This is Mensch and Taylor's "Breaking News?"

[MineralMan]

https://patribotics.blog/2017/05/23/exclusive-marshal-of-the-supreme-court-warned-trump-over-muslim-ban/

Yesterday, that pair of bloggers announced that they had important "Breaking News," but they delayed releasing it due to the Manchester terrorist attack. Well, here it finally is. Once again, they have called up the image of the Marshal of the Supreme Court as the deliverer of their shocking and hugely important news. I won't quote from the blog, but I will link to it for those who wish to read it.

Suddenly, it appears that the Marshal, who has long been virtually unknown, is now a major player in the Trump debacle.

[uppityperson]

1. I don't care who reports first, but who reports accurately

[MineralMan]

2. Well, it seems as though our two favorite bloggers

have exclusive coverage of this crucial story. No other media outlet has even mentioned this unprecedented delivery of a SCOTUS order to the President on the tarmac. Is it an accurate report? Who can say?

[pnwmom]

76. Have you seen any other MSM report that included the court order?

I thought her post was useful for that alone.

[hlthe2b]

3. While there is such a thing as a USSC "Marshal", he/she is essentially the bailiff,

everything else about the procedures they cite are ridiculous.

Perhaps someone might send them both a link to this document from the American Bar Association:
http://www.americanbar.org/content/dam/aba/publishing/preview/publiced_preview_scprimer.authcheckdam.pdf

as well as some of the readily available legal primers on "impeachment" and "executive powers".

[MineralMan]

4. Well, "he" is a woman, but you're right.

If such an "order" had been issued, there would be a record of it on the SCOTUS website. I can find no such order there. The SCOTUS is pretty good about posting its actions as public information. I'd think this would have been noted in some way.

[hlthe2b]

5. if they were to take such action, there is no way they would not go through WH General Counsel..

It is ludicrous to think they would bypass official channels. The GC, after all, represents the institution of the Presidency, not Trump per se nor personally.

silly when so much of this background is so widely available if both bloggers would do a little homework.

[MineralMan]

7. Further, it is highly unlikely that this Marshal

would have been able to access the President on the tarmac at all. That is not how things are done. It is simply not credible.

I can just imagine the Marshal of the SCOTUS speeding to Andrews, flashing lights ablaze, and insisting that she had a "paper" for the President. Nobody even really knows that office exists, really, and such an action would be completely unprecedented.

That is not how the Supreme Court delivers its orders. It simply is not.

[sarah FAILIN]

21. Nobody else has met someone on the tarmac?

I think that's not entirely true, lol.

I will wait to judge this. I thought the Chaffetz quitting story was bs too but now we see it was just off on the timing which could have changed because of the story coming out.

[MineralMan]

23. Not without being noticed.

Somehow, I doubt that Mensch and Taylor were there to observe that event. But they have, you know, "sources."

It seems odd that the major news media doesn't have any "sources" close to the SCOTUS, you know, and didn't know anything about this emergency delivery to the President. Odd, indeed...

[geo1]

39. One thought....

Haven't been able to figure out if Mensch and Taylor are being "played", or if they are simply making guesses and hoping something sticks. A possible source for the idea this could have happened:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshal_of_the_United_States_Supreme_Court

One of the duties of the Marshal per this source:

"Serve and execute all process and orders issued by the Court or a member thereof"

[jberryhill]

64. US Marshals don't enforce discovery deadlines

The court would have to issue an order to show cause if a production order is not met, and that would be served on the attorneys, not the litigant.

[rusty fender]

67. Tarmac and holding up a paper

invokes the image of Chamberlain holding up his "Peace for our time" paper with Hitler, except in this case it's more likely a message from Arby's that reads, "We have the meats!"

[FSogol]

11. No way, the Marshal is a ninja-like superhero battling the evil Trumpy on the Tarmac using her

court-issued wishful thinking powers. I just can't understand why people question Louise Mensch.

[NewJeffCT]

29. Not merely a Ninja

A Jedi Ninja

[EL34x4]

36. I wonder how much $$$ Mensch is raking in...

...from the several PayPal donation buttons on the Patribotics site.

[MineralMan]

58. Not much, I imagine. And not as much as she would like, I'm sure.

[Cattledog]

6. So the NYT, WAPO, WSJ, BBC, etc. etc. didn't get wind of

a messenger from the SCOTUS meeting the POTUS on the tarmac of AFB to urgently deliver a message "you may be impeached."
I'm calling BS.

