General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsAnother shout-out to Stein and the BoBs and other far left idiots who brought us here.
Still think there's no difference between the parties? Still think Trump is a harmless clown? Still think Hillary is the "corrupt" one? That fear of Trump is no reason to cast a vote?
Future FBI director Giuliani/Himmler thanks you for your help.
PS: yes, I'm going to keep posting about the far left every time Trump does something horrible. I'm not going to forget how destructive these people are.
still_one
(92,168 posts)DanTex
(20,709 posts)still_one
(92,168 posts)Cha
(297,154 posts)ordered to go into denial mode for all they're worth.
still_one
(92,168 posts)emulatorloo
(44,117 posts)Gothmog
(145,131 posts)nycbos
(6,034 posts)Last edited Wed May 10, 2017, 05:48 PM - Edit history (1)
Something something Hillary is a neoliberal, warmonger, corporatist, would have started a war with Russia. Something something.
The people you mention are too brainless to tell the difference.
pablo_marmol
(2,375 posts)Oooops.
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)Poor literacy, poor information gathering and knee jerk reactions are what characterize the extremists, it's probably why they're so easily ratfucked, manipulated, propagandized and why they seem to have been quoting each other so often.
I'm not sure if its deliberate, or if they're just lazy, but the frequency with which they engage in this behavior all over the internet is troubling. Even more so when they flagrantly project their own actions onto anyone and everyone who challenges them. It would be amusing if the consequences were not so appalling.
arthritisR_US
(7,287 posts)all they appear to be able to access.
Kahuna7
(2,531 posts)Merlot
(9,696 posts)The media. commie. Years of planning on the part of repubs. racism. Those things brought us here.
While I may not agree with or like the steins of our world, they have every right to their viewpoint. Telling them to get in line and vote a certain way - how is that different from repubs or dictator ships around the world.
Theyare entitled to their opinion and vote. We have bigger fish to fry.
ps.I don't blame the left for what is a HUGE story about treason and colusion on the right. What the right wing did is FAR more damaging than anything differing viewpoints on the left did.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)But the far left has now put two Republicans into the White House in 16 years. And this one is Trump. I'd say that's some pretty big fish-frying.
Yeah, the Steins have every right to their worldview, as do the racist alt-rightists. And I have every right to criticize both of them for their support of GOP.
Bradical79
(4,490 posts)Vladimir Putin and his far right dictatorship. That's the common thread here. Stein was involved with Russia herself. Many of the far left BoBers were Russophiles who constantly downplayed anything negative about Russia and embraced obvious Russian propaganda. They listened to Russian sources and fake news more than they listened to Bernie himself. Basically, they aren't some sideshow scape goat or people we have a slight disagreement with.
Jill Stein should be lumped into the same group as Flynn and the rest of the traitors. I don't think she did what she did because of the common "both parties are the same" fallacy. I think it was corruption and malice just like General Flynn. I don't know what she tells herself to sleep at night, but she's an ally of a regime that supports murder of non-heterosexuals, violence against women, and many other crimes that would disgust any real lefty. Maybe she was a legit liberal at some point, but today she's a fraud who sold out to fascists.
skylucy
(3,739 posts)arthritisR_US
(7,287 posts)Gothmog
(145,131 posts)Trump may be far worst than W
Bradical79
(4,490 posts)Not some lefty with a differing viewpoint. Why some are ignoring the evidence is beyond me. She did her job for Putin, just like Trump's people did theirs. Russia helped fund her, she defended and distracted from Russia, was at the same table Flynn had been paid to be at celebrating Russia's propaganda network. She's part of this.
arthritisR_US
(7,287 posts)bettyellen
(47,209 posts)They spread the bullshit that had middle America thinking - even those lefties "hate" Hillary. Their derangement was obvious to only those who did their research. They laundered the fake news coming from Russia to make it palatable to some lefties. It certainly was a factor.
