Yet another reason to oust DWS

[SHRED]

The 28 Democrats Who Voted For Fast Track

https://ourfuture.org/20150615/the-28-democrats-who-voted-for-fast-track

Payday Debbie must go!


..

[Jackie Wilson Said]

1. Ugh...But we need to replace them with other Democrats.

[daleanime]

2. But if their replacements would vote the same way.....

would that make any difference?

[Jackie Wilson Said]

3. Who says they will? Are you willing to allow GOP to take their place who will

vote to deport millions and treat gays and minorities like 2nd class citizens?

[daleanime]

5. Concern is not the same as prediction.....

and getting the right type, kind?, of democrat is just as important as getting a democrat. Would it be the same thing if you had Elizabeth Warren representing you instead of DWS?

[Jackie Wilson Said]

6. Life is gray and a matter of degrees. This black and white approach since Bernie entered

the picture is troubling for those who have the most to lose.

[daleanime]

11. You see people with the most to lose....

I see people with the most to gain. Too bad we can call the whole thing off, the planet it burning and we don't have anymore time to waste.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

12. Good point, we are past the point of no return on climate change anyway, so all of this

is temporary.

The planet is gonna burn as in the temps and life.

[Dont call me Shirley]

14. DWS is clearly a gop, no black white or gray about that. No room for her in the D party.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

16. I didnt realize DWS was anti choice, anti voting rights among other things.

[Dont call me Shirley]

17. She is most definitely anti-voting rights with her flagrant use of the Paul Weyrich Strategy.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

18. Do you have any proof of that?

I see you are not debating the choice issue, there are dozens more where she is not GOP

I thought about chastising you for making such a ridiculous statement of calling her GOP but I dont think it will matter

[Dont call me Shirley]

21. Plenty of GOP closet prochoicers. She has supported, yes supported, and is supporting GOP candidates

in Florida elections. Lost too many state seats and governorships under her "leadership". She's a loser, gotta go!

[JDPriestly]

26. We who support Bernie support him because we believe that we all,

that is ALL AMERICANS, have the MOST TO GAIN if Bernie becomes president.

On what issues do you disagree with Bernie?

And please don't think I will disapprove of you if you tell me on which issues you disagree with him.

This is a discussion site. We discuss the issues here so it's OK to say what you think. If we disagree, it is not personal. It is about the ideas and issues.

Why do you think that there is a black and white approach since Bernie entered?

Because I do not think that is correct about Bernie at all.

Bernie points to certain issues that others including Hillary would have ignored were he not in the race, and Bernie offers solutions to those issues.

Most Hillary supporters claim that he doesn't say how he is going to achieve what he sets forth as his proposals.

It's not possible to have it both ways.

It's not possible to claim that Bernie has a black and white approach but also claim that he doesn't know how he is going to achieve his goals.

In my view, the truth is that Bernie's proposals are goals, not rigid, dogmatic, must-do at all costs items. They indicate a direction that Bernie and we would like to take. It's a very new, very needed direction for America in my view.

We no longer live in a time when, as my ancestors did, a family can start out in a wagon, homestead land, keep moving and homesteading and buying and selling land until they find really good land and then farm and create a life for themselves. There is no longer enough land for all of us to do that. And so we have to change our economic organization a bit without losing our individual freedom. That's not going to be an easy thing to do. Right now, the status quo is that the rich who control the money can invest anywhere in the world and take the industry and jobs anywhere in the world leaving ordinary Americans in a post-industrial country in which jobs are ever scarcer and our trade deficit ever larger. Wages buy a lot of cheap products made in countries that pay slave wages, but Americans have to buy stuff and pay their rent on credit in many cases because the jobs here are service jobs that not only pay too little to survive on with a family but are very insecure.

That is the essential dilemma that Bernie, and Bernie alone acknowledges and deals with.

Is Bernie rigid, "black and white" in his proposals?

