We tried to warn you - first they came for abortion - now it's birth control

[SFnomad]

White House Invites Literally Anyone To Refuse To Cover Birth Control

WASHINGTON― A draft of the Trump administration’s new birth control coverage exemption has leaked, and it is far more wide-reaching than had been predicted.

The new rule amends the Obama administration’s coverage requirement to allow any employer, school or insurance company to opt out of covering contraception due to any moral or religious objection, Vox reported Wednesday. Even massive for-profit companies with no religious affiliation will be able to deny birth control coverage to their female employees.

“This rule would mean women across the country could be denied insurance coverage for birth control on a whim from their employer or university,” said Dana Singiser, a spokeswoman for Planned Parenthood. “It makes a farce of the Trump administration’s so-called ‘women’s empowerment’ agenda and endangers a woman’s ability to make the most basic and personal of decisions ― when and if to have a child.”

[NoWheyJose]

1. What are the ramifications of this? Are they attempting to ban birth control?

[SFnomad]

18. Re: Are they attempting to ban birth control?

Not yet, but this is the first step. The right wing has learned they should not try and do everything all at once, just try to erode your rights slowly and step at a time, until they reach the ultimate goal ... or its equivalent.

[Ilsa]

23. They want to make birth control expensive for women,

and unobtainable for many.

I was fertile during a time when contraception wasn't covered by insurance, so I paid an extra $40 a month not just to prevent pregnancy, but prevent occasional ovarian cysts and regulate my periods. I was lucky in that I didn't have to decide between contraception and paying my bills. When OC became covered by insurance as a prescription, I had more money to spend and save.

[SharonAnn]

38. I worked for a Fortune 100 firm until 2000 and birth control was not covered in our insurance plan.

However, Viagra was covered.

And this was a Fortune 100 company with supposedly the "best" insurance.

Frankly, i would think it would be cost "risk management" issue. Paying for pregnancy care, delivery, and 6 weeks disability pay would be far more expensive than paying for birth control

[radical noodle]

46. I don't know of many companies that covered

the cost of birth control before the ACA made it mandatory (with the Supreme Court adding exceptions). Birth control was not considered a necessary prescription, but a choice women made. Sad that we'll now go back in time.

[Warren DeMontague]

25. Yes. Read the HLA plank that has been included in the GOP platform for decades.

They would like to outlaw oral contraceptives which most of the anti-choice orgs (the people pushing this shit) believe can act as abortifacents.

The real end goal, of course, has always been to overturn not just Roe but also Griswold (with that annoying "right to privacy", amirite?) and eventually to outlaw (hopefully with "biblical punishments" like death by stoning) all forms of non-procreative sex.

[LeftyMom]

44. Same for IUDs, and hormonal contraceptives of any sort

I haven't seen them float a non-religious argument against barrier methods except for their relatively low reliability, but maybe there's one I've missed.

[Warren DeMontague]

50. At the core, they're all religious arguments.

Positing that a fertilized egg is the same thing as a baby, is a position based entirely on religious belief.

But it is theoretically possible that they might "allow" people in this country to still use condoms, grudgingly.

[drmeow]

57. Condoms are allowed

because they give men more control. As long as the men have a say then controlling a woman's reproduction is allowed.

[Warren DeMontague]

58. Interesting theory.

Any man who has actually had sex, of course, in the real world would probably see some compelling reasons why he might want him and his partner to be "allowed" to use oral contraception.

I do understand that these dudes don't have a lot of sex.

[drmeow]

60. But these are (mostly) men

who think that women are fundamentally deceptive - they pretend to be on birth control to trick you into getting them pregnant and marrying them, they pretend not to be on birth control when you want to have kids cause they don't want to ruin their figures, they pretend you raped them because of any number of reasons. These are (mostly) men who think that women who have sex are sluts but men who have sex are studs.

These are (mostly) men who think women need to be controlled - and what better way of controlling women than by controlling whether or not they have children. Since a man has to cooperate (usually) to wear a condom (although prostitutes have some tricks), keeping condoms available means that men get to control whether women can get pregnant or not.

