saw a thread complaining about movie theaters....

I didn't read it at the time, as I hadn't been to a newly run movie in quite a while.

Well, I did today and I'm here to pile on the complaints about movie theaters.

Had plans to see a movie (Youth) with a friend today after work. We were both going to rush from work to make it to a matinee showing in the late afternoon.

I get to the theatre to find out that it's a "luxury" theatre with reserved seating only!!

This means I can't just buy my ticket and go in, no, I have to select a seat.

"But my friend is coming to meet me and she might be running late, how do we sit together?"

Turns out, I have buy her ticket and leave it with the ticket taker (not the box office, no, that would be too simple!) with her name.
I have to call her and let her know it's waiting for her, so she doesn't buy another ticket!!

Unfortunately, due to her work, she had her phone turned off and it wouldn't let me leave a message!
(My phone doesn't text).

So, I have to wait for her to show up, so we can buy our tickets together, in order to sit together.

Oh, and the "reduced" matinee price was $14!!!! On a Wednesday afternoon!!

I love Michael Caine, but boy, I was tempted to tell them to shove it.
We would have gone to another theatre, but this was only theatre in town showing "Youth".


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A few days ago, I saw a thread complaining about movie theaters.... (Original Post) Coventina Jan 2016 OP
I've read the threads and all I can say is... Liberal Jesus Freak Jan 2016 #1
Our experience too MuseRider Jan 2016 #8
Absolutely agree! Hangingon Jan 2016 #41
We had no problem finding one. Liberal Jesus Freak Jan 2016 #42
Learned yesterday that beginning 1-1-2017 our eye doctor will no longer take Medicare! Hangingon Jan 2016 #43
Jesus! Glamrock Jan 2016 #2
Arrive at official movie start time HERVEPA Jan 2016 #3
20 minutes of movie previews today - I timed them Retrograde Jan 2016 #5
Then arrive later, problem solved. nt Logical Jan 2016 #7
^^This. It's the law. Atman Jan 2016 #23
Theatre was in Scottsdale, AZ. Coventina Jan 2016 #18
I am extremely fortunate to have a dollar movie theater here. sure, the movies are not niyad Jan 2016 #4
Oh, I have so many fond memories of dollar movie theaters!!!! Coventina Jan 2016 #20
Reserved seating is a huge plus. Codeine Jan 2016 #6
I agree, they upgraded the theater near me last year and it is a huge improvement Bjorn Against Jan 2016 #10
Yep. I go to more shows now. It's the only way to go, IMO. Hassin Bin Sober Jan 2016 #11
I see some upsides, BUT, it makes going to the movies a big THING Coventina Jan 2016 #21
At this point I won't go to a non-reserved show. Warren Stupidity Jan 2016 #47
I refuse to watch much western cinema at this point, most of it is absolute trash. Shandris Jan 2016 #9
Also, if you're planning on seeing a film Codeine Jan 2016 #12
I don't have a smart phone, and we had no idea the seats were reserved when we made our plans. Coventina Jan 2016 #22
Our theater offers both. Atman Jan 2016 #24
This theatre had nothing but assigned seating. Coventina Jan 2016 #26
Assigned seating at a movie theater HeiressofBickworth Jan 2016 #13
It does strike me as a bit pretentious as well. But, I wouldn't mind so much if Coventina Jan 2016 #29
We have a drive-in. LeftyMom Jan 2016 #14
I love drive-ins!!! But, the only one near us closed. Coventina Jan 2016 #30
Do they still send a truck around spraying for mosquitos? JustABozoOnThisBus Jan 2016 #32
There's nothing like that here. Blue_In_AK Jan 2016 #15
Found that out when the whole family went to see The Martian. RiffRandell Jan 2016 #16
The thing is, I don't understand why they have to make it such a PITA. Coventina Jan 2016 #33
These are usually the theaters with lazyboy full reclining seats. dilby Jan 2016 #17
Yes, they did have those very fancy seats and they were nice. Coventina Jan 2016 #34
Yeah, these are very specific Regal theaters and they are not all that way. dilby Jan 2016 #36
I saw Star Wars: The Force Awakens yesterday in 3D. MohRokTah Jan 2016 #19
That's the only way to fly, as far as I'm concerned. Iggo Jan 2016 #27
Sunday matinees. MohRokTah Jan 2016 #28
Lucky you!! Coventina Jan 2016 #35
Our theater serves beer now. Atman Jan 2016 #25
Out here in Dirtland Codeine Jan 2016 #31
This theatre had a full bar!!! Coventina Jan 2016 #37
1st world problems suck... snooper2 Jan 2016 #38
Oh whatever. Coventina Jan 2016 #39
no offense taken LOL - We all have first world problems snooper2 Jan 2016 #40
I LOVE the reserved seating concept TeddyR Jan 2016 #44
There were long lines at the theatre yesterday. Coventina Jan 2016 #45
I don't like reserved seating... PasadenaTrudy Jan 2016 #46
I love those 'choose your seat' theatres Beaverhausen Jan 2016 #48
I guess there's just no "one size fits all" solution. Coventina Jan 2016 #49
Reserved recliners are the best thing ever in theaters. Only one I will go to now Godhumor Jan 2016 #50
Most cinemas in Europe EdwardBernays Jan 2016 #51
As an aside... If you say "My Cocaine" you say Michael Caine's name in his accent. Glassunion Jan 2016 #52
Your First World Problem complaints are unbelievable thelordofhell Jan 2016 #53
Wow, judgmental much? Coventina Jan 2016 #54
You started this.......By being judgmental in your OP thelordofhell Jan 2016 #55
I was bashing poor customer service. Coventina Jan 2016 #56
There's always at least one. RiffRandell Jan 2016 #59
Thanks RiffRandell! Coventina Jan 2016 #60
Did you purchase the $10/$12 popcorn and $5 soft drink? B Calm Jan 2016 #57
I actually had a free popcorn voucher, but I did get the $6 soda. Coventina Jan 2016 #58