Bernie has a lot of experience working with others in government. He was the mayor of Burlington, Vt. and successful enough to be re-elected several times. Mayors are leaders. They don't get re-elected unless they do a good job and compromise.

Bernie has been in Congress since 1992 and has compromised on many, many issues and voted for many bills that others wrote and that are not entirely what he would write if he had his druthers. He is a person who reaches compromises quite successfully and not at all a "my way or the highway" "black and white" thinker or politician.

I am sorry, but I think that appraisal of Bernie --- and it is by no means unique to you --- is just unfortunately mistaken. I think it is kind of one of Hillary's slogans.

The momentum and enthusiasm in Bernie's campaign is partly due to the fact that Hillary is not a good candidate on a personal level. She does not connect with crowds. She does not connect with people on the internet. I think she connects with the people she meets in small groups, her donors mostly.

But unfortunately, presidents, because they lead so many people, have to be able to connect with groups of people both large and small. She just seems braced and stiff and defensive in front of groups of people. I don't think she has held any rallies for people who can't pay large sums of money in California. She comes to raise money in California but beyond that we don't see or hear from outside of the e-mail demands for money. (I've been on her list because I was very active in the Obama campaigns.)

Besides, her stands on the issues in many cases are just not as good, not as clearly formulated, not as understandably expressed as are Bernie's.

And most of us trust Bernie more than Hillary because she changes her minds on issues, on moral issues like fairness to LGBTs and LGBT marriage and many, many other issues while Bernie finds the moral underpinning of a stance on an issue and in general stays with it. He thinks through the rights and wrongs on issues before he takes a stance, basing his thinking on fundamental principles of democracy and the value of the individual and freedom in a society and then decides where he stands based on his values. His values happen to be my values and those of most Democrats and most progressives.

Bernie's thinking process is evident from the speeches he has made over the years including, foremost, the speech he made to explain why he voted against the Iraq War. I hope you watch that speech. It's easy to find on his YouTube channel.

So I hope I have been able to help you feel more comfortable about Bernie and why so many of us support him.

Thanks.

[SHRED]

4. Tim Canova

http://m.dailykos.com/story/2016/1/11/1468473/-Why-I-m-running-against-Debbie-Wasserman-Schultz

[daleanime]

9. I need to do more research....

but he looks like a definite improvement, not that that would take much.

[rpannier]

24. It does in a more indirect way

She carries seniority within the party
Her replacement would go to the bottom of the group along with all new members
In that sense it makes a lot of difference
Yes, they vote the same way, but the replacement lacks the standing and influence within Congress

[passiveporcupine]

31. aren't you for Clinton?

She is for all the trade deals and fast tracking. If you don't think so, you are kidding yourself.

Yes we need to replace DINOs like this, but not with worse DINOs.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

43. No, Bernie...but will of course support her if necessary.

[passiveporcupine]

44. As will I

Sorry, I must have confused you with someone else.

[JI7]

7. maybe the people in her district are fine with her

[SHRED]

8. She heads the DNC however

I think she should go as DNC Chair and hopefully the people of her district vote in Canova.

[StevieM]

10. Do Sanders supporters really not get that Obama is the one who appointed her?

Nobody pressured him into it. She was the person that he wanted.

[floriduck]

20. We understand that very well. We also

understand that he has not only allowed her to cause the loss of over 900 Democratic seats from Governors to Senators, but he has endorsed her in her current campaign. Just how does a leader of his magnitude encourage and allow her to remain in her position after all that carnage. What does that say about our President?!

[StevieM]

32. OK. I appreciate your reply. Here are my thoughts:

First, DWS did not become chair of the party until April 5, 2011. She wasn't in charge during the 2010 midterms.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debbie_Wasserman_Schultz#Chair_of_the_Democratic_National_Committee

In 2012 we won the popular vote for the House, but the districts were hopelessly gerrymandered. We also picked up a couple senate seats, even though we had to defend 23 seats, while only having 10 to pick up. (I'm including Maine as a pickup, since the Independent caucuses with Democrats).

