Nordstrom to target struggling malls when considering closures as JC Penney, Macy's axe stores

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

Things are looking dire for malls across the country, and the news in recent weeks hasn't helped.

In January, Macy's released the list of the 100 stores the retailer is closing in 2017. Friday, J.C. Penney said it plans to close as many as 140 stores over the next few months. Sears and Kmart have also announced closures.

These moves to overhaul their retail strategy and strengthen operations come as traditional retailers struggle with the fact that customers are less interested in malls and shop more online. Some analysts estimate as many as one in three U.S. malls will close in the coming years.

Seattle-based Nordstrom Inc. (NYSE: JWN) has been facing similar struggles, but has not done the wide-spread closures its fellow retailers have. Executives hinted this week that sweeping closures would not be in the cards during a conference call with analysts after the company reported fourth quarter results.

http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/news/2017/02/24/nordstrom-to-target-struggling-malls-when.html?ana=e_me_set1&s=newsletter&ed=2017-02-27&u=ColXVN5SPzQtLHFP87ho2w07857290&t=1488216452&j=77502091

[MineralMan]

1. The Mall is Closing. My closest big mall was ghostly quiet this past Christmas

season. It's anchored by Sears, J. C. Penney and Kohls. I was in there, because it also contains the nearest Barnes & Noble and I wanted a particular calendar for a gift. About 1/3 of the smaller stores were shuttered. The floor kiosks that used to populate the mall during the holidays were very few. What was most shocking was that there were so few shoppers in the mall on a Saturday afternoon near Christmas. Very few. I parked just short distance from the Sears entrance, in a nearly empty parking lot and walked through that store. Empty. The open areas in the mall had few people, too.

The food court had only a couple of vendors left, where it once had 20. This particular mall is moribund. Twelve years ago, it was jammed with stores and shoppers around the same time. Once J.C. Penney and Sears shut down, and they will soon, there will be no reason for anyone to be there anymore. Kohl's is a decent sort of department store, but this year, the counters were often without any staff. I walked past the jewelry counter, and there was nobody there on a Saturday afternoon near Christmas to show people their deeply discounted jewelry.

The malls are dying. Their time has passed. They will not return to life, either. Virtually everything you can buy there you can get from Amazon for less and have it delivered free to your door in a couple of days or less. Why would you go to the half-empty Maplewood Mall? What is the point of malls at all in 2017? They're done. Maybe those big buildings will be converted to senior living facilities. That might work. The residents could amble through the open areas without venturing out into the Minnesota winter. That might work.

But the malls are done. They are no longer of use as retail centers, really. Probably the Mall of America will survive, simply by dint of it's expansive size and easy access. I don't know. But mid-sized malls like the one in Maplewood, MN, are finished. I expect its doors to be closed next Christmas season. I don't actually care. The Barnes and Noble didn't have the calendar I was looking for, anyhow, so I ordered it from Amazon.

So long, malls...it was nice knowing you for a while.

[MADem]

3. Hybrid use, perhaps? nt

[csziggy]

27. That's what is happening to one failing mall here

Tallahassee has had three malls - Northwood, the original, Tallahassee Mall which has been failing, and Governor Square Mall, which is currently the more prosperous one.

Northwood was converted to alternate use - for a while the public library had a section of it before the new building was funded. Most of the rest it was used as state offices.

Tallahassee Mall is undergoing reconfiguration right now - part of it will be residential, part offices, part retail areas, including retaining the movie theaters. From the plans I think it will be a very dynamic area one it is done.

On the other hand, Governor's Square Mall is still hanging in there though I haven't been to it since I bought appliances for our new house in 2007.

[MADem]

35. I think housing IN the mall is the ticket, especially in areas of inclement weather.

Very HOT weather is as much of a drag as very cold weather, really!

Empty nesters and young adults, people who like to spend a few bucks going out to eat, would love a place like that. Be nice to go to dinner and a movie in a snowstorm without having to put on a coat!

I really think these hybrid use malls should consider putting at one end full gyms with swimming pools in and offering memberships--sorta like the YMCA only a bit more chi-chi. Hell, I'd spend money on that!

[kcr]

4. Not all of them. Malls in affluent areas are doing well.

What's bad about this is these closures will hit hard the areas that can least afford this. For some communities these malls were the only thing left, and their closure will mark the beginning of the end. It's easy to point to Amazon, but a large contribution is corporate mismanagement and sheer greed, particularly in the case of J.C. Penny.

[MineralMan]

10. My local mall is in an affluent area, and yet, it is

failing fast.

[Mosby]

5. a lot of the problem is high rents

I have some friends and family who used to own some stores, they left the malls decades ago for strip centers because of the cost of rent. Not only did they pay rent but they paid part of the malls operating costs like electricity.

In the Phoenix area some of the malls in really nice areas are still going strong, but they have to compete with shopping "areas" like Kierland commons and the area around Pima and FLW.