[MineralMan]

8. But, Mensch and Taylor have, you know, "sources."

Not everyone has access to their tremendous "sources," which are the best sources, believe me.

[pnwmom]

77. Who was Deep Throat talking to besides Woodstein? No one. n/t

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

83. But at least Deep Throat had his terminology straight

and didn't give Woodward "information" that was absurd or impossible on its face. And if he had, the WaPo editors would have been smart enough to recognize it was BS and not print it. If you read All the President's Men you'll see how careful the Post was to verify its information before publishing, and how they spiked stories they couldn't confirm. Deep Throat didn't give his stuff to the equivalent of an obscure blogger, either (maybe the writer of some mimeographed leaflet distributed on street corners?), but to a major newspaper. He wanted to get the information out where it would be read and believed.

[HopeAgain]

9. Man, I need to go back to Law School

To me, this does not sound like it is in line with federal appellate process. At least she waited almost 18 hour after the bombing to start with the new fake news cycle...

[MineralMan]

15. Exactly. The Scotus does not act in that way. Ever.

It doesn't dispatch the Marshal to hand-deliver "orders," nor to inform the President of the United States about "impeachable offenses."

The entire account is completely unbelievable to anyone who follows the court.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

84. Yeah, I don't remember any of that stuff either.

So I tried to look it up Supreme Court Marshals serving notices of impeachment in the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, Criminal Procedure, Appellate Procedure, the rules of the House and the rules of the Supreme Court. It wasn't there.

[mhw]

10. Why would anyone bother to read & re-post anything from them?

I'll wait for Murdoch Media to air their version.

Why the curiosity for Menche & Taylor is beyond me.

[MineralMan]

12. That, my DU friend, is an excellent question, indeed.

Why would anyone?

"Murdoch Media?" You do know that there are media not owned by Murdoch, right?

[mhw]

30. Really? You mean others than Claude & Louise?

I personally find the 2 of them rather interesting.

I applaud anyone taking a dump on Team Trump.
It's sorta of like, "Fake News back-at-ya-Donald Trump"!

Raw intel is interesting to follow actually. Sometimes it leads to a fork in the road. But the best part is when it dammed well leads to the outing of a most despicable criminal act.
I love the sleuths who live for this stuff.

Its akin to reading a best selling spy thriller. And it appears Claude & Louise have grabbed the curiosity of even the most diehard naysayers.

That's how I see it.
Enjoy

[MineralMan]

32. "Raw intelligence" is factual, but hasn't been fully analyzed.

Factual is the operating word here. What those two bloggers produce isn't "intel" at all. It is speculation, based on overactive imagination and a poor understanding of how things actually work.

It's laughable, which is why I'm laughing at them.

[mhw]

34. Overactive imagination?

Hmm, how do you know they have no sources.

If its all based on their overactive imagination, then they are part time great spythriller writers & part time genius because the two have had an some damned fine uncanny ability to overactively imagine the truth also.
That must be why they credit those fake raw intel gathering sources .
To deflect from their unexplained ability to also be absolutely correct in their reports

There's a million or so bloggers/twitterers online to read.
I find these 2 quite interesting since they are more correct in their leads than not.

And they continue to dump on Trump & his criminal mob family.
I don't get why anyone would object to that, frankly.


And that's why I will continue to read Claude & Louise.

[Demit]

13. And she was treated brusquely, sources say!

"Marshal Talkin was told by White House staff – brusquely, sources say – that she was too late to deliver the message to Mr. Trump; he had already left for his first trip overseas."

It's that kind of little detail that makes their "breaking news" so...special.

[HopeAgain]

18. And don't forget the inclusion of case numbers...

It's gotta be true, it has citations!

[Madam45for2923]

14. We are in unusual times with a very corrupt/treasonous administration

[MineralMan]

16. What does that have to do with how the SCOTUS

operates? What was described is ludicrous. It did not happen.

[Madam45for2923]

19. Woah! Okee!

[cwydro]

17. I can't believe there are DUers who actually think these two are trustworthy.

It would be funny if not so pathetic.

[Madam45for2923]

20. I don't mind people critical or doubtful of her, I mind what seems obsessive posts/peer pressure fo

others to stop reading/following her if they wish to.

My motto is I'll read whoever I damn please, including LM if I wish.

I understand why she can be criticized, but I don't understand the need to be pushy towards fellow DUers to do as you deem "appropriate".

That part is very annoying.