[Warren DeMontague]

63. I'm sure that's part of it.

I remember when I went to the March for Womens Lives in DC in 2004, and while there were 1.2 million of us there for choice, there were a few scattered jesusbagger anti-choicers standing on the sidelines yelling crap about sin and hell.

From my perspective it didn't look to me like they understood sex at all. Or, they were afraid of it.

Statistically, of course, women tend to be more likely than men to be pro-choice; but not by huge percentages-- maybe 5-10% or so.

But yes, unfortunately there are a lot of authoritarian types running around who want to control other peoples' lives.

[Girard442]

2. The religious right doesn't compromise.

They take ground. If any compromise is offered, they'll take it, but only as a position from which to launch new attacks to seize more ground. If abortion and contraception are outlawed, what could be next? Death by stoning for premarital sex?

[get the red out]

8. Yes

That is EXACTLY how they are. I have been afraid of them for almost 40 years.

[Blue_Tires]

3. Just one more thing to file under: "But Hillary is no different from Trump!!!"

[sinkingfeeling]

4. But they still have to cover Vigara, right?

[irisblue]

5. Well yeah, boner meds aredifferentdon't you know? LOL

[NoWheyJose]

6. Off topic, but . . .

. . . I heard a warning against taking Viagra and Rogaine at the same time. It makes your hair stand on end.

[deurbano]

26. Good one!

[Ohioblue22]

11. My insurance doesn't . Viagra is medicinal for a medical condition

And it isn't just for men there are wives that are glad it is available. Viagra isn't the same as birth control

[Demit]

14. There are husbands who are glad for birth control. So it isn't just for women.

And birth control pills are "medicinal," as they are prescribed for medical conditions as well (pain from endometriosis and fibroid tumors). Remember Sandra Fluke's testimony?

Not sure what distinction you are trying to make.

[Ohioblue22]

15. Mainly the poster said that Viagra was covered by insurance and I

Said that it isn't by my insurance. I never said or implied that birth control wasn't medicinal or that men aren't glad it's available. Any medicine covering medical conditions should be covered

[Demit]

20. Well, you plainly said Viagra isn't the same as birth control.

And the 2 facts you used to describe it seemed to imply how you thought it differed. Is there another way to interpret your comments? Maybe you could clarify.

[Ohioblue22]

24. Well like i said Viagra isn't covered by insurance b.c. is . Idk why people

Keep saying Viagra is

[Demit]

32. Obviously you don't want to address my question.

But I hope you remember the facts about birth control you learned today that, also obviously, you didn't know.

And btw, some insurance companies do cover Viagra, Cialis or Levitra, even if yours doesn't.

[Ohioblue22]

34. I have. apparently it doesn't fit the answer you expected

[Charlotte Little]

52. Totally knew what you meant...

Not sure what the deal is with Demit. Must be very touchy about this topic.

[justiceischeap]

19. Dude, you don't know much about BC, do you?

I'm a lesbian who was put on BC for "medicinal" reasons. I started menopause just before turning 30, which is bad, so I had to be put on BC to kickstart things until my docs could figure out why I was going through menopause.

There are multiple uses for BC that don't involve actually preventing pregnancy.

[progree]

28. Medicare Part D explicitely doesn't cover drugs used to treat sexual or erectile dysfunction

That's all Part D plans, not just some.

And my ACA plan (from HealthPartners) didn't either.

I don't know of any health plan that covers Viagra but doesn't cover contraceptives.

And I have never heard of a health plan that covers Viagra for free. But all ACA plans are required -- or at least were before Hobby Lobby -- required to cover female contraception for free, i.e. no out-of-pocket costs, not subject to a deductible.

And as a male, I am delighted that the ACA and many insurance plans do cover female contraceptives. So I'm not whining or complaining. Viagra and contraception are two totally different purposes.

[sinkingfeeling]

43. True, but many HMOs do with a higher copay.

http://www.personalhealthinsurance.com/does-health-insurance-cover

[progree]

53. Your link got chopped off. Thanks, good article. Here's the link

http://www.personalhealthinsurance.com/does-health-insurance-cover-viagra/

/---- Begin excerpts --------------------------------------------------
insurance companies have been ambivalent about their coverage for ED drugs, with some insurers picking up the cost and others refusing to cover any portion of the bill.

