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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDoes Alex on MSNBC think she is at the beach?
Joy Ann just finished and I didn't quick change the channel....look what she has got on....yikes !!!
monmouth4
(9,686 posts)Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Dignity and modesty are not just no longer requirements for on-screen "professionals," they are often proscribed. Most cable programming is first of all entertainment, after all.
Just look at CNN's long discussion of bump stocks and gun rights elbowing aside little, unimportant things like children's healthcare, SCOTUS's gerrymandering case, the newest tax scan to transfer increasingly large amounts of our national wealth to a few.
I opened this thread thinking it'd be about something else, btw, and find involved discussion of a blouse.
calimary
(81,110 posts)I noticed that NBC has been trying to redo Megyn Kelly's look, having her wear a few more demure things, less peek-a-boo or "come-hither".
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)to draw Fox viewers, and most of MSNBC and CNN are now on my drop-dead list, so I didn't realize. I did read her show's in trouble.
Who knows, though. Since so many people have been turned into zuckerheads, caring more about what the personalities are wearing and being entertained with the latest manufactured/sensationalized violence or scandal than real news, perhaps it'll help. I thought her serious haircut, losing the hackneyed glam locks, was her big restyling.
politicaljunkie41910
(3,335 posts)later in the segment. Both of them are exposing their shoulders and both seem to be covered up to their neck, except that Alex's hair and skin tone are so similar in color that it makes her look like she has little to nothing across the chest but that doesn't appear to be the case.
However, if it is a case where MSNBC is trying to force their female anchors to appear more sexy, than shame on the network, and they should hear from their viewers if they are trying to follow in the steps of Faux News to attract ratings.
ananda
(28,834 posts)..
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)Lol. The subject reminds me of a ruralish Italian restaurant down in Florida. All the servers, middle-aged women of various figure...profiles, wear t-shirts and black tights. Don't know who started it or if anyone's insisting they keep it up, but it and some good recipes do make that restaurant memorable. Suspect they may like letting people know they're still sexual beings who still have something to strut. At least that, and tips, are reasons I could identify with.
Sigh.
TheBlackAdder
(28,167 posts)rocktivity
(44,572 posts)For MSNBC News, however...
rocktivity
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)asiliveandbreathe
(8,203 posts)clothes....OMG as someone here said...sooo unprofessional....yikes!!
AJT
(5,240 posts)RandySF
(58,488 posts)AJT
(5,240 posts)woolldog
(8,791 posts)Love the outfit choice.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,587 posts)But who wants professional-looking women on their TV? Women aren't good for anything unless they look sexy, right?
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)Yikes.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,587 posts)If you're a man you probably don't get it, though.
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)So you're right. I don't understand.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,587 posts)She looks unprofessional, not dressed appropriately for her job as a major network news anchor. The male anchors are all dressed in business suits; why would a female anchor be dressed in a party or beach outfit? If I showed up at my (old) job wearing that top I'd be sent home to change clothes, but not because I looked "slutty" (at my age "slutty" would be a tough look to pull off), but because it would not be appropriate attire for appearing in front of the other professional people I was working with.
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)muriel_volestrangler
(101,266 posts)question everything
(47,434 posts)It is unfortunate that there are too many men - young and old - and even young women, who do not understand what a professional appearance mean.
On Friday Nicolle Wallace on MSNBC wore an almost sun dress, and had a forum of four men, all in suits and ties.
Ever since Michelle Obama, in 2008, was praised for her "sculptured" arms, all of a sudden many women appearing on TV - cable, network, local - feel, or their producers feel, that they have to show as much akin as possible, whether their arms and thighs are toned.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)changed on a daily basis.
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)a kennedy
(29,615 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)calimary
(81,110 posts)"Sexy" for a NEWS ANCHOR????