In 2014 we fell apart at the end when the GOP convinced people that President Obama was determined to let people from Africa bring ebola into the United States.

The only way I can see Obama replacing her would be if Clinton or Sanders were to become the presumptive nominee and ask him to make a change. I can't imagine he would refuse them if they asked. But I also can't see him suddenly firing the DNC Chair that he picked because supporters of one of the two candidates in a presidential primary are asking him to.

[FighttheFuture]

22. And his administration was the one that ousted Howard Dean and shitcanned the 50 State Strategy!

Once Obama received all the benefits of Dean's hard work, time to shove him out lest all these new voters start asking WTF and screw up the entrenched power structures. A structure that Obama is firmly ensconced within.


Looking Back at Howard Dean's 50-State Strategy

When former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean became chairman of the Democratic National Committee (DNC) in early 2005, one of his main efforts was to undertake a "50-state strategy," a bid to build up party infrastructure and candidate recruitment at every level and in every state -- even in solidly Republican bastions.

"We strengthened the parties so sitting governors could find good candidates" for offices high and low, Dean said. "That's much easier to do from Topeka than it is from Washington."

State party chairs loved the idea, but among national strategists, the approach was controversial. Dean bumped heads with then-Rep. Rahm Emanuel, the chairman of the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee, who believed in a more conventional strategy of focusing limited campaign resources on swing districts. On CNN, Paul Begala said Dean's gambit amounted to "hiring a bunch of staff people to wander around Utah and Mississippi and pick their nose." (Begala later apologized.)


Here's how the Democrats fared in the reddest of red states between January 2005 and January 2009, the period when the 50-state project was in operation:

State House seats: Net gain of 39 seats, a 2 percent increase of all seats in the states analyzed
State Senate seats: Net loss of two seats
Governorships: Net loss of one
Attorney generalships: Net gain of one (elected seats only)
U.S. House seats: Net gain of three seats
U.S. Senate seats: Net gain of one seat
Presidential performance: In 15 of the 20 states, the Democratic nominee saw an increase in vote share between 2004 and 2008. In three other states, the vote share remained constant. It dropped in only two states.



Now let's compare this record to the one between January 2009 and January 2013.

State House seats: Net loss of 249 seats, a decrease of 13 percent of the existing seats in those states
State Senate seats: Net loss of 84 seats, a decrease of 12 percent
Governorships: A decrease by half, from eight governors to four
Attorney generalships: A drop by two-thirds in elected AGs, from nine to three
U.S. House seats: A 40 percent drop, from 44 seats to 26
U.S. Senate seats: A drop from 11 seats to 8. (It could drop further by 2014: Of those eight remaining seats, three senators are retiring and another three face tough reelection contests.)
Presidential performance: Only two of the 20 states (Alaska and Mississippi) saw higher support for Obama in 2012 than in 2008. In most of the 20 solidly red states, Obama's 2012 vote fell back roughly to John Kerry's level from 2004.
Altogether, these post-2009 declines are, to put it bluntly, pretty catastrophic. In these 20 solidly red states, the Democrats controlled 13 legislative chambers in 2005, a number that fell to just three in 2013. Of the 40 chambers in these states, only two experienced a net gain of Democratic seats between 2005 and 2013; in the other 38, the Democrats lost ground.

[Thespian2]

23. Careful...

you are confusing some folks here by using facts...ignoring facts is important if you are a corporatist...

[JDPriestly]

30. Thanks. Debbie does not make an enthusiastic, attractive appearance

on TV. It's not about her looks. I am not talking about physical appearance. The problem is her lack of enthusiasm and lack of a caring demeanor. We need someone who is a better communicator, someone whose enthusiasm is infectious. Howard Dean had that quality. Debbie just does not. She may be well organized, but she does not have that special quality that makes people WANT to follow her as a leader.

