Popular Muslim stabbed to death hours after wishing Christians ‘Happy Easter’ on Facebook (UK)

[MowCowWhoHow III]

Source: Metro

A popular Muslim shopkeeper was stabbed to death hours after wishing ‘a very happy Easter to my beloved Christian nation’ on social media.

A silent vigil will be held at 9pm tonight in tribute to peaceful Asad Shah, who was murdered outside his Glasgow newsagents last night.

The shocking attack outside his shop on Minard Road in Shawlands came just hours after Mr Shah, 40, posted heartfelt Easter wishes to the Christian community on Facebook.

His last post read:

Good Friday and a very Happy Easter, especially to my beloved Christian nation.

Let’s follow the real footstep of beloved holy Jesus Christ and get the real success in both worlds.

Read more: http://metro.co.uk/2016/03/25/popular-muslim-stabbed-to-death-hours-after-wishing-christians-happy-easter-on-facebook-5775756/

[MynameisBlarney]

1. Damn

That is just sad as hell.
Why is it always the nice people that get killed?

[Jenny_92808]

2. I have been disturbed a lot

that trump supporters are embracing hate so much. Those who chose to divide and concur are in the wrong.

I feel so sad that a good man was murdered because of someone else's hate. Such injustice!!!

[xocet]

5. Trump's rhetoric probably has little to do with this incident in Glasgow, Scotland, UK...

To wit:

Man arrested over death of Glasgow shopkeeper Asad Shah was another Muslim: Police say the attack was religiously motivated
17:16, 25 Mar 2016 | Updated 19:26, 25 Mar 2016 | By Record Reporter


POLICE say both the victim and the accused are Muslim, and that the attack on Asad Shah, who was brutally murdered at his shop in Shawlands last night, was 'religiously prejudiced'.

...

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/man-arrested-over-death-glasgow-7628936

[MariaThinks]

9. this is what happens to muslims when they try to leave the religion or open minded about someone

elses.

there is a debate on youtube worth watching. The question was is 'islam a violent religion'. it's worth watching what the 2 muslims end up admitting.

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

11. Yeah. This ain't Trump's fault.

People over here act like everything Trump says or does is heard with bated breath in other countries.

Not so. We are not the center of the universe, and not everyone is following what that jackass says.

[TowneshipRebellion]

26. You might be suprised.

nt.

[ode2joi]

63. Happy Easter

I am beginning to lose hope in my fellow man.

[RKP5637]

76. We are less than 5% of the world's population. I agree, I don't think the other 95% of

the world takes messages from Trump and acts upon them. What does bother me, however, are those in the US on the edge that feel it's now OK to do what lurks in the dark corners of their minds.

[passiveporcupine]

27. That is what I thought too.

It was because he was wishing Christians a Happy Easter. Muslim fanatics would not allow that.

Damn, it's gotta be hard to be a loving Muslim in this screwed up world. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

And those first Muslims who try to reshape thinking, become targets.

RIP Mr. Shah

[RKP5637]

77. Each day it becomes more dagerous to live in the new environment of "damned if

you do and damn if you don't." Some just lust for violence, anything seems to give them an excuse, an act of kindness, an act of hatred, compromise and/or reconciliation ... or just being pleasant. All are targets for violence.

[Yo_Mama]

21. The man was murdered because of Muslim fanaticism, not because of Trump

Because of his Easter wishes. The takfiri crew probably decided that was apostasy, and deserved death.

I am terribly sorry for this good man, but going off on a wild tangent does nothing to help his family or solve the theological problem that apparently caused his death.

As shocking as this is, it is important for everyone to remember that most of the murders committed by Muslim fanatics are of other Muslims with whose theology the fanatics disagree.

This belongs with the group of atrocities that includes the Bangladesh murders,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attacks_on_secularists_in_Bangladesh

Pakistani murders of would-be reformers,
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/pakistan/12177270/Pakistan-executes-fanatic-who-murdered-blasphemy-reformer.html

Murders and assaults on journalists who dare to call for reform in many Muslim countries.
https://www.cpj.org/

[treestar]

35. I think that poster was comparing the amount of hate

not saying Trump had to do with this, but commenting that it is dangerous to spread hate.

[Ed Suspicious]

102. This.

[Zira]

3. I'm so sorry.

RIP.

[LongTomH]

4. Farewell to a truly good man.

[muriel_volestrangler]

6. Man arrested over death was another Muslim: Police say the attack was religiously motivated

POLICE have arrested a 32-year-old man in connection with the death of Glasgow shopkeeper Asad Shah.

And they say they are treating the popular shopkeeper's death as "religiously prejudiced".
...
A second man, aged 32, was also injured in the incident and is described as “stable”.