Uh-uh, says THIS now-retired news anchor. That's not the point of a NEWS ANCHOR, okay? A NEWS ANCHOR is selling facts. NOT flagrant sex. And this is a NEWSCAST. NOT a peep show.
tenderfoot
(8,425 posts)What did she say?
leftstreet
(36,098 posts)LuckyCharms
(17,413 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,587 posts)I've always been a bit irritated at the fact that the news shows dress their female hosts in attire more appropriate for a night out on the town (sleeveless, with cleavage), while the men wear professional-looking business suits. This outfit was way over the top, though. Who let her out there wearing that? Or did they make her wear it?
marybourg
(12,586 posts)professional women started balking at the "professional look" and started wanting to look "hot" also, as in "I can have it all". The first signs I noticed (I was an "older" professional woman) was strappy stiletto heels and sultry, long straight, unrestrained hair. This was still a minority "look" then, but it seems to have become nearly universal now, if what I've seen recently on lawyer/doctor shows on Netflix is anything to go by. But I'm long retired, so I don't really know.
And I find the dress, hair styles and obvious selection for appearance of the female anchors that I see (happily only in passing) on cable news offensive when contrasted to that of the male anchors.
Orrex
(63,172 posts)I don't want to know details; an approximate description is plenty.
Clamdiggers? Jeggings? Shorts and t-shirt?
Is she in a studio or on location?
calimary
(81,110 posts)She's wearing one of those drop-shoulder tops that looks like a beach cover-up. Those tops are fashionable right now and look great if you're after the come-hither look at a cocktail party or some such big night out. That is flatly NOT appropriate attire for a news anchor. And on a Sunday morning, to beat.
No one will win any points for calling me a prude, okay? But FOR PETE'S SAKE! That is the most massively inappropriate on-camera outfit I think I've ever seen! Worse even than what's paraded all day long, every day, year-round, on Pox Noise.
Orrex
(63,172 posts)BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)Deep breaths.
calimary
(81,110 posts)BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)Trying to figure out whats got everyone all upset.
Rhiannon12866
(204,763 posts)Me.
(35,454 posts)I agree about non-professional but she has a habit/history of skirting the line. However, I did think she really crossed it this morning.
tblue37
(65,227 posts)spiderpig
(10,419 posts)Wasn't it in a promo for the fabulous interview? And in the "serious" conversation she wore more "serious" attire.
This shot was a head-turner when I first saw it. Nothing says "professional journalist" like a slinky off-the-shoulder dress slit up the thigh, accompanied by a pair of CFMs.
Women who spent their lives fighting for respect must be appalled.
demmiblue
(36,823 posts)Orrex
(63,172 posts)comradebillyboy
(10,128 posts)Orrex
(63,172 posts)Iggo
(47,534 posts)Zorro
(15,722 posts)TexasBushwhacker
(20,142 posts)comradebillyboy
(10,128 posts)jodymarie aimee
(3,975 posts)love it....thanks for the wonderful laugh....
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Id feel like my shirt was falling off lol!
melman
(7,681 posts)That's the outfit people are losing their minds over?
phleshdef
(11,936 posts)Last edited Sun Oct 8, 2017, 05:17 PM - Edit history (1)
Man, I don't see why anyone would care, really, if that bothers anyone, those bothered are the problem, not her clothes.
melman
(7,681 posts)Exactly. Sometimes you have to step back and say 'maybe it's me'.
For anyone scandalized by that outfit, this would be on of those times.
jmowreader
(50,528 posts)Whoever did her makeup needs to be thrown out of the union, though...she looks half-dead.
TheBlackAdder
(28,167 posts).
.
madaboutharry
(40,190 posts)I thought "What is she wearing?"
She has dressed this way before in really poor fashion choices.
spiderpig
(10,419 posts)and will soon become as dated as 80s padded shoulders and 60s Nehru jackets.
Whenever I see someone wearing one on TV I think: "Don't you realize that in coming years you will cringe looking back at yourself?