Liberal Jesus Freak

(1,451 posts)
1. I've read the threads and all I can say is...
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 10:49 PM
Jan 2016

It is the ONLY benefit to living at the end of the world. We saw the new Star Wars...during Christmas break...at a matinee with 15 other people. In 3D. For $15 for the two of us. Sorry about your experience but I bet your restaurant/bar choices are better than ours

MuseRider

(34,095 posts)
8. Our experience too
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 11:25 PM
Jan 2016

we always try to go late on a night when there won't be a lot of people there. There was no talking or phones at our showing, probably 20 people there. We have gone to popular movies and been the only one's in the theater. I hate going when they are full. It is obnoxious.

Hangingon

(3,071 posts)
41. Absolutely agree!
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 12:43 PM
Jan 2016

Here in the sticks, we pay $4 -$6 for a seat and there is bring your own bowl Freeport corn on Tuesday evening. On the other hand, we can't find a primary care physician.

Liberal Jesus Freak

(1,451 posts)
42. We had no problem finding one.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 12:58 PM
Jan 2016

Of course, he's an hour away No medical emergencies for us. But if I get strep throat at least I can go to the movies

Glamrock

(11,787 posts)
2. Jesus!
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 10:49 PM
Jan 2016

Where do you live? Last time I paid that kind of cash for a movie was a Tolkien flick in 3d at an Imax. (Wasn't really worth it, but it was Xmas break. Because of the price, most of the kiddies were watching the non 3d version.)

That being said, my issues with theatres is the intro previews, commercials, psa's, etc. Man, they just keep piling it on. Seems like 30-40 minutes of that crap at this point. Drives me nuts. And of course, if I show up late to avoid it, I end up missing the first few minutes. Sometimes, you look in the mirror and expect to see Charlie Brown.

 

HERVEPA

(6,107 posts)
3. Arrive at official movie start time
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 11:04 PM
Jan 2016

and you get 15 minutes of previews.
The other crap, and it is crap, is before that time.
And the luxury seats are great!