[Tanuki]

9. In Nashville, Vanderbilt University Medical Center has leased space in a once-dying mall and opened

several outpatient clinics. It is really a win-win situation, as it frees up space on the main medical campus, increases people's options for healthcare, and gives a new and steady stream of clientele to remaining stores and restaurants in and surrounding the mall. There's plenty of parking in the mall parking lot, and they run a shuttle back and forth to the main medical campus.

https://www.vanderbilthealth.com/100oaks/

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

29. The mall isn't dead, but many malls are dead

Many mall owners failed to invest in keeping their properties modern and desirable and invested instead in their relationships with large anchors. This was driven by a fear that the large anchors might decamp to free standing stores. This wasn't entirely unfounded, it happened in Canada for instance as aggressive mall landlords squeezed their tenants too hard. But ultimately lavishing the traditional anchor stores will generous tenant allowances was futile. The money could have been spent keeping the malls themselves desirable for the 6000-8000 square foot tenant instead of merely keeping their two of three 120,000 square foot tenants happy. I worked for a large retailer and I remember many surreal teleconferences where we basically brainstormed on ways to spend tenant allowances, these were always minor Saudi royalty level wasteful and tacky.

There is actually a shortage of prime mall retail space. But the retailers in question aren't going to move into the ugly mesa colored mall with wrought iron gold light fixtures.

[still_one]

2. Nordstrom is perceived or real higher quality, and caters to a more affluent demographic

so it may not be impacted as much by the "Amazons", or online sales as a JCPenny or Macys

There is much more overhead to maintain a store than for mail order or online sales, and that may be part of the problem

[MineralMan]

12. That's the problem with my nearby mall.

All of its stores are quickly fading and there are no companies looking to pay for anchor space in such malls. Once the anchor stores leave, that's it for them. Kohl's is not Nordstrom. and Nordstrom is not Macy's The Macy's stores are closing, too. Retail marketing is changing in ways that are not compatible with malls, I think.

[LisaM]

6. I know that malls contributed to the demise of downtowns, but....

what I really lament is the loss of the in-person shopping experience. I like to shop; I like stores, I liked the 1990s when the stores had high inventory and adequate staff. I like seeing people out and about.

It's bad that retail jobs are being lost - they say cashiering jobs are the next to go, and there are a lot of them - where will these people work?

[Tanuki]

8. I like being able to try on clothing or shoes before I buy. eom

[jmowreader]

15. I have to buy shoes in person

I have feet that are between sizes - imagine a 9-3/16 and you've got it. I have four pairs of shoes I wear regularly and they're all different marked sizes. If I bought shoes by mail the postman would keel over from all the returns.

[crazycatlady]

28. I'd only buy shoes online if it is a brand I'm familiar with

Or I'm replacing an existing pair with an identical one. Same with makeup. I have to sample to see if something looks good on me. Now that I've found my perfect eyeshadow shade, I'll replace it online.

Clothes I don't necessarily have to try on, but I want to feel the fabric to check for quality.

[NewJeffCT]

31. I had to buy a dress for my daughter last year

we couldn't find anything at the local stores that was reasonably priced and it was close to when she would need it - so I ordered from amazon. Unfortunately, she's between a small and a medium, so I ended up ordering two dresses for her - one small and one medium. She tried both on when we got them 2 days later, and then we kept the one that fit better and returned the other. (We didn't have time to order, wait 2-3 days, try it on, then order again if it didn't fit. But, if the dresses were expensive, many people wouldn't be able to buy two at once with the luxury of being able to return one a week or so later.

That said, I don't particularly like to shop, but I do see the advantage of being able to try something on before buying and also it's not quite the same browsing online as it is going through a rack of clothes or a shelf of books in person.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

25. Exactly. One of the reasons I rarely shop online.

And I don't know if I've ever bought actual clothing online.

I like to have the physical product in my hand when I purchase it. I don't want anything to be left to chance for shipping, or the wrong item gets shipped, or it's broken.

Once I pay, I like for that to be it.

[Skittles]

30. honestly, I HAVE to try them on

seriously, some people just CANNOT buy clothes without trying them on first - I think that includes the majority of women, yes?

[MineralMan]

13. Some people like that in-person shopping experience.

I think more, though, don't really have the time for it. That's part of the problem, I think. People are working harder and for longer hours to get by. It takes time to shop at a mall. Now, I'm not someone who enjoys shopping at all. I avoid it whenever I can.

[LisaM]

14. Yes, it's harder to find the time for some reason.

I dislike online shopping for a variety of reasons, one of which is the sheer packaging it takes up (I read some terrible stat about Amazon Prime boxes this past year, though I'd have to dig it up for the specifics).

However, the lost cashiering jobs could be a major issue in a few years if we don't do something about it. I never use the self-check at the grocery store specifically because I want the store to have to have more employees (if this was a tiny mom-and-pop, I might think differently, but our stores are all huge chains).