For example, Medicare Part D does not cover any type of erectile dysfunction drug. This is bad news for the elderly population, the largest group of men who need the help provided by ED medications. On the other hand, many private insurance plans, such as Aetna and United Healthcare, make provisions to cover the cost of Viagra or other ED drugs when deemed “medically necessary” by a doctor and if the patient’s state of residence requires them to do so. HMOs usually cover Viagra with a higher co-pay than for other drugs.

...A debate has been raging for some time over the fact that many insurers make some provision to pay for ED drugs but do not cover birth control pills for women. ABC News ( http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=91538 ) reports that several lawsuits have been filed against insurers for failing to cover birth control when they have provisions to cover erectile dysfunction drugs.
----- End excerpts ---------------------------------------------------

This makes it sound like only when deemed “medically necessary” by a doctor and if the patient’s state of residence requires them to do so. I don't know if treating impotence is medically necessary or not. (It would be interesting to know if there was a distinction between being married or single in the "medically necessary" clause if recreational sex is deemed "medically necessary&quot . The next sentence on HMOs usually covering Viagra with a higher co-pay -- it isn't clear whether that is under "medically necessary" conditions or not.

My ACA plan was a HealthPartners HMO plan, and it wasn't covered under any condition at any cost.

But the ABCNews article (link above) from 2002 says this (keeping in mind it is from 15 years ago, and formularies have long been trending to getting tighter and tighter ):

/---- Begin excerpts --------------------------------------------------
Within weeks of hitting the U.S. market in 1998, more than half of Viagra prescriptions received health insurance coverage.

... This week, New York became the 20th state to require that insurers and employers provide contraceptive coverage. That means that half of U.S. women now live in states requiring at least some birth control coverage, according to Planned Parenthood. Massachusetts and Arizona passed similar bills earlier this year that will go into effect in 2003.
---- End excerpts ---------------------------------------------------

I don't see anything about any plan covering Viagra for no out-of-pocket costs, unlike contraceptives that the ACA mandates be covered at no out-of-pocket cost.

Thankfully. This male, and I'm sure I speak for many, are delighted that female contraceptives are covered for free. For both selfish and altruistic reasons.

[radical noodle]

47. There are also wives who are not glad

that Viagra is available.

[Ohioblue22]

49. I imagine that's true it's one of the reasons planned parenthood is so important

[radical noodle]

55. Yes! I never went to Planned Parenthood

but I support them 100%.

[Doreen]

30. Well, hell yeah that is about the almighty man.

That penis is more important than anything in the world.

[no_hypocrisy]

7. Days of the Theocracy by Kristin Lems

[Wounded Bear]

9. The endless march of the RW to take us back to the 19th Century...

[Freethinker65]

10. If this happens, the Democratic Party should take both the house and senate

Going backwards on contraceptive coverage for employer based coverage will hit the pocketbooks of millions of Trump/GOP families that thought their coverage was safe. It will be interesting to hear the spin on why policies become even more expensive despite providing less.

[FiveGoodMen]

12. SHOULD, yes. But will they?

Over and over and over and ... (you get the point) I see posters here saying, "Finally, reason will win out. We're right and no one can help but see it."

Meanwhile, the bad guys take more and more ground.

My point: Being right doesn't mean you win.

We need to figure out how to get our message to people in a way that will sink in.

We need to find and effective way to counter the propaganda.

Being right doesn't mean you win.

[Freethinker65]

16. I think this might do it, IF voters are able to vote and be countrd

The GOP has spent decades chipping away at reproductive rights keeping the anti contraceptives/abortion voters nibbling on the line while other fiscal conservatives figured as long as it did not affect them or their families they would continue to vote against "tax and spend liberals". If the GOP proposed healthcare effectively excludes reproductive care (and even perhaps maternity/prenatal care), the Democrats suddenly become the party of family values by default. It would take a lot to screw that up, but anything is possible.

[TheBlackAdder]

13. Now in an equillibruim, if there are more births, $350,000 in taxes and costs per new add on.

.


