Biden: We don't need 'socialism'

[riversedge]

Source: the Hill




January 20, 2016, 03:49 pm


Biden: We don't need 'socialism'

By Jesse Byrnes


Vice President Biden on Wednesday offered criticism of "socialism" during a speech abroad, seemingly a shot at Bernie Sanders, a self-described democratic socialist and Democratic candidate for president.

Biden made the remark in a keynote address at the World Economic Forum in Switzerland, where he called for "a more progressive tax code" and a strengthening of the middle class.
.............................

Sanders often touts "democratic socialism" in his calls for the wealthy to pay their "fair share" in taxes. He is in second place in the Democratic presidential race, 13 percent points behind rival Hillary Clinton in the RealClearPolitics average of national polls.

Read more: http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/266483-biden-we-dont-need-socialism

---

[questionseverything]

25. his tweet

Vice President BidenVerified account
‏@VP
"We need a more progressive tax code -- not confiscatory policy. Not socialism. A tax code." -VP Biden #wef16

/////////////////////////////////////

i thought bernie's plan was financed thru a progressive tax code?

confiscation does sound scary tho

[cannabis_flower]

73. Yeah, I have...

several Facebook friends that I leave off of shares of political post because they think taxes = agents of the government taking your money under the threats of force such as guns.

[Wilms]

42. I read earlier that he has a number of bruises on his face.

They appeared after some comments he made last week that seemed in praise of Bernie.

[merrily]

78. Haven't read the thread yet, but I'm betting this is a thread win.

[Odin2005]

2. Whatever, Joe.

[TheBlackAdder]

103. That's the same socialist stuff GHWB attacked Bill Clinton with in 1992! OH, THE IRONY! nt

[silvershadow]

3. Biden too? Bro, it's gonna be a wave. Hide and watch. Right through the primaries and onto

a huge win in the general.

[question everything]

71. No. He supports Democratic candidates

not Socialists with a history of running against Democrats and now decided to pretend to be one.

[2pooped2pop]

77. well to be fair Hillary is pretending that she is not a republican lite

actions speak louder than words

[wendylaroux]

4. No,we need Democratic Socialism

either you,or someone you know,needs it badly.

Caring for the poor is good.

[secondwind]

97. INDEED!

[elleng]

5. 'U.S. Vice President Joe Biden criticized modern corporate "short-termism"

on Wednesday and urged chief executives gathered in Davos to look after their workers as well as their shareholders.

Relishing his nickname of "middle-class Joe", he told delegates at the World Economic Forum annual meeting that the middle classes, the backbone of economies and democracies, now faced unprecedented threats from technological change.

"My call to action here is simple - embrace your obligation to workers as well as your shareholders," Biden said, criticizing the recent trend by firms to return mountains of cash to investors by buying back stock rather than investing for the future.'

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-davos-meeting-biden-idUSKCN0UY2FY

[babylonsister]

38. Wow, that needs to be said over and over.

"...to look after their workers as well as their shareholders." What a concept!

[elleng]

46. Yes it does, b'sis,

and he's just getting slammed here. Some folks!

More of what he said: .@VP says "not that intl corporations are bad. Short termism is order of the day." CEOs in room won their spots by short-termism ‪#‎WEF16‬

We need 2 bend these changes 2 the benefit of society, @VP says about ‪#‎4thIndustrialRevolution‬ and will be much harder than past ‪#‎WEF16‬

@VP politely chides ‪#‎WEF16‬ CEOs: 54% of you bought back stock. 37% of profit went to shareholders. 9% went to R&D, wages, cash, etc

These from Steve Clemons, who is with VP @ Davos.

[babylonsister]

47. THE SKY IS FALLING!

People don't read, myself included upon occasion.

It's really silly season. I'm trying to just observe. That doesn't always work.

[elleng]

49. Really IS silly season!

I just edited, added a few tweets from Steve Clemons.

P.S, glad you're enjoying yourself down south!!!

