Restaurant in Rome bans children under the age of five due to multiple 'unpleasant incidents'

[Miles Archer]

http://www.thedailymeal.com/news/travel/restaurant-bans-small-children-being-uncontrollable-little-terrors/012716

La Fraschetta del Pece, an upscale seafood restaurant near Rome’s historic district has posted an angry notice on its window banning children under the age of five.

"Due to some unpleasant incidents caused by a lack of manners, children under 5 are not allowed in this restaurant,” the note reads, calling them “uncontrollable little terrors.”

“They run slalom among the tables,” the owner Marco Magliozzi told the Italian newspaper La Repubblica. “They throw olive oil on the floor, they upturn the water, they send the salt shaker flying across the room, they try to dismantle the furniture, they shout, they cry and above all, they hate fish.”

The tone of the policy has particularly provoked customers with toddlers who were forced to find other eating establishments.

[BeyondGeography]

1. In fairness

Living with toddlers can be like hanging out with a drunk person.

[Miles Archer]

4. Had house guests for six weeks. They had a 3 year old daughter.

"Free range toddler." She does whatever she wants, screams for attention, stomps all over the house like an infantry of one, gets into everything (including the knife drawer in the kitchen), harasses the cats, you name it.

When it comes to parenting, they are both really good at sitting in front of the tV drinking beer.

It was the longest 6 weeks of my life.

[BeyondGeography]

6. Lol...that wasn't my style

Glad I waited until I was a little older to have kids. Much patience and strength in those early years required.

[SheilaT]

30. You probably should have set some house rules,

and if the little girl was that difficult, politely told them that they needed to find other accommodations.

You are especially entitled to set limits on knives and harassing the cats. The other thing you might have done would to have disconnected the TV.

Please do not take any of this as direct criticism. It can be very difficult to tell someone their kid is annoying, but if you never had little ones of your own, even typical behavior can be very hard to tolerate. And someone staying with you needs to follow your house rules.

[Miles Archer]

32. House Rules = She Who Owns The House Makes The Rules

My girlfriend's home, my girlfriend's son.

I was vocal about it all, and I was outvoted. Kid got a free pass on everything. They're moving out on Sunday. Life is good.

[SheilaT]

36. Aaah. That does make a difference.

But why your girlfriend was willing to tolerate that behavior is beyond me. Although perhaps she raised her son the same way.

[justamama83]

33. That's not free range

that is lazy parenting.

[Major Nikon]

41. My border collie is really good at herding my 2 yr old nephew

We just tell her to go get him and she does so without frightening him. Fortunately my in-laws are good parents and don't let him run amok, but it is big fun to watch the dog round him up.

[ScreamingMeemie]

54. This was my favorite part of owning a Sheltie...

She never let them get too far afield.

[tazkcmo]

2. Sounds like normal behavior to me.

I'd ban their parents as they obviously have no control over their children's behavior. My kids had to sit on their hands if I saw them beginning to get antsy or fidgety.

Added on edit: Until my children were old enough to sit still for any period of time, they didn't get to go out with Mom and Dad. How can you enjoy a meal out when your kids are being whirling dervishes in a public place? Screw that. Get a baby sitter and go enjoy a nice meal.

[gollygee]

3. My kids both liked fish as toddlers

That "and above all, they hate fish" part made me laugh. LOL!

Some kids aren't very well supervised in restaurants. I've seen it too. It's frustrating when I work so hard to make my kids behave in a restaurant and I see other kids running around the tables.

I don't like it when people complain about kids simply making kid noises - noises that are no louder than the noises adults make at restaurants. And I'm an adult who sometimes accidentally knocks over the water. That complaint seems unfair to me. Anything you'd allow in an adult, you should allow in a kid IMO. But I have very frequently seen parents who don't take their kids out of earshot when they're unreasonably loud, and who let their little kids run around in restaurants and play with salt shakers (yuck - unsanitary!) and that isn't OK.