[HopeAgain]

28. That's fine

do you feel the same way about InfoWars?

[Madam45for2923]

42. When situations are fast-moving and tactical in nature, take raw intel for what it is. Don't mistake

Protip: When situations are fast-moving and tactical in nature, take raw intel for what it is. Don't mistake for analyzed/finished work.

Also, when things are super important and moving quick, don't spend time lashing out at sources if they miss a detail. Assess. Move forward.

Moreover: intelligence is a team sport. Different skillsets come together in real time. No one source knows everything - nor one analyst.

Fake News (or propaganda) is the mass repetition of a single lie. This is different than "Hey, it looks like - Oh wait, stand down."

Momentary mistaken observations or the need to cross-check intel with a subject-matter-expert is not the same as being reckless/fraudulent

Compare the above tactical intelligence practices with journalism. Both deal with information, but goals are very different by nature.

With regards to the nascent culture of Impeachment Twitter, think of the updates here as raw intel and journalists as finished intel.

For contrast, see what real Deza/Fake News looks like, exposed by @RVAwonk
(Story about Seth Rich)

Deza/Fake News is a coordinated attempt to distract the public from truthful (not perfect) narratives. It is not about "mistakes."

Deza/Fake News is the pounding of a single bullshit story in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Debate never entertained.

To sum up: you may see updates on a fast-moving situation. Seek confirmation. Use skepticism. Challenge your assumptions! And stay sharp

Link to tweet

I thought I'd share this guy's great take on situation we are in.

[HopeAgain]

45. Honestly though, what's the rush?

Let the public see it unfold in its own time on solid grounds. The courts, investigators and committees are doing what they do and we will get the salient information as it becomes clear. This whipsaw back and forth between reality and fiction serves nothing except to give fodder to the other side to scream about conspiracy theories against the President by more fake news when real damaging news comes through.b
People can read and post what they like, that is a basic tenant of liberty; even Alex Jones has the right to spew his hate filled lies. It's just frustrating to me to see these thread titles that portend to have relevant information and find out it is just Palmer/Mensch/Taylor speculation passed off as news. I am reluctant to even open threads that start with the words "breaking" or "sources confirm" for fear it will be another Mensch dalliance rather than a confirmed WaPo story.

Remember: the truth is on OUR side.

[Madam45for2923]

47. The rush is that there is a point of no return in Fascism/Dictatorships. Cannot let that happen.

Am very glad that the truth is on our side!

[bettyellen]

54. Well if that's so we'd ignore the WaPo and NYT reports too-

But they're actually spurning on the committees and investigators so that's a big nope.
Meh, there are going to be rumours and misdirections also. I think most of us already know that. I'm not lumping them all together as credible, just interesting.

[pnwmom]

79. InfoWars is an alt-right site. Terms of service bans that here. n/t

[mhw]

38. Thank You.

Why would anyone object to dumping on Trump?

They are doing a pretty good job of it & their following has indeed continued to grow.
Why? Because people are fed up with evil Trump's bs & he's become the villian we all want to see taken down.

That they engage readers to follow along in outing actions & players within this madness, is worthy of a big kudos to the both of the..

Wft, let them have their little corner in exposing & fighting against the international criminal coup against the U.S.A

F'king go for it Claude & Louise

[Madam45for2923]

41. Yes! F'king go for it Claude & Louise!

F'king go for it Louise & Claude!

[mhw]

43. We & many others get exactly what these 2 are doing.

[Madam45for2923]

48. Yep! & peer-pressuring us won't work as much as others wish that to be so.

[HopeAgain]

56. Making stuff up?

Mimicking the RW media?

Mensch was a pro-Brexit disgraced MP who alleged BLM was funded by the Russians. No thanks

[mhw]

75. Key word- "Alleged" thanks for adding that.

And they aren't making stuff up.
But some wouldn't know that since they don't read all they've written.

I really don't care what her past "alleged" positions are.

And yet some are busy discrediting another from outing the Putin/Trump chain of command.
Not my problem to figure out why that is.

I'll support anyone who steps up to speak against the coup on global & US soil.
Thanks anyway.

We do the best we can with what we're facing.
Kudos for Louise & Claude & all who assist them in their effort.

[mythology]

68. Because fan fiction is boring?

There is enough wrong with Trump that is true that making things up is not only unnecessary but also actively harmful.

[mhw]

72. Ha!

Why are people so mad about some anti-Putin/Trump blog they never ever read?


Oye.