Retrograde

(10,128 posts)
5. 20 minutes of movie previews today - I timed them
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 11:12 PM
Jan 2016

that doesn't count however many commercials mainly for TV shows that exhibit a complete lack of creativity before that. OTOH, it was only $7.50 for the geezer showing of Star Wars this morning, and since the movie theater validates parking we didn't have to pay for that.

Atman

(31,464 posts)
23. ^^This. It's the law.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:31 AM
Jan 2016

It's been in effect for quite a few years now. Theaters must start the movie at the advertised time. NOT the previews and ads, the actual movie. But some people like watching the previews.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
18. Theatre was in Scottsdale, AZ.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:18 AM
Jan 2016

But I've been to movies in Scottsdale before and never had to pay such outrageous prices!!
However, this was a brand new theatre, so maybe this is the wave of the future, as some have said elsewhere in the thread.

I guess I'm being priced out of going to movies.....

niyad

(113,055 posts)
4. I am extremely fortunate to have a dollar movie theater here. sure, the movies are not
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 11:06 PM
Jan 2016

first run, but the price is right (even some of the concession items are reasonable, and there is a dollar store several doors down)

even for michael caine, would not spend $14/ticket.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
20. Oh, I have so many fond memories of dollar movie theaters!!!!
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:23 AM
Jan 2016

We used to have a wonderful one not too far away.

Believe it or not, they would often run indie / art films if they were "big" enough.
(Think things along the lines of "The King's Speech" or "Sense & Sensibility" that kind of thing).
And, they would KEEP running something for as long as it was popular!
My brother must have gone to see "Tombstone" there at least three dozen times!!


It came to a bittersweet end, though.

The space was sold to the city and they turned the space into an art museum!

It's a really nice museum with some really wonderful pieces (including a permanent installation piece by James Turrell),
but there are times I miss the dollar cinema.

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
6. Reserved seating is a huge plus.
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 11:15 PM
Jan 2016

The seats are more comfortable, the audience smaller, the lines quicker, and the overall experience far more enjoyable.

You're complaining about the best thing to happy to movie theaters since the popcorn maker was invented!

Bjorn Against

(12,041 posts)
10. I agree, they upgraded the theater near me last year and it is a huge improvement
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 11:33 PM
Jan 2016

The prices have remained close to what they were before the upgrade but we now have super comfortable recliners and there is still enough room for people to walk down the aisle even with the leg rests fully extended. Being able to choose your seats ahead of time is also a huge plus, there is no more going into a packed theater and struggling to find seats.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
21. I see some upsides, BUT, it makes going to the movies a big THING
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:26 AM
Jan 2016

instead of a casual meet-up for friends.

For me, yesterday, it was an inconvenience.

Not mention a completely rapacious price.

 

Warren Stupidity

(48,181 posts)
47. At this point I won't go to a non-reserved show.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 01:49 PM
Jan 2016

I want to know where I'm sitting. I don't want to stand in lines. I loathe the endless ads.

 

Shandris

(3,447 posts)
9. I refuse to watch much western cinema at this point, most of it is absolute trash.
Wed Jan 6, 2016, 11:28 PM
Jan 2016

But I'd happily go see the Love Live! movie or maybe a Pokemon movie. Something light, airy, cheery, and with good messages. Anything else, it's not even on my radar anymore. I'd buy a large drink of some kind to help the establishment, though; its not their fault that their margins are SO slim, and they really are. But otherwise I won't set foot in one except to buy my yearly gift certificates for them for others (because my conservative family LOVES the movies).

Now, if I could get my app back that let me watch east Asian (SK/CH/JP) tv I'd be happy but no, it died and went away.

 

Codeine

(25,586 posts)
12. Also, if you're planning on seeing a film
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 12:00 AM
Jan 2016

grab your phone, launch Fandango, and buy your tickets instantly. You don't even need to print anything -- the app will give you a scannable code that you show the ticket taker person/machine.

Do it while you're with your friend the day before or something then waltz into the theater on your own time, stretch out in your recliner, and relax knowing that you won't have to adjust your seat to let people pass in front of you anymore.

