I don't think this administration fully understands just how many

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

seniors are out there, and how riled up we can get. They think the protests against Trump and various nominees have been unpleasant? I don't think they know what could come.

It's bad enough we didn't get an increase this year or last, thanks to the way the COLA is figured. To go back to the days when there was no COLA, before 1975, when the phrase "Living on a Fixed Income" was absolutely true, will bring back those golden days of dire poverty to many seniors. I hope it's clear I'm being very sarcastic with the use of golden days. Furthermore, if they think they can actually cut SS they will discover just what an insurrection could look like.

SS was intended to be the third leg of a three-legged stool, the other two legs being a pension and savings. And each one of those legs should contribute about a third of an older person's income. For lots of reasons (and the disappearance of pensions is only part of the story) some very large number of seniors depend on SS for anywhere from half to all of their income. Which means those people are living pretty close to the edge.

A lot of those seniors vote, and a lot of them will let Congress know exactly what they think if any cuts are planned. A quick look at the SSA website shows that over 43 million people over the age of 65 receive SS. There are several million more disabled people receiving SS or SSI, and several million more under the age of 65 who took early retirement. I suspect that a noticeable percentage of those many millions would protest, march in the streets in their home cities and in DC. Many thousands would occupy their Representatives' and Senators' offices.

It's rarely a good idea to mess with old people.

[iemitsu]

1. You bet we will.

[leftofcool]

2. Actually he does realize how many of us there are.

So does the GOP. They just don't care.

[napi21]

10. The Con and his cohorts in crime might not care, but the Congress Critters DO! It's THEIR seats

on the block and they sure don't want to loose their next election. THEIR seat is MUCH more important than the Con in the WH. They know he'll be gone some day, one way or another, but THEY still want to be in power. They'll kick that JA to the curb if it costs THEM!

[leftstreet]

3. They understand. They don't care

They aren't afraid of citizens

Yet

[iluvtennis]

26. +1000 that that congress reps don't seem to care what their constituents think/want. nt

[lastlib]

39. Actually, they might be afraid of citizens, but......

they're MORE afraid of their owners, the mega-donors. The congresscritters don't DARE risk the wrath of the 1% by actually working for constituents.

[Wounded Bear]

4. I'm one of those...

I depend on my SS income, and I had to retire early at 62, so I took a cut to do that.

I got a $5/month raise. My rent went up $23. Prices on fuel and food are already on the rise.

Yeah, I vote blue.

[tblue37]

5. Seniors VOTE! nt

[Generic Brad]

37. And if they suspend elections - oh, well

They would not mess with things like that unless they were assured they would never lose power again. Either the fix is in or they plan to cancel all future elections.

[MineralMan]

51. And how would they do that in this country?

That's just silly, really. We'll have our election, as always. Will we turn out? That's the real question.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

52. Back in 2004 a lot of people were freaking out over the possibility

of elections being cancelled. It didn't happen then, it won't happen in the future.

[democratisphere]

6. Many strong loud persistent voices can and will make a difference.

Never let up!

[napi21]

7. Hooray to YOU for helping to promote the opinion of most all Seniors! I posted something

similar about a week or so ago. More or less saying "You ain't seen nothin' yet!" I've been consistently writing to my Rep. & two Sens. every time I see some comment of theirs disparaging tthe ACA, SS, Medicare, and the like, and they get mouthy about those things all the time. I'm in a wheelchair, but I will be occupying their offices with the rest of you if they push any cuts, reductions, or major changes to those programs.

I joined the "Indivisibles of Ga." recently. They have sub groups set up for almost all the Counties in Ga. and have a great blog network to keep people informed of any new info and which of our congress critters ha said or done something we can't let pass.

Check to see if there are groups near you that you can join.

It's the only way we can save our Country from an insane dictator!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

8. Well stated! K&R n/t

[DFW]

9. Give me about 3 weeks

Then I officially become a "senior," too. I'm already more than a little tiled up.