Just adding 10,000 kids each year, for 18 years will increase a state's yearly budget to over $3 billion.


10,000 x $18,000 (school, medical, food, housing) x 18 until emancipated.

The loss from a child dependent deduction adds a couple more grand.



These fiscal conservatives will be crying in a few years.

.

[smirkymonkey]

17. Bastards!

[demigoddess]

21. it is also because they want to spend less on medical care for women. By the time

they have killed birth control they will work on some other area such as mammograms. You already see they want to cut back on pediatric care for children. They just want to keep women from outliving their husbands. etc etc etc.

[deurbano]

27. I think it's at least as much about control, since pregnancy costs a lot more than birth control.

[radical noodle]

48. And pregnancy is more dangerous

than abortion, but they don't care.

[Mariana]

22. I'm old enough to remember when the "conservatives"

wanted to make birth control mandatory for every woman receiving any kind of public assistance. They were willing for the government to pay for it, too.

[keithbvadu2]

29. We already have radical Christian terrorists in America... A theocracy will not change that.

............Religious freedom? ... Who decides for whom?

Cool: I must / cannot do it because of my religious beliefs.
..... I decide for myself.

Cool?: You must / cannot do it because of my religious beliefs.
..... I decide for you.

Uncool?: I must / cannot do it because of your religious beliefs.
..... You decide for me?

=================================

Some of our 'Christians' say they want America to be a Christian run country.
Which version of Christianity?

Many Catholics/Protestants feel that the other is not a true Christian.

What will they say/do when it is not their version of Christianity in charge?

Christians in Ireland fought each other using terrorism.

We already have radical Christian terrorists in America.

A theocracy will not change that.

[dlk]

31. It's About Turning Back the Clock to Women as Chattel

There is no logic or reason behind the Republican agenda for women's reproductive health.

1. They are against sex education (because knowing how the human body functions is apparently a problem/sin/government interference/fill-in-the-blank).

2. They are against birth control to prevent unwanted pregnancies.

3. They spend inordinate amounts of time, money and legislative sessions restricting access to legal abortion with bizarre and cruel schemes (think vaginal ultrasounds and fetal funerals for a start).

4. Then, if this wasn't going far enough, they shame and cut services to support pregnant women while the U. S. maternal mortality rate is climbing.

5. Then, after women give birth, Republicans cut services and supports to mothers and to their young children because they have no right to live indoors or have food to eat, as rich men need more tax cuts.

Is this agenda really so different than that of the radical political and religious extremists we see in other parts of the world?

Whatever caused Republicans to despise women (and children) so much?

[cynical_idealist]

62. Their new motto:

We'll get you born, then you're on your own.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

33. For about a year, my birth control pills were covered 100%.

As of a couple of months ago, BlueCross BlueShield decided to start charging me again for the same medication. It now costs me $30 a month vs $0.

I thought it was mandatory to cover oral contraceptives. I was told that if there is another equivalent generic available that I could take it and it wouldn't cost me in but I don't want to chance it not working.

[progree]

41. In the ACA, I think they have to offer a drug/device in every contraceptive classification for free

but they don't have to cover all contraceptive drugs/devices. I remember reading an article recently about it where some insurance companies are not quite following the rules or doing so in as limited a way as possible. Just going by recollection from some article I read many months ago.

[leftyladyfrommo]

35. Some of the right wingers see birth

Control as a form of abortion. Anytime the egg is killed it is killing a potential human.

Their goal all along has been to make birth control illegal.

[Amimnoch]

36. Anything to protect the group of cells, but still.. fuck the actual baby.

No birth control, no contraception, no abortion... BUT once you have the baby you will be forced to have, no insurance, no food or housing assistance.. it's your own fault, and your own responsibility..

Wonder how much longer it will be before they start going after the legalization of marital rape again.

[Dorn]

37. The anti-abortion debate is about controlling bodies: woman *and* men

If abortion is eliminated the next thing after birth control will be adding chips into everyone's body. This is not tin foil hat stuff, the IOT and internet are perfect for the introduction of networked human beings. How many people volunteer to wear tracking devices (think FitBit) now? Money is being eliminated gradually and completely by bank cards once the corporations can track you completely abortion will be the least of our worries.