One can rail against the modern world or one can enjoy its benefits. The former will accomplish nothing, while the latter can bring much pleasure.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
22. I don't have a smart phone, and we had no idea the seats were reserved when we made our plans.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:29 AM
Jan 2016

It wasn't until I arrived at the theatre ahead of my friend that we discovered all seats were reserved.

I wouldn't have been so grumpy about the whole thing if:

a) the price wasn't so high ($14 for a matinee? really?)
and
b) I could have left a ticket for my friend with the box office

Atman

(31,464 posts)
24. Our theater offers both.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:36 AM
Jan 2016

Usually first-run big movies are in the reserved seat theater and in an open seating theater at the same time. Of course, the reserved seating is a nicer, more comfortable theater.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
26. This theatre had nothing but assigned seating.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:41 AM
Jan 2016

And, I have to admit that "Youth" is hardly a "big" movie.
This was the only place in the greater-Phoenix area showing it.

HeiressofBickworth

(2,682 posts)
13. Assigned seating at a movie theater
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 01:34 AM
Jan 2016

is so damned pretentious. We have one of those in our area. Higher ticket prices and one has to pick out specific seats even if there are only a hand-full of other people at the movie. Live theater- ok, sporting events - ok, but movies? HA. I go to a lot of movies (3 last Saturday) but I try to avoid the snooty theater. However, occasionally, it is the only theater showing a movie that I really want to see. I go to a lot of indie and foreign films which are rarely in the mall multi-plex. Fortunately, there are a few other theaters that show the type of movies I like.

And don't even get me started on their high price for foofy food.......
And having to wait in one line to order drinks and then wait in a separate line to order food.... and having to pay separately for them.

OTOH, it is a 21-and-over theater so there are no squalling babies or babbling teens.

Ah, life is full of trade-offs.


Coventina

(27,057 posts)
29. It does strike me as a bit pretentious as well. But, I wouldn't mind so much if
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:46 AM
Jan 2016

they wouldn't CHARGE so much ($14 for a matinee?) and would have allowed me to leave a ticket for my friend at the box office.

You'll like this: there were TWO different snack bars in the theatre: one was traditional with popcorn, soda, candy and the other one with "foofy" food, as you put it: high end pastries and stuff like that. So the two crowds didn't mix!!

And there was a bar as well! An actual bar where you can just hang out and drink or order drinks to take into the theatre.

Unlike your theatre, the facility is not 21 and over, there were many children there, but none going to see "Youth".

Definitely not a children's movie!!

LeftyMom

(49,212 posts)
14. We have a drive-in.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 01:52 AM
Jan 2016

I can adjust the sound to my liking. I can stop on the way for take-out. The only annoying children are my own.

It's the best.

Except when it's raining or foggy.

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
15. There's nothing like that here.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 01:58 AM
Jan 2016

I have to echo the sentiments of those others here who say sometimes it's great to live in Nowheresville.

RiffRandell

(5,909 posts)
16. Found that out when the whole family went to see The Martian.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 02:16 AM
Jan 2016

Sunday morning matinee.

Only seats available were the front row, which I cannot do.

My husband and our 2 kids sat in the front row while somehow I scored a great seat smack in the middle of the theater.

I kept waiting for someone to approach me and say "You're in my seat" like when someone is in your seat at a concert or on a plane.

Had someone done that of course I would have moved but no one did. We just couldn't get 4 seats together.

It wasn't even opening weekend. I had people on both sides of me but enjoyed the movie aside from not sitting with my family.

Now we know to plan ahead of time. Our matinee prices are cheaper, though!

It's a huge freaking pain in the ass to go to the movies these days.

Youth looks great, reviews have been great and awesome cast!

