How About National Mail-In Presidential Elections?

[MineralMan]

We have one election in this country that selects two national candidates - the President and Vice-President.

All other elections are local, district or state elections. Why should the presidential race have to be subject to all the weird state-by-state election processes in the first place? Instead, why do we not institute a nationwide presidential election on a mail-in ballot basis? The Federal government has all of our addresses, via the IRS and other agencies. For those who are homeless or do not file income taxes, another method could be found to deliver ballots to those people.

Now, even if we kept the electoral college, a simple state code on each ballot could identify the source of that ballot for tabulation purposes. Ballots could be sent to every adult via the USPS, following the party primaries and conventions identified the various candidates. A postage-paid return envelope, signed by each voter, but discarded before counting, would allow easy return and verification of completed ballots to a central vote counting location, where optical readers could record the votes from a standard ballot form.

Observers from both parties would observe the counting, tabulation and auditing of the votes, and it could also be streamed on the internet for everyone to observe. The states would not be able to suppress the vote, interfere with voting, or fake the count in any way. Voters would have until election day to drop their ballots in the mail, and we could allow whatever time was required for all ballots to be delivered by the USPS, which would handle ballots in a specifically defined way.

How could anyone object to a fair account of the votes of adult citizens in every state, territory and elsewhere? Let the states and counties handle local, district and statewide elections, but make the presidential election a separate, federal election with a separate ballot and tabulation system.

We could do it easily. It would cost something, but the cost would be well worth it, if it meant fair elections. By removing all of the variables of state voting laws and systems, it would be fairer.

[shraby]

1. I've always thought the federal election should be separate from the state elections with all

their various voting odds and ends which vary from state to state.
The way it currently exists, it's like mixing apples and oranges.

[MousePlayingDaffodil]

2. I believe you are proceeding from an unsound premise . . .

. . . when you ask "why should the presidential race have to be subject to all the weird state-by-state election processes in the first place?"

Article II, Section 2 of the U.S. Constitution specifies that "each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress ...." (emphasis added).

In other words, the reason that the "presidential race" is "subject to all the weird state-by-state election processes in the first place" is that the Constitution provides for precisely that. It is left to each individual state to decide how it wishes to appoint its Electors.

[MineralMan]

5. But, see, the vote would be taken state-by-state and the results

transmitted to the various states, which could use their constitutional right to choose electors based on their voters' choices. My suggestion would not violate the Constitution in any way. The states would still appoint their electors.

Personally, I'd like to see the EC go away, but I understand why that is unlikely, too.

The idea is to remove the state from the process of controlling voting for President and VP. Federal law already sets standards for who can vote in Presidential elections, and every state follows that law in one way or another. But voter registration and voting locations remains in state hands. I suggest that, for the President and VP, that should no longer be the case.

I want to standardize voting qualification and balloting for just those two elections. But the state can still appoint electors based on the results for that state. Simple. Ballots will be coded by state when they are mailed out, and the state would be one data point during tallying.

[MousePlayingDaffodil]

11. I think you're missing the point . . .

. . . which is that the process to which we colloquially refer as the "presidential election" -- i.e., the process that takes place -- or, rather, which now culminates (given the widespread use of "early voting" in various states -- on the "first Tuesday after the first Monday in November" is not, constitutionally-speaking, the "presidential election." Constitutionally-speaking, the "presidential election" has yet to take place. By operation of Amendment XII and the U.S. Code, the presidential election will take place on December 19. See 3 U.S.C. sec. 7 ("The electors of President and Vice President of each State shall meet and give their votes on the first Monday after the second Wednesday in December next following their appointment at such place in each State as the legislature of such State shall direct.&quot . In this regard, I would add, technically-speaking, Donald Trump is not yet the "President elect" as that term is used in the Constitution.

Rather, what takes place on "election day" in November is the various states appointing their Electors. See 3 U.S.C. sec. 1 ("The electors of President and Vice President shall be appointed, in each State, on the Tuesday next after the first Monday in November, in every fourth year succeeding every election of a President and Vice President.&quot

To do what you propose would require a constitutional amendment, as others here have pointed out.

[TreasonousBastard]

6. This is true-- it would require an amendment that might not set up...

anything better than we have now.

[beaglelover]

3. I like your idea!! But I would not make it by state, all votes should just count equally.

The various states get equal representation in the Federal government in the Senate. No need for the POTUS vote to be by state.

[MineralMan]

4. Frankly, I would prefer that, as well.

However, I think that dumping the electoral college is going to be a tough nut.

[MichMary]

7. That would take a Constitutional amendment

2: Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or Person holding an Office of Trust or Profit under the United States, shall be appointed an Elector.

The process for amending the Constitution is cumbersome. And at this time, with an R Senate, R House, 30-some governorships, R-dominated legislatures, etc., etc. I would say the chances of that kind of an amendment passing would be somewhere near zero.

[LisaM]

8. Who pays for the stamps? Who makes sure people have access to post offices?

We have all mail-in here (in Washington) and I hate it. It also hasn't increased turnout.

[LisaM]

10. Seattle also has a HUGE mail theft problem

A lot of people put their outgoing mail in boxes that are accessible to the public. We have an enormous problem with mail theft - people just taking everything out of mailboxes, particularly anything that looks like it might have money (the problem is worse at holiday time). Some people have responded by buying locking mailboxes, but now those are getting ripped open, too.

I can only imagine the shenanigans that would go on during election season.

[TreasonousBastard]

9. Right off the top of my head I see a problem with PO Boxes...

people moving without tell the new huge federal bureaucracy about it, and just the extraordinary job of one agency registering and getting ballots to maybe two hundred million people and then counting them-- essentially duplicating the job states are doing reasonably well at now. And relying on the Post Office...

Since there is a fairly large population that only votes in Presidential elections, and not all of them, state turnouts now benefit by having local elections the same day as Federal ones.

Several states are experimenting with various new voting schemes, and time will tell which ones are actually workable.