If we want to reduce abortions increase the access to birth control, rich people have always and will always get abortions. The abortion debate is about controlling bodies the 99%.

[Alt-Orange]

39. It has now gotten to the point where...

I literally hate any and all elected officials with an R in front of their name. All this "Religious Freedom" bullshit has got to be stopped. This country was NOT founded on any Religious/Christian principles, in fact it was the opposite. It's none of their goddamn business what a woman does in her private time, rather it's sex for pleasure or to make a family. They are not for small Gubmint - they are for pushing their beliefs on others through public policy because they know religious believers numbers are thinning out as the years go on.

Proud Atheist and Freedom lover.

[roamer65]

40. It's all about white babies.

Next step down the road of fascism will be forced abortion/sterilization for minorities. Welcome to the modern perversion of eugenics.

[flibbitygiblets]

42. I disagree; I think it's quite the opposite

They take away birth control choices for poor women, especially minorities, so those children will grow up uneducated and poor, (especially with anti-education cronies like DeVos running education into the ground). IF these children don't end up in jail (privatized money-making prisons), they'll work in low-wage jobs that further enrich big corporations like WalMart and McDonalds. Without education, they'll be unlikely to break out of the poverty cycle, and are more likely to believe propaganda and vote against their own best interests. It's happening already.

They don't give two sh*ts about fetuses OR Christianity. If they did there would be free healthcare and no homeless people. They hypocritically use religion to enslave people.

[leftstreet]

45. Impoverished women aren't using private insurance

This article is indicating changes to insurance offered through employment

[napi21]

51. It also PROVES the Republicans have been lying to the people for decades! They claim to be against

abortion but now want to exempt from insurance the one main thing that reduces abortion!

[MontanaMama]

54. Where the hell are reasonable men in this

godforsaken country any more?? Men ought to be leading the fucking pro birth control parade!!! Last I checked...straight men like having sex with women. Do they want to make a baby every time they do the deed? Seriously??? This is out of control.

Not to mention the reasonable men who might have a daughter who might have sex outside of marriage?? Where are YOU guys? Back in the day (early 80's for me) I remember my dad telling me that it was MY responsibility to remain child free until I could financially care for a child. He drilled it into to my head that if I were to get pregnant, the options open to me for my future would narrow. He acknowledged that it was sexist and not fair but it was reality. He was right.

AND, where are the corporations that have a CFO with a goddamn brain? Birth control is a whole hell of a lot cheaper than maternity care under the best of circumstances. Screw these people.

This is about power. This is about control. It is THAT simple.

[raccoon]

59. THANK YOU. nt

[WinkyDink]

56. Are we ruled by fanatical Catholic men? Ha! What am I thinking?! We're ruled by GREEDY men!

[niyad]

61. "days of the theocracy" kristin lems

Days of the Theocracy
Words and music by Kristin Lems
© 1979, 2005, 2015 Kleine Ding Music (BMI)

First they fight abortion, birth control is next
Then comes sex if you’re not married, finally, out goes sex!
Put the prayers back in the schools, install "parochiaid,"
Allow for corporal punishment, and then you got it made!

Chorus:
We’re going back, back to the good ole days
When men were really men and women knew their place
Back, back a couple of centuries
And welcome back the days of the theocracy!

2. The family is so holy, there must be no divorce
And if a wife is not content, she must adjust, of course
And if he’s forced to beat her, it’s all for her own good
She must know what her limits are, as any woman should.,

(chorus)

3. The next to go is daycare
It’s all a commie plot!
What could be more fulfilling than a child, wanted or not?
A woman’s world is housework, God wanted it that way
A salaried job degrades her since she never works for pay


(chorus)

4. They teach us women’s lot is "love honor and obey"
And while their crusty notions seem like jokes to us today
They’re sitting in the Capitol, they’re voting on our lives
If we don’t stop them soon, our freedom will not long survive!

Alt chorus:
No going back, back to the bad ole days...
When men were really masters and women were their slaves
Let's go ahead, ahead for future centuries
And build a world that’s based on true democracy
And build a world that’s based on true equality!
Ah – person!