[Wilms]

60. Here's where he got into trouble.

"We need a more progressive tax code -- not confiscatory policy. Not socialism. A tax code." -VP Biden #wef16

So now socialism is in the same boat as "confiscatory policy"?

The only thing Biden let out was telling them to "cut it out".

[secondwind]

98. SOCIALISM IS PAYING JOE'S SALARY, HIS HEALTHCARE, AND HIS PENSION... WHO IS HE KIDDING

[kacekwl]

83. Then why the obvious slam on Bernie ?

Seems like they speak the same language.

[elleng]

84. They do. I don't know why the 'slam,'

but it was really a very small part of what he said.

More of what he said: .@VP says "not that intl corporations are bad. Short termism is order of the day." CEOs in room won their spots by short-termism ‪#‎WEF16‬

We need 2 bend these changes 2 the benefit of society, @VP says about ‪#‎4thIndustrialRevolution‬ and will be much harder than past ‪#‎WEF16‬

@VP politely chides ‪#‎WEF16‬ CEOs: 54% of you bought back stock. 37% of profit went to shareholders. 9% went to R&D, wages, cash, etc

These from Steve Clemons, who is with VP @ Davos.

[davidpdx]

91. Didn't know he was going to be in Davos

I'm an island over from where where he is.

[99th_Monkey]

6. Oh no Joe.

I kind of expected this Red-Baiting crap from McCaskill ... but Biden??

Un-fucking-believable. I thought Joe had more integrity than that, and more of a sense of trust in the
American voters to "know what's good for them". Pathetic development.

I'm just glad Sanders is so good at turning this bull-shit into fertilizer to grow his campaign and his campaign
war chest.

Go Bernie!!!!

[pangaia]

24. "Un-fucking-believable. I thought Joe had more integrity than that,"

So did I. So did I.

I wonder with what he was threatened.

[KingCharlemagne]

99. Joe Biden was Chair of the Senate Judiciary that gave us Clarence Thomas. - nt

[TheBlackAdder]

102. GHWB used the same 'Red Baiting' stuff in 1992 against Bill Clinton, McCaskill uses same tactic.

.


THAT IS IRONY!


.

[Jackilope]

7. Establishment Dems don't want to rock the corporate boat. n/t

[emsimon33]

16. Actually they don't want to rock the corporate gravy train!

[glinda]

32. Actually they don't want to their names included in anything that ends up revealed.

[elias49]

8. Don't need Social Security? Farm subsidies?

Corporate tax breaks?

[maxsolomon]

10. Fire Departments? Paved Roads?

blegh, this country is dumb

[EndElectoral]

34. Medicare? the Armed Forces?

Ahh, Joe...you're a union guy....c'mon...screw the memo.

[merrily]

86. Government paychecks and perqs, courtesy of the U.S. taxpayer?

Government officials who descry socialism are really saying they earned the benefits of the taxpayers' money, but taxpayers did not earn the benefits of the money they actually did earned and paid to governments in taxes.

It's a hell of a nerve on their part, in my opinion.

[Dawson Leery]

9. Obama and Biden should come to Hillary's defense openly.

Bernie is a come lately to the Democratic party.

Planned Parenthood > Bernie Sanders

[Skwmom]

14. They want Biden to replace Clinton. They are not going to do a full defense.

They don't want to anger either side of supporters. Good luck with that. n/t

[lunamagica]

51. That is never going to happen. eom

[1StrongBlackMan]

58. trump, Joe Scarboro, and a couple Democratic talking heads (on the Joe Scarboro Show) ...

wants biden to replace Clinton.

[mpcamb]

62. "Bernie is a come lately to the Democratic party."

Last edited Thu Jan 21, 2016, 11:01 AM - Edit history (1)

Yeah, he's been working for the middles, the lower middles and the poor, while the establishment Dems have been pimping for the wealthy and for Wall Street for donations.
Let's hope he can pull the whole country back to the America where ordinary people had a voice and had a chance.