[napi21]

12. Hey! You're oe of us already! It's only the regulations who worry about "3 weeks". Please

join a local group and start writing & calling your congressmen. The more active we get, the more afraid THEY get. IF we caan get them running scared, WE WIN!

[DFW]

13. Local group? That would be a little complicated

I live in the German Rheinland (greater Düsseldorf area). Back home, my local congressman, after DeLay's gerrymandering, is Pete Sessions, who robotically does whatever his extremist right wing masters tell him to do. He is a little piece of refuse not worth a call to the States. I'd rather call a friend, like Jerry Nadler (D-NY), who thinks like I do, and will vote as I would if I were in Congress.

[napi21]

14. Can you vote at election time? My son voted from Italy while he was working there.

If you can vote, you are a constituent who can join others to vote these idiots out of office. I understand calling is out of the question, but sending an email to express your dissatisfaction only takes a few minutes and will help push a PUB closer to panic! Believe me, they're lovin this being in total charge gig, and lots of angry contacts will stress them out. It's worth it for you (if you come back) & all of us too/

[DFW]

17. I can and do vote.

I send email, but sending Pete Sessions anything but money gets ignored. I keep my contacts up, although usually with people who I think will listen:
[URL=.html][IMG][/IMG][/URL]

[brer cat]

27. You know how to make us green with envy!

[DFW]

28. Just presenting my credentials

Beats a long explanation

[brer cat]

29. I've seen those particular creds before

and they are quite impressive. Sigh. I wish I could shake his hand, or better yet get hug!

[DFW]

48. It was a privilege to spend an hour with him

His breadth of knowledge after 3½ years in office was impressive. I realize that a U.S. President's breadth of knowledge after 3½ years in office is SUPPOSED to be impressive, but too often it is the opposite. I'd opine that this will be the case with the present office holder, except that I think there is a very good chance he won't hold that office 3½ years from now.

[Cha]

49. Not an Obama hug but I saw this pic earlier and saved it.. 'cause it's so cute..

I know I'm crazy.

[lunatica]

11. I certainly plan to get riled if they mess with SS

I'm over 65 and still work full time. I will need my SS and I will need my modest pension so I can have a fundamental income that can't be taken away by Wall Street or any President. It may turn out to be the one thing that keeps me from being homeless.

[lastlib]

40. Be pro-active--get riled up now, before they act.

Beat them over the head with your concern, and let them know the consequences in advance of messing with SS.

[usaf-vet]

54. Sadly they are purposely NOT listening.

GOP Congress members are shutting off their phone, not retuning calls, not going to town hall meetings, sending aides to meetings rather than attending themselves, saying that they fear for their safety (Democrats remember tea party), saying the protester are bused in and paid. When they do arrange town hall meeting, they either don't show up, leave early setup the meetings last minute or have by invitation only meetings.

THEY ARE NOT LISTENING!
THEY DO NOT CARE.
THEY FEEL THEY ARE IN SECURE SEATS.

SO THE MESSAGE FROM THEM IS... F U!

[jalan48]

15. Thanks for the post and you are 100% correct. At some point what do we have to lose?

We're old already.

[calimary]

16. Besides, it's NOT NICE to mess with old people.

[George II]

18. I know in our town roughly 60% of the voters are 55 or older. That is some voting bloc.

[Mr.Bill]

19. I think sometimes they forget

we are the generation that stopped a war and made a president resign.

[raccoon]

46. And stopped the draft. nt

[TygrBright]

20. Agree. And one of the places they're gonna find out what's what on Obamacare...

...is when seniors realize that the closing of the "donut hole" in their medication bills is gonna get rolled back.

That's gonna rile up a major avalanche.

prognosticatorially,
Bright

[napi21]

41. You're right! I forgot about that! WE should spread that info far & wide to get EVERYBODY at their

damn town halls!

[RobertDevereaux]

21. Bravo!

This late-sixties guy is with you all the way!

[samnsara]

22. be sure to support AARP!