Competence is not enough for the DNC head.

[StevieM]

33. I think it is a bit of an overstatement to say that he "fired" Howard Dean.

Governor Dean served for 4 years. Then he stepped down and the incoming Democratic president made a new appointment, Gov. Kaine.

That's the way it usually works. A new chair comes in every four years. DWS has been there for 5 because Gov. Kaine stepped down earlier than usual, so he could run for the U.S. Senate.

[FighttheFuture]

41. I recall teh stopried from that time, Rahm fought with Dean bc he woudl not give Rahmmie $$$ for

his DCCC BS candidates. Dean was needing funds for the 50 state strategy. Obama came in and Dean was personna non grata, partly from his long running feud with Rahm Emmanual, Obamma's Chief of Staff. Let's face it, he was pushed out. More telling is the 50 state Strategy was cancelled.

Timmah Kaine, Obama's new toady, then worked tierlessly loosing more seats in 2010 and that big announcement afterward.

Washington (CNN) — Democratic National Committee Chairman Tim Kaine plans to make what’s being billed as a major announcement for the party Wednesday.
:
Eager to bridge a daunting enthusiasm gap, Democratic National Committee Chairman Tim Kaine recited a list of President Barack Obama’s accomplishments Wednesday to an auditorium packed with George Washington University College Democrats.

It came as he unveiled a new website, a new logo and a new slogan for his party: “Change That Matters.”

A “D” inside a circle ? That’s your answer to what looks like it could be the biggest political setback for the Democratic Party in 16 years ? Yea, you go with that dude.

Looks likes the D being flushed down the toilet, to me! Others were even less kind...

So yeah, I guess your right; "That's the way it usually works." A new DLC Centrist corporate friendly administration takes power and sweeps out all those pesky progressives and their lofty expectations and uppity demands. Can;t have them rocking their boat, now, can we!?

[arcane1]

28. Just because he appointed her doesn't mean people have to automatically like her.

We can think for ourselves.

[StevieM]

34. I agree and I don't expect you to like someone just because the president does.

I just don't understand why Sanders supporters are acting shocked that he endorsed her for reelection in her primary.

She is the sitting Democratic member of Congress. A Democratic president is usually going to support their re-election bid, especially if that president likes them enough to make them chair of the party.

[FighttheFuture]

42. I thnk the shock comes from many are still under the delusion that Obama is all hopey/changy when

it's really much more business as usual and then some as we continue soft stepping to the right.

[JDPriestly]

29. The election results in the off-years prove that she has done a lousy

job of inspiring Democratic voters to come out.

One of Obama's great traits is his patience.

Another is his loyalty.

But his loyalty to Debbie Wasserman Schultz who lost both the House and the Senate in 2014 is just baffling. She has done a lousy job. Doesn't mean she is a bad person. She just hasn't lead the DNC very well.

We need change. She needs to go.

Even great people like Obama have failings. In this case, a couple of Obama's good qualities are preventing him from doing what needs to be done and what needs to be done is to replace Debbie Wasserman Schultz with someone who is more inspiring to voters. When Debbie appears on TV, she looks like and acts like a sad sack. That is not good for the Democratic Party.

Obama is making a mistake in endorsing Debbie Wasserman-Schultz. We need someone to represent the Democratic Party to the world who is lively, smart and loving, someone who really attracts voters and causes them to want to vote. Debbie doesn't do it.

[StevieM]

35. You really think he would ever not endorse a sitting member of Congress for renomination?

Especially HIS OWN party chair?

The argument for withholding his endorsement from an incumbent Democrat is that she has done something so bad as party chair that she deserves to be drummed out of the party and out of congress. But she is HIS party chair selection. He picked her and she serves at his pleasure.

If you want her replaced then you have to win the nomination for Bernie. If Bernie or Hillary becomes the presumptive nominee then Obama will defer to them and allow them to change the party chair, if that is what they want.