A well-tailored sleeveless dress is one thing (although I'm not fond of looking at armpits of any gender in a news environment), but this style reeks of "sloppy" and "ain't I current?" I wish it would go away.
calimary
(81,110 posts)@AlexWitt Dear God, Alex, would you mind PUTTING SOME CLOTHES ON? PLEASE?? Horribly inappropriate on-camera outfit for a news anchor!
@AlexWitt Who OK'd your "anchoring" the news with all that bare skin showing? HORRIBLY inappropriate! Credibility, NOT semi-nudity! @msnbc
SHAME on her. Jodymarie aimee, you're absolutely right. You wear stuff like that to the beach. NOT to the news set. Unless, I suppose, if it's the Playboy Channel or some such thing.
I'm very uneasy about all that "look how my clothes are almost falling off!" fashion that's so pervasive right now. All those bare-shoulder tops that are okay if it's a cocktail party or an awards night or a heavy date that is deliberately planned to end in the bedroom. I WAS a news anchor when I was younger. Even on radio, I understood how important it was to dress for credibility. When I was working, women were just starting to gain entree - not only into the newsroom but actually on the air. That was back when the only female on the news set was the weather girl or some other professional cutie-pie who did the feature story or the kicker at the end of the news cast, and even then, said cutie-pie dressed at least somewhat appropriately. Back then, your credibility was all you had - ESPECIALLY for women trying to break through that particular glass ceiling. When I started, straight out of college radio in the mid-'70s, there were almost NO women in any significant positions. My first several jobs were because they had no women, at all, and needed one to be able to "check that box". Back then, a woman NEVER dressed like that - unless, of course, she wanted the boss's couch instead of the anchor chair.
Shit - I remember going to radio conventions where I was the only female wearing a blazer. Most of the other women there were dressed like Alex Witt chose to dress, for on-air, this morning. DISGRACEFUL!!!
I hope women all over America are tweeting to her about how slutty and inappropriate she's "dressed", while purporting to anchor the news. GOD, why didn't she just go on, wearing a bikini forcryingoutloud!
melman
(7,681 posts)DISGRACEFUL and "slutty"? For showing shoulders.
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)madaboutharry
(40,190 posts)She looks ridiculous.
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)madaboutharry
(40,190 posts)And you don't know the gender of the OP. A lot of members use the names of their kids or relatives in their username. It isn't certain who the OP is. The fact is Alex Witt is wearing something inappropriate for a news anchor.
procon
(15,805 posts)If some dude was sitting at an anchor desk in a cropped muscle shirt with his bare abs, I'd still criticise his poor judgement. Outside of Fox News and their tarted up buxom blondes, the news is a serious business, not a personal fashion show.
Witt made a poor decision, and it isn't her first. News anchors typically dress conservatively for a reason; they don't want to become a side story that makes them the brunt of laughter and derision, as she is now. She leaves a lot to be desired as a journalist, but when she chose to pull a beachy, summer sundress out of her closet in October to show off her bare shoulders, she gave up all pretense to the profession.
So, one more time to the aggrieved fashionistas, the criticism is not about this woman's malfunctioning wardrobe choice, it's about trying separate the respected journalists as consummate professionals, from the giddy clothes horses who giggle and coo on Fox News.
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)Response to jodymarie aimee (Original post)
Post removed
Dreamer Tatum
(10,926 posts)Oneironaut
(5,486 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)Jezus H. Kryst.
She's wearing a modest blouse with a stylish 'cold-shoulder' cutout!
You did get me to look, though.
calimary
(81,110 posts)I guess you have to click on the link. imgur.com changed. Now I can't find the link for posting in discussion groups.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)My standards of exhibitionism are evidently much, much higher than yours!
My favorite anchor person!
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Just saying. If you got it, flaunt it. If not, keep it covered.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)But that has nothing to do with being very good news anchors who do very well at their jobs.
And I couldn't care less what they wear!
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Edit: But I do know when clothing is unbecoming to someone.
phleshdef
(11,936 posts)Dreamer Tatum
(10,926 posts)She looks a little casual on air right now.
That's all.
