Saudi Arabia offers Germany 200 mosques – one for every 100 refugees who arrived last weekend
Source: .independent
Saudi Arabia has reportedly responded to the growing number of people fleeing the Middle East for western Europe by offering to build 200 mosques in Germany.
Syrias richer Gulf neighbours have been accused of not doing their fair share in the humanitarian crisis, with Bahrain, Kuwait, Qatar, Oman and the UAE also keeping their doors firmly shut to asylum-seekers.
According to the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, which quoted a report in the Lebanese newspaper Al Diyar, Saudi Arabia would build one mosque for every 100 refugees who entered Germany in extraordinary numbers last weekend.
It would be unfair to suggest that the Gulf Arab states have done nothing to help the estimated four million Syrians who have fled their country since the start of the conflict in 2011.
Just this week, the al Hayat newspaper reported that 500,000 Syrians had found homes in Saudi Arabia since the civil war began as workers, not refugees.
Read more: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/saudi-arabia-offers-germany-200-mosques--one-for-every-100-refugees-who-arrived-last-weekend-10495082.html
JI7
(89,240 posts)wouldn't offering to pay for health care and school and housing do a lot more to help
Ichingcarpenter
(36,988 posts)release the 28 pages....... now
samsingh
(17,590 posts)CJCRANE
(18,184 posts)The same goes for the Arab Spring.
pampango
(24,692 posts)"increase religious fundamentalism" even though that has been the effect.
4. Muslim religious groups spear-headed the revolutions. This allegation is made by Iran from one side and Western conservatives from the other. It is for the most part incorrect. Leftists, secularists, workers and students made the revolutions. The Muslim forces had often been devastated by government persecution and were weak (Tunisia) or had been made a junior partner in governance and were reluctant to risk entirely losing that position (Egypt). In Egypt, the revolutionaries are referred to in Arabic as the thuwar, and they are contrasted to the Muslim Brotherhood and other forces. In Egypt, it is these secularists and leftista who are are still calling for demonstrations in Tahrir Square. The most effective revolutionaries in Libya, the Berbers of the Western Mountain region and the urban street fighters of Misrata, were the least fundamentalist in orientation. While the Muslim religious parties may be good at organizing to win elections and so are perhaps the main beneficiaries of the revolutions politically, they did not make the revolutions themselves.
http://www.juancole.com/2011/12/top-ten-myths-about-the-arab-spring-of-2011.html
CJCRANE
(18,184 posts)Your post answers that question.
Look at the results of what's happening and been happening in the world, not the spiel we're spoon-fed.
pampango
(24,692 posts)It was not a 'designed' effect when "leftists, secularists, workers and students" led the Arab Spring.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"Look at the results of what's happening and been happening in the world..."
Post hoc ergo prompter hoc.
delrem
(9,688 posts)You'd think there'd be some trace of them. But there isn't.
Where are they in Libya?
Where are they in Syria?
Where are these "elections"?
A lot of bombs delivered by the US and friends, a lot of mercenaries. Not many of these "leftists, secularists, workers and students", tho' their putative existence provided a good pretext for bombing to "save them".
metalbot
(1,058 posts)(Note that I'm not necessarily supporting this view, but it's worth exploring)
When the Libyan "Arab Spring" hit, rebel forces were at the gates of Tripoli, and poised to simply topple Qaddafi. At this point, the "revolution" had been comparatively bloodless. Qaddafi then went on an all out attack, pushing rebel forces back across the country, and then laying siege. At this point, the US chose to intervene to eliminate any air and heavy weapon advantage that Qaddafi had. If the US had been willing to intervene six weeks earlier, we could have potentially left the more progressive rebel leaders in place, who were instead supplanted by tough militarists who were able to endure a crushing campaign from Qaddafi's forces.
