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librarylu

(503 posts)
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 03:39 PM Jun 2016

Conservatives Try To Scapegoat Islam To Avoid Responsibility For Perpetuating Anti-LGBT Violence

Last edited Thu Jun 16, 2016, 12:07 AM - Edit history (1)

"On Sunday, police arrested a man by the name of James Wesley Howell as he was on his way to the Los Angeles Pride festival in West Hollywood. In his car were three assault rifles, high-capacity magazines, a stockpile of ammunition, and the ingredients necessary to make an explosive device. Police have corrected an initial report that he intended “to harm” the pride event and now say his intentions were unclear, but his destination was not.

Howell is white, and he’s from Indiana."


http://thinkprogress.org/lgbt/2016/06/13/3787637/orlando-islam-scapegoat/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=tptop3&utm_term=4&utm_content=13&elqTrackId=991487f16c934b02be59f1f906686e21&elq=8b6ff197b35949d4b9de559b56343431&elqaid=30452&elqat=1&elqCampaignId=5816

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Conservatives Try To Scapegoat Islam To Avoid Responsibility For Perpetuating Anti-LGBT Violence (Original Post) librarylu Jun 2016 OP
Perhaps even a white man from Indiana draws inspiration from online videos Nye Bevan Jun 2016 #1
How does one vindicate or redeem the other? I don't follow your thinking. Bluenorthwest Jun 2016 #2
Who said that? librarylu Jun 2016 #6
This may not be the best example of the asserted proposition . . . MousePlayingDaffodil Jun 2016 #3
Do these facts matter? librarylu Jun 2016 #14
Always easier to distract using scapegoats (Muslims, Mexicans, Chinese, etc.) than it is to offer pampango Jun 2016 #4
+1, and the people who've done this in the past have usually been really bad folk uponit7771 Jun 2016 #12
God Guns and Gays underpants Jun 2016 #5
Muslims are mostly conservatives themselves, were you unaware of this? Quantess Jun 2016 #7
I did not write the article librarylu Jun 2016 #8
Okay, cool with me! Quantess Jun 2016 #9
Thank you. librarylu Jun 2016 #10
I still don't understand. Sorry. (no text) Quantess Jun 2016 #11
Don't understand what? librarylu Jun 2016 #13

Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
1. Perhaps even a white man from Indiana draws inspiration from online videos
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 03:48 PM
Jun 2016

in which ISIS throws gay men from buildings and crushes their skulls with rocks? After all, so many of those countries have the death penalty for being gay, there must be something wrong with those gay people, right?

Alternatively, he could just be enraged by one of those "bathroom bills" here in the US.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
2. How does one vindicate or redeem the other? I don't follow your thinking.
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 03:49 PM
Jun 2016

Because of Howell, Mateen is innocent? That makes no sense.

librarylu

(503 posts)
6. Who said that?
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 04:11 PM
Jun 2016

I posted the first two paragraphs of an article I found interesting. Then I posted the link. That's usual for posting copyrighted material, is it not? Readers are invited to read the rest of the article.

3. This may not be the best example of the asserted proposition . . .
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 03:59 PM
Jun 2016

. . . insofar as the perpetrator here was purportedly gay himself. Nor, apparently, do authorities now believe that Howell was traveling to the gay pride event in order to inflict harm there.

Facts do matter, don't they?

* * * *

Indianapolis Star

June 14, 2016

JEFFERSONVILLE — The James Wesley Howell that Jeffersonville knew was a quiet young man best known for walking his black Labrador, Midnight, through the streets of the well-to-do Louisville, Ky., suburb his parents called home.

But 30 minutes away in the small city of Charlestown, friends and a boyfriend told a different story. This Howell, they said, was a troubled and sometimes violent man who had a dangerous relationship with fast cars, big guns and many of the people closest to him.

It remains unclear why the Southern Indiana man was in Santa Monica, Calif., early Sunday, when he was stopped on his way to a gay pride event in Los Angeles. When Howell, 20, was arrested, police said they discovered three assault rifles, high-capacity magazines and ammunition in his car, along with a five-gallon bucket filled with explosive chemicals. He remains in jail there on a $500,000 bond. The FBI also is investigating.

