Hillizabeth!!

[annabanana]

Watching the two of them at the rally in Cincinnati is exhilarating!

[pinboy3niner]

1. Liz Warren is KILLING it!

[Ninga]

2. This speech deserves to b seen 24/7!!!!!! Nt

[annabanana]

4. Hillary now touting Consumer Financial Protection Bureau!

Which, of course, is Warren's baby!

[pinboy3niner]

3. .

[longship]

5. Wonderful, but please no Warren as VEEP.

We, and Hillary, will desparately need her in the US Senate, not as a relatively powerless VEEP who only gets to vote upon a tie.

Only a mad person would see this any other way.

No sitting Democratic US Senator should agree to be VEEP.

We have a great opportunity this year with the Senate. The problem is, in the next cycle we have an equal problem to the GOP this year. We're likely screwed! Unless we can sweep as many Democrats into office as we can.

That means don't take good Democratic Senators out of office for effectively ceremonial positions! And certainly not Elizabeth Warren (whose Senate star has arisen) or -- god love him -- Al Franken (whose star is rising).

We need these people in the US Senate. And do not forget this! Although MA and MN are both very liberal states, both of these Senators' predecessors were Republicans. For Christ sakes, the current governor of MA is also GOP!

I cannot and will not support a sitting Democratic US Senator for VEEP. Hillary is just going to have to fish for a running mate someplace else.

[BlueMTexpat]

8. I concur.

Keep our Dem Senators where they are!

But she is GREAT campaigning with Hillary! Of that, there is no question whatsoever!

[annabanana]

9. I think this ticket would be so popular it would drive the Senate races

into the Dem column anyway.

(That and the unintentional assist from the shit-spackled muppet fart)

[writes3000]

10. Ding-Ding-Ding! You Are Correct, Again!

[Ninga]

11. The message and excitement of a Clnton/Warren ticket will benefit down ticket. We need

a clean sweep.

[longship]

12. Then what happens in 2018, when Dems have the hindside in Senate elections?

And what happens when VEEP Warren, or VEEP Franken gets replaced by a GOP Senator, just like both their predecessors were?

What then? And have you bothered looking at the Senate races for 2018? It is looking grim for the Democrats.

Nope! We need all the strong Democratic Senators in the US Senate, not one of them as VEEP. We cannot afford to have this back and forth, back and forth on party majority.

We need a long term majority to get our agenda through. That means stop fishing in that fucking pond for VEEP!

[katmondoo]

13. A real boring VP will not drive people to the polls

and will not drive people to vote an all Dem ticket. I do not see an increase for the Senate or house without some excitement. A Hillary-Warren ticket would be exciting.

[longship]

15. Who in the fuck said anything about a boring VEEP choice?

I just said not a sitting Dem Senator, especially not Elizabeth Warren or Al Franken, both who are achieving some notoriety and power, and both who were preceded by fucking Republicans!!!

Right! Let's take one of them out of the US Senate where they can do some actual good and thrust them into what can only generously be termed as a ceremonial position. (Oopsie! Almost forgot! VEEP gets to vote on US Senate ties. Now that's REAL power! )

I will stand by my post. No US Senate VEEP demotions!

[ChisolmTrailDem]

18. While I strongly agree with your position here, I am still conflicted. I have always been...

...enamored of Sen. Warren, all the way back to her interview with Charlie Rose when I knew she would some day be president. I still think she will be.

The reason I am conflicted about her joining Hillary is because, while I agree we need her in the Senate, I also take into consideration who would fill Hillary's shoes should something unfortunate happens. I'm not ready for that to be Tim Kaine as much as I am for it to be Sen. Warren. Also, a VP slot would set her to fulfill my long-ago premonition, though I do not believe she necessarily needs that position to become president.

[longship]

19. You've outlined my dilemma perfectly.

I think that we should all just let Secy Clinton surprise us all with her choice, praying that we won't lose the Senate in either 2016 or (horrors!) 2018 (when things look really bad for us) because she chose a sitting Democratic US Senator.

I really hope that Hillary thinks deeply and strategically about this.

[ChisolmTrailDem]

20. Agreed, longship. But, damn, that energy with Hill and Liz today! nt

[longship]

16. Have you actually looked at the 2018 Senate race?

And again, both Warren and Franken were preceded by GOP Senators in two of the most liberal states of the country!

Why? Oh why would any rational person want them to vacate their seat for a near powerless, ceremonial position?

Both of their stars are rising, Warren's more than Franken's, but both can make a difference only by retaining their fucking seats.