Read more at http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/man-arrested-over-death-glasgow-7628936#VHEA3ibpB6YiJBFH.99

[FLPanhandle]

7. Muslim extremists will kill anyone who leaves their religion

Now, they are killing anyone who even is polite to other religions.

[hollowdweller]

24. Girl around here

WV married a Christian guy, she was a Muslim. She wasn't killed or anything but the entire family disowned her. Was really sad for her. Her entire Islamic family

[Yo_Mama]

37. That's terrible. n/t

[scioto99]

105. The good news - assuming she isn't killed - is that her free brave choice is what changes Islam.

If she has kids, wanna bet she teaches them that Islam's just one of many okay religions; that her kids are free to marry as they wish when the time comes; and that the ostracism, beatings, and murders meted out against Muslim youth who 'step out of line' are backwards and wrong?

I salute this girl and her husband and her new life. Hope she stays safe.

[ericson00]

51. its all colonialism's fault.

/s

[MariaThinks]

8. sadly this is what happens to the moderate muslims from what i can see

what a wonderful man

[smirkymonkey]

17. No wonder they are so afraid to speak out.

How sad. Poor man. May he rest in peace.

[MariaThinks]

30. millions of moderate muslims?

what would be a moderate muslim. Here are some of my thoughts:

- stand up for the rights of anyone who asks questions or speaks their mind freely
- support the rights of woman
- stand up for the rights of people who want to convert to another religion - not shun, threaten or kill them
- denounce unequivocally violence and killing of people - is there anything like 'Thou Shalt Not Kill'?
- denounce the stoning and maiming that sharia law implements against homosexuals, men and women who are not married and who happen to be in each others company, adultery
- stop cutting off arms and legs of thieves
- don't change the laws of countries they flee to in order to avoid the problems in their birth countries
- stop forcing women to wear the headscarves and full body covering
- make honor killing illegal


I don't think any of these are unreasonable and if a muslim can't publically agree to these then where are the moderate muslims?

[Yo_Mama]

38. Except those who speak out sometimes get killed for speaking out.

Esp. in Muslim countries. There is a new wave of utter fanaticism; it is neither rational nor traditional.

[MariaThinks]

44. notice that there is NO response from any of the moderates or those continually

saying that it's only a small few.

If that is true, I would thing a lot of people would be yelling it, especially after another 2 radical muslim planted bombs killed hundreds of people.

it's an attempt to delay and not answer any questions.

If I had said something negative I would have been blasted by angry posters for my intolerance.

[840high]

49. .+10

[MariaThinks]

52. still no other response from the 'moderates' - surely they understand how bad we feel for the

slaughtered victims?

[Denzil_DC]

56. Actually, the "moderates" in the world at large are very unlikely to read DU.

As for those of us, moderates or not, who do read DU, some of us learn to tune out those who seek to capitalize on tragedies whose background they don't really understand.

As for Glasgow, where this happened? Well, you evidently have time galore to spend on the Internet - go do some looking and you'll find there have been relatively large vigils in the aftermath of this horrible attack, and universal condemnation and sorrow. What else could one expect?

[passiveporcupine]

28. Fortunately not many of them end up as targets.

There are probably millions of moderate Muslims living in the Western nations that can speak openly and appreciate people from other religions.

Mr. Shah was vocal about it on facebook and apparently some radical knew him and didn't like it. This may tend to make other Muslims more silent than they were before, and that is a shame.

[MariaThinks]

29. i don't see them on any talk shows or publicly stating views that would show moderate beliefs

Look at the great example the Pope is showing?

Where do moderate muslims show humility like him?

[MariaThinks]

31. i saw a debate where a radical muslim who turned peaceful was asked why more people in his

home country of Pakistan did not come out and speak moderate views. His response was that people promoting moderate views in Pakistan are threatened and killed.

it's on youtube - a debate of 2 against 2 with a live audience.

[passiveporcupine]

41. You can find lots of things on youtube.

I noticed your agenda here with your first post that I saw.

Hey, look what I found on youtube?

And this is a good one too, that might help put your mind at ease.

Thom just posted this here.

[MariaThinks]

42. my agenda is the truth and stopping slaughter. i don't need to wonder what yours is.

I don't care what people worship as long as they don't kill other people.

[passiveporcupine]

45. I'm sorry, but I just showed you some truth in two videos

and it didn't change your opinion of Muslims one bit, did it?

You are not looking for truth. You are looking for evidence to back up your bias.

[Turborama]

83. Just watched the 2nd one & I highly recommend the Muslim haters to watch the last 40 seconds of it

But it'd be better if they could find the time to watch the whole thing.

Thanks for sharing.

