Flint, MI HAS NO POTABLE WATER - WHERE IS FEMA?

[people]

Rachel Maddow just asked where is FEMA when people in Flint, Michigan have no potable water. Where is FEMA? The fact that U.S. citizens in Flint, including babies, children and adults are being poisoned by water with lead in it and NO U.S. government agency is delivering water there is truly shocking. This is really beginning to remind of Katrina - poor people without water and the U.S. government doing NOTHING to get water to everyone there. It makes me sick. What kind of a country do we have? Does anyone have any connections to FEMA to get them to deliver water there?

[drray23]

1. snyder has to initiate it

I think, for FEMA to intervene, the governor of the state has to declare an emergency, then explicitly request FEMA to help.

Given the dire situation, maybe the feds should intervene anyway and immediately start sending resources regardless of what this idiot governor is doing.

[TDale313]

9. I believe a State of Emergency has been declared.

Perhaps that's a first step. People need to fucking go to jail over this.

[valerief]

47. Fuck jail. Prison. For many decades. nt

[TDale313]

49. Agree. n/t

[DinahMoeHum]

65. Fuck that. What I want is. . .

. . .unfortunately not suitable for further discussion here.

[Mbrow]

71. Big k&R

I know what you mean, we're are innocent until proven guilty, but people like these assholes along with child and animal abusers make it hard to wait for a verdict.

[enough]

2. No potable water in Flint, MI, no law-enforcement in Burns, OR, no viable public schools

in too many places to name.

There may come a time when we begin to wonder what's happening.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

4. I believe that time may have already arrived. n/t

[7wo7rees]

11. Sadly.....

[Plucketeer]

45. Already here

and entrenched.

[IDemo]

38. begin?

That began for me at the turn of this century.

[appalachiablue]

81. 2000 was the turning point to even more US decline sorry to say.

[TDale313]

3. Sounds like they're mostly relying on private donations

The whole situation is heartbreaking and infuriating and a bit overwhelming. I think FEMA should get involved. This needs to get fixed asap and people need to go to jail.

[Siwsan]

7. It has been private donations

They had collection/donation centers throughout the city and township, where I live. And I see lots of shopping carts, in the township, being loaded up with bottled water because the supplies are so low in the city. (Flint Township water supply was never affected by the switch.)

I'm hoping that Rachel's report, tonight, lights a fire under a whole lot of asses. And I'm going to head out to look for a donation center, tomorrow.

[TDale313]

17. Thank goodness for decent people who are trying to help

In any way they can. I'm going to donate to the local United Way there. I urge everyone to help if they can. That said, private donations alone aren't going to fix this. Safe drinking water, especially for a population this size, is one of those things we really do need government to help assure.

[Katashi_itto]

5. Did the people not Vote for this? After all they voted Rick Snyder in twice.

[Shandris]

10. (Although I'm sure you know this) It is important to remember that while a majority overall...

...probably did, nearly 40% of the populace cast their votes for the Democratic candidate. It is unconscionable to abandon either group, but especially those who voted and lost.

Furthermore, even the group that voted Republican did not receive campaign promises of DEATH. Were they supposed to be able to read his mind?

Collective guilt is a great, great evil.

[Katashi_itto]

12. I understand quite well. But you get what you let into office.

[Shandris]

14. Then you do not understand at all.

You can not know what you let into office.

[Katashi_itto]

16. He was allowed in twice.

[Shandris]

20. Then -I- do not understand at all, for I am a fool! =) I thought he was a first-termer.

I withdraw my complaint and shuffle off with shame. Good evening to you, Katashi.

[Katashi_itto]

21. You too

[passiveporcupine]

53. regardless, you seem to think

those who didn't vote for him deserve this? Fuck that. I didn't vote for Bush. Did I deserve him?

[arikara]

64. That's harsh

did any children have any say in letting him in to office? Or the ones that voted for the other party?
We had Harper wrecking havoc in Canada for 10 years, yet the majority actually voted for other candidates 3 times. You guys had Bush/Cheney. Cons are very good at gaming the system.

[people]

57. I doubt Flint voted for Snyder

Flint has a lot of poor people and people of color. These are not people who generally vote Republican.

[Siwsan]

13. Nobody voted to be poisoned

The decision to switch was made by the Emergency Manager. But even IF the people had voted for this, they didn't vote to receive untreated water!!!! NOBODY VOTED TO SKIP THAT VITAL STEP IN THE PROCESS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And as to voting for Snyder, Flint is a heavily Democratic district and I have zero doubt that most residents did NOT vote for Snyder. We are paying for the idiocy of the rural voters.