Don't forget to look at 2018 before disagreeing with me. It looks as bleak for Democrats as 2016 looks to the Senate GOP. We need every seat we can hold. That means no sitting Democratic US Senator as VEEP in 2016.

It is really simple.

[LanternWaste]

14. The extent of any Vice President's influence is predicated on what the President expects

"not as a relatively powerless VEEP who only gets to vote upon a tie..."

The extent of any Vice President's influence is predicated on what the President expects from the position (e.g., Hobart, Wallace, Cheney, Nixon, etc). The office in and of itself is neither neutered nor powerful-- it is what the particular administration want. Essentially, were Warren picked as VP, she would have as much policy input as the Clinton White house allowed her.

(The American Vice Presidency: From Irrelevance to Power, by Jules Witcover-- whom I suspect is not in fact, mad; despite seeing it differential than you)

[longship]

17. Irrelevant! This is about holding the Senate through the 2018 election.

Where Dems are in rather bad shape, at least as bad as the GOP is this year. That is why it is a short-sighted fool's errand to raid the US Senate for a VEEP nominee.

No Senator as VEEP!

[Warren DeMontague]

25. It's important to distinguish- different story if the Senator comes from a state with a (D) Governor

There are a lot of states where we could take a good Senator, the Dem. Gov. could pick a replacement, and the seat would not be in any real jeopardy even in 2018.

[longship]

29. Well, one has to be very careful.

Scope out the political turf.

In two of the most liberal states in the nation, two of the US Senators supposedly promoted as Hillary VEEP choices, Warren and Franken -- love both of them -- were preceded by a GOP US Senator in their seat. And as to Warren, the MA governor is GOP, too. Thankfully he would have no say in a putative Warren replacement, thanks to MA law. However, when the last senatorial vacancy in MA happened upon Teddy Kennedy's death, we got Scott Brown. And MA does have a fucking GOP governor which shows how even a liberal state can go wrong when one prods the political beast.

My advice. When one needs to take back the US Senate from the opposing party one does not arbitrarily remove a seated senator from your party from their office in order to achieve some political gain. This especially given the vagaries of politics. Think strategically -- long term -- not tactically.

And don't forget. The Dems are in big poo-poo in the 2018 senate races. We need not only a majority; we need a buffer against 2018!

[Warren DeMontague]

31. I guess I'm biased, because my state has 2 great (D) Senators

and I'd be ecstatic to see either on the ticket.

And I have less than no worries as to either Senate seat going Republican any time soon. Republicans can't get elected dog catcher in this state.

[annabanana]

37. curious.. What do you think the republican party

will look like in 2018?

[longship]

38. I have no idea, annabanana.

Trump is such a fucking wild card that I don't think anybody could predict.

But then again I thought the same about fucking Rush Limbaugh many years ago. And about Sarah Palin. And Newt. Yet they are all still slurping at the edges.

After 40-some years active in politics, I just don't know anymore. Except that I don't think anybody else does either. That is what I am most sure about.

So? A shrug.


And my best to you.

[Warren DeMontague]

24. how about a sitting Democratic US Senator from a state with a Democratic Governor?

who would then appoint the replacement?

[longship]

32. How did that work out when Ted Kennedy died?

Just asking. MA is one of the most liberal states in the country. Who is their governor? Just asking.

I don't like to roll the dice in such matters.

And in MA, the governor does not replace vacant Senate seats. That did not stop Scott Brown from replacing Ted Kennedy.

[Warren DeMontague]

34. Wyden and Merkley are from Oregon.

So I'm not talking about MA, I'm talking about OR.

[longship]

36. I know.

That would be a far better situation.

But I would hate to lose a single US Senate seat for a VEEP appointment. We are as fucked in 2018 as the GOP is this year, just going by the numbers. If we take back the senate this year, we cannot afford to lose any seats we hold. Because in two years, it may all turn around yet again. That is my metric. We need to not only gain the senate majority, we need to hold it. Removing Dem senators to serve as VEEP, especially our brightest and most talented, accomplishes nothing but weakening the very body of government which we desperately need in our corner.

Witness our recent SCOTUS vacancy. How's that working out for us?

QED.

My best to you.

[Warren DeMontague]

39. I don't think all Senate seats are created equal.

Oregon is not going to send someone like Mark Callahan.. or Monica Wehby- or whoever else the state GOP puts up- to the US Senate. It is not happening. Not now, and not in 2018, either.