[TygrBright]

42. Why, so they can sell us to the Pharmaceutical industry again? No thanks. n/t

[Sherman A1]

56. And the Alliance of Retired Americans

Any group that will help is a good one at this point.

[shraby]

23. We're ready! We're pissed anyway because of no raise in anything but expenses.

[LuckyLib]

24. What is just as frightening, is the number of Americans who have no savings and due to whatever

circumstances, no retirement whatsoever. They will be moving back in with the children who lived with them in their 20's/30's! And there will be folks with no family who will be in very difficult circumstances.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

30. I know, that is very frightening.

I am in a reasonably good financial place myself, and I appreciate that.

I'm also old enough to remember the first generation of seniors, my own grandparents, who got Social Security. What they got was a true pittance, and both sets lived with grown children because there was no way whatsoever they could manage on their own.

It could come to that again, all to easily.

[Volaris]

25. And don't think the elected GOP don't know this, cause they sure as hell do

It's why they only ever played at shutting down the govt as a political weapon. Remember how that lasted so long that the Social Security checks didn't get mailed?

Yeah neither do I, and for damn good reason. The GOP knew that grandma would go set the fucking county courthouse on fire, and THEN go vote.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

32. Actually, I'm pretty sure there's never been a shutdown

that interfered with paying SS out.

Checks haven't been mailed in I don't know how many years. You can only get them electronically, either as a deposit to a checking account or to a "Direct Express" card.

Trivial detail, I know, but it bugs me when people talk about social security checks being mailed out.

[napi21]

43. I understand your point, but, if there ever was a LONG shut down, wouldn't the processing stop too?

I'm pretty sure those payments are done in house, and in a shut down, employees don't work or get paid. My only point is the "checks" word is being used as a euphamisim to mean YOU JUST DON'T GET ANY $$.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

47. I have no idea how long such a shutdown would have to be.

And electronic processing of the payments means that you don't need humans to gather up all the printed checks and tote them to the post office, or at least to the SS mail room. The processing is probably very automatic. It's highly possible that new applications for SS and SSI wouldn't be processed.

Keep in mind, the shutdowns have never quite sent every single person who works for the government home. I like to say nothing is impossible, but even Republicans have mothers who need that SS deposit every month.

[brer cat]

31. It's not just the seniors.

It's also their children and grandchildren who don't want them moving in with them or being homeless. I don't think they could do much to SS or Medicare with an enormous backlash.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

34. True, the younger generation likewise has a vested interest

in SS, but they are, it seems to me, a bit less likely to storm Congressional offices over this.

I have two grown sons, and I doubt either one of them seriously thinks I might move in with one of them if my financial situation deteriorated enough.

[HockeyMom]

33. Grey Revolution

Remember, we Cut our Teeth on Protesting! I haven't missed voting since I turned 21 in 1969! Do not even attempt to mess with our Medicare and Social Security. Take you Voucher and shove it up your As------.

[jimjc]

35. We will but

the problem is in the south. I've retired in the south after living outside Chicago for more
decades than I like to remember.

Many people don't understand that southern seniors will vote Rep. no matter what, they
don't want to hear anything that will change their mind. So it will not be easy with these
seniors. The key will be their healthcare, any changes may help win them over.

[napi21]

45. Hearth Care & SS MONEY! Most southerners live on SS after they retire. They can't afford to go

even one month without receiving their money. I sympathize with you BTW. I grew up in Pa. Now live in GA. LBJ didn't realize how accurate he was when he said "If I demand integration, we'll lose the South for a generation." Problem is, I think he underestimated the time. I sure don't see any backing off of racialism here, nor when we lived in SC. Most can't even tell you why they feel that way. I've tried a few times with a rational discussion and without ruffling any feathers. They'll say they don't trust blacks, but don't now why. They say they're afraid but don't know why. Sad to say, I've given up trying.

