If Mueller Has E-Mails From Papadopoulos To Russians Talking About Meetings With Trump........

[ChoppinBroccoli]

............doesn't he have Trump? As in, dead to rights, on collusion?

Papadopoulos has already pled guilty, which means that they now KNOW that the evidence they have is solid. If some of that evidence consists of emails from Papadopoulos trying to set up a meeting between Trump and Putin (and we know it does, because the emails were released--I saw them yesterday), it seems to me they have Trump dead to rights. This sounds to me like Mueller is slow playing this, taking out a few of Trump's foot soldiers, hoping that one of them will flip on him maybe? I just don't see any way Trump weasels his way out of this one.

Even if he manages to escape impeachment courtesy of a spineless Republican Congress who will pull a Joe Paterno and pretend they don't see anything, Mueller's still got him on CRIMINAL charges. And, oh, please tell me that Papadopoulos wore a wire.

[Not Ruth]

1. We always assumed that Trump did not use email because it was too complicated for him

Turns out that email is his kryptonite

[DURHAM D]

2. Last night on CNN they said that Ty Cobb

(Trump's attorney) indicated that all the emails from the campaign were turned over to Mueller some time ago and they were cooperating fully with the investigation.

Have not heard that reported elsewhere.

[bettyellen]

5. I expect that's a lie just like Manafort's lie that led to the no knock warrant....

Am wondering if there were more of those than we've heard about. This George kid initially lied too, and then somehow they got the emails.

[greyl]

14. There are also texts, calls, meetings, drops, couriers, and messengers. nt

[LonePirate]

3. Not necessarily.

There is a distinct difference between a campaign staffer trying to arrange a meeting with the Russians and 45 asking, encouraging or ordering his staff to arrange a meeting with the Russians.

For me, the timeframe of the emails is far more intriguing given how it suggests the campaign knew or thought the Russians had the Clinton emails before it became public info. (Note: I am not up to date on all of the details here so there is likely a far more thorough knowledgeable interpretation out there.)

[L. Coyote]

4. Now we to connect the dots, from the hacks to the perfectly timed releases.

If Manafort's people in Russian weren't doing the hacking themselves, who did it, when, and how did that illegal material become a tool in the Trump's campaign is what Mueller will be piecing together. Did Trump pay for the hacks?

The strategy yesterday seems to have been, let's get just enough out there so collusion is admitted, and let's show that this was a wider conspiracy than previously revealed. Also, let's show the public and the conspirators we have had a cooperating witness for months. But mostly, they had to show their hand now due to a statute of limitations issue. This is just a sneak preview.

Trump Reacts to Mueller's Indictments --- the Hitler video --- LOL ---

[MaryMagdaline]

6. Underlying crime

It will be difficult to get Trump. "Collusion" has to match up to a specific statutory crime. His underlings will go down for filing false paperwork ( not listing Russian communications on federal forms) lying to the FBI, etc. Trump never had to fill out forms since he was elected. If he doesn't interview with FBI they won't catch him lying. Lying to American people, which he does all the time, is not a crime. Most fertile ground for getting Trump will be finances. Fair game to investigate because Mueller will have to show WHY the Russians had every reason to believe he could be blackmailed. Before I die I want to see prosecution for the sale of his home in Palm Beach to the Russian oligarch.

[monmouth4]

7. And he did not live in that house one day..n/t

[Demsrule86]

11. No it won't. But thanks for playing.

[hvn_nbr_2]

8. "pull a Joe Paterno and pretend they don't see anything"

Nice turn of phrase. I think we should see, hear, and use it more often.

[onenote]

9. I haven't been able to find the emails. Can you post a link?

[ChoppinBroccoli]

13. This Is Where I Saw It. Hope This Helps.

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/10/30/1710963/-Papadopoulos-is-the-singing-canary-Named-Trump-WH-can-t-say-it-s-not-related-now

[Demsrule86]

10. legal types ares saying he did wear a wire.

[Jim Lane]

12. "Collusion" is a confusingly vague word

Would it be per se illegal for a U.S. politician to meet with a representative of a foreign government? In this case, "per se" means that the mere fact of the meeting would be a criminal offense, regardless of what was discussed.

I haven't seen any knowledgeable source saying that such a meeting would be illegal.

Obviously, there are ways to hold the meeting illegally. Trump, as a private citizen, was barred under the Logan Act from negotiating with a foreign government with regard to any disputes between that government and the United States. I think it be violating the law if he met with Putin and said, "If I'm elected, I'll lift the sanctions if you do X in return." I haven't seen any evidence of any possible Logan Act violation, though.

Furthermore, even the Logan Act doesn't bar all negotiations. Trump as a real estate developer could meet with Putin or any other head of state for a talk along the lines of "I'll build thus-and-such new building in your capital city if you give me these particular tax breaks."

Aside from the Logan Act, there would be other ways for Trump to meet with Putin in furtherance of an illegal goal. That additional evidence would have to be provided, however, before a prosecutor could have Trump "dead to rights" on any felony.

AFAIK, even an actual Trump-Putin meeting, had it occurred, would not have been enough to establish that Trump committed a crime.