Take a look at the Primary turnout numbers.

https://ballotpedia.org/United_States_Senate_election_in_Oregon,_2016

The GOP simply cannot win statewide races. The numbers are not there. Even when we were stuck running a massively damaged governor candidate- Kitzhaber in 2014- who subsequently had to resign, he STILL beat the Republican hands down.

Now, people will say taking a Senator from a State like OR doesn't confer any electoral college advantage, since OR is so blue- and that may be true, but that's the flip side of taking a safe choice from a senate seat standpoint.

But, okay, you don't want a Senator- who do you have in mind?

[longship]

40. Well, the GOP holds the vast majority of governorships, and I might add, state legislatures.

So much about statewide elections. Here in MI we are utterly fucked statewide. Thankfully we have two Dem Senators. But Snyder is a fucking weasel. The state senate and house are in the hands of madmen.

And the state legislature censured a woman state rep for daring to say the word "vagina" on the floor. It resulted in a very public performance of The Vagina Monologues on the state capital steps in protest, which did next to nothing to change things here. We're still screwed.

[Warren DeMontague]

41. Yeah, we are definitely spoiled here in OR.

but the political landscape is totally different. The Red/Blue divide is pronounced enough that the GOP can't nominate candidates that are palatable to the general electorate- and even when they do, they still lose- because the concentration of people in the blue areas simply dwarfs the rest of the state.

[longship]

42. Well, Oregon is unique.

It's like being a Republican in California. Abandon all hope.

But here in MI, I live in a very rural area. Most of the roads are not even paved. (Good luck with your driverless cars here.) Too many state offices have no Democratic opponent; the Republican runs unopposed. It's really tough here. We depend on Detroit and Flint to elect what few statewide offices Dems hold. Without them, we'd be Nebraska, or Idaho, or something.

As always, good friend.

[caraher]

44. Or Indiana

One state to the south, one party rule. I used to live in Michigan and that's the difference - we have nothing like the urban Democratic strongholds to keep the crazy in check. (And even so, you still have Snyder, you still have "right to work" - if you'd told me even 10 years ago that could ever happen in Michigan I wouldn't have believed it...)

But I digress... I also think Warren should campaign with Hillary but keep her Senate seat. We need her there. And very few voters decide based on the #2 person on the ticket. Warren can whip up excitement for down-ballot races exactly the same way she is giving Hillary a boost - by giving speeches and continuing her relentless attacks on Trump.

[Warren DeMontague]

45. I hear you. I have friends and family in Illinois.

It's a clusterfuck at the state level right now. The Governor is a wannabe Scott Walker, I guess-- playing chicken with things like department of transportation road repairs.

Meanwhile my state just pulled in something like 60 million in revenue from legal marijuana. And our roads are GREAT. Imagine that!

Best to you too, sir.

[BlueMTexpat]

6. Here's a link ...

http://www.wcpo.com/news/political/local-politics/follow-live-hillary-clinton-holds-public-event-at-union-terminal

[annabanana]

7. thanks! ,. . .n/t

[90-percent]

21. Yes, this is great

Our Democratic team of nice, wonderful, generous Oligarch's are gonna trounce the mean, nasty, greedy, self absorbed Oligarch on the other side!

I'm looking forward to enjoying the many benefits of the TPP. which I understand is now officially supported by the DNC?

As I understand it, the TPP was crafted in complete secrecy by a team of 600 average working people who worked on it together in their spare time over the last six years to make it really really good for average people?

-90% Jimmy

[Lady_Chat]

22. I am loving these two together!

So much energy! Warren is on fire. You couldn't ask for a better advocate, than Elizabeth. Would love to see them on the same ticket. So tired of it always being two men. I understand wanting to keep Warren in the Senate, but is there any chance we can get a Democrat in the Senate to replace her?

[BlueStater]

23. "Hillzabeth"? Are they a couple? n/t

[trof]

26. THE DYNAMIC DUO! TAG TEAM!

[Skittles]

30. there you are

YEE HAW TROF; yes INDEED

[trof]

35. YO!

[Laffy Kat]

27. Makes me proud!

I'm so proud my first child voted for the first black president and my #2 son and only niece will vote for the first woman POTUS. I will die a happy mom (not that I'm ready, mind you). I think it's entirely possibly we'll have an openly LGBT POTUS in my lifetime.

[k8conant]

28. OMG!

[senz]

33. Why, they're just so much alike!

Two peas in a pod! Not a bit of difference between them!

[deaniac21]

43. Better than

my vibrator!