[HopeAgain]

24. Ohh, they do and they are very sensitive about it

I've been described as a troll for questioning her.

[jberryhill]

37. Welcome to the club

I got called "Comrade" by one of the zombie spreaders of this horseshit.

This latest chapter is fucking ridiculous, even for Mensch.

[FBaggins]

61. Every time they make the news (emphasis on "make")

... I feel an overpowering need to meme

[seaglass]

44. Or #TeamDeza - so fucking absurd. n/t

[titaniumsalute]

22. You know Limbaugh, Hannity, Alex Jones all have sources too...

So what?

[MineralMan]

25. Sources are where you find them.

Or they find you, I suppose. But, Mensch and Taylor appear to have the very best sources, it seems. Sources like no others. Tremendous sources, believe me!

[titaniumsalute]

26. LOL...no LOSERS as their sources...

[Princess Turandot]

27. "...despite an order of the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals..."

"The decision to send her was taken, sources say, when White House Counsel, Don McGahn, did not release Rudy Giuliani’s ‘Muslim memo’, despite an order of the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals to do so by that date."

The 9th Circuit CoA isn't involved in this case, which is Arab American Civil Rights League v Donald Trump. The case in question is being heard before the U.S. District Court, in the Eastern District of Michigan (Detroit). The judge's orders from that District Court are even quoted in this article. (And it's a Judge Roberts, although in this case, it's a Victoria Roberts!)

Had they checked her order, they might have noticed the next paragraph, where she sets forth the next steps should the WH object to turning over the memo at this stage. That's allowed under the Federal evidence rules, and she obviously expected it.

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3718827/Arab-American-Civil-Rights-League-v-Donald-Trump.pdf page 8

The next step is the ACLU's filing of a motion with her this week asking her to compel the WH to release the document.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

35. They can't even get the jurisdiction right.

I think Louise and Clyde have a Legal Magnetic Poetry* set and they are just randomly stringing together legal terminology on their refrigerator doors.

*Magnetic Poetry, if you haven't seen it, is a little box of assorted words on magnetic backing that you can assemble to write "poems" on your refrigerator or other metal surface. It comes in various topics and languages.

[Orrex]

31. Marshal Marshal Marshal

[MineralMan]

33. LOL!

An apt allusion.

[FSogol]

40. LOL, DUzy!

[Lee-Lee]

46. At this point it's clear one of two things is happening

Option 1- Mensch is just making shit up that sounds good to her, and feeds into her audience, but can't be bothered to even get basic details right.

Option 2- "Sources" are deliberately feeding her outright lies and misinformation and she isn't doing a single solitary bit of basic journalism work by fact checking things to see if they are even plausible before she passes it on.

Either way any credibility she once had she's flushing down the toilet.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

53. Reputable news outlets try to find at least two independent sources

before they publish a story. If they go with whatever gets thrown over the transom without vetting it, they can end up with a lot of egg on their faces, or even sued. The Washington Post and the New York Times are publishing some juicy stuff these days, and it's believable because their practice is to verify the information before printing it. If I had some hot news that I wanted to leak to the media I'd go to them, not some blogger who can't even get their terminology straight.

[emulatorloo]

49. Curious, where were y'all when DU was full of Breitbart stories in 2016?

And breathless links to Fox News. And slavish reverence for Fox News legal "experts" (aka liars)?

I saw some of the vilest rw sources, editorial cartoons, RT hit-pieces uncritically and gleefully posted.

Ya'll spend any time or energy to shut that down?

Not addressing you MM.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

51. I didn't see a lot of that, and when it appeared it was usually shut down pretty fast.

[emulatorloo]

52. I know what I saw and I know what I alerted on.

I know DU'ers who did the same.

Thanks for the reply. Maybe you had those folk regurgitating RT and Breitbart and Joe DiGenova on ignore?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

55. I alerted on such things from time to time as well.

I'm just saying that I didn't see a whole lot of it (maybe most of it was removed before I noticed it). People do tend to pounce on stuff that fits into their agenda, regardless of the source. Maybe everyone should be a little more discerning and not assume something to be true just because they want it to be.

[emulatorloo]

65. Excellent.

I'm revisiting a very long thread from April 2016 by a DU'er I once had a ton of respect for. Asserting that Fox News reporting is honest and impeccable. So many in that thread aggressively defending Fox!

The thread's still up and has 132 recs.

Folks questioning Fox Reporting are ridiculed and attacked.