[dumbcat]

5. Good

I wish many more restaurants would do this. But I would put the age cutoff at 12.

[GummyBearz]

44. If I could

qualify for the gigantic loan it would take to start an airline, I would start one that only allowed people 12 and older to fly. I think I would be the richest person alive after 5 years.

[hifiguy]

45. I remember the days when people could still smoke on airplanes.

I thought that the smokers and the screaming kids should all have been isolated together behind a nice thick soundproof and stink-proof Lexan divider. It would have been fun to see which group killed off the other first.

And small children have no place whatsoever in an upscale restaurant. If you have enough money to eat in one you have enough money to shell out for a babysitter.

[oberliner]

7. Love it

There are plenty of family friendly restaurants. No reason why we can't have more family unfriendly restaurants for people without children to enjoy their meals in peace.

[dembotoz]

8. of my 3 kids 1 would be fine in the upscale eatery....the other 2?????? not so much

our restaurant choices were modified accordingly


the restaurant has a point and it is their decision

[lynne]

9. Good for them!

Wish more restaurants would do the same thing.

I only take exception with them blaming the toddlers when - in reality - it's a lack of parenting that's causing the problem.

[Nye Bevan]

10. I'm absolutely fine with this.

If a restaurant wants a more adult kind of environment I think they have every right to set a lower age limit. When my kids were that age, if a restaurant did not have high chairs or a kids' menu I would get the hint and not take them there, but obviously plenty of people do not follow that approach.

[Iggo]

11. Like this is some kind of new problem.

[linuxman]

12. Good.

I'm not going to restaurants just for food. I'm going for a carefree meal and to enjoy myself. If you bring your little shitheads with you, you've fucked it up for me and everyone else. Same goes for movies. Hire a sitter.

[smirkymonkey]

23. I agree. There is a reason I didn't have kids and I don't want to be

around them when I go out to enjoy myself. Parents are so clueless these days. They think that everything little Bratley does is just so adorable and see no need for any kind of discipline.

[linuxman]

24. Don't get me wrong, we want kids. Like 4 of them.

We just don't plan on taking them anywhere except kiddie screenings and McDonald's until they can be expected to be respectful in other environments. I'm all about kids, but I can appreciate the need to not ruin other people's good time because I cheaper out on a sitter.

[we can do it]

46. I agree, more should follow.

I am also sick of people plunking their brats down at a bar.

[awoke_in_2003]

57. I agree with most of what you said

I just disagree with who you called shitheads. It isn't a case of shithead kids, it is shithead parents.

[Act_of_Reparation]

13. Excellent news.

Now if we could get airlines and movie theaters to do the same, everything would be fan-fucking-tastic.

My only contention is that there are plenty of children over the age of five that suck, too. They should consider raising the limit to 18.

[NaturalHigh]

27. There is a theater near us with a gallery reserved for 18+.

It also has a "crying room" where parents can take their crying children and still be able to watch the movie.

[Act_of_Reparation]

37. There's one of those near me.

No crying room, unfortunately, but there are 18+ showings... And waitresses that will bring you booze and food throughout the showing.

[LiberalElite]

38. and also some department stores -

there are a couple in NYC that I avoid because people let their kids run around like they're in a playground with clothes racks. It is a very unpleasant experience, especially if you don't have kids and thus aren't used to being around them. Those parents are thoughtless jerks.

[TwilightGardener]

14. I have to laugh at the most serious sin: HATING FISH.

[LiberalElite]

39. When I was a kid i liked fish -

but I didn't like peanut butter or watermelon.

[TwilightGardener]

50. You have to admit that's unusual.

Unless you're talking Gorton's fish sticks or Long John Silver, which I loved as a kid.

[LiberalElite]

51. Oh yeah. I know it was unusual. I recall returning from a stay

at the New Jersey Shore proudly holding a balloon stating "I cleaned my plate at..." (wherever it was). It was a seafood restaurant. I also liked fish sticks, which was a good thing considering I was raised Catholic and every Friday was fish day untill some time in the '60s.