[Katashi_itto]

15. Again, its terrible. But you get what is allowed into office.

[Siwsan]

18. And, again, Flint is suffering for other people's stupid votes

Stop blaming the victims.

[Katashi_itto]

19. Meh. Watch them go elect another Republican after this one.

[Siwsan]

23. I get it - you are unreachable and really don't care about us.

Children are being poisoned. Babies are being poisoned. Students are being poisoned. Visitors to our summer festivals have been poisoned. The city of Flint did NOT VOTE TO BE POISONED and it infuriates me to think anyone is blaming them.

We have a Democratic state representative. A Democratic state senator. A Democratic congressman and TWO Democratic Senators. Flint votes for Democrats but we have no control over the rural votes.

[Katashi_itto]

26. Dude I live in New Orleans. We had Jindal for two terms. The state is a smoking ruin.

New Orleans is a single spot of blue in a Red 3rd world hellhole.

People get what they deserve when they vote these sociopaths in.
Does it make it any nicer? No. It is what it is.

The Republicans will continue voting these freaks in. Until the entire country is a cesspool.

[Siwsan]

30. A. I'm not a "dude"

And B. Apparently you won't accept that the people of Flint are in no way responsible for being poisoned.

We do our best to vote in Democrats and were successful in every office that affects us, save for one. Unfortunately it was the big one. I wish it was different but it isn't. It's the hand we were dealt. I can only hope that people will learn from this. I don't hold out a lot of hope because anyone who would vote for a failed businessman to run a state is probably beyond rational thought, anyway.

This is my home town. I love this city and it kills me to see what is happening.

And, BTW, I've never been to New Orleans but would love to visit that city, some day.

[Katashi_itto]

35. Dude can apply to either gender where I come from.

Lay you odds they will vote in yet another Republican after this one.

They will continue to do so because your average conservative has zero empathy -unless it directly affects them.

I would almost say they are a different species.

As for Coming to New Orleans you should. It's another country. Not American at all.

It's the queen of the Caribbean. First parade of the Mardis Gras Season Marched last night.

The Joan Of Arc Krewe.




http://joanofarcparade.org/

[Siwsan]

40. Well, not where I come from

In fact, until today I have never been referred to in that way.

Flint will survive this, although the children will be permanently damaged. And we might also continue to be punished for the moronic voting decisions by others but this might just wake up the complacent voter because there is no political up-side to poisoning children.

The one positive to come out of this is Snyder has effectively killed off any future political aspirations.

[Katashi_itto]

44. I think thats what it's going to take to wake the rest of the country up.

We get someone like Trump, or god in heaven Cruz and we end up with a few million dead because of them. Otherwise voters will continue with Business as usual.

I hope your right about Snyder, but there are always more of his type ready to fill his shoes.

[TDale313]

24. Your callousness is disgusting.

The people who have gotten most fucked over in Michigan are poor minorities in urban areas who have not voted for this shit, mostly vote democratic, and whose ability to self govern was stolen by this emergency manager shit. What's happened in Michigan is a tragedy, and those suffering most are not the ones responsible.

[Katashi_itto]

27. Yep to bad. see #26.

[TDale313]

31. Welcome to ignore.

No one fucking deserves to be poisoned.

[Siwsan]

32. Thank you

It is beyond belief that anyone would blame the people of Flint for this disaster.

[pnwmom]

42. Flint is a largely Democratic city, which formerly had a Democratic mayor,

until that mayor was fired by the Republican Governor and replaced by an Emergency Manager -- as the State Legislature, controlled by the Republicans, gave him the power to do.

But the state of Michigan isn't just Democratic Flint. And the state overall voted in the Rethug governor -- not Flint.

Do you get it yet?

And the Rethugs in the State who voted for Snyder, the Governor? They might not even care what happens to the people of Flint.

[pnwmom]

39. No, they didn't. None of them voted for poisoned water. And the Emergency Manager

or his minions broke the law, which required monitoring the water and treating it if it was corrosive.

It's not fair to blame the voters for not realizing the Governor would appoint people who broke the law.