[Skwmom]

11. Says Mr. "I'm no populist." n/t

[stonecutter357]

12. K&R!

[cascadiance]

13. And we don't need fascism through "capitalist" bills like the bankruptcy bill pushed on us either!

Joe, voters are waking up and are reawakening the REAL Democratic Party that spoke against economic royalists instead of getting in to bed with them. DEMOCRATIC Socialism works more for the 99% than the 1%. The 1% knows the end of their power is near. Hope they don't fight too hard to keep that from happening. French monarchs learned the hard (and sharp to their neck!) way when they tried to stop it too much. There aren't many more DICTATOR communists for the 1% to work with the way the Kochs did using Joseph Stalin to build their empire with.

[Warpy]

15. Like HELL we don't

A messy mixture of socialism and capitalism is just what we need, the only debate occurring when systems move back and forth between them.

"Socialism" should be a dirty word only to the 0.1%, and that aint you, Joe.

[AgingAmerican]

17. So we don't need Social Security, Medicare or public utilities?

Republican nonsense.

[msongs]

18. so is Biden going to be called a "goon" too by the usual suspects? nt

[madfloridian]

22. Who are the "usual suspects"??

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511032682

[merrily]

87. A one line negative, substance-free post. How unusual! And full of pith.

[7962]

19. Sorry, Joe, cancel that Medicare.

[madfloridian]

20. And so it begins.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511032682

They don't think we are worthy, but they sure as hell want our votes.

[TM99]

21. We have socialism Biden.

Privatize the profits, and socialize the loses.

And you are your crony pals, you remember them, the ones you pandered to for the abomination called a bankruptcy reform bill, can go fuck yourselves!

[comradebillyboy]

23. Biden goes under the bus along with PP, HRC, Travyon's mother etc etc...

[MrWendel]

26. The Mayor...

of Flint.

[Beacool]

28. Don't forget Holder and most Democrats in Congress.

[Beacool]

27. How things change, there goes good old Joe under the bus.

Wasn't he highly praised recently when he spoke positively about Sanders?

[andrewv1]

39. Looks like the Hillary gang might be getting their new replacement!

You think Joe is getting ready to run & throw Clinton under the bus?.....

The "Socialist" Banks & Wall St. is possibly starting to realize that she cannot win the General Election to push more of their agenda through.

Changes could be coming when you are betting on someone that's under FBI investigation & that most of the country just doesn't care for.

[Beacool]

54. Nope, but keep hoping.

[rhett o rick]

40. Not by me. Joe was another pseudo-Democrat that bowed down to George Bush

the worst president we've ever had, and supported the Iraq War that was so devastating to the 99%. Didn't hurt the Wealthy in fact most made huge profits.

Two sides to the class war and those that side with the MIC are not on our side.

[Carolina]

66. Thank you

When Joe voted for IWR, I lost all respect for him. So these latest comments only reveal his true self. He's long been a corporate Dem.

[KingCharlemagne]

100. The writing was on the wall with Biden after Clarence Thomas - nt

[swilton]

68. Joe doesn't like socialism but nepotism is OK

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2014/05/14/hunter-bidens-new-job-at-a-ukrainian-gas-company-is-a-problem-for-u-s-soft-power/

Totally agree with your comment.

[merrily]

88. Biden loves him some socialism though, emphasis on "him." See reply 86.

[quickesst]

57. Of course...

... He was praised when he spoke positively about Bernie Sanders. Well, that's changed now, you know............. like a weather vane.

[madfloridian]

29. Does that mean no socialist votes wanted 2016?

?

[dlwickham]

30. Poor Joe

Looks like he's going to get tossed under the bus now

[rhett o rick]

41. I agree. Poor hapless Joe. Doesn't know whether he is coming or going. But he does

know a good Corporate deal when he sees one.

[Dawson Leery]

52. PP/HRC/Biden/John Lewis/The Mayor of Flint have all failed

to properly genuflect to St. Bernard of the Green Mountain.

[Baclava]

31. The Hillary attack hounds are on the loose!

Can I say that here?