As far as the peanut butter and watermelon - I didn't like the way peanut butter stuck to my teeth, and this was before seedless watermelon. I didn't like dealing with the seeds.

P.S. It gets a little weirder though - I also liked calf's liver.

[awoke_in_2003]

59. "I also liked calf's liver"

I take back what I said. I love liver.

[ProfessorGAC]

63. Sane Here

I was the weird kid who would actually order it when i went out to eat with my mom and dad. Probably all the way back to when i was 6 or 7. I got some shocked looks from waitresses. Even had them say "You sure?" and my parents would say "He likes it." Thing is, my mom couldn't stand it, so she never made it at home. For me, it was a treat.

[awoke_in_2003]

58. I knew

there was something wrong about you Just kidding

[Orrex]

15. Apparently the toddlers kept uncovering all the nekkid statues.

It fills my heart with joy to see people fulminating over other people's children.

[Iggo]

16. I don't hate children, but...

[woodsprite]

17. That's one restaurant that I wouldn't have a problem not visiting.

We have received praise from servers for how polite and well-mannered our kids are. The first time a server praised my kids manners and thanked my husband and I for teaching them how to behave, I was floored! Then it happened several more times and in multiple places over the years.

We've always taken them with us. If they caused a fuss when they were little, we took them out until they calmed down. If we could go back in, we would. There were times, where one of us ended up with "meals to go", but that was probably only 2-3 times. We brought distractions, played quiet games. We didn't let them 'cry it out' in the restaurant (or any other place - like church) or act grumpy and uncivil, neither did we let them run around or stand on the seat and peer over the divider to other patrons.

I know some kids aren't taught manners at home or don't have anyone to help them learn. Truthfully though, how will kids learn how to act when they're out in a restaurant or at a fancy function if they aren't introduced to the situation?

Oh, and our kids only had issues if their chicken or fish had breading on it. You know most kids menus are chicken fingers, fish sticks, ...etc. They wanted me to pull it off. I used to complain about it and tried to get them to eat it with the coating, but then figured I shouldn't push since what they really wanted turned out to be healthier. We just started looking for restaurants with a better kids menu selection.

[Retrograde]

25. but for every well-behaved child (and I have met some)

there's an undisciplined brat.

I've known parents who started taking their kids to informal restaurants at an early age, gradually moving on to fancier places as the kids learned to behave in public. They would bring them to otherwise adult gatherings and made sure to have appropriate books, coloring books and toys to amuse them if necessary. No problems there (although one once complained that the parties were boring when he was the only seven-year old present). Other parents let their kids run wild , assuming that the other adults would keep them out of trouble. Which lead to problems when they were brought to households of childless people: opening drawers and doors, sticking anything they found into their mouths, trying to pull heavy bookcases down on top of themselves - those were the type that eventually led to some adult gatherings specifically banning children.

[woodsprite]

29. OMG, I babysat two kids like that on 2 occasions - both parents were child psychologists.

I said "Never again!" no matter how much they begged me. I don't see how one person actually could keep an eye on them. They had special locks on the front door so the one girl (5yo) wouldn't run out into the woods on a whim, they climbed the bookcases, tried to get out on the balcony, the brother (3yo) got soaked in an aquarium, and they locked themselves in the bathroom. The bedtime routine was to let the little girl rip a piece of plastic off of an old bread bag. She slept with that on her thumb, and they locked her bedroom door at night.

Even being young, with no kids of my own, I saw so many things that scared me about these 2 kids. I did not want responsibility for them.

I saw them once in a Burger King (a year or so later) and yes, they were given freedom to totally run wild. I doubt the kids ate anything for their dinner except for a few bites when they looped near their table. The parents sat at the table talking in deep conversation and paying no attention to the kids.

[LiberalElite]

40. That's so ironic that they were child psychologists -

wonder how often they were sued for malpractice.