SharonAnn
(13,771 posts)onecaliberal
(32,777 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)Bueller?
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)She's wearing a top that doesn't cover her shoulders and some people are apoplectic.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)But Im not having any luck.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,587 posts)or one of those sleeveless undershirts to do a news broadcast you'd think he looked totally professional, right?
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)saidsimplesimon
(7,888 posts)of professional dress codes, it is my opinion that TV news anchors should dress better than Ben Franklin.
Didn't Thomas Jefferson say, "As for fashion, bend with the wind, on principal stand like a rock".
TenHouseCats
(52 posts)they're men, and that automatically renders them professional in all ways.
spiderpig
(10,419 posts)AW looks ridiculous now and will look like a fool a year from now.
It's been remarked that Cary Grant was the epitome of men's style because he never went to extremes in his attire. Always classically cut and tailored, which has given him a timeless image of class.
I wear what I want, but I'm not on camera purporting to be a serious journalist.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Oneironaut
(5,486 posts)Im all for professionalism, but maybe she thought that top was cute and felt like wearing it today? Its not like shes naked or wearing BDSM attire. Not sure what the big deal is.
calimary
(81,110 posts)"It's not like she's naked"? Well, all the camera has to do is zoom in a little, and...
Oneironaut
(5,486 posts)You would think her boobs would be hanging out based on the replies here. Its pretty funny.
You can tell DU is getting bored and its a slow news day.
xor
(1,204 posts)I assumed it was going to breasts hanging out with last night's makeup smeared all over her face. When I first found video of today I figured I must be looking at an older clip because it didn't seem bad at all. I dunno.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,266 posts)What would a zoom show different? Is there some detail in the print of her dress that offends you? I get that bare shoulders are anathema to you, but I can see those without zooming in (and I have no religion telling me to find bare shoulders offensive). Is there something about her nostrils you hate too? A skin blemish? An out-of-place eyelash?
cwydro
(51,308 posts)I mean, geez.
LuckyCharms
(17,413 posts)I think she looks OK. Maybe a tad inappropriate, but not over the top in my opinion.
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)Old Vet
(2,001 posts)Nothing in-proper with what shes wearing, Shes a fairly attractive lady wearing a nice outfit. I would of thought NOTHING about it if it wasn't for the do-gooders making a issue out of it.
procon
(15,805 posts)If she was going to the beach or a BBQ, then you're right, there is nothing improper with what Witt is wearing. However, she's a big time news anchor on a major news network, and instead of presenting a professional image as a respected journalist, Witt chose to look like she was attending a garden party in that frock.
Yes, she might be "a fairly attractive lady wearing a nice outfit", and again, that's the point, she's not hosting a lollapalooza fashion sale on the Home Shopping Network, yeah? Look at most TV anchor hosts, they are very professional and conservatively attired in unremarkable, dark, muted clothing choices.
This is not a question of us "do-gooders making a issue out of it", it's that some of us still think that its important to respect the value of journalism, a profession that is under constant attack by rightwing sources. Let not defend Alex Witt as she swings her news show towards the Fox News business model, where women really are cast as on air personalities based solely on their looks and their silly gyrations in keeping those too tight red dresses from revealing everything.
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)It ain't that big of a deal.
procon
(15,805 posts)It's quite likely that most Republicans don't respect journalists, preferring to hide their shenanigans behind spurious claims of "fake news" whilst ogling women on Fox News. Please, point me to the links, the discouraging stats, that prove this stunning assertion you present is factual, that it ain't a big a deal, or admit this is merely your own personal opinion.
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)You make such a big deal of some woman's bare shoulders.
I doubt you are a majority.
procon
(15,805 posts)the real criticisms don't even register.
Rhiannon12866
(204,763 posts)It annoys the hell out of me, too - not just that it's unflattering, but it makes no sense if you're looking for a warm sweater...
BannonsLiver
(16,294 posts)My pet peeve: People who aren't actual cowboys wearing cowboy hats. It just looks ridiculous.