[Truprogressive85]

33. Here we go !!!

Oh the alarms are ringing

Sen Sanders is no longer the fringe, but a threat to the Dem elites who have ignored their base for far too long



You cant you have a revolution without revolt and I stand side by side with comrades

[scottie55]

80. Best Response Yet

Biden too busy defending his Goldman Sachs buddies from prosecution to notice somethin' is a stirrin' in America.

[UpInArms]

35. "I really love ya, man"

to Alberto Gonzalez during his confirmation hearing

STFU Joe

your day is done

[Gregorian]

36. Another "it can't be done" statement. We went to the moon; we can improve our system for fairness.

I used to think I would live the rest of my life with a bad back. Once I learned how to fix my body, I did. I didn't say, oh it's going to be painful so I'll just live the rest of my life with a painful spasm. I went to work, and did the needed improvements.

[madfloridian]

37. They are coordinating well.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511032682

[dhill926]

43. this is NOTHING compared to what republicans will...

throw at Bernie if he gets the nomination. Better to find ways to counter and defend now. It WILL get ugly whether it's Bernie or Hillary...

[Ed Suspicious]

50. If you think Republican attacks will debilitate Bernie as much as

attacks from "Democrats" then you would be wrong. I'm all in on Bernie against the neofacsists everywhere.

[lovemydog]

44. I think Hillary supporters here and Sanders supporters here

in this thread are overreacting.

My take is that Biden was saying we don't need socialism in a strict sense, in terms of government takeover of the means of production of major businesses. In that sense, Biden has always been a capitalist. I think he's right that we need a much more progressive tax system.

I'm just not that paranoid to read anything more into it. The 'seeming swipe' at Sanders was written by the author of the article. Biden didn't say anything of that sort, directly or indirectly. I think he still respects Sanders and Clinton, and is going to keep saying what he believes without trying to unduly affect the primary race.

I know some folks in this thread have linked to other articles saying some people are 'prepared' to 'call on' Biden to run for President. But again, that's a far cry from him actually accepting. It appears to me that he doesn't want to run. Kind of like Warren didn't want to run. I take them at their word for now.

But I suppose jumping all up and down with rage about the latest statement or non-statements is the more appropriate thing to do here at DU. I guess I'm kind of in the minority on that, or at least in the minority of people who choose to comment on these types of threads. I just don't believe it's necessary to get all outraged about every person's statements and don't interpret them as 'throwing' someone 'under a bus' or as a 'rejection' of many elements of liberal policies like Medicare and public schools. He's basically telling a bunch of capitalists that we need a much more progressive tax system. I think Sanders and Clinton and O'Malley and most on the left and most democrats too, agree with him on that matter.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

55. Good points. People are awfully edgy here lately.

[lovemydog]

64. Thanks.

I enjoy finding some middle ground among the left and among the more traditional democrats. There's a term for it (like straddler or something like that, lol). I like reading here. But sometimes it seems the nuance is kind of missing in a lot of posts. It sometimes feel like 'you're an idealistic daydreaming hippie' versus 'you're an oligarchy enabling corporatist.' I reject those kinds of labels.

I suppose that can be somewhat expected considering it's really close to the first primaries. People are pretty passionate about their candidates for President. I still feel that what we all have in common, in this case a more progressive tax policy, is a good thing. I'm of the view that we can use a much more progressive tax policy and the main way to accomplish that is to elect much more liberal people to Congress. I think either Sanders or Clinton would go along with it if we had a very big majority in the House and Senate.

So much of politics though is the trade-offs that must be made in order to get anything accomplished. And unfortunately we've still got far too many Americans who think taxes should only be used for the military even while our infrastructure is in need of repair and our health care (despite all the improvements made under the Affordable Care Act) is more expensive than in other comparable western nations.

I also think it's important to read critically, and recognize a lot of political writing as intended to inflame to generate clicks, rather than taking on the more lofty or objective style of just quoting what Biden actually said rather than inserting the notion that somehow he was 'taking a swipe' at Sanders. I mean heck, he was just praising Sanders a few days ago and he wouldn't change his mind that quickly, imho.

