Someone in the State Department actually mentioned the Geneva Convention

[malaise]

in relation to a photo of the sailors.

Abu Ghraib, Gitmo, torture, parading Sadam's dead sons, what was done to Gadaffi's corpse, drones, and you raise theGeneva COnvention over handcuffs for violating Iran's waters - listen folks the Geneva Convention applies to all states. Someone has to rein in this madness.
The United States is not the only sovereign state on this planet - stop violating other people's rights and space.

[delrem]

1. The USA is exceptional. Didn't you know?

And it's Wednesday. The USA supports the Geneva Convention on Wednesdays, except in their black sites.

[merrily]

2. Chelsea Manning

The Eighth Amendment (Amendment VIII) to the United States Constitution is the part of the United States Bill of Rights (ratified December 15, 1791[1]) prohibiting the federal government from imposing excessive bail, excessive fines, or cruel and unusual punishment. The U.S. Supreme Court has ruled that this amendment's Cruel and Unusual Punishment Clause also applies to the states. The phrases in this amendment originated in the English Bill of Rights of 1689.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eighth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

The Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment (commonly known as the United Nations Convention against Torture) is an international human rights treaty, under the review of the United Nations, that aims to prevent torture and other acts of cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment or punishment around the world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Convention_against_Torture

Then, there are black holes, extraordinary rendition and drone killings.

[malaise]

3. Excellent post

This madness has to stop

[merrily]

4. Thank you. I don't see it stopping any time soon. It's bipartisan!

[malaise]

5. Sadly I think you are correct

It could get worse but I hope not

[Blus4u]

6. Carpet bombing tends to be the 3rd & 4th words out of the GOP candidates' mouths -

need to keep those bastards out of the Oval Office.

Always good posts, malaise...don't ever stop.

Peace

[malaise]

7. Yep I heard Cruz and the other clowns

Rand Paul seems sane on this topic

[Stardust]

8. Rachel Maddow was upset about the humiliating treatment of the sailors.

She acknowledged that since we aren't at war that the Geneva Convention didn't technically apply, but it was still shameful.

But then she segued into wondering what really caused the boats to go off course. I didn't quite buy the "mechanical problems! So distracted!" story either.

I don't know what to make of Rachel sometimes...

[malaise]

9. Rachel is always pro empire

She grew up in a military family - not once did she raise the fact that the soldiers were piked up in Iranian waters.

Rachel is a barrel of contradictions - not unlike many of us.

[karynnj]

19. I was mystified by that whole segment

Assuming the Iranians approached the boat to take it into custody - wouldn't you assume they would have the sailors put their hands in the position they were in -- the boats after all had guns. As to the later photos of them being given food -- my interpretation before hearing Rachel or the Republicans was -- they are all in one room. Not bound in any way. Sitting on an oriental carpet. They had bottles of water, fresh food and a Persian stew of some kind.

They looked bored - not terrified. The later film of the handsome young lt saying that they made a mistake and went into Iranian waters, they were sorry - is really not like the statements forced out of Americans in Vietnam. He did not look like someone in distress. (This is not exactly the treatment given at ABu Ghraib!)

The NYT article gives a hint of what caused this international incident.

It sounds like the young swiftboat sailors might have not been carefully going from point A to point B.

I can't cut and paste - because the NYT somehow makes that impossible. But after saying that the course they were suppose to take would course mapped in advance to avoid Iranian water, a "Navy officer" said - "Look, these are kids riding around in cool cammy (camouflaged) boats." It then speaks of senior Pentagon people expressing dismay - as details come in. They said that it seems that the guys and the gal were not good mariners. It also said they went in pairs.

Reading between the lines - it sounds like they might have been racing around on a beautiful Mediterranean day and they were not paying attention that they entered Iranian water. (From the maps shown, there is territorial water around the small island owned by Iran that their Navy used.) Regardless, they are very very lucky that Kerry had that relationship with Zarif!

Now, obviously JK's time on the swiftboats were different as there was some real probability that he could be killed or seriously maimed any mission he went out on -- and he was not your average person. However, remembering the films he made of the swiftboats going through water when they were NOT in the dangerous channels - I would bet that the MA sailor in him might have when not in danger enjoyed the speed of the boat himself!

link - http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/14/world/middleeast/iran-navy-crew-release.html?_r=0

[90-percent]

10. fox news military faux expert i saw briefly flipping channels

I was flipping channels and caught some self righteous uniformed guy on Fox very indignant about the horrible savage Iranians committing such atrocious violations of the sacred Geneva Conventions. TALK ABOUT HYPOCRITICAL!

I think it is a certainty that some bad actor tin pot dictator will call us out on our selective use of the Geneva Convention. Our Abu Ghraib and water boarding and droning and wanton "collateral damage" during the GWB conduct of the Iraq invasion did not score high on the Geneva Good Guy points system.

Didn't this General even think of how hypocritical his statements were? This guy was still in "catapult the propaganda" mode!

I am still utterly infuriated that Cheneybush implemented TORTURE as official United States policy. Undermines everything we good Americans are supposed to stand for. And broke our 200 year string of at least not being so blatent or official about it.

-90% Jimmy

[CBGLuthier]

11. Every time someone talks about how horrible Iran is I think of this

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655

Iran Air Flight 655 is an Iran Air civilian passenger flight from Tehran to Dubai. On 3 July 1988, the aircraft operating on this route was shot down by the United States Navy guided missile cruiser USS Vincennes under the command of William C. Rogers III. The incident took place in Iranian airspace, over Iran's territorial waters in the Persian Gulf, and on the flight's usual flight path. The aircraft, an Airbus A300 B2-203, was destroyed by SM-2MR surface-to-air missiles fired from Vincennes. All 290 on board died.[1] The cruiser Vincennes had entered Iranian territorial waters after one of its helicopters drew warning fire from Iranian speedboats operating within Iranian territorial limits.


The US murdered 290 people in an instant and Iranians are the bad guys? We didn't even fucking apologize.

[malaise]

13. Yep and they pretend it didn't happen

Cubana as well - I won't forget either

[Solly Mack]

12. With a straight face?

[malaise]

14. LOL

Ha

[Solly Mack]

18. The hypocrisy is staggering.

[Vinca]

15. Did Iran even sign on to the Geneva Conventions?

I'm finding it amusing that people on the right apparently have never considered what we would do if a couple of Iranian ships cruised into Casco Bay in Maine.

[malaise]

17. People on the right and Neo-Con Dems

actually believe that America owns the world and its citizens can do what they want where they want with impunity while violating every law, treaty and convention that applies to most of us.

To the right and neo-cons, a terrorist is anyone who disagrees with the American view.

[pampango]

16. DU'ers can mention the Geneva Convention. Our State Department should not.

If all countries followed the Convention, the world would be a better place.