[passiveporcupine]

94. Glad you got to see it

I wish everyone would watch it. Especially those who fear Muslims. Thom posted it here in the multimedia group, and it just happened to be the same day this thread got started. Perfect timing.

But will they watch it?

what struck me was the interview that ABC put together where they edited out all the parts of the American Muslim interviews to cut out the parts where they agreed radical islam is wrong...they wanted to make it look like Muslims everywhere don't care, or maybe even side with radicals like ISIS.

You know that is what most people see when they search on the web or youtube for proof to back up their fears. They are watching edited clips that give them just what they want to see.

It's bad enough to have to fight Islam overseas...but to have to fight these hateful and fearful attitudes at home too, knowing it's attitudes like this that drive more Muslims to extremism...it's just disheartening.

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

10. Someone didn't get the message that Islam is a religion of peace

Damn.

I hope his family finds solace in knowing that Asad Shah was a real man of peace.

[potone]

13. I hope his family will get support from the Christian community there.

If anything good can come out of this, it would be that Christians and Muslims unite against religiously motivated violence. Then his death would have accomplished something good, as tragic as it is for his family and friends.

[Akicita]

23. Wishfull thinking I'm afraid. We can seed what happens to a Muslim who expresses unity with

Christians.

[MariaThinks]

32. or with any other religion.

[cynzke]

36. A MAJORITY of the 1.6 Billion Muslims in the World...

DO GET the message. But it only takes one misguided "bad" apple with a gun or a bomb making headlines and the message is obliterated.

[MariaThinks]

39. i've heard that meme - meanwhile tens of thousands are getting slaughtered by those 'few'

what's the percentage? 1% are bad, 10 %, 20%, 50%?

so I guess the larger the 1.6 number, the more bad apples there are.

[Quantess]

64. "one" bad apple?

The list of bad apples is adding up fast. There have been really a lot of bad apples, more yet to be uncovered for every day that goes by.

[whatthehey]

12. Religion doubtless had nothing to do with this

The Glasgow police are making things up to point blame away from US foreign policy where it belongs.

[Coventina]

14. +1

!!

[FrodosPet]

16. I think you forgot something

The tag.

[whatthehey]

20. Some people really mean it

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

18. WTF?

Your tinfoil hat is on too tight.

[Democat]

34. Bush and Obama are to blame

No matter what.

[philosslayer]

48. The quick arrest and public revelation of a motive DOES sound awful convenient

I'll wait for more facts before rendering an opinion. No one knows the previous interactions between these two men.

[warrprayer]

15. Killing peacemakers

Deserves a special place in hell.

[Odin2005]

19. If I were a European Muslim I would be terrified right now...

...and this is why.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

25. Yeah, members of your own religion, stabbing you to death....

....most likely simply for being respectful of another religion during their holiday.

Truly scary and sad, huh?

[DetlefK]

33. Nothing new: A sunni-shia shadow-war has been going on for decades in Europe.

A few years ago, I saw a TV-documentary:
Muslims in Europe don't like to talk about whether they are Sunnis or Shias if they are around Muslims they aren't already friends with. Sunnis and Shias get in arguments all the time behind closed doors. It has become so bad that Muslims lie about their denomination for peace's sake and out of fear of becoming outcasts in their local muslim community.

Nobody bothers to report on this and few people actually know about this. This article covers it a little bit:
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-31691120

[flamingdem]

22. I'm glad they caught the attacker

It's amazing that they have so much hate even in another environment. You'd think it would moderate their views a bit as this man had moderated his and was optimistic and positive.

[Turborama]

40. FWIW, the largest Muslim majority country in the world celebrates Easter

Good Friday is a public/national holiday in Indonesia, as are four other Christian holidays.

Details: http://www.expat.or.id/info/holidays.html

[MariaThinks]

43. but homosexuality is illegal and people are put in jail for it.

[Turborama]

53. No it's not.

And that has nothing to do with them celebrating other religions' holidays, anyway.

Nice try to keep the hate fire fuelled up, though.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_Indonesia#Legal_rights

[MariaThinks]

54. sure -i'm the bad one

[Turborama]

60. Posting disinformation to incite fear and hate isn't a good thing.

I'll get to your wrongness below shortly, once I've finished helping out my Muslim neighbour.

[MariaThinks]

61. i posted the truth to the disinformation you were posting

but don't let me stop you. Please travel to Saudi Arabia and try to have a beer.

[Turborama]

62. No, You posted a non sequitur strawman in response to FACTS, after originally posting a lie.

And if you had followed the link I posted then you were definitely following it up with disinformation not misinformation about Indonesia's law.