But NOW they know and they should either impeach him or vote him out as soon as possible.

http://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/internal-email-michigan-blowing-flint-over-lead-water-n491481

Marc Edwards, a professor at Virginia Tech who has been testing Flint water, says treatment could have corrected much of the problem early on — for as little as $100 a day — but officials in the city of 100,000 people didn't take action.

"There is no question that if the city had followed the minimum requirements under federal law that none of this would have happened," said Edwards, who obtained the Muchmore email through a Michigan Freedom of Information Act request.

[notadmblnd]

51. Actually no, the people did not vote for it. In fact, they voted just the opposite

The good people of Michigan voted against allowing the Governor to take over financially struggling cities by declaring local governments dissolved and appointing city managers. It was on the ballot, voted down and the politicians went against the people of Michigan's wishes and passed a bill in Michigan congress after which the Governor signed into law.

If the Governor of Michigan hadn't been given the authority by republicans in Michigan's congress to take over and sell off troubled cities' assets to the governor's friend and cronies, this would have never of happened.

But even IF Michigan residents had voted for something like this, their children did not and do not deserve to be punished for their parents sins by being poisoned.

SMDH, I can't believe you actually said something like that.

[LanternWaste]

59. I'd imagine no one voter voted specifically for a lack of potable water.

I'd imagine no one voter voted specifically for a lack of potable water in the municipality.

[KamaAina]

60. Statewide, maybe. Flint is true Blue.

[TexasProgresive]

6. FEMAs probably in New Orleans getting ready for Mardi Gras.

[Katashi_itto]

8. The First Parade already took place yesterday. The Joan Of Arc Kewe marched.

Havent seen any FEMA down here.

So far the city is just putting up the parade stands for the REALLY large parades.

[TexasProgresive]

34. I was trying to be cute

Since the bottled water and/or ice was sent to Minnesota during Katrina.

[Katashi_itto]

36. Ah! I had forgotten that. :)

[ChairmanAgnostic]

22. FEMA was sent to NOLA by Paul Ryan.

[SCVDem]

25. Where are the tankers?

Why aren't there 18 wheelers backed up on the freeway or train cars carrying water waiting to unload!?

This is a national embarrassment and people must go to jail for human rights violations!

Remember, they were cutting off people who couldn't pay. Then they deliver crap!

[underthematrix]

28. FEMA is already with state officials on how to get portable water

It's called logistics. Remember this is the Black President. He's already got the EPA and FEMA in the loop.

[questionseverything]

67. well then you know about something that rachel doesn't

and apparently the people of flint don't know

since we saw her report last night that said

THERE IS NO WATER AVAILABLE

the fbi should be arresting at least the emergency manager by now (the reporters have done all the work gathering evidence)

and getting a warrant for every piece of communications snyder has ever had

[underthematrix]

68. No I don't believe people in flint do not have any clean water to drink

That doesn't even make any sense if you think about it. They are telling you that story in a way to elicit your outrage and lo and behold u are outraged.

[questionseverything]

69. so you are saying that rachel's report last night was incorrect?

or that chris hayes reporting the same this minute is incorrect?

if you have a link to prove the feds are there distributing clean water, now would be a good time to share it

[underthematrix]

72. Yes. I'm saying Rachel Maddow's report

was designed to elicit your outrage and OMG! how dare they. etc. and it worked. Here's a link to what's happening at the federal and state level. http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/05/health/flint-michigan-water-investigation/index.htmlIt's CNN so I would normally post two sources but this is basically what's going on. Hysteria not necessary. The President is AA. He has to be on top of everything. He has to be 1000 times better than any white president. So yeah I knew it was being handled because I know PBO never gets a pass on anything.

The article suggest that some people are still suspicious of Michigan even though they've been transferred to Detroit water supply for several months.

Hey it's the job of the Maddow show producers to get you to tune in and how they do it is to get you all in your feels. I don't watch cable news even though I may tweet some vids. I know what they're doing and I reject it.

[questionseverything]

73. your link does not work

evidently you have not been paying attention because switching back to Detroit's water did not stop the lead.....the corrosive water that was used earlier has damaged the pipes......the cleanest water on earth flowing thru those pipes would be dangerous especially to children and babies

finally last night (probably because of rachel's report and the outrage) fema sent 2 people to michigan to help.....which would be great if they were driving semi trucks full of water but i am guessing not

btw there is a poisonous gas leak on the west coast that has been going on for months, the feds haven't got a handle on that either

this attitude that a potus can not be questioned because of identity politics is so dangerous it is absurd

[underthematrix]

75. It's not the same article I originally read

but it makes the same point. My question is how do we get white people to stop voting for republicans when it is clear they are trying to kill them and their children? When do white people set aside their hate of otherness and start realizing that Republicans are literally trying to kill the working class and poor? This is not a conspiracy theory. This is a conspiracy reality.