[1939]

42. That is what I did (they are in their 50s now)

I would take them to Shoney's after church/Sunday school. If they behaved, they got to go again the next Sunday (they liked Shoney's). After they were civilized enough for Shoney's, we worked them up the restaurant food chain. After they saw that privileges had to be earned, I took them to some real high end restaurants (which really impressed them).

[KamaAina]

18. Italian kids sound like fun!

[Hortensis]

20. Love it. I could take a fair number of

flying olives as long the noise was happy.

[Hortensis]

19. Whoa! I might laugh in amazement, but I wouldn't eat there.

It's one thing to sympathize with a no-small-child rule (I do) and another to accept such unnecessary insult to our own grandchildren -- definitely not. We've got your backs, little ones.

[bigwillq]

21. It's their restaurant.

I feel like they can, and should, do what they want

[Atman]

22. Bam the idiot parents.

When our boys were toddlers we took them into some of the finest restaurants in Boston and NYC. We supplied them with coloring books and taught them that this was a "quiet time." They were always well behaved, even when the parents were getting annoyed at slow service or inattentive servers. We frequently had people come up to us and compliment us on our well behaved beautiful little boys (who many people thought were twins, despite them being two years apart).

It's not the kids' fault. It's the parents' fault for kowtowing to little spoiled brats which they created.

[NaturalHigh]

26. That's reasonable.

Why do some couples think that their children need to go everywhere with them anyway? An "upscale seafood restaurant" probably isn't the best place for little kids, and customers paying premium prices don't want to be disturbed by the little angels.

[Jim Beard]

28. I used to really hate screaming kinds in a restaurant until I became a grandparent

and now I am more understanding of each situation. If one is really having a bad day, it is taken outside and there is a relay of adults that watch the child and them finish eating their meal. We are very conscious of the children's behavior.

One of the worst things is the children's restaurants where they play more than eat. They promote bad eating behavior.

Each child is different and quite frankly, a crying child is preferable to a drunken adult.

[awoke_in_2003]

60. I agree

While the restaurant in question has the right to do what they do, i would rather hear loud kids than loud adults.

[Egnever]

31. As someone with kids I have no problem with this.

If it was a deny's I might but upscale restaurants are not made for kids. They are meant to be a dining experience and misbehaving kids can ruin that experience for people that are paying significant money to be there.

[justamama83]

34. I have teenagers ages 17 and 14

anything that I perceive to be "upscale" is avoided like the plague. People work hard and deserve to eat in peace - especially if they are paying out the wazoobie for the pleasure. My children have always been well behaved but I'd still not take the chance of teenage 'tude ruining someone else's dining experience.

[we can do it]

47. Thank you.

[MineralMan]

35. Bobby! Sit down and eat your octopus!

We paid good money for that and you're going to eat it, or I'll know the reason why!

Seriously, though, taking small children to a fine dining restaurant is a mistake. It's not a venue where they will be comfortable, in most cases. That means they'll be bored, frustrated and uncomfortable. That never leads to good things. I don't understand that practice at all.

Still, my chief complaint is about children in public places who use their "alarm scream" to get attention. You know, that high-pitched, high-volume shriek. It's a natural thing for small children to do when they're in pain or danger. When they do it other times, a correction is needed to prevent a constant "wolf-calling" situation.

I hear it at least once every time I go to the supermarket. When I look for the source as all humans are supposed to do when an alarm scream is sounded, it's coming from a child sitting unharmed in the kiddie seat in the shopping cart. There's nothing wrong, and nothing to be alarmed about. The child's parent always seems not to have heard the alarm, somehow.

I don't get it.

[1939]

43. In supermarkets

When a kid starts crying over delayed gratification, I call out "hit em again, hit em again" which seems to bother some mothers (well, womb providers more than mothers).

[Des Moines De Mon]

48. I agree with the restaurant

But it's not that they're uncontrollable so much as uncontrolled. If me, my brother or my sister acted up in a public place, our asses would be 17 shades of red a half an hour after we got home.

