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Recursion

(56,582 posts)
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 11:31 AM Mar 2016

The National Review doubles down on blaming poor whites

This is kind of fascinating, in a train wreck sort of way

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/433060/white-working-class-debate-facts-can-be-nasty

Last week I wrote a lengthy Corner post in support of Kevin Williamson’s excellent (and strongly-worded) attack (paywalled -- Recursion) on the notion that white working-class voters constitute just another American victim class. In the absence of war, plague, or natural disaster, white citizens — indeed, all citizens — have real agency. They have the power to help themselves. Writing to echo Kevin’s point, I cited my own long experience in reaching out to struggling poor and working-class families:
Yet millions of Americans aren’t doing their best. Indeed, they’re barely trying. As I’ve related before, my church in Kentucky made a determined attempt to reach kids and families that were falling between the cracks, and it was consistently astounding how little effort most parents and their teen children made to improve their lives. If they couldn’t find a job in a few days — or perhaps even as little as a few hours — they’d stop looking. If they got angry at teachers or coaches, they’d drop out of school. If they fought with their wife, they had sex with a neighbor. And always — always — there was a sense of entitlement.


In response, I’ve received quite a bit of blowback but very little actual argument. I’m “nasty” and self-hating, I’m trafficking in “social Darwinism,” and at least one writer feels my words are so self-evidently awful that merely quoting me is an illustration of the “extraordinary sewer that is the American right today.” But lost in all the name-calling is any actual refutation. There is an enormous problem with self-destructive behavior in the white working-class — indeed, in poor and working-class families of all races. There is an enormous problem with entitlement. Talk to public school teachers. Talk to social workers. Talk to medical professionals in poor and working-class communities. Yes, they can point you to salt-of-the-earth families striving to make the best of terrible misfortunes, but they can also point you to many, many families where the parents engage in appalling behavior, the kids learn from mom and dad, and yet they’re befuddled and angry that they can’t get ahead.

It’s fascinating the extent to which some of my conservative critics have adopted leftist arguments. I could type all day about the failings of the establishment or the elite (indeed, I’ve written far more about the moral and intellectual bankruptcy of America’s cultural elite than any other social class), and my cheering section is vast. To use the Left’s language, that’s “punching up,” and that’s cool and fine. But when I talk about undeniable, rampant problems in America’s working-class, then I’m a meanie. That’s “punching down.”

This is classist nonsense. It’s the “soft bigotry of low expectations.” We’re all responsible for our actions, and our income is irrelevant to our moral obligations. We could have the greatest elite in the world, but if America’s poorer citizens can’t stay faithful to their spouses, are indifferent to their academic and work performances, and abuse alcohol and drugs, then their lives will be a struggle — even if we created the big-government, protectionist utopia that the socialist Left and Trump Right seem to crave.
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The National Review doubles down on blaming poor whites (Original Post) Recursion Mar 2016 OP
Pretty strange effort to conflate the "socialist Left and Trump Right." raging moderate Mar 2016 #1
Oh, I hope it's clear I'm not endorsing French's POV Recursion Mar 2016 #2
Oh, no, Recursion, I can see that your post does not endorse French's POV. raging moderate Mar 2016 #3
"are indifferent to their academic and work performances, and abuse alcohol and drugs"? KamaAina Mar 2016 #4
Question re this part malaise Mar 2016 #5
That's easy - The Green Poultice hatrack Mar 2016 #6
LOL - got you! malaise Mar 2016 #10
He gets into that later on in the piece Recursion Mar 2016 #8
Thanks malaise Mar 2016 #11
Victim blaming. Downwinder Mar 2016 #7
Sure, but the right only pushes back when they blame white victims Recursion Mar 2016 #9
Please proceed! forjusticethunders Mar 2016 #12
"there was a sense of entitlement" trotsky Mar 2016 #13
This poor white guy thinks the National Review can go eat shit Odin2005 Mar 2016 #14

raging moderate

(4,297 posts)
1. Pretty strange effort to conflate the "socialist Left and Trump Right."
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 11:52 AM
Mar 2016