You seem to think the feds can come in and do things they cannot. There are protocols that must be followed. It's called rule of law. Learn the rules before you bash the feds aka POTUS. States have to invite them in. I live in California and Gov Brown has the situation under control. He set some protocols in motion to address all other gas storage facilities. The situation in the Northridge area requires relocation of all residents in Porter Ranch and probably some of the surrounding areas. But that's a complicated LEGAL process, the builders, the engineers and geologists that certified the land for residential use, the company that uses the land for gas storage, the homeowners, the renters, the businesses, the public services, such as schools, social services, senior services.

The POTUS is not your daddy. I think that's the confusion. He runs a HUGE executive branch. States have govs and govs have executive branches that administer state functions. The President does not run states. Yes this POTUS understands that most Americans are so stupid they think he can personally come into a state and tell the state what to do. That's not how it works. States usually have to REQUEST federal support. That's why Gov Brown declared a state of emergency which means the feds can come in. I wish you had that same outrage over the loss of voting rights for people of color which again POTUS cannot personally do anything about. He has to use legal challenges through the DOJ to address the problem.

[questionseverything]

76. so basically you have gone from "potus got this"

to "potus hands are tied"

the feds do not have to wait to be invited in if the gov in question is doing something illegal...and surely we can agree that allowing an entire city to be poisoned is illegal?

the emergency manager that ok'd using the bad water (even tho he had been warned of the danger) should be arrested by now and the feds should be looking thru every communication from snyder's office to see how deeply he is connected

[underthematrix]

77. Oh geez

yes POTUS has got this within the confimes of the law see FEMA response http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/01/09/federal-disaster-agency-monitoring-flint-water-crisis/78553680/
Here's the DOJ response through US Attporney http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/01/05/us-attorneys-office-investigating-lead-flint-water/78303960/
http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/01/05/us-attorneys-office-investigating-lead-flint-water/78303960/

Yes we can agree a state gov poisoning a city is a crime but I prefer the Obama's administration's approach - always operate within the law and push hard so ALL the FACTS are put on the table. I think if they build a really strong case, the Republican Gov and his team could do time.

The situation is so horrible that it has invaded the entire infrastructure of the water system and other infrastructures (health systems - http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2015/12/us_rep_dan_kildee_calls_for_st.html education system, social services system) in the county and maybe even further. The cost will be tremendous and will require federal funding to address. http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/michigan/2016/01/05/flint-water-probe/78307142/
It is is very complicated.

[questionseverything]

79. things have changed since you and i started this sub thread

unfortunately the people of flint,today, sunday the 10th,still do NOT have access to clean water

before we continue to discuss, we need to either agree on that point or you need to provide proof i am mistaken

[Warpy]

29. Waiting for Snyder to pull his thumbs out of his ass and declare an emergency

which it is. However, he doesn't want to lose face, it might damage his future prospects with the Koch organization, FEMA is one of those touchy-feely help the poor agencies that the brothers Koch think smacks of socialism.

[madokie]

33. but rich people have been cleaning up

with tax breaks and loosening of regulations.

Thats the kind of nation we have. Pretty much in your face about all this too. I'm sick and tired of the way things are and will be voting in the Primary to put a stop to it.

[Cal Carpenter]

37. FEMA in Flint is Fucking Emergency Manager Assholes. n/t

[ecstatic]

41. That report was heartbreaking. I'm really upset and disturbed

by what Rachel revealed tonight. Where is the national media? How can they laugh and talk about Trump while this is going on?! I feel sick over this. "Governor" Snyder needs to be arrested tonight, along with any complicit staff members.

[Baitball Blogger]

43. Gee, never saw it that way until now. But Republican leadership eventually does

result in emergencies that require Federal intervention.

[annabanana]

80. Who would've guessed..

No one could have foreseen...

Completely unexpected. . .

[Spitfire of ATJ]

46. Republicans keep forgetting that the government is responsible for the people....

They think it's all about power and loyalty.

[Rex]

48. America and our corporate wastelands.

I hear tell that town has been falling apart for years and years. Maybe it finally reached the nonviable stage.