Joseph Greeson, of Clarksville, said he hadn’t spoken with Howell since June 1. The two car enthusiasts met through a friend last November, and Greeson had done some rim and lighting work on Howell’s Acura, the same car Howell was driving when police stopped him in Santa Monica.

“I never really got, like, any bad signals,” said Greeson, 18. “Just that it was strange and kind of weird. He was an only child and just kind of lonerish. I don't know. It’s hard to explain.”

Greeson said he heard his friend had skipped town last week. Howell’s parents called Greeson’s mother looking for their son. And though Greeson said he knew Howell faced prior legal trouble in Indiana, he said he couldn’t fathom the man driving to California to harm anyone.

“He might have got scared because he got in trouble here and stuff,” Greeson said. “He might have just been heading out and then had the guns with him for whatever reason and just, you know, wrong place and wrong time.”

Howell’s most recent troubles occurred last October, when he was arrested in Clark County after police said he pointed a loaded gun at a neighbor. He was ordered to forfeit all weapons in April after pleading guilty to a misdemeanor intimidation charge connected to the case. As part of the deal, Howell was sentenced to a year of probation. A felony charge of pointing a firearm was dismissed. An Indiana probation officer met with Howell three weeks ago, rated him a low-level offender, and had yet to schedule an in-home visit, according to the Associated Press.

Across the river in Louisville, Howell’s fate in criminal court is pending. Three days after his plea deal in Clark County, a grand jury indicted Howell on charges of speeding, fleeing police and reckless driving. Howell is accused of driving 103 mph in a 55 mph zone in February. Police allege he sped off before an officer could arrest him.

In a video of the incident Howell sent to Greeson and other friends, the police officer is seen asking for Howell to roll his windows up and get out of the car. Howell, ignoring the officer, steps on the gas.

“He sent it to all of us in a group and thought he was, like, badass for running away from the cops,” Greeson said. “We all quit talking to him for a while after that.”

Early police reports suggested that Howell told Santa Monica authorities he intended to inflict harm at the gay pride parade in West Hollywood. Department officials later walked those comments back, saying the man had only told them he was headed that way.

Howell's arrest came as the country reeled from the massacre in Orlando, Fla., in which a gunman killed 49 people at a gay nightclub early Sunday. The incident stoked fears of violence at gay pride events across the country, though police said they do not know of any connection between Howell and the shootings in Orlando.

Greeson and others told IndyStar that Howell harbored no violent feelings toward the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community. In fact, they said, Howell is gay.

“He didn’t like anybody to know about it,” said Zach Hambrick, an ex-boyfriend from Charlestown. Hambrick said he met Howell on a dating app. Although the pair were happy at first, Hambrick said, things soon went south. They haven't spoken in several months, Hambrick said.

“After things went bad, that’s when he started getting violent with me,” said Hambrick, 17. Asked about Howell’s arrest in Santa Monica, Hambrick said, “It didn’t surprise me. It didn’t surprise me at all.”

Hambrick said his ex-boyfriend kept a collection of guns. In a small house Howell briefly shared with Hambrick in Charlestown, neighbors said, he kept a couple of handguns and a rifle displayed in his room.

“I don’t know why he had so many,” Hambrick said. “He didn’t hunt. He just had them.”

Records from the Charlestown Police Department detail allegations that the day before Howell’s October arrest, he pointed a rifle at Hambrick. Howell told police he held the gun at his shoulder but kept it pointed skyward as he told his former boyfriend to leave, an account echoed by multiple witnesses. No charges arose from that allegation.

Jeremy Hebert, 37, the Charlestown neighbor named in the October 2015 arrest report, said he had multiple concerns about Howell. During one of Hebert's encounters with Howell, the younger man sat in his car, clearing ammunition from his rifle. Between each rack, he raised his gun and pointed it at Hebert.

Another time, Hebert said, he overheard Howell yelling that he wished “he could take everybody out.”

“Get the kid some help and everything,” Hebert said.

Howell is scheduled for an arraignment in Los Angeles on Tuesday. Prosecutors in his pending Louisville case, meanwhile, filed a motion Monday to revoke Howell’s bond in that case, according to the Jefferson Commonwealth attorney’s office.