They're trying to get the Russian investigation shit down now. That's not an opinion- that's treason at this point.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Our side specialize in weakening our nominees and actively work to take votes from our nominee. Even if rightwing candidates or voters don't like their party nominee, they fall into line when voting in the General. In a close race like on November 8, 1.5% to 2% of a vote in key states determine who our President will be.
Having written the above, we are better off talking to the non voters that did not vote and now regret their decision than to spend time and energy trying to bring around anyone that would listen to a Jill Stein or Cornel West.
obamanut2012
(26,068 posts)And, when is Jill going to explain that dinner with Flynn and Putin?
demosincebirth
(12,536 posts)She gave a stupid answer on why she voted the way she did.
Gothmog
(145,131 posts)JCanete
(5,272 posts)reframing her logic.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)LexVegas
(6,059 posts)boston bean
(36,221 posts)CanSocDem
(3,286 posts)...specifically British Columbia. They just elected a government of 'left', far left and way far left.
Liberals, social democrats and GREEN's. I guarantee they'll live better than you.
.
Cha
(297,154 posts)arthritisR_US
(7,287 posts)DanTex
(20,709 posts)CanSocDem
(3,286 posts)To be honest, I sometimes have trouble seeing "liberals" here and when I travel in the US.
What you call "far left", I call an enlightened citizen. Someone who understands the principles of social justice and devotes their efforts to achieving a just and democratic society.
In Canada, we understand the desire of corporations to seize the 'levers of power' and eliminate the public-interest-regulations that stand in the way of profits.
Ever since we took on the medical industry and wrestled control of public health away from the free-market, new generations of regular citizens grow up knowing the difference between a government that serves them and one that doesn't.
.
disillusioned73
(2,872 posts)the USofA still likes hippy punchy (unfortunately)... maybe someday we'll catch up to Canada when it comes to political enlightenment..
Thanks for your northern perspective..
Hekate
(90,648 posts)Thank you both for your input.
Bradical79
(4,490 posts)Their chosen candidate deliberately allied herself with fascists overseas. They almost entirely involve themselves with trying to disrupt the presidential elections rather than win local and state seats. Things that would give them real influence to enact liberal policy. I could care less about your Canadian Greens being great for Canada, while our Greens are trying their damndist to ruin my life and allying with fascist murderers. If they support our Green Party, then fuck them too.
CanSocDem
(3,286 posts)...is simply aware of the world beyond themselves. They are citizens of the world. Intelligent people understand that raising the standards of ALL people, raises their own life. The USA is mostly about personal wealth so I get where you're coming from.
The left in Canada has a big tent. We're all firmly aligned against corporate interests that seek shareholder profits over the public interest. Greens are our conscience and every seat they win is another victory for the people. Social democrats like me are the propagandists and liberals get the vote out. We work together.
I agree that voting "Green" in the USA is a bit of a stretch. So far you only see them as spoilers and that in itself seals their fate. However, something you should remember is that the USA stands alone in its' hatred of social justice.
.
Bradical79
(4,490 posts)Our Green party, perhaps unlike yours, is allied with Fascists. I don't know much about Greens outside the U.S., but ours are much more than spoilers. They're malicious frauds.
Also, while it's sad that social justice is such a dirty word here among some, the idea that the U.S. is "alone" in its hatred of social justice is absurd. If that were the case, it would be a much easier fight, and Donald Trump may not have become president! Maybe our Greens would then be an asset rather than a destructive and willing tool.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)I will fully admit, Canada is more progressive than the US. As an American progressive, this bothers me, and yes I wish we had stronger public-interest regulations, universal healthcare, a more equitable tax code, and so on. That's why I vote for Democrats.
But the far left here -- by which I mean the Green Party and others who advocate voting third-party or write-in because the Dems aren't sufficiently pure -- does not work towards any of those things. They work for the exact opposite, by intentionally trying to reduce Democratic turnout and thereby put more right wing Republicans into office.
revmclaren
(2,516 posts)Only if they actually light their a$#es on fire!