[question everything]

50. Michael Moore says that the governor should be charged (nt)

[chapdrum]

52. A question I think of every day.

"What kind of a country do we have?"

However, the answer is becoming clearer rather quickly.

To generalize, my first thought is: We are on our own.

[steve2470]

54. FEMA sends 28,000 liters of bottled water to Flint amid lead troubles

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2015/12/fema_sends_thousands_of_cases.html

That was in December.

Also, this:

By declaring a state of emergency Flint can now access state resources, such as Michigan State Police's homeland security division. More noteworthy the move qualifies the city for federal aid from the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), who can now do a damage assessment.

"The state of Michigan will use its resources to the fullest possible extent during this emergency,” a statement by the Michigan Emergency Management, Homeland Security Division said. “If state and local resources are unable to cope with the emergency, the Governor may request federal assistance.”

While the declaration means more resources — and hopefully a quicker recovery for the devastated city — the news of a formal federal investigation into the whole affair is just as welcomed.

On Monday Rachel Maddow covered the Flint Crisis, once again, and pointed out a very frustrating obstacle for anyone trying to get to the bottom of what happened in Flint: the governor is exempt from Freedom of Information Act requests in Michigan. This means that while journalists, activists, lawyers and citizens can sort of hash together (by sending in FOIA requests to people around the Flint fiasco such as the MDEQ) what happened the actual role of Gov. Snyder is somewhat obscured*. Michigan is just one of two states (Massachusetts is the other) where the governor is exempt from FOIA law. The federal probe will alter the status quo, as it will allow documents and emails from the governor to be subpoenaed.

http://www.metrotimes.com/Blogs/archives/2016/01/06/feds-to-investigate-flint-snyder-declares-a-state-of-emergency

[WhiteTara]

61. that's water for a day

with 42,000 residents drinking less than a liter per day.

[Liberty Belle]

55. Does the Gov. who won't declare an emergency have financial ties to bottled water companies?

Worth someone checking into.....

We saw similar things happening here in CA; I know of a community in San Diego's mountains that ran out of water, all the wells ran dry in the drought. The government wouldn't do anything. People had to pay to truck in water all summer long. That's so wrong.

[LibraLiz1973]

56. I'm asking the same question.

How is this even happening with so much coverage and there is NOTHING being done?!?!?!??!

[Herman4747]

58. CAN THE GOVERNOR BE RECALLED?

If so, when is the earliest this can happen?

[Kaleva]

66. Many in Michigan don't care much about Flint

[IDemo]

62. There was a suggestion last summer regarding the California drought

That water could be brought in by railroad tanker car for a minimal cost. That may be something worth considering.

[zentrum]

63. It might be another New Orleans.

Harry Shearer says he and many residents believe that there was a top down plan to rid the city of its poor Black families after Katrina hit. Many of the relocations (to Texas) have never returned and the demographics of the place have hugely changed—less minority poor. Gentrification by hurricane.

Flint is predominately Black and 40% of the population is poor. Gentrification by lead?

[jwirr]

70. Doesn't the governor have to ask for them to come in by

declaring a state of emergency?

[Tanuki]

74. Yes, Rachel mentioned this in her report, and there is more about the process in this Detroit Free

Press article:
http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/01/09/federal-disaster-agency-monitoring-flint-water-crisis/78553680/

[Tarheel_Dem]

78. Since Michigan's own governor just declared a state of emergency 2 days ago, what was FEMA......

supposed to do? There are official channels for federal intervention. You've got a Governor who has made it his personal mission to reduce the role of the federal government, and in the case of Detroit, has replaced the power of locally elected officials with that of "emergency managers" hired by him, and who report directly to him.

AFAIK, this is still a representative democracy. So no, this is not "Obama's Katrina" as the GOP & many of you have hoped for. This is a colossal fuck up by the state of Michigan, and the Governor they voted for.

[HereSince1628]

82. Yes, TURNING SOME VALVES TAKES DAYS/WEEKS because... POLITICS

These people think prolonging the poisonings makes them look like adults?

Somehow, it seems like TURNING ON THE SAFE WATER is not such a difficult solution. Doing that FIRST, and then sorting out the issues about paying for the safe water just seems more like an adult way to deal with the crisis.

But, I know that it's not ADULTS that are making the decisions. IT is CAPITALISTS that are making the decisions, and THAT makes ALL the difference.