[hollowdweller]

56. To republicans all democrats are socialists.

Bernie is not that far from Biden. Both are a LONG way from Hugo Chavez.

I'm for Bernie and I like Biden.

However I really have to say tax cuts for middle class is ok, but what we need is unions and laws to increase their powers.

All the "Socialisim" that Bernie and Biden favor are basically attempts to subsidize employers low wages.

I personally think workers need to strike and rather than have the gov't be a middle man in giving benefits.

[lovemydog]

65. Thanks for your comments.

I like Bernie and Biden too. I would like to see more powerful unions as well. And laws that don't allow corporations to replace striking workers with non-union people. In many states, this 'right to work' crap has really gotten out of hand, allowing corporations to hire non-union workers in areas that are traditionally union. I think preventing this 'right to work' crap is a great example of something that can be fought on a State level and requires awareness & commitment to local issues and informed voter turnout at every election.

[malthaussen]

106. Then why does he mention a "confiscatory tax system?"

Who has proposed such a thing? Do you suggest that it is a straw man, a throwaway line? But why mention "socialism" at all in the context of the tweet? You suggest he means classical socialism, in the sense of government control of the means of production, but that does not appear from the context of the tweet. I agree, those 140-character one-liners are difficult for providing nuance, but no one said he had to use that format.

-- Mal

[rug]

48. "A spectre is haunting Europe — the spectre of a more progressive tax code

All the powers of old Europe have entered into a holy alliance to exorcise this spectre: Pope and Tsar, Metternich and Guizot, French Radicals and German police-spies."

Go home Joe.

[malthaussen]

107. ...

Although I never could understand why they called it a "holy" alliance rather than a "unholy" one.

-- Mal

[CBGLuthier]

53. Well, it's been a while since he said something kind of dumb, guess he was due.

[bowens43]

59. Biden is an idiot. Socialism is EXACTLY what we need.

[Beacool]

69. Last time I checked, Democrats were not the Socialist party.

If some of you want Socialism, then Sanders can run as a real Socialist and not as a Democrat.

[scottie55]

81. What We Want Is A Future

Where we are not being robbed every time we turn around.

Labels are meaningless.

Socialist / Capitalist / Farter

It's actions that matter.

Personally I like Bernie's actions a lot more than the Clinton's.

And I like the Clintons.

Most Americans are too stupid to see past a 6 word sound bite. Fox News knows this, and uses it.

Compassionate conservative. Sounds good. In reality it is pretty much means murder.

[Beacool]

85. I have zero interest in voting for Sanders.

I don't dislike him and I obviously would vote for him in the unlikely event that he became the nominee, but I think that he's a one note candidate who is over promising. Aspirations are fine and dandy, but there has to be a time when we also think of what can be realistically accomplished. I read several comments about changing Congress. Even if Democrats became the majority again, it would be a steep mountain to climb (as Obama found out). I try picturing him in the Oval Office, in the Situation Room, at a State Dinner shaking hands, and I just don't see it. I also have concerns about his age. IMO, 75 is too elderly to start a first term. For the record, I think that Hillary is barely making it under the wire (she would be the second oldest president after Reagan). I don't know, I could be wrong, time will tell.

[davidpdx]

92. If we question Hillary's age or health then what is it?

Come on you know the word, it's thrown around here enough. Starts with a "m"?

[merrily]

89. Last time I checked, DEMOCRATIC Socialists were different from socialists.

[valerief]

61. "No, we can't! No, we can't!"

[Skittles]

63. oh but we're supposed to LOVE Uncle Joe

he is so.......nice!!!!

[brooklynite]

67. Wasn't some claiming that Biden was hinting at supporting Sanders recently?

[Kalidurga]

70. Joe Biden, for Drug War President 2016!

This comes as no shock to me. At least now he isn't putting dirty hippies in jail he's just going around hippie punching.

http://marijuanapolitics.com/joe-biden-drug-war-president-2016-marijuana-reform-could-take-a-step-back/

[PoliticalMalcontent]

72. Biden: "He's a good man! Vote for him!" - with regards to Sanders in September

This sounds more like Joe Biden protecting the establishment with what he said today, and that's fine. I understand the thought behind it, even if I am a little disappointed.