Sorry, no more bull accepted on the bobs and third way voters.
ONLY!
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)People apparently have their own super special definitions of what liberals are. If you don't see enlightened citizens here and in the US, who understand principles of social justice and democracy, I can't help wonder where you've been traveling and if something has preventing you from opening your eyes.
This snotty nosed superiority of Canadians is amusing, it's not exactly reflected as a 100% purity of perfection in those people who cross the border daily to seek medical care, nor do the regular citizens running around there shooting up mosques etc. seem to demonstrate this narcissistic view of Canadians.
I live in a border state and not a single Canadian I've ever met (and that's quite a few) labored under this level of delusion. But they've for the most part had their eyes open, and have vision that's at least corrected to 20/20, though even the ones with cataracts are not this blind.
CanSocDem
(3,286 posts)Basically it means everybody in the society has an equal chance to succeed.
I lived in the USA for 3 or 4 years at different times and then for more than 20 years I drove a transport truck, in and out and throughout the continental United States....since the 60's. A day never went by that I didn't encounter at least a half a dozen Americans who had NO chance of succeeding.
Sometimes it was the colour of their skin or their sexual orientation. Other times it was their gender or simply the economic environment they were borne into.
Everything about American culture screams "Inequality!". From trade and commerce to religion and education. The emphasis is competition, not co-operation. The free-market with its' vast cultural influence actually encourages INEQUALITY.
"Snotty-nosed superiority" or not....I stand by what I post.
.
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)So you drove a truck around and lived in a country for some years, during which somehow met everyone in the country and evaluated their basic beliefs? Oh, you basically decided for yourself that the people you met had no chance to succeed? This is not sounding terribly well researched a position you're taking here. It's possibly that superiority those blinders that led to these unfounded judgments.
Perhaps you should talk to some Canadians, who also experienced the racist abuse at the hands of White Canadians? The younger brother of a friend of mine would be burned by cigarettes on his way home from school in Edmonton, by white Canadians, who apparently failed to understand the English terms you're so kindly explaining to us Americans. I guess no one told them that their superiority wasn't due to their white skin but due to their sacred Canadianness that amounted to same thing their cousins to the south subject people to.
It's cute that you think American culture is somehow different from Canadian culture, same language, same genetic stock, same delusions of superiority and same blindness to its own faults.
Snotty nosed superiority not based in anything approaching any real understanding of the historical or actual reality of what goes on among these descendants of Europeans who invaded this continent and who follow the same patterns of abuse, denial and delusions of superiority not borne out by fact.
It's the same condescending bull shite that every continent that bore the invasion from the same Europeans recognizes, and it's found in sacred Canada too, just look at your spree shooting racists and the everyday kind that like to burn little kids on their way home from school.
There is no difference between the people you excoriate and the people you falsely elevate.
JTFrog
(14,274 posts)But have no fear, the day is young.
George II
(67,782 posts)arthritisR_US
(7,287 posts)JHB
(37,158 posts)...because they are $%$$*^$ responsible for this too.
revmclaren
(2,516 posts)So no... They don't figure into the equation.
Proud Liberal Dem
(24,407 posts)and the people and groups whom helped facilitate its outcome. It's a free country and people were free to vote for Trump, vote for Stein, vote for Johnson, write in a name, or simply not vote at all, but that doesn't mean that I can't keep being bitter, angry, sad, etc. about the very profound consequences that we- as a country- are now experiencing as a result of elevating somebody like Trump to the Presidency of the United States, as well as further empowering the hateful and destructive forces of the Republican Tea Party.
aikoaiko
(34,169 posts)Priceless.
TransitJohn
(6,932 posts)Cheers!
Gothmog
(145,131 posts)The JPR idiots are no doubt happy about trump's latest actions. Many JPR posters, BOBs and Stein supporters worked very hard to elect trump
leftstreet
(36,106 posts)Bleacher Creature
(11,256 posts)Everyone who allowed this mess to happen is going to have to live with it the rest of their lives.
dawg
(10,624 posts)Many of us Hillary voters are actually to the left of them. We just weren't stupid enough to throw away our votes in one of the most important elections of our lifetimes.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Blue_true
(31,261 posts)QC
(26,371 posts)I honestly can't recall it.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)I mean, the post literally has a criticism of Republicans right there.