We all loved The Martian.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
33. The thing is, I don't understand why they have to make it such a PITA.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:55 AM
Jan 2016


Youth was quite good. I was prepared for a major tragedy, but I ended up laughing and not crying at all.
I think those who find it a tragic movie have not had very many bad things happen to them, because everything in the movie is just "life stuff" that either I or someone close to me has experienced.
Michael Caine and Harvey Keitel have wonderful chemistry together, and they really carry the movie.
Although Rachel Weitz (?) as Michael Caine's daughter is really great as well.

Definitely worth seeing, but maybe not worth $14 for a matinee, unless you are a crazy Michael Caine fan.

dilby

(2,273 posts)
17. These are usually the theaters with lazyboy full reclining seats.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 02:48 AM
Jan 2016

I bought tickets for my family to see Hunger Games at a theater like this, it was great I bought the tickets ahead of time was able to get 13 seats all together and did not have to worry about arriving an hour ahead of time to sit together. Also the full reclining seats made the extra money totally worth it, being able to have your legs up while laying back felt like a living room experience with a giant screen.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
34. Yes, they did have those very fancy seats and they were nice.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:58 AM
Jan 2016

It's just that a casual get-together with a friend after work is not compatible with going to the movies anymore, apparently.

dilby

(2,273 posts)
36. Yeah, these are very specific Regal theaters and they are not all that way.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 12:02 PM
Jan 2016

In Oregon I think we only have one in Lake Oswego so it's not like all of them are heading this way. But if it's the closest one to you it can be a bummer.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
19. I saw Star Wars: The Force Awakens yesterday in 3D.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:20 AM
Jan 2016

I went to a 12:20 showing.

Cost me $7.50 for the ticket.

There were 5 people in the theater.

That was an incredible experience in fine entertainment at a very reasonable price.

Iggo

(47,534 posts)
27. That's the only way to fly, as far as I'm concerned.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:42 AM
Jan 2016

Imax on Tuesdays at lunchtime. Nobody there.

Even when I go on the weekends now, I like to go to the earliest show I can get to.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
28. Sunday matinees.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 11:46 AM
Jan 2016

Go when everybody is in church and make sure it's not opening weekend of the show you are seeing. Catching it the last weekend it's open in a Sunday Matinee is the only way I go on weekends.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
37. This theatre had a full bar!!!
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 12:03 PM
Jan 2016

You could order a drink to take into the theatre, or just sit and drink at the bar.

I don't know why anyone would want to do that, though.

But then, there's a bar in our local Safeway as well!!

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
39. Oh whatever.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 12:08 PM
Jan 2016


Sorry to offend, Saint Snooper2.

You can trash the thread so it doesn't pollute your virtuous eyes anymore.
 

TeddyR

(2,493 posts)
44. I LOVE the reserved seating concept
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 01:05 PM
Jan 2016

Only theaters I will go to now. I don't have to stand in line for tickets and don't have to worry about showing up early to get the seat I want.

PasadenaTrudy

(3,998 posts)
46. I don't like reserved seating...
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 01:22 PM
Jan 2016

I like to choose once I walk into a theatre. I rarely go to movies anyways, I like to watch at home on iTunes. If I go out, I like Laemmle Theatres.

Beaverhausen

(24,470 posts)
48. I love those 'choose your seat' theatres
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 01:59 PM
Jan 2016

I love movies, love seeing them in theaters and I'm very picky about where I sit.

I bug my friends to make sure we show up early enough that I can sit where I want.

Luckily I'm near Hollywood where we have tons of great theaters with great screens and good sound.

And OK, I work for a film studio. So I know how many people this industry employs so I have no problem paying the price for tickets.


However I can see why your experience was frustrating. By the way, did you like the film? I have been wanting to see that one.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
49. I guess there's just no "one size fits all" solution.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 02:13 PM
Jan 2016

I guess going to the movies is becoming more of an "occasion" and I will have to adjust to that.
I was just sort of blind-sided by the whole thing yesterday.

Anyway, I made a few comments about "Youth" upthread, but for the sake of one in the biz I'll make a few more.

It's a very slow-moving, dreamy, almost poetic movie. It dips into magical realism / fantasy a few times.

There isn't much of a linear plot, just an exploration of some people's lives as they spend time at a beautiful Swiss resort / spa.