My God this thread is delightfully ridiculous.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)The Church Lady would be proud.
Stallion
(6,473 posts)lpbk2713
(42,736 posts)Shoulders!!11!
CakeGrrl
(10,611 posts)Granted, it's sports/entertainment, but the women sure do have to glam it up for fans of a sport whose players consistently spit and crotch-adjust. High heels, tight dresses and skirts. No slacks or pantsuits - or anyone over about 3% body fat - to be seen.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)This is the *new* DU? Apparently?
Really?
MFM008
(19,803 posts).....................
xor
(1,204 posts)Someone get that woman a burqa ASAP!
I wouldn't have thought anything of it if I saw it before reading your thread. Maybe a generational thing?
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)in the real world.
It would be inappropriate for a teacher, for a banker, for a cop, for a physician,.....you surely get the drift.
But hey, if Jeremy Bash shows up in just swimming trunks, I'm there! 😝
Polly Hennessey
(6,787 posts)Alex gives us news tidbits while we wait for our Daiquiri. Weather today: bright and sunny. Perfect for off the shoulder attire -- make that both shoulders. It is the Balmy Breeze News Hour with Alex Twit.
OregonBlue
(7,754 posts)for a news program. Not a very serious look. On the other hand, I don't think she should be stoned for having made a bad choice.
question everything
(47,434 posts)On Friday she was wearing sun dress while having five guests, all men, in suits and ties. Yes, I, too, turned it off.
Ever since Michelle Obama, in 2008, was praised for her "sculptured arms," many women facing the screen - I can hardly call them journalists - show that they, too, have them. And if the tables are open, show some thigh, too.
WoonTars
(694 posts)...for female reporters? How about its none of your damn business what she chooses to wear on the air.
What is this, the fucking fifities?
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)It is a shoulderless top. Add sleeves and nobody would notice.
I think seeing bare shoulders adds a little more skin in the image but seeing shoulders is not unusual.
I don't have a problem with it.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)wearing the same outfit.
Or a male TV newscaster showing up in a T-shirt or maybe no shirt.
muriel_volestrangler
(101,266 posts)For instance, here's a First Lady making a speech to the DNC (and being praised for her dress):
http://www.bravotv.com/blogs/15-times-michelle-obama-slayed-flotus-style
I think a political speech is comparable to presenting a TV show.
WoonTars
(694 posts)...and I've been fine with it...
Like i said, this ain't the fifties and we need to stop judging women based on their looks, or what they wear..
Voltaire2
(12,958 posts)ismnotwasm
(41,965 posts)From the description I thought she was must be wearing a crop top and daily dukes.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)seriousness, even gravitas?
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)By the way some folks are making it sound, you'd think she was exposing her breast.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)"on the scene" of wars or tragedies, but in-studio.
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)Last I checked male reporters weren't going through nearly as much of the sexist shit that women on air are subjected to. And yes, I'd take Thomas Roberts in a tank top on Sunday in studio seriously as well.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)general observation while not revealing my own. I would take Ms. Witt seriously, because I am familiar with her work.
But do I think she goofed today? Hell, yes. It's plain WEIRD.
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)the complaints on this thread over bare shoulders to be overblown.
phleshdef
(11,936 posts)Its seriously "get a fucking life" material.
Voltaire2
(12,958 posts)This is how proper women dress:
I give up.
A HERETIC I AM
(24,362 posts)As it would seem this thread is short of things to clutch
Jesus H. Christ on a location shoot wearing taffeta and strappy sandals
Liberal Jesus Freak
(1,451 posts)I sadly agree with thee 👍
Baconator
(1,459 posts)I'd expect this from the christian right exclaiming their horror at Michelle Obama's exposed shoulders...
What the hell?
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)Yeah, alert ME, after your asinine insult.
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)be mad when folks compare you to Twitler because that is what he does.