[usaf-vet]

55. I was stationed in SC 50 years ago. That is the way it was then! I mistakenly.....

..... thought it would have change by now.. 50 years later. Sadly it has not. If I never cross the Mason-Dixon line again that will be to soon and just fine with me. I guess some of us are born to be "damn yankees" some are born or raised to be racists.

[GP6971]

36. Baby boomers who have children

realize that they have their children's support or at least I do. They realize that if they cut SS that I'll be moving in with them. That's reason enough for them to join the protest movement.

[elmac]

38. The fascists understand

they just don't give a rats ass about anyone but themselves and their rich buddies. They have the voting thing all tied up and can bring putin or the FBI in for a special boost at election time. It will take a civil war or revolution to bring big D back.

[ThoughtCriminal]

44. They are not just touching the "Third Rail"

They are pissing on it.

Almost as though they knew that they did not really have to worry about how anyone votes anymore.

[Progressive dog]

50. Total number receiving any SS benefits is

over 65 million. For medicare, it's 55.3 million in 2015. Most of us counted on the government's promise and we expect it to be honored.
Many of us have just a 2 legged stool, since our pensions became 401K's and most of the contributions were deducted from our paychecks.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

53. The Medicare number tells you just how many people

(or very nearly so) are over 65 in this country.

Unfortunately, the three legged stool rarely had all three legs. People don't save enough (and the exact reasons why don't particularly matter here) and rarely contribute enough to their 401k. It's also important to understand that most traditional pensions did require contributions from the employees, as well as from the employer. And that fewer than 50% of all workers were ever covered by such a traditional pension.

Which means Social Security is even more important than it ought to be, but it is.

My two Senators and my Representative are all Dems, lucky me. But if the Republicans try to introduce legislation to reduce SS, I would go to DC to protest.

[murielm99]

58. We did plan ahead.

But pensions are being cut. Savings can be wiped out in an instant. Even those of us who felt secure no longer have that feeling.

If you saved and planned for years and it is taken, there will be hell to pay.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

60. Tell me about pensions being cut.

I am getting a bit less than one-third of what I should be getting because the company I worked at for ten years when I was in my twenties declared bankruptcy and passed their pension obligation over to the PBGC. Luckily for me I'd always assumed that pension would be trivial, although were it the full amount it would me much more than trivial.

And the latest movement afoot is to drastically cut state, local, and municipal pensions. I have been aware for about twenty years now that many of those pensions have been seriously underfunded. Rather than trying to figure out how to fund them properly, the answer is to cut them, leaving the retirees totally screwed.

[BobTheSubgenius]

57. I couldn't possibly agree more.

One thing that should also be noted, IMO, is that one of those legs - personal savings - have taken a huge hit from both sides of the equation. It's much harder to save an actual nest egg now, and what you might manage to save doesn't produce much income.

A reasonable expectation for ROI in this economic climate - barring any catastrophe that might be around the corner - and assuming one is suitably risk-averse in their later years, is about 3-3.5%. This means that every $100K invested yields $3000-3500, before taxes.

To be reasonably self-sufficient via one's personal finances and assuming no help from the govt. requires a nest egg of $750,000 to $1,000,000.

The other approach is to just spend it till it's gone. Going that route, $500,000 spent at the "no frills" rate of $25,000 will last 20 years. If you need more per annum than that, you have to hope you die before your money runs out.

Now THAT'S something to hope for, isn't it?

[druidity33]

59. K&R, but......

I feel that someone must state this (if I'm reading the chart at the linked page correctly):
People 65 and older voted in favor of Trump 53% to 45%. They comprised 15% of the voters.
People between the ages of 18-29 voted in favor of Clinton 55% to 37%. They comprised 19% of the voters.

Of course these are exit polls and it depends on how much we trust them, but...



http://college.usatoday.com/2016/11/09/how-we-voted-by-age-education-race-and-sexual-orientation/

Though i see from this link that that is a better outcome for Democrats by 4 points than the last election:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/11/08/us/politics/election-exit-polls.html?_r=0