[HERVEPA]

52. Yeh, beating kids always has good results.

[Des Moines De Mon]

56. Spanked, not Beaten

Mom and Dad never beat us even once! If you suffered a violent upbringing, then I am truly, honestly sorry, my friend, and wish you the best going forward.

[HERVEPA]

62. Thank you. No, I had a fine upbringing no beating/spanking.

Spanking accomplishes nothing. Violence begets violence. Raised two kids without spanking who have turned out fine, and neither would think of hitting their child in any way.

[KentuckyWoman]

65. That may be the statistics but it's not always individually true.

My dad only got physical with me once and that was not even a spanking... just an attention getter. Thank goodness I never had kids because my insides go straight to wanting to hit something when under stress. ( I don't but the urge is there)

My brother, who liked to push and push and push, deliberately seeing how mad he could get people, had his attention got quite a lot. As an adult you'd be hard pressed to find a violent bone in him.

So like I said.... it's not always cut and dry.

[Scurrilous]

49. @#$% upscale..

...much better.

[tandot]

53. We have a 6 1/2 year old and I totally agree with that restaurant's owner

We frequently went out to restaurants once he was a couple of month old ... the rule was ... if he got uncomfortable and started to fuss or cry, one of us took him outside while the other paid for the food and we took it home.

A few years back he had a meltdown in a nice restaurant. I grabbed him and carried him out while he was screaming. People stared at me, most of them had the look of "Thank God she is taking charge of it" ... He calmed down after a while and we went back inside and finished our meal in peace. I will not tolerate him throwing a tantrum in a restaurant. People are there to enjoy a meal and it is usually not cheap.

If you can't control your kid's behavior, just take her/him outside.

[ScreamingMeemie]

55. As I age, I find the most disruptive folks are those who are old enough to know better.

Just saying.

[Behind the Aegis]

61. True, but unfortunately, they usually have kids in tow.

;P

In all seriousness, most restaurants have little to no problem throwing out disruptive adults, at least this has been my experience. However, when it comes to children, all we see is lots of foot staring and "uh, well, I don't wanna get into a parenting issue."

[PassingFair]

64. The girls and I met up with a friend of mine last weekend...

And we were laughing SO HARD that the table of elderly ladies next to us MOVED seats.

I was laughing so hard I didn't even notice. Nearly choked, and had a headache for the rest of the day.

Disruptive?

Who cares!

[nadine_mn]

66. The key here too is fine dining vs family restaurant

For some folks going out for a nice fancy meal is something they have saved up for and would like to be able to enjoy it. Esp parents who saved up and got a sitter, only to find themselves having salt shakers thrown at them.

When my husband and I (we are kid free) go out to eat a family restaurant, we know there will be kids there, it will be noisy with families etc...and if we don't want that environment, we don't go. Same thing with restaurants like Applebee's that have noisy happy hours...we know what to expect and plan accordingly. But if there is an expensive upscale dining restaurant, we also expect it not to have adults who are not supervising their kids or obnoxious adults who don't know how to be respectful and quit shouting into their phone.

There is such a sense of entitlement that makes me want to barf. The "well my kids are special so the they can go everywhere with me", even adult functions like cocktail parties where parents are asked to leave kids at home. As a pet owner, we enjoy taking our dogs places and enjoy places that allow pets...pet stores, some pet friendly cafes. But no matter how well behaved our dogs are (the ones we have now are not public appropriate) we don't get butt hurt if we can't bring them everywhere. Same thing with places ...like courtrooms, movie theaters, that ask you to turn off or put your phone on vibrate. Always some asshole (not the one who accidentally forgets) who is expecting a "very important" phone call and has to have the ringer on, and must answer loudly before (maybe) leaving the room to take the call outside.

Kids are acting age appropriately...it's the parents/guardians who really need the notice. But of course, they would all say..."well obviously that doesn't apply to me" so all kids get banned.