Back in the Jeffersonville neighborhood that Howell’s parents called home, many neighbors declined to speak with IndyStar. The large house belonging to his parents was apparently empty; a privacy screen set up just inside the doorway shielded the interior from view.

Chris Rowe, 43, who lives a few houses down, said he was friendly with the Howells and never expected something could be amiss.

“His parents have given zero indication that they are anything but squared away,” Rowe said.

Rowe, who works as a juvenile probation officer in nearby Floyd County, said he was previously unfamiliar with Howell’s criminal history in Clark County. But he said he sympathized with the man’s parents.

“I deal with juveniles, so I know the pickle they get in. That’s their flesh and blood. That’s their kid. What are you supposed to do? You can’t just boot him out on the street,” Rowe said.

“I feel bad for the parents. Your child is how many thousands of miles away? When are you going to get to see him again?”

pampango

(24,692 posts)
4. Always easier to distract using scapegoats (Muslims, Mexicans, Chinese, etc.) than it is to offer
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 04:02 PM
Jun 2016

real solutions.

Quantess

(27,630 posts)
7. Muslims are mostly conservatives themselves, were you unaware of this?
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 04:27 PM
Jun 2016

I know some delightful muslim women who dress western and show their hair. I'm not talking about them.These strong women came from shitty places like Iran where they were oppressed just for being women. Iran used to be less oppressive to women, before it became worse. I realized that I need to include this in every single post so that people don't jerk their knee and yell: "ISLAMOPHOBE!"

Radical Islam has become so much worse over the past few years.
Europe is not the same europe it was, after taking in so many refugees.

The fact remains that there IS a great cultural divide, and that women, gays, transgendered people, cartoonists who depict Muhammed, and people from other religions, will pay the ultimate price.

librarylu

(503 posts)
8. I did not write the article
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 04:42 PM
Jun 2016

I think there's a quote function I should have used but this is my first time posting a topic here and I don't know what I'm doing.

Please see my grand total post count, most of which is today. This is the second least posting I've ever done on a forum I've joined. I joined Dawkins' just in time for the implosion and, IIRC, didn't post at all. Elsewhere I'm prolific.

Is this any better?

Donald Trump not only lashed out at radical Islam, but even suggested that the LGBT community will apply “political pressure” to retaliate.
Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) said in a statement, “Enough is enough. What we need is for every American — Democrat and Republican — to come together, abandon political correctness, and unite in defeating radical Islamic terrorism.”
Outlets like the Heritage Foundation’s Daily Signal and The Federalist have already run headlines such as, “Where Does The Hate Come From?“, “The Orlando Terrorist Attack Is The Price We Pay For Not Destroying ISIS,” and “The Orlando Attack Is What Actual Homophobia Looks Like.”


I'm not in favor of any religion. I think we would all be better off rejecting ancient mythology and sticking to science.

librarylu

(503 posts)
10. Thank you.
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 04:57 PM
Jun 2016

I added my badge of honor from another forum where I was once on the Steering Committee to my sig line. I made the mistake of proving to the Chief Administrator the Supreme Court Building friezes are not portraying Christian Principles. Things went downhill from there.

I still haven't found the right tags. This maybe?

Radical Islam inspired the shooting, the argument goes, and so radical Islam deserves 100 percent of any blame or outrage that follows. The people making this argument are the same people who regularly speak out against LGBT equality — who support discrimination against same-sex couples in the name of “religious liberty” and who demonize transgender people as mentally ill. Now, they are nothing but sympathetic to the LGBT community — if they acknowledge it at all — and quick to disregard the anti-LGBT sentiment that is ubiquitous in the United States quite independent of any influence from Islam.

librarylu

(503 posts)
13. Don't understand what?
Tue Jun 14, 2016, 05:28 PM
Jun 2016

I haven't figured out how to edit the initial post to make it clearer the paragraphs are quotes from the article. " " didn't seem to do it. Now I know how to post an excerpt. I'll do that if I link to any more articles.

In this case there is no evidence so far that Mateen was linked in any formal way to any terrorist groups. The author of the article is making the point that Islam is being scapegoated by some conservatives while we have plenty of homegrown homophobia right here.

I don't know if understanding exactly why this very angry young man went over the edge will help prevent another similar tragedy but putting a stop to gay bashing of any kind certainly can't hurt.

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