Much the same happened in Syria - the only people left to after the fighting were the extremists.
delrem
(9,688 posts)The US acted over and over and over again, and is still acting, and the consequences all across the Middle East are horrendous and would cause any but a totally amoral nation to stop and think about doing it again, and again, and again. But not the USA - that so-called defender of "freedom" and "democracy" and "western values".
pampango
(24,692 posts)If you disagree with his analysis of the Middle East and prefer that offered by the dictator, go right ahead.
Do you believe that Assad ever had any intention of dealing with protests against his rule in way other than using his huge army and secret police? His father did in famously in 1982 in Hama, Bashar intended to do the same. Anyone who protested against him was designated a 'terrorist' and it is pretty obvious how the regime deals with 'terrorists'.
If you choose to believe that all opponents to Assad's family dictatorship are and always have been religious terrorists, you are welcome to your opinion.
Isn't it odd that when peaceful protest is repressed violently, the "secularists, workers and students" tend to either get killed or arrested, tortured and 'disappeared'? (Hence there is little 'trace' of their existence except perhaps in mass graveyards.) As peaceful protesters disappear, they are replaced by (or change themselves into) more militant fighters.
delrem
(9,688 posts)That's the lamest accusation - and it's the identical accusation you leveled at me the last time you berated me for having a different opinion than the the lies and sorry excuses that you offered up as absolute truth when you denied that Hillary Clinton had anything to do with "Friends of Syria" or the hellhole of chaos that the ME now is.
The USA is in the military empire business, not the "freedom and democracy" business - and just to clue you in, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and the other US allies in the US War on Terror in the ME are not "democracies". They want nothing to do with "Leftists, secularists, workers and students" - and you know it.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)The same groups from Darnah, Benghazi and Tobruk who had been shown to have supplied the highest percentage of Jihadist terrorists who were the most effective and fanatical al Qaeda foreign fighters in central Iraq during the US occupation.
A December 2007 West Point study examined the background of foreign guerrilla fighters jihadis or mujahedin, including suicide bombers crossing the Syrian border into Iraq during the 2006-2007, under the auspices of the international terrorist organization Al Qaeda. This study was based on about 600 Al Qaeda personnel files which were captured by US forces in the fall of 2007, and analyzed at West Point. The study probed mentality and belief structures of the northeastern Libyan population, which was the location US Ambassador Chris Stevens made his headquarters after his arrival in March 2011. See, Joseph Felter and Brian Fishman, Al Qaidas Foreign Fighter in Iraq: A First Look at the Sinjar Records, (West Point, NY: Harmony Project, Combating Terrorism Center, Department of Social Sciences, US Military Academy, December 2007). Cited as West Point Study
Stevens was himself a principal expert in the State Department who assessed the basis for the rebellion, and the author of suppositions about the political nature of the anti-Qaddafi revolt in these areas. It is no accident that he located his headquarters in coastal Eastern Libya rather than than the western mountain region or Misrata, which is central Libya.
More on the West Point Study, here: http://www.asiantribune.com/news/2011/03/17/libyan-rebellion-has-radical-islamist-fervor-benghazi-link-islamic-militancyus-milit
The introduction of the report says:
In November 2007, the Combating Terrorism Center at West Point received nearly 700 records of foreign nationals that entered Iraq between August 2006 and August 2007. The data compiled and analyzed in this report is drawn from these personnel records, which was collected by al-Qaedas Iraqi affiliates, first the Mujahidin Shura Council (MSC) and then the Islamic State of Iraq (ISI). The records contain varying levels of information on each fighter, but often include the fighters country of origin, hometown, age, occupation, the name of the fighters recruiter, and even the route the fighter took to Iraq. The records were captured by coalition forces in October 2007 in a raid near Sinjar, along Iraqs Syrian border.
Libya_1.JPGAnti-Libyan regime fighters prepare for battle in Ajdabiya in eastern Libya
Although there is some ambiguity in the data, it is likely that all of the fighters listed in the Sinjar Records crossed into Iraq from Syria. (Un-Quote)
The Asian Tribune presents here the salient data, information and observations of the Combating Terrorism Center of West Point maintained in the U.S. Defense Departments Harmony Data Base. The analysis gives an alarming picture of the political shade of the Libyan rebels of Benghazi and Darnah, the eastern stronghold of anti-Qaddafi movement. The observation in this Defense Department document is very revealing.
