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DetlefK

(16,423 posts)
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 04:29 PM Jun 2016

Scientists just discovered that climate-change is wiping out the concept of seasons.

Last edited Fri Jul 1, 2016, 06:19 AM - Edit history (1)

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/06/unprecedented-scientists-declare-global-climate-emergency-after-jet-stream-crosses-equator/

Climate scientists this week expressed alarm after “unprecedented” data showed the Northern Hemisphere Jet Stream crossing the Equator.

...

“It’s the very picture of weather weirding due to climate change. Something that would absolutely not happen in a normal world,” he wrote. “Something, that if it continues, basically threatens seasonal integrity.”

...

“That’s bad news for seasonality,” he continued. “You get this weather-destabilizing and extreme weather generating mixing of seasons that is all part of a very difficult to deal with ‘Death of Winter’ type scenario.”

University of Ottawa climate scientist Paul Beckwith called the new behavior “unprecedented.”

“Our climate system behaviour continues to behave in new and scary ways that we have never anticipated, or seen before,” Beckwith observed. “Welcome to climate chaos. We must declare a global climate emergency.”

In a YouTube video, Beckwith said that the jet stream behavior signaled “massive hits to the food supply” and “massive geopolitical unrest.”



------------

EDIT:
I posted this without cross-checking it first and it has been debunked.
http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/6/30/1543998/--Jet-Stream-Crosses-Equator-Not-Unprecedented-not-a-Climate-Emergency-Hell-Freezes-Over
I hereby apologize for any misunderstandings and inconveniences.
38 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Scientists just discovered that climate-change is wiping out the concept of seasons. (Original Post) DetlefK Jun 2016 OP
That would certainly affect agriculture. no_hypocrisy Jun 2016 #1
Here is a link to the blog that Ripstory stole from snooper2 Jun 2016 #2
Thanks, that story with photo makes a hell of a lot more sense Warpy Jun 2016 #4
I've been seeing the progressive disappearance, mixing, Hortensis Jun 2016 #17
Do note that they're pointing to the southern jet Warpy Jun 2016 #3
Temperature went from 90 to 60 in a few hours here. louis-t Jun 2016 #5
That's very common with cold fronts. B2G Jun 2016 #9
That happens in the Midwest with Cold Fronts. NutmegYankee Jun 2016 #30
Some years back it went from something like 70 degrees SheilaT Jul 2016 #38
"Just?" villager Jun 2016 #6
Gee, I thought we would be under water by now.... frankieallen Jun 2016 #7
Or at least have our heads buried in the sand. Mister Ed Jun 2016 #11
But James Inhofe made a snow ball!?! guillaumeb Jun 2016 #8
Robert Scribbler is not a climate scientist. Brickbat Jun 2016 #10
He's a novelist and has no scientific background whatsoever. B2G Jun 2016 #12
Exactly. Brickbat Jun 2016 #13
Eh? RobertEarl Jun 2016 #20
Bill McKibben wrote a book years ago RobertEarl Jun 2016 #14
Link to the study? Dr Hobbitstein Jun 2016 #15
Don't hold your breath. Brickbat Jun 2016 #16
Wasn't going to. Dr Hobbitstein Jun 2016 #18
Read McKibben's book 'End of Nature' RobertEarl Jun 2016 #19
That's not a scientific study, though. Dr Hobbitstein Jun 2016 #21
Lots of science in the book RobertEarl Jun 2016 #22
I agree that CC is a real thing and has caused changes. Dr Hobbitstein Jun 2016 #23
Exactly RobertEarl Jun 2016 #24
That's fine and dandy. Dr Hobbitstein Jun 2016 #25
u may want to visit ur local Cryptoad Jun 2016 #26
The point is, there is no peer reviewed article here. Dr Hobbitstein Jun 2016 #27
Stop asking for proof and get on the "world is ending" bandwagon. frankieallen Jun 2016 #32
"Lots of science in the book"......ok, I'm sold... frankieallen Jun 2016 #33
The request to do your studying? RobertEarl Jun 2016 #34
so my choices are, read a book by an author who makes living trying to convince people the world frankieallen Jun 2016 #37
Maybe this? some guy Jun 2016 #29
Thank you. Dr Hobbitstein Jun 2016 #35
high desert still seasonal DustyJoe Jun 2016 #28
It hasn't hit 50 below in years, and that used to be where the "bragging rights" came in, raven mad Jun 2016 #31
That headline is very misleading and sensationalist. Odin2005 Jun 2016 #36

Warpy

(111,169 posts)
4. Thanks, that story with photo makes a hell of a lot more sense
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 04:35 PM
Jun 2016

and shows both the northern and southern jets with branches going all over the place. That picture is a lot more disturbing than the one posted at Rawstory.