I enjoyed it and I would recommend it for those who want such an experience. It's definitely not for the action/adventure crowd.

Michael Caine and Harvey Keitel are wonderful together. I would definitely go see any movie that pairs the two of them again.

The soundtrack is very haunting and I've caught myself humming bits of it today.

I think as someone in the business you would like it. Especially the bits that are about movie making.
(The Harvey Keitel character is a famous director working on a new script).

Godhumor

(6,437 posts)
50. Reserved recliners are the best thing ever in theaters. Only one I will go to now
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 02:18 PM
Jan 2016

I was annoyed at having to see Star Wars in IMAX due to the recliner theater being sold out, heh.

EdwardBernays

(3,343 posts)
51. Most cinemas in Europe
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 02:22 PM
Jan 2016

Are reserved seating. You buy specific seats in advance.

I'm sure that's not the case everywhere, but I haven't been able to walk into a cinema and choose a seat in years.

I actually MUCH prefer this system btw. No more crappy seats.

thelordofhell

(4,569 posts)
53. Your First World Problem complaints are unbelievable
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 02:55 PM
Jan 2016

Youth is a special showing at only one theater in the area.

There is absolutely NO way you could not know this and just casually go see this movie.

And if you paid any attention to the local media, you should have known about the new "luxury" theater with reserved seats.......They closed the old version of this theater to much publicity and fan fare.

Selecting your seat is fairly new in your area, but has been around in the larger markets (and overseas) for quite a long time.

So your friend has a phone that doesn't go to voicemail when turned off?? Sorry your friend has a phone that sucks.

Oh, and I looked up your movie and showings.......There is no matinee pricing for this movie.......probably because it's a small release special run. Which is what the "luxury" theater you went to is famous for showing......with no matinees.....In the most expensive part of town.

Once you "learned" all of this (the reserved seating is the only thing you could have not known, as all the other things are fairly common knowledge), you could have waited for your friend to show up, tell them the situation, and probably just bought tickets to the next showing (or even that showing, as it most probably would not be sold out) and go frollick in one of the most expensive malls in the country.



Coventina

(27,057 posts)
54. Wow, judgmental much?
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 03:05 PM
Jan 2016

Going to see the movie was my friend's idea.
It was she that told me where and when it was showing, I didn't do any of the research, as if research is required for going to see a movie.



And no, I don't pay attention to the local media. I have much better ways to spend my time.

Not everyone has smart phones or even cell phones, but I guess that's a personality defect in your world?!?!

$14 was the listed price for ALL the movies showing at that theatre during the matinee hours. That's what their sign said. It had nothing to do with that particular movie.

And, I did wait for my friend to show up, because that was the option that was left to me.

And, I hate malls and have not shopped in one for years, I certainly don't spend my time "frolicking" in them, expensive or otherwise.

Geez, what is your problem?

thelordofhell

(4,569 posts)
55. You started this.......By being judgmental in your OP
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 04:27 PM
Jan 2016

Bashing an experience that was different........That's my problem with your OP.

"And no, I don't pay attention to the local media. I have much better ways to spend my time."
----And when you don't pay attention, you get what you deserve.


Sorry if you feel hurt, but I'm not going to treat your OP with kind kid gloves when it's ridiculous.

Coventina

(27,057 posts)
56. I was bashing poor customer service.
Thu Jan 7, 2016, 04:35 PM
Jan 2016

The whole situation could have been resolved if I could have left a ticket for my friend at the box office.

If movie theaters are going to emulate live theatre, symphonies, and operas then they need to step up their service to having "will call" services at their box offices.

And please, local media? Nonstop nonsense about traffic accidents, local ball teams, the latest sensationalized murder?
I'm sorry to hear you are wasting your life on that.

You are the only rude one on this thread. Everyone else who disagreed with me did so politely and we had reasoned discussion about it.
And, a number of posters happened to agree with me, so I reject your "ridiculous" premise.

And, please...I've been on DU way too long for you to come even close to hurting my feelings.

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