This explains the tone of several responses, people don't seem to read what does not fit their bias, instead creating poorly crafted strawman arguments that don't go very far to advance the discussion, but do seem to fulfill the intent to disturb any amity by deliberately sowing discord.
Though that is the intent of some posters on the internet, it's a huge part of how we got here, but it's an obstacle to the fight we're up against now as Americans.
Can we honestly stop this selective reading and rude responses? It's not helping Democrats, progessives, liberals or sane people fighting Trump, it is helping him and the right wingers though. That isn't what we want as Democrats, progressives and liberals, right?
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)George II
(67,782 posts)...safe neighborhoods, all the food they can eat (and probably waste). Why should they worry about the consequences of a trump presidency? He won't affect their cushy lifestyles.
WoonTars
(694 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)WoonTars
(694 posts)Was my post confusing to you? How could i have made my point more clear?
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)So, here's your chance to be honest... or to deflect and give an evasive reply... or to just ignore me. Whatever you decide to do will be fine with me.
lovemydogs
(575 posts)Some people voted for others. That is their right.
It was not enough to make that big of difference.
I happen to be a progressive Sanders supporter who supported Hillary in the general.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)yardwork
(61,599 posts)That includes Jill Stein and everybody who voted for her in the GE, as Susan Sarandon bragged she did.
If you voted for Hillary in the GE, then the OP is not about you.
Cha
(297,154 posts)voters in those critical electoral states.
It was Enough to make a difference.. that's why he's calling out the 3rd party Assholes.
And, he's not talking to you if you voted for the Progressive Hillary in the GE.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)It's very strange and it makes me wonder what's going on with some people... I'd like to know what their true motivation is. The whining "can't-we-all-just-get-along" schtick doesn't seem very sincere or believable to me. There's more to it than meets the eye. I just can't figure out exactly what it is.
Cha
(297,154 posts)It's not like they give a shit about the Planet as they sit cushiony on their Million$$$$$ of Bucks while trump Fucks those who don't have any extra dollars.. and the Planet herself.
arthritisR_US
(7,287 posts)TheFrenchRazor
(2,116 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)They aren't blameless. No need to defend them by deflecting entirely to the Russians and Comey.
(The rest of your comments are related to the primary, so it's best if I refrain from replying or commenting on that.)
R B Garr
(16,950 posts)created within the Democratic party because of you-know-what and you-know-when and they exploited them. That's reality. The divisiveness was their reward.
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)flagrant lies and pure propaganda, while pushing them to not vote, write in invalid candidates and to go third party with the Russian darling, Jill Stein. The online trolls who were screaming BoBers (a phrase created and popularized by Kushner's Observer) simultaneously became Stein supporters. And I mean that literally, they all sported the same profile pics at the same time.
When will people who saw the racist, misogynist failure that was Trump and enabled his success accept the fact that their votes and their failures to vote are what landed us in this nightmare?
If they will not take responsibility for their own actions, their own ignorance and their failure to grasp what was going on here, they will continue to be responsible for their own misery at the hands of the people they ostensibly oppose but whose greatest enablers and supporters they are.
Purity voters are how we got gerrymandered districts to begin with, they need to own up to their personal failures and step up already.
Cha
(297,154 posts)hackers, the 3rd party Liars, the m$m, Voter Suppression.
pnwmom
(108,977 posts)the difference.
The idiots who voted for Jill Stein alone could have turned the 3 states.
BainsBane
(53,031 posts)Response to DanTex (Original post)
Post removed
Jamaal510
(10,893 posts)revmclaren
(2,516 posts)Karma is a constant in all spiritual beliefs and even in many scientific circles. And karma follows you into future lives as well. Damn you quantum physics (NOT!)