I speculated on another thread that this might be what's shutting down the hurricane formation, especially in the Pacific.

It will be interesting to see if the present jet stream mess can be categorized as weather or if it becomes climate.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
17. I've been seeing the progressive disappearance, mixing,
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 05:55 PM
Jun 2016

redefining of seasons for years now. We came to the Deep South in 2000. The changes had undoubtedly been happening for a long time by then, but for the first few years we had 4 lovely, very distinct seasons. Summer evenings meant watching fireflies flashing all over the meadow and a noisy summer chorus of millions of insects singing away. Now the flashes are isolated and the chorus muted.

And summer and erratic winter highs and lows have lengthened to dominate most of what used to be spring and fall. What is happening is extremely real.

Warpy

(111,169 posts)
3. Do note that they're pointing to the southern jet
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 04:32 PM
Jun 2016

and while the northern jet is contorted over Asia, it's well above the equator.

 

B2G

(9,766 posts)
9. That's very common with cold fronts.
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 04:47 PM
Jun 2016

It is normal and it doesn't point to evidence of climate change. That is weather.

NutmegYankee

(16,199 posts)
30. That happens in the Midwest with Cold Fronts.
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 07:59 PM
Jun 2016

There was one famous storm in 1836 in Illinois that took the temps from the 40s to 0 in just a few minutes, resulting in many fatalities.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
38. Some years back it went from something like 70 degrees
Fri Jul 1, 2016, 09:52 AM
Jul 2016

to minus 20 in less than twenty-four hours because of an extreme arctic cold front sweeping in. We did know ahead of that huge drop in temperature, thanks to weather satellites and modern communications.

Fast and dramatic changes in weather are quite common, although global climate change may possibly be making them happen even more often. There are some fascinating books out there about specific weather events that make good reading:

The Children's Blizzard by David Laskin
Isaacs's Storm by Erik Larson
Sudden Storm by R. A. Scotti

The last one is about the Great Hurricane of 1938, and there are quite a few books out there about that storm.

My point is that sudden and dramatic changes in weather happen a lot, more or less all the time. It's worthwhile to read up on some of the events that have occurred.

 

B2G

(9,766 posts)
12. He's a novelist and has no scientific background whatsoever.
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 05:00 PM
Jun 2016

It's people like him that give the other side ammo.

robertscribbler

I'm a progressive novelist, non-fiction writer and emerging threats expert. I've served 8 years in the combat arms, spent 3 years as a police officer, and spent 3 years as Editor, Emerging Threats for Jane's Information Group. I've spoken at over 250 events for schools nationwide and am currently working to both complete my third speculative fiction novel "The Death of Winter" and my second non-fic -- a climate justice based book called "Abolition -- Ending the Resource Curse," and a climate/emerging threats book entitled "The Second Great Dying."

My robertscribbler blog is dedicated to supporting causes and spreading information and analysis that advance environmental, social and economic justice. Please feel free to contact me if you believe your cause would benefit from my written advocacy or if you need expert trends analysis in one of these key areas.

http://en.gravatar.com/robertscribbler

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
14. Bill McKibben wrote a book years ago
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 05:16 PM
Jun 2016

Called the 'End of Nature'.

For those who care it was very depressing, and now we are living it.

 

Dr Hobbitstein

(6,568 posts)
15. Link to the study?
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 05:43 PM
Jun 2016

Not a blog or youtube video, but an actual study? Without this, it's just speculation from a blogger with no background in science.

Climate change is very real, but it's important to look at the actual studies, not youtube videos and blogs by bad sci-fi authors.

 

Dr Hobbitstein

(6,568 posts)
18. Wasn't going to.
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 05:56 PM
Jun 2016

Alarmist FUD is what it is. What it does is gives the CC-deniers ammo. Every. Single. Time.

 

Dr Hobbitstein

(6,568 posts)
21. That's not a scientific study, though.
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 06:11 PM
Jun 2016

That's a book by a journalist. I want data from scientists.

Funnily enough, criticism about that book from wiki:

"Spy Magazine estimated that the publication of the book involved the death of 3,200 trees"
 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
22. Lots of science in the book
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 06:16 PM
Jun 2016

I guess you haven't read it?

Doesn't matter, the end of the natural world is here. Birds are almost gone, the ocean is much warmer, glaciers are going if not gone, weather systems are more severe. 99% of climate scientists agree we have altered the natural world.