(Begin Report):
Initial Findings
Country of Origin
Saudi Arabia was by far the most common nationality of the fighters in this sample; 41% (244) of the 595 records that included the fighters nationality indicated they were of Saudi Arabian origin.
Libya was the next most common country of origin, with 18.8% (112) of the fighters listing their nationality stating they hailed from Libya. Syria, Yemen, and Algeria were the next most common origin countries with 8.2% (49), 8.1% (48), and 7.2% (43), respectively. Moroccans accounted for 6.1% (36) of the records and Jordanians 1.9% (11).
The obvious discrepancy between previous studies of Iraqi foreign fighters and the Sinjar Records is the percentage of Libyan fighters. (See Appendix 1 for a brief summary of previous foreign fighter studies.) No previous study has indicated that more than 4 percent of fighters were Libyan. Indeed, a June 2005 report by NBC quoted a U.S. government source indicating that Libya did not make a top ten list of origin nationalities for foreign fighters in Iraq.9 As late as July 15, 2007, the Los Angeles Times cited a U.S. Army source reporting that only 10 percent of all foreign fighters in Iraq hailed from North Africa.10 The Sinjar Records suggest that number is much higher. Almost 19 percent of the fighters in the Sinjar Records came from Libya alone. Furthermore, Libya contributed far more fighters per capita than any other nationality in the Sinjar Records, including Saudi Arabia.
The previous reports may have collectively understated the Libyan contribution to the fight in Iraq, but the relative synchronization of earlier analyses suggests that the pattern of immigration to Iraq has simply shifted over time. In an admittedly small sample, 76.9% (30) of the 39 Libyans that listed their arrival date in Iraq entered the country between May and July 2007, which may indicate a spring surge of Libyan recruits to Iraq. If the numbers cited by the Los Angeles Times in July 2007 are any indication, even the U.S. Army may have underestimated the Libyan contingent in Iraq.
The apparent surge in Libyan recruits traveling to Iraq may be linked the Libyan Islamic Fighting Groups (LIFG) increasingly cooperative relationship with al-Qaeda, which culminated in the LIFG officially joining al-Qaeda on November 3, 2007.
City/Town of Origin
Of 591 records that included the country of origin of the fighters, 440 also contained information on the home city/town the fighters hailed from. The most common cities that the fighters called home were Darnah, Libya and Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, with 52 and 51 fighters respectively. Darnah, with a population just over 80,000 compared to Riaydhs 4.3 million, has far and away the largest per capita number of fighters in the Sinjar records. The next most common hometowns? in real terms? listed in the Sinjar records were Mecca (43), Beghazi (21), and Casablanca (17). City/town of origin for Saudi Arabia, Libya, Morocco, Algeria, and Syria are broken out in greater detail below.
Libyan Hometowns
The vast majority of Libyan fighters that included their hometown in the Sinjar Records resided in the countrys Northeast, particularly the coastal cities of Darnah 60.2% (53) and Benghazi 23.9% (21).
Both Darnah and Benghazi have long been associated with Islamic militancy in Libya, in particular for an uprising by Islamist organizations in the mid?1990s. The Libyan government blamed the uprising on infiltrators from the Sudan and Egypt and one groupthe Libyan Fighting Group (jama?ah al?libiyah al?muqatilah)claimed to have Afghan veterans in its ranks.14 The Libyan uprisings became extraordinarily violent. Qaddafi used helicopter gunships in Benghazi, cut telephone, electricity, and water supplies to Darnah and famously claimed that the militants deserve to die without trial, like dogs.