Karma is AND will be a glorious!
tenderfoot
(8,426 posts)eom
TransitJohn
(6,932 posts)Votes aren't owed, they're earned. Plus, your narrative about the left causing Hillary's loss is bullshit, too.
Ninsianna
(1,349 posts)the ire is properly directed against the small minority that lost states due to ignorance, anger, and plain old stupidity.
Had they bothered to do their homework and learn things, they would not have been such easy targets for propaganda and they would have learned that the issues they claimed to find so important were addressed by the candidate who legitimately represented them.
That narrative is backed up by facts, it's bullshit to pretend that the so-called left didn't play a role here.
The narrative that the party and the candidate that earned a historic number of votes is somehow worthy of ire from those who were too busy being ratfucked by the right and the Russians with their lies, is what's pure bull shit.
When one wastes ones vote in states where the loss was by such slim margins, one doesn't get to blame anyone else but oneself, fake purity and profound ignorance and a lot of stupidity and right wing misogyny got us Trump. Ire should and will be directed at those responsible, they thought they wouldn't be singed when they sought to burn it all down, and they're learning differently, but they don't get to blame anyone but their less than pure selves.
TransitJohn
(6,932 posts)But, they didn't win enough Electors. Another reason that the candidate's and Party's strategy failed. You should cast your blame where it is due.
Skittles
(153,150 posts)she ran against the least qualified candidate ever, a man who was held to NO STANDARDS AT ALL
TransitJohn
(6,932 posts)in regards to candidates. That is, if the purpose is to, you know, actually fucking win. Plus, her campaign was shit, too.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Too reductionistic by far.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)kcdoug1
(222 posts)For the aweful campaign they ran. Would have been MUCH better off talking to real working people than holding 2,500.00 a plate private fund raisers
rgbecker
(4,828 posts)Haven't seen any DUers claiming no difference between parties. Take your complaints to some other site.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)MountCleaners
(1,148 posts)And here is what he said to a REAL "far-left idiot" about voting for Democrats.
Stein's positions aren't that radical. She probably has a stock portfolio like Nader did. It's the Green Party's tactics and attitudes that suck.
Environmentalist positions aren't "far left". "Far left" ought to refer to anti-capitalism and revolutionary sentiment. But enabling Republicans will certainly cause greater environmental devastation.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)DefenseLawyer
(11,101 posts)"You're all stupid! Vote Democrat!" Now that's the slogan that's going to carry us to victory in the next election.
DanTex
(20,709 posts)meadowlander
(4,394 posts)Ala "If you don't vote Democrat, every bad thing that ever happens in the world will be your fault."
BTW, I voted for Hilary but bullshit like this from her supporters is a huge part of what turned me off about her campaign.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)...that weren't cast or were cast for Trumpism.
The far left is insignificant in the media landscape.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)and even if they haven't they usually have the good sense and decency to STFU out of shame...
It's the clowns who are still doubling down after all this time who I have the most ire for...
Skittles
(153,150 posts)and I mean EVERYONE
R B Garr
(16,950 posts)democratisphere
(17,235 posts)Else You Are Mad
(3,040 posts)The moderate left that voted for Obama twice and then Trump, they are just as at fault.
Oneironaut
(5,492 posts)They fit into multiple categories:
- Safe-space social justice whiners (aka The left's authoritarians)
- Putin loving Left-Libertarians (Stein, Assange, Greenwald, etc)
- Anarchist little boys whose mommies didn't show them enough love
- The perpetually outraged who insist that every Democratic candidate who doesn't agree with them 100% is the exact same as the Tea Party. These are the types that wanted Trump to win so that we can "let it burn."
We need to stop letting these dweebs steal the narrative. Part of the problem is that the media loves idiots. The normal left is "boring" to them.
Littlered9560
(72 posts)Since I am a low post count noob I'm not allowed to voice strong opinions here. Especially against he who shall remain nameless.