[MineralMan]

16. I generally don't use the self-check lanes, except

at one supermarket which I shop at frequently, because it is nearby. Without exception, the checkers in that store are sullen, slow, and decidedly not interested in what they're doing. So, I go through the self-check lane. It's faster and I don't have to deal with people who wish I was not in their line.

I've been shopping less and less in that store, though. The management knows how I feel about it, too. I'll give you an example. I was in line at that store, when I saw the checker stop work to chat with her sister, who had walked up with her baby. The baby vomited on the checker, including her hands. She wiped her hands on a paper towel and continued to handle food as she checked out a customer. I do not want the stomach flu from my grocery checker's hands. I won't accept any such thing.

I put everything back in my cart immediately and left that line. I pushed my cart over to the customer service counter and asked for a manager. I explained what had just happened. The manager just shrugged and suggested I find another line.

It's difficult to care about people who work in such places, since they seem not to care about their customers. I'm sorry, but that is something I cannot help but react to.

[LisaM]

19. Yikes! I wouldn't go through their lines either, and I'm no germ phobe.

At least the grocery stores where I shop are clean. That would never happen!

[lagomorph777]

23. I like to shop and always considered malls a hindrance, having to walk through a lot of crap

such as (ack!) the perfume counters in department stores to get to the store I wanted to shop at. Most malls are very heavy on ladies clothing and light on useful things such as appliances or hardware.

[eniwetok]

7. It's not just Amazon...

Malls aren't convenient for those looking for a few items... and so it comes as no surprise there's also been a return of the older-style shopping plazas... and then there's WalMart.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

18. I fucking despise Wal-Mart

Fortunately there are other alternatives in my area. I have a Costco and a Fred Meyer (it's a department store chain in the northwest if you're unfamiliar with it) in my neighborhood. Both are unionized and offer competitive prices.

[eniwetok]

20. Duh... I forgot about the wholesale clubs

The two in my area seem to be doing ok so they have to be stealing business from those high margin malls.

[Phentex]

24. Malls overwhelm me...

if I go, I try to go to one or two specific stores. But because I don't go very often, I find myself having to search for things. I try to avoid it.

[Initech]

11. When nobody has money to buy shit, this is what happens.

This is what the billionaires and corporatists need to realize - it's not the jobs, it's the fucking wages! The GOP can talk shit about jobs all they want, but when it comes right down to it, they don't give a fuck. They don't or won't do anything to improve wages or working conditions, or benefits. They just want what looks good to a right wing think tank.

[MineralMan]

17. Amazon seems to be selling stuff to people, it seems to me.

People are buying stuff. They're just not buying it at malls so much any more.

[eniwetok]

22. quick factoid

The value of the MW almost doubled between 49 and 69. It reached it's peak constant dollar value in 1968. It merely adjusted to inflation it would be worth about $11.05 today... about $7300 a year. This affects EVERYONE in between the current $7.25 and that $11...

We've let the economy to become addicted to a depreciating MW which means it would have a harder time adjusting to a sudden rise up to $11 than if the MW had simply been adjusted to inflation every year. The GOP uses its own duplicity in letter the MW depreciate as a excuse to not raise it.

[ProfessorGAC]

21. The Sears Around 20 Miles South of Us Is Closed

They tore the KMart down. That's how closed that place is.

I'm not surprised.

[Xolodno]

26. Amazon is the scapegoat.

Sure, it is responsible for some of the declining sales. But its not the death knell. These companies are just blaming a competitor that managed to catch on to technology while they stuck there heads in the sand. Makes for a better sound bite when you tell people your jobs are gone.

Income inequality is the cause of death of the mall. I work in an affluent area and the mall there is thriving...I go past a mall in an area that obviously has people whose incomes have not kept up...and the mall shows it.

Then of course, malls have been over saturated in some areas, a developer would just mention they might consider a mall in the area and every city in the area would sell themselves into slavery.

Then some downtown's found a way to fight back, and good for them, through urban renewal projects that brought foot traffic back.

[crazycatlady]

32. It is also because people aren't buying as much stuff

Owning a McMansion full of stuff is no longer the American dream. When millennials live in small apartments in the city, there's simply no space to keep buying crap.

I'm borderline millennial and my relationship with stuff is that it exists to serve a purpose. Sitting on display to look pretty is not a purpose. Over the last few years, I cleaned out 2 houses of deceased grandparents and I don't want to leave my nieces to dispose of truckloads of crap when I die. (My boomer mother helped me and she's only gotten worse-- her memories of people are tied to stuff, mine is not).

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

34. The "urban millennial" is a fiction

[dembotoz]

33. I don't need a mall anymore

live in an affluent area and i can not really remember last time i went into a larger mall for anything outside of a movie.

i go to my costco and there are some stores grouped near by...more of a shopping area than a mall.
local trader joes is part of a larger mall and i just do not go there....parking is more bother than its worth. I like to park, walk in, walk out....spend a day shopping? not if i can help it