Abu Layth al?Libi, LIFGs Emir, reinforced Benghazi and Darnahs importance to Libyan jihadis in his announcement that LIFG had joined al?Qaida, saying:
It is with the grace of God that we were hoisting the banner of jihad against this apostate regime under the leadership of the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group, which sacrificed the elite of its sons and commanders in combating this regime whose blood was spilled on the mountains of Darnah, the streets of Benghazi, the outskirts of Tripoli, the desert of Sabha, and the sands of the beach.
Like other governments in the region, Libya appears concerned about the possibility of jihadi violence within its borders. In May 2007, the Libyan government arrested several Libyans on the grounds that they were planning a car bomb attack similar to an April attack in Algeria.17 And in July 2007, a group calling itself al-Qaeda in Eastern Libya announced a suicide attack in Darnah.18 Libyas leader Muammar Qaddafi has taken measures to mitigate the threat from such groups, and has reportedly released over 80 Muslim Brotherhood activists in the hope that they will moderate the views of more violent Islamist activists.
If LIFG is funneling Libyans into Iraq, it may exacerbate rumored tensions between LIFG elements over whether or not to concentrate on militant activity within Libyas borders.20 Such debates are common among national jihadi movements shifting focus to global issues. This sort of debate disrupted both Egyptian Islamic Jihad and the Egyptian Islamic Group in the 1990s.21 Reports suggesting that LIFGs decision to join al-Qaeda was controversial may be exaggerated, but they probably reflect a contentious debate over LIFGs future.22 LIFGs support for al-Qaedas Iraqi affiliate has probably increased its stature in al-Qaedas leadership, but complicated its internal dynamics.
Recent political developments in Afghanistan and Pakistan, the prevalence of Libyan fighters in Iraq, and evidence of a well?established smuggling route for Libyans through Egypt, suggests that Libyan factions (primarily the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group) are increasingly important in al-Qaeda. The Sinjar Records offer some evidence that Libyans began surging into Iraq in larger numbers beginning in May 2007. Most of the Libyan recruits came from cities in North?East Libya, an area long known for jihadi?linked militancy. Libyan fighters were much more likely than other nationalities to be listed as suicide bombers (85% for Libyans, 56% for all others).
The Libyan Islamic Fighting Groups unification with al-Qaeda and its apparent decision to prioritize providing logistical support to the Islamic State of Iraq is likely controversial within the organization. It is likely that some LIFG factions still want to prioritize the fight against the Libyan regime, rather than the fight in Iraq. It may be possible to exacerbate schisms within LIFG, and between LIFGs leaders and al-Qaedas traditional Egyptian and Saudi power?base. (End Report)
- Asian Tribune -
delrem
(9,688 posts)racing across Libya in battered pickup trucks. Heroes all, fighting for democracy and western values!
Yes indeed: "Leftists, secularists, workers and students made the revolutions". It's true. I read it here on DU.
icymist
(15,888 posts)If Sadia Aribia wants to do something useful about the refugee crisis from Syria then maybe they should start accepting more refugees into their country instead of telling other countries what to do. Even if that is with their own money. Hey, Saudi Arabia, use that money to house refugees!
Turbineguy
(37,291 posts)just to chase people to Saudi Arabia?
peacebird
(14,195 posts)Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)Would I be wrong to assume they would be extremist Wahabi Mosques?
snagglepuss
(12,704 posts)has written extensively about this.
rpannier
(24,328 posts)Last thing they need is a bunch of wahabbi mosques
DhhD
(4,695 posts)leveymg
(36,418 posts)leftynyc
(26,060 posts)would tell them to stuff it and if they really wanted to help - either take in refugees themselves or offer a pile of money to build housing, feed people, perhaps build a few schools. How the fuck do they think 200 mosques is going to help?
jfern
(5,204 posts)The idea that this will help is absurd.
DetlefK
(16,423 posts)Seriously, the last thing we need is more religion.
The head of the "Zentralrat der Muslime in Deutschland" ("central council of muslims in Germany", a lobbying-group and umbrella organization of all muslim communities in Germany) has already asked german politicians to make it clear to the refugees that the sectarianism of the Middle-East is not welcome in Germany.