 

Dr Hobbitstein

(6,568 posts)
23. I agree that CC is a real thing and has caused changes.
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 06:21 PM
Jun 2016

I also agree it is man-made.

What I'm SPECIFICALLY talking about is the article in the OP. That particular article talks about NEW data. Where is that data? I want to see it before I believe something a sci-fi author/blogger talks about.

The book you refer to is from 1989. Lots has changed since then. We know way more now about CC than we did then.

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
24. Exactly
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 06:27 PM
Jun 2016

We know much more now.

New data is coming in so fast it is hard to keep up!

But Bill's book was groundbreaking and has been proven to be a harbinger of what we see today. Full of science that is applicable today, 'End of Nature' has proven to be quite correct in its prognosis.

 

Dr Hobbitstein

(6,568 posts)
25. That's fine and dandy.
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 06:54 PM
Jun 2016

But doesn't address my point as to the data that is referenced in the OP, but doesn't seem to exist with a cursory google search. Just a couple blogs and youtube videos.

Once again, I'm looking for actual peer-reviewed science. Not a book or article or video that may or may not quote it, but the actual research.

Some people like to read summarizations. I do not.

 

Dr Hobbitstein

(6,568 posts)
27. The point is, there is no peer reviewed article here.
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 07:29 PM
Jun 2016

The source is a blog by a sci-fi writer.

CC is real, but let's not give credence to quacks.

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
34. The request to do your studying?
Thu Jun 30, 2016, 03:59 AM
Jun 2016

Yeah, I saw that. To start with read the 'End of Nature' book and then you will begin to understand what's going on. If you choose not to read, well, then it just puts you in the denier's circle and is a circle that just circles. I don't do circles.

 

frankieallen

(583 posts)
37. so my choices are, read a book by an author who makes living trying to convince people the world
Thu Jun 30, 2016, 02:52 PM
Jun 2016

will end any day now due to global warming, or be in some deniers circle.
I guess I have to choose the deniers circle.
Of course i understand that weather changes are happening, and that some of those changes are man-made. but i get irritated when I see people take any stupid comment regarding a map they found on the internet, and say, "see, it's proof the world is ending, no more snow, we are all going to starve next year, it's too late to do anything !"
These are the same people who thought "The Day After Tomorrow" was going to end the discussion on climate change.
There is a difference between facts, and speculation, that point seems lost on many who wish with all their heart and soul that the earth is warming, that's it the capitalist fault, and were all gonna die.

DustyJoe

(849 posts)
28. high desert still seasonal
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 07:48 PM
Jun 2016

February lows stayed between zero and ten for a month and June temps the past few weeks staying mid 90's preceeding the monsoons that start in July. Pretty much the same as it has the 45 years i've lived here. Seasons seem intact here at least.

raven mad

(4,940 posts)
31. It hasn't hit 50 below in years, and that used to be where the "bragging rights" came in,
Wed Jun 29, 2016, 09:14 PM
Jun 2016

here in the Interior. Permafrost isn't, anymore. Polar bears are dying. Villages on the coast are drowning. Glaciers receding at an alarming rate.

The first palm tree I see growing on it's own in Juneau? That's it for me!

Over the past 60 years, the average temperature across Alaska has increased by approximately 3°F.[3] This increase is more than twice the warming seen in the rest of the United States. Warming in the winter has increased by an average of 6°F [3] and has led to changes in ecosystems, such as earlier breakup of river ice in the spring. As the climate continues to warm, average annual temperatures in Alaska are projected to increase an additional 2 to 4°F by the middle of this century.[3] Precipitation in Alaska is projected to increase during all seasons by the end of this century. Despite increased precipitation, the state is likely to become drier due to greater evaporation caused by warming temperatures and longer growing seasons.[3]


https://www3.epa.gov/climatechange/impacts/alaska.html

Hey, folks (in particular CC "isn't real" idiots, mostly Repukes) - Denial AIN'T a river in Africa, and if this keeps up, there may not be any rivers left.

Barrow is considered a "ground zero".............. and any Alaskan who's been here 30+ years will tell you that, yeah, that glacier used to come all the way up to the road, you could park and get out and touch it........... Not anymore.

Mendenhall:

Odin2005

(53,521 posts)
36. That headline is very misleading and sensationalist.
Thu Jun 30, 2016, 08:37 AM
Jun 2016

Jet streams are messy things with lots of splits, meanders, and even the occasional cut-off upper-level low. Based on the weather map in the article this is just one rather weak jet stream branch crossing the equator, which is really bizarre and possibly indicative of the sort of weather fuckery expected from global warming but it's not "OMG, WE'RE DOOOOOOOMED!!!".

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