"He's a good man! Vote for him!", Joe Biden supposedly said of Sanders back in September. (Source)

Biden may have criticized 'socialism' on Wednesday, but last week he was busy praising Bernie Sanders on income inequality (Source). Per that same article, an interesting quote: "If Bernie Sanders never said he was a democratic socialist, based on what he's saying people wouldn't be calling him a democratic socialist."

Makes one wonder what has changed between this week and last.

[PatrynXX]

74. Well good right now there isn't one running for president

So there. We do have a Liberal running for the seat and a Conservative who should be running as a Republican but other than that don't see any real socialists running.. not that that word catches anyones eye anymore

[chapdrum]

75. The same Joe who carried water

for Clarence Thomas during the latter's confirmation hearing.

Got it.

[merrily]

79. Cheap shot, equating Democratic Socialism with socialism. He knows better.

So does McCaskill. So do the Clintons.

Maybe people who have spent a lifetime as Governors, U.S. Reps, U.S. Senators and/or Vice President and President don't need Democratic Socialism. Those are good paying jobs with reliable, generous pensions, health care and perqs aplenty. Many of the rest of us, Joe, could use some Democratic Socialism, especially since the Democratic Party walked away from FDR and LBJ and went Third Way.

BTW, Joe, isn't living off government paychecks and perqs, courtesy of taxpayers, a bit like Democratic Socialism?

[underthematrix]

90. LAWD! VP Biden lit a fire with that one

And I love it. In other words we ain't got time for that shit. We're about keeping the White House, retaking the Senate, maybe the House (if we can get white folks to stop voting for wingnuts who keep tryna kill them, e.g. FLINT KILLA H2O) and turning gov mansions and state houses blue.

[pandr32]

93. He has earned the right to speak out

and obviously some will not like it. I guess "he was gotten to" or is now part of the problem with many people here. Too bad.

[4dsc]

94. Someone is getting scared

and we know who that is.

[Vinca]

95. Well, if that's the case, when does the dismantling of Social Security, Medicare, the VA,

the military, the Interstate highway system, etc. begin. As it turns out, the "socialized" parts of our government are the ones people like the most.

[Stimoyo]

96. Biden under the bus?

Already happened.

[Stellar]

101. So, Everybody's jumping on the Hillary band wagon, we will not allow our constituent...

to think for themselves.

Bernie, what are you doing to the high rollers in our party?! They want to put and end to it NOW and not wait around and let that...Socialist...take over the party.

How many people in the Democratic party had the word 'Socialist'on their lip starting yesterday, pulling for Hillary? And How many people that were out there on the same shows that spoke for Bernie Sanders? I don't know if they know this but they are not dealing with the constituents of the Republic0n party, and I think they may have made up my mind for me about Sanders.

Wasn't Sanders the same 'Socialist' that voted with the democratic party for many years? I guess just as long as he doesn't run for President he's OK with the real Democrats, huh?

[Tom Rinaldo]

104. Right. We don't need Social Security, or Medicare. We don't need Public Education...

...or public Libraries. We we would all be better off with private for profit fire departments. Let's start on that as soon as we finish privatizing the prison system. Who needs O.S.H.A. or the E.P.A. when left to itself free range Capitalism would eliminate the need for any of those pesky regulatory agencies? And while we are at it Joe, why not get rid of those public leeches Secret Service Agents who always are hanging around you? I'm sure Bkackwater would be happy to protect you for a fee.

[malthaussen]

105. You say that like it's a bad thing, Mr Biden.

Ya know, no more proof is needed that Bernie Sanders is a threat to win, than the fact that they are already unlimbering the Red card in the primaries. They play a dangerous game, because they want it to appear that they, too, support the social programs that an overwhelming majority of Americans want, but by attacking Mr Sanders's socialism, they set themselves up for the obvious counter-attack.

-- Mal