Happily she and her fellow Fox News Progressives have since found a safe space.

[LeftInTX]

78. I avoided DU during the primary

[MineralMan]

57. I was here, alerting on them as right wing sources.

I also posted about them at the time. That's where I was and what I was doing. Thanks for asking. I've been doing that for years with posts from right wing sources. Sometimes, they got hidden, and sometimes not.

As for not addressing me, you replied to my post, so I'm answering.

[emulatorloo]

70. I know you pushed back hard. That's why I said I wasn't addressing you.

I responded to the OP for visibility.

I've already been told that I must be mistaken that DU'ers uncritically used right-wing sources .

Thanks for confirming that it did indeed happen.

If you think I'm your adversary, let me assure you I'm not. If you get bored look at your older threads. When I saw them I pushed back on those lying about you and smearing you.

Take care.

[MineralMan]

73. No problem. Just clarifying.

[MGKrebs]

50. I think the issue is the obsession to know something before "everybody else".

This causes people to satisfy that obsession by offering any information they can come up with that looks unique and "real time". A lot of these stories may start with a grain of truth but in the frenzy to constantly feed the information beast a lot of the details have to be guessed at. And I'm sure sometimes even the original "grain" is a guess.

I think it's a pretty natural human quality. I remember getting excited about discovering new bands before they hit the mainstream. I just think that as one gets older you generally learn to filter what you see based on your experience.

[FreepFryer]

59. Given her centrality in Mensch et al, I await the Marshal's public dismissal of these rumors. (n/t)

[FreepFryer]

60. If Mensch et al's rumor mill achieves wide circulation, that is. Might be awaiting a long time (n/t)

[MineralMan]

63. Odds are that the Marshal doesn't even know Mensch and Taylor

exist. Now, if the legitimate news media picked up on the story, which it won't, she might clarify, but if she doesn't even know something is being said, what's she supposed to do?

Not everyone visits DU or random political blogs. Not everyone searches for themselves online. Some people just do their jobs and that's it.

[FreepFryer]

74. That's why I suggested it would take more circulation, and time.

Your tone and message comes across as really brusque and absolutist - I haven't defended unverified reporting as valid, so I'm not sure why you feel you need to instruct me as to the nature of society, blogs, online use by people who work, etc.

And - just want to put this out there in good faith - You may want to look at how you are communicating because I find it hard to tell if you are being condescending or just adopting a dominant tone out of exhaustion, because you wish to negate any risk of 'Menschites'.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

62. I'm going to post something positive (and OT) about Mensch

In light of what happened in Manchester, she's also been tweeting in support of Muslims and against Islamophobia since last night.

[gldstwmn]

66. This is starting to sound like

a bunch of Fitzmas bullshit. Why are they doing this?

[MineralMan]

69. Why are they doing this? There are a couple of possibilities:

1. They're being paid for it by someone. (I consider this one to be pretty unlikely)
2. They're seeking fame and celebrity status. (Much more likely.)
3. They see it as a money-making scheme. (Donation buttons on a blog are a clue.)
4. They're having everybody on. (Ding, ding ding!)

[emulatorloo]

71. Try Trash Thread, Trash Keyword, or Ignore Poster

Settings in your "My Account" page.

[pnwmom]

80. 2 things I found useful or interesting in her post:

First, she attached the 8 page court order from the Eastern Michigan court, which I hadn't seen before (I missed it in Politico.)

Second, she listed all the court cases that the Giuliani memo is relevant to.

As to the rest of her report, I'm comfortable just waiting-and-seeing.

The court order is here:

http://www.politico.com/f/?id=0000015b-fe11-d361-abff-ffdb15370001

[yodermon]

81. This is too much even for me. Great fun though.

In one of the twitter threads was this video, of trump getting off Marine 1 and getting on Air Force 1. No Supreme Court Marshal in sight.

[MineralMan]

82. Nope. I didn't see the SCOTUS Marshal either.

Hmm...oh well.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

85. Isn't that the woman in the red shirt, smiling and waving with Melania,

being all sneaky and friendly until she could sneak up on Trump and hand him that... whatever?

[yodermon]

88. Well... You tell me ;)

Here is Pamela Talkin.

[SaschaHM]

86. The presidential tarmac meetup that no one, not one single outlet or embedded reporter, saw during

the day. You just can't make this up.

[greytdemocrat]

87. Damn!

And here I thought someone had finally found
solid evidence of Trump not paying one of his many
Atlantic City parking tickets!