I personally know members of both groups, and I canvassed and phonebanked in Illinois. Believe me, these two groups have NOTHING IN COMMON! Furthermore, the "socialist Left" is not trying to create a big-government, protectionist utopia, but rather to DISMANTLE a big-government, protectionist utopia for the top 1% and their stooges. What we have RIGHT NOW actually IS BIG GOVERNMENT handing out money, covert action, military support, police brutality, and official harassment to keep the money and power and products flowing in one direction.

raging moderate

(4,297 posts)
3. Oh, no, Recursion, I can see that your post does not endorse French's POV.
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 12:08 PM
Mar 2016

Actually, I meant to criticize French.

Partly because my 35 year career as a public-school itinerant speech/language pathologist took me to many towns throughout rural Illinois, and I witnessed the arduous labor of most of these working class rural residents, and I had grown up among working class urban residents. They are by no means as homogenous a group as French and his cohorts seem to imagine. Some are artistic and creative, using their gifts to earn little sums here and there. Others read extensively in their spare time, from public libraries and secondhand bookstores. Mostly, however, they spend their lives dodging various bullets and meteors that life throws at them, problems which are blissfully ignored by people like French. I was not surprised when the lifespan of rural working class women went down. Those women mainly pull double or triple duty in life. And most of the men work just as hard as they ever did. I don't have as much familiarity with current urban working class people, but I bet it is not too different for them. I suspect that people like French take brief glances, overgeneralize, and jump to too many conclusions. I know they conveniently forget the MANY HUGE favors our government actually does for wealthy people.

 

KamaAina

(78,249 posts)
4. "are indifferent to their academic and work performances, and abuse alcohol and drugs"?
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 12:27 PM
Mar 2016

So Dumbya is one of "America's poorer citizens"?

malaise

(268,904 posts)
5. Question re this part
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 12:36 PM
Mar 2016
but if America’s poorer citizens can’t stay faithful to their spouses, are indifferent to their academic and work performances, and abuse alcohol and drugs, then their lives will be a struggle


How does this part differ from the elites?

hatrack

(59,583 posts)
6. That's easy - The Green Poultice
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 12:39 PM
Mar 2016

Apply enough of it, and all of your shortcomings are magically washed away!

Piss on the National Review from a considerable height.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
8. He gets into that later on in the piece
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 12:54 PM
Mar 2016

He's complaining the elites don't preach what they practice, and have much higher marriage rates and lower divorce rates than the poor, but refuse to urge the poor to emulate them.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
9. Sure, but the right only pushes back when they blame white victims
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 12:55 PM
Mar 2016

This is exactly the "honest" continuation of the conservative philosophy, and the right absolutely can't stand it.

 

forjusticethunders

(1,151 posts)
12. Please proceed!
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 03:40 PM
Mar 2016

Please, continue making the same arguments you made against black people and directing against poor white people.

Are these guys even trying anymore? They're actively trying to undermine the one thing keeping the pitchforks away from their mansions - the psychological wage given to poor whites for not being black.

trotsky

(49,533 posts)
13. "there was a sense of entitlement"
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 03:51 PM
Mar 2016

The right wing needs to connect that final dot. For the group they are now bashing, that sense of entitlement is a direct result of several decades now of blaming "the other" for the poor white man's problems.

Can't get a job? Why they must have given it to a minority. Lousy liberal affirmative action.

Can't get an education? Damn liberal elitists run the schools anyway.

Can't get ahead? It's because those damn Democrats are stealing your taxes and giving them to people on welfare!

Your relationship stinks? The gays are getting married, that's why!

Dude, you've programmed them never to look at themselves for answers. That it's always someone else's fault. Are you honestly surprised now?

Odin2005

(53,521 posts)
14. This poor white guy thinks the National Review can go eat shit
Fri Mar 25, 2016, 04:00 PM
Mar 2016

You fuckers fed my demographic group hate and bile for decades to get them to vote for you elitist fuckers against our economic interests and only NOW are you ashamed at what you have created?

Go to hell. I hope Trump tears your party apart and eats you fuckers alive.

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