[JDPriestly]

40. It's early. She is being challenged. He should not have picked sides.

[Omaha Steve]

13. FIRE DWS! Donate to Democratic Underground for Tim Canova FL-23 here

Democratic Underground for Tim Canova FL-23: https://secure.actblue.com/contribute/page/du4timcanova

[mahannah]

15. If Obama wanted her gone, she would be. He does not.

[BillZBubb]

27. Which just goes to show Obama is human and does make some pretty large errors.

This one is a biggie.

[cantbeserious]

19. Bernie Is The Only Antidote To Rampant DNC DWS DLC HRC Third-Way Corporatist Corruption

eom

[Hotler]

25. The other antidote is an in the streets fighting mad revolution....

nothing is going to change, I repeat, nothing is going to change until people get off their butts and take to the streets for weeks at a time by the tens of thousands. As much as I wish Bernie to win the POTUS, the PTB will never let it happen because they have too much to lose. They will rig the vote or????? think John Kennedy. There are some very bad people in this country and they need to be ..... well.... rope, lamp post. The French knew how to deal with this shit back in the 1800's.
A La Lanterne!

[SHRED]

37. If the PTB continue to not...

...throw us peeons a few bones now and then you are probably, and sadly, correct.

[JDPriestly]

39. Getting into the streets is not the answer.

It just scares sensible people.

Bernie is handling things correctly.

The French revolution occurred at a time when there was a monarchy. We do not live under a dictatorship or monarchy.

I do not think Bernie is espousing a violent revolution but rather a democratic one in which you and I and all Americans become more engaged politically, learning more about political issues, discussing political issues with each other and then voting.

Street demonstrations are OK in certain circumstances, but that is the lazy way. People get out demonstrate, change the names of the people who are in charge at most. (In 1968, after years of street demonstrations, we got Nixon. The demonstrations brought a worse government than we had.

Street demonstrations make the demonstrators feel like they have accomplished something when they haven't. What is needed is informed voters who can discuss politics and persuade others to do what is right for the common good and vote for candidates and issues that will benefit everyone in our society.

Demonstrations are counterproductive in most instances. The only good thing they achieve is bringing likeminded people together.

Rather than demonstrate against the Iraq War, activists should have gone door to door in their neighborhoods and talked to their neighbors and presented the known facts. That did not happen so we got two terms of GWB.

No to just demonstrations.

[Cassiopeia]

36. The reason for Obama's glowing endorsement

and the reason there was never a thought of removing her after 2014.

Not only will she vote for the TPP, she'll rally the troops on both sides to vote with her. November is going to be interesting. Everything Obama has on hold now will happen very quickly, especially if Sanders would be the next POTUS. I'll bet Congress goes into the most intense work cycle ever before if Sanders is to be sworn in Jan 20th.

[ChiciB1]

38. WELL, LOOKIE, LOOKIE... There's Good Ole' Debbie! And To Think

we keep being told how Hillary WON'T support HER in how she votes!! What IS IT that people can't see???

DISGUSTING Crap! Just ANOTHER reason why Obama "Loves Debbie!" Adorable, I'll DELIVER WHATEVER I CAN Debbie! I REALLY WONDER what they've PROMISED HER! I have no ILLUSIONS that Obama and Hillary are in this together either! He endorses her and THE former REPUKE running for Senator here in Florida.

If ever there was a CLEARER picture of $$$$$ in action this is it! With Obama leading the way and apparently making a path for Hillary! We've been so screwed and it's becoming clearer and clearer every single day!

WHEN will people WAKE UP??? Don't bother with the replies because as Rachel says... it's BULL PUKEY! MSNBC has also decided that IT HAS to be Hillary from the comments I see here. I stopped watching them a very long time ago, but I ONCE thought Rachel had some integrity... BULL PUKEY, Rachel!