6chars
(3,967 posts)Guy Whitey Corngood
(26,494 posts)from the pages of history.
Demeter
(85,373 posts)Hotbeds to grow hybrid Wahabi-Nazis.
I would treat business with Saudis as I would dining with the devil: use a VERY long spoon!
I know it all looks on the surface to be a kind, philanthropic and "royal" gesture, but the track record for the House of Saud says look for the worst possible outcome, their advantage.
sulphurdunn
(6,891 posts)If reports from there about the treatment foreign workers are any indication, the Syrians would be better off with refugee status. Exploitation of cheap foreign labor is profitable. Caring for refugees is not.
bluedigger
(17,086 posts)They must be winning.
JustABozoOnThisBus
(23,325 posts)... at moving a quarter million Islamic folk into Europe. or closer to 800k as is sometimes estimated for the whole wave.
Of those, some small percentage will be "radical" or will be "radicalized".
Yep, winning.
Je ne suis pas Charlie. But there will be more.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)Fucking assholes.
DhhD
(4,695 posts)you want to look at with reguards to some information about the religion there).
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Commission_of_Spain
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3715/germany-islam-christianity
https://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=AwrSbnOU8PJVAbgAbvxXNyoA;_ylc=X1MDMjc2NjY3OQRfcgMyBGZyA2Rzc195c2V0X2NocgRncHJpZANPamZoZHVJMFN5dS45T1hqWkpnNENBBG5fcnNsdAMwBG5fc3VnZwMwBG9yaWdpbgNzZWFyY2gueWFob28uY29tBHBvcwMwBHBxc3RyAwRwcXN0cmwDBHFzdHJsAzI4BHF1ZXJ5A0lzbGFtaWMgQ29tbWlzc2lvbiBvZiBGcmFuY2UEdF9zdG1wAzE0NDE5ODQ3NDA-?p=Islamic+Commission+of+France&fr2=sb-top-search&fr=dss_yset_chr
https://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=A0SO8y3v8PJVACUACMFXNyoA;_ylc=X1MDMjc2NjY3OQRfcgMyBGZyA2Rzc195c2V0X2NocgRncHJpZAN0aENoUW93OVNtS29zaGpaQVRrRjBBBG5fcnNsdAMwBG5fc3VnZwMwBG9yaWdpbgNzZWFyY2gueWFob28uY29tBHBvcwMwBHBxc3RyAwRwcXN0cmwDBHFzdHJsAzM5BHF1ZXJ5A0lzbGFtaWMgQ29tbWlzc2lvbiBvZiB0aGUgVW5pdGVkIFN0YXRlcwR0X3N0bXADMTQ0MTk4NTA2NQ--?p=Islamic+Commission+of+the+United+States&fr2=sb-top-search&fr=dss_yset_chr
JNelson6563
(28,151 posts)riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)romanic
(2,841 posts)or more specifically, the House of Saud, just disappear? That would greatly benefit the refugees and Islam as a whole vs a "mosque" or some other veiled attempt to indoctrinate innocent people with bullshit Wahabbi-whatever bullcrap.
smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)Imagine my surprise.
Brother Buzz
(36,382 posts)hollowdweller
(4,229 posts)I hate to say it, and I know it's a minority but it seems like refugees and immigrants from the middle east are the only ones that seem to come to another country and wind up blowing stuff up or hating on the way of life of the countries they come to.
We in the west are basically subsidizing the regions unsustainable population growth by absorbing the excess who can't find a job or have to flee the sectarian or tribal fighting that holds the region behind.
I'm all for letting them come, the US should take more too, but I think we need to do everything we can to get them put their religion in the proper perspective for living in a multi religious society. Somehow I think that allowing the Saudis to have any hand in setting up religion in exile is a bad idea.
awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)something that no country needs. These are the fools that were behind 9/11.
roamer65
(36,744 posts)Seriously, many of them may be ISIS infiltrators.