I'm sorry if bare shoulders on a Sunday morning has broke your puritanical little heart to the point that you feel the need to lash out at anyone not living in the 60s.
procon
(15,805 posts)Baconator
(1,459 posts)... but if the answers are yes then you've been judged using all the same taglines you saw in this thread.
It's a crappy double standard.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)teacher-apropos.
Baconator
(1,459 posts)I don't faint at shoulders...
phleshdef
(11,936 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)Baconator
(1,459 posts)That at least has some context and makes sense.
Right now everyone seems to have their plain white panties twisted over some exposed shoulders.
I'm grateful every day for the very little thought I have to put into my professional clothing. Suit, business casual (slacks w/ button shirt or a polo) or just my everyday Army Combat Uniform.
I've got 3 of each and can mix and match until the cows come home.
The women in my program have to have a full freakin' wardrobe and I'm sure they get the same dirty looks that folks are digitially passing along here.
Too short..
Too tight...
Is that a tanline I see?
Too loose...
Slut...
Battleaxe...
There's no winning and everyone should just keep their judgy bullshit to themselves until these ladies are showing up to work in bikinis.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)phleshdef
(11,936 posts)I don't give a shit what people wear or don't wear. I don't objectify that kind of shit.
RandySF
(58,488 posts)SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)If you want the thread to make sense though, someone w/ photoshop is going to have to put her face on top of an exposed Playboy model
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,311 posts)Response to RandySF (Reply #127)
RandySF This message was self-deleted by its author.
50 Shades Of Blue
(9,920 posts)Mira
(22,380 posts)so I'm not influenced. I saw it, and turned it off with the loud comment of: "that's what I call a fashion risk..."
I honestly don't like her show because, being a visually oriented human since birth, I don't like her hair because it is utterly incongruous with her face.
Call me shallow....
samnsara
(17,604 posts)...as part of my escape from the 21st century....
RandySF
(58,488 posts)rocktivity
(44,572 posts)with matching tubes on her arms. The bare shoulders are completely inexcusable -- and that hairdo was borrowed from someone fifteen years younger. MSNBC's makeup department needs a makeover.
At any rate, this thread would not be complete without
rocktivity
CTyankee
(63,889 posts)While I don't like the look I don't particularly have an opinion whether it is "appropriate."
My response: big yawn...
seaglass
(8,171 posts)...
What you dont see on TV is that many times women have clothespins in the back to make [their clothes] tighter.
Asked who is behind the pinning, she described it as a self-reinforcing situation, in which less prominent anchors, hoping to move up, emulate provocatively dressed anchors. Its a way of getting attention, she said.
Almost no one in the business wants to go on the record to discuss what form the encouragement takes. Theyre afraid of losing their jobs or ruining professional relationships.
But off the record, current and former female broadcasters in Boston tell stories about wardrobe consultants hired by station management pushing clothing that some on-air talent dont want to wear; women crying in the makeup room because they feel pressured to dress a certain way; a modestly dressed anchor being asked to dress like a sexier new colleague who wore her skirts short and her tops unbuttoned.
RandySF
(58,488 posts)Shes not naked. Its Sunday on a holiday weekend. Warm day on the East Coast. Whats the big deal?
OldHippieChick
(2,434 posts)do not like shaming women or blaming them for their clothes. At the same time, I think there is professional dress an there is something else. If she chose the clothes, she needs to know she chose unwisely. If the clothes were forced upon her by TPTB, then we need to let them know they belong in Hell.
malaise
(268,693 posts)I don't plan to wear it, but I don't get the question about the beach. What's wrong with bearing the top of her arms and her shoulders?
snooper2
(30,151 posts)Pathwalker
(6,598 posts)she's wearing a sleeveless top - her entire arms are showing! Oh, the horror - where's my fainting couch?
BTW, the shoulder cut-out has been a fashion trend for a year now, Alex Witt has been wearing them for six months. It sure took you all a long time to notice.
Also, the female weather person on the Weather Channel has a shoulder cut-out top on too - is she a slut, too?
This thread reeks of sexist puritanism.