[MariaThinks]

55. i hope no one took your advice in Indonesia - here' s the truth

Indonesia's northwesternmost province of Aceh for example, has a sharia-based anti-homosexuality law that punishes anyone caught having gay sex with 100 lashes. Beyond the national and provincial laws, overt violence against gay or transgender people, by civilians, is still rare.

from wikeapedia


seriously, why the attempts to cover this up?

[Turborama]

80. There's no cover up going on. You made a false statement about Indonesia and were corrected.

Last edited Mon Mar 28, 2016, 09:19 AM - Edit history (4)

I have lived in Indonesia for several years, have married an Indonesian from a Muslim family who converted to Christianity (which her Muslim brothers had no problem with, btw) and have an in depth knowledge on the subject.

Aceh is the very predictable strawman that anyone who hates Muslims but doesn't know anything about Indonesia brings up, after a quick Google search for something bad about the place.

Look...



Aceh is a relatively small semi-autonomous region on the far west tip of Indonesia - a country of over 18 thousand islands.

Saying what happens in Aceh is the law of Indonesia is as patently absurd as saying:

"Because 'sodomy' is a felony in Michigan that's punishable by a 15 year prison sentence, it's illegal in the whole of the country."

http://www.thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/johnwright/michigan_senate_passes_bill_saying_sodomy_is_a_felony


In San Antonio, Texas, flirting is against the law. Does that mean flirting is illegal throughout America?


Anyway, my original point still stands. The largest Muslim majority country in the world celebrates Easter - and other Christian holidays - with a public holiday.

[MariaThinks]

93. i'm not sure how you can deny the fact i put on the table. If we're not talking facts let's end this

conversation. Accecdotal information is not convincing. If flogging for gay acts is against the law - it is against the law. It doesn't matter if people find ways to circumvent the law - not everyone will be so lucky.

you get the last word. I'm only interested in fact based conversations.

[Turborama]

100. There's no denial. Just refutation of your original lie about Indonesia.

Seems to me that, due to cognitive dissonance, your prejudices and fears are immune to the reality and facts of this subject when they are shown to you.

Bye!

[LiberalLovinLug]

46. I am tired of liberals

that coddle a religion that encourages violence,and is an enemy of liberalism, under the premise of empathy, acceptance, and sometimes simply because of a knee-jerk counter reaction to right wing xenophobia the other way. A set of faith based beliefs that are completely counter to the gains that progressive policy fighters and makers have achieved in the last century in the West. A religious cult that has been ingrained into the psyche of a huge segment of Earth's population. And like all religions, moderates submit to will of the most vocal and extreme, or at least say nothing, and many secretly support them while paying lip service to abiding by their western hosts law. Organized religion is a scourge. Islam is where Christianity was during the Inquisition at the height of the Roman Catholic dominance. Liberals would do well to choose their own hard fought gains over always having to bend backwards further than they have to in order not to be branded un-PC.

[smirkymonkey]

47. +1000

[muriel_volestrangler]

50. So you were against what Asad Shah said, then?

You are attacking liberals for showing him empathy and acceptance, because his killer was Muslim, and so that makes his religion an unalloyed 'Bad Thing', despite his obvious ability to live in peace with Christians and to wish them a Happy Easter in the country he loved.

When you talk about Shah's "western hosts", are you saying he should not have been seen as a permanent resident in Scotland?

[LiberalLovinLug]

57. Another thing I hate

Is when some liberals, so eager to find the slightest hint of what could be construed non supportive, not unconditionally empathetic, and thus giving comfort to the enemy (the racist right wing). Its almost comedic. Twisting my post to say something it is not. I thought it would be obvious I was not condemning the overture of Asad Shah. Yes he shared the same religion (we assume) that his murderer did. The point is that they both follow a religious cult that it is excused to kill someone who says happy Easter to Christians, and even though there may some sympathy for Asad, there is also a lot of support I would gather in that same community, for the actions of the murderer by many so-called moderate Muslims. We sure don't hear a lot shock or empathy or denunciation from the majority Muslim community.

In fact it is Asad and others that may even have more, if only in secret, liberal ideals that live in Muslim dominated cultures, that are neglected by western liberals in a stampede to make sure that the moderate, apolitical, religious, conservative, majority is coddled, and excused for having anti LGBT opinions, anti-choice, anti-woman's rights, pro death penalty for apostates etc..That we shouldn't get too picky and not offend this "moderate majority" by criticizing them or the draconian religion that leaders use to indoctrinate them with by speaking out in defense of the tiny vocal minority of progressive citizens in Muslim countries that usually end up dead or in long prison terms simply for wishing for the freedom to have basic human rights.

[Denzil_DC]

58. "there is also a lot of support I would gather in that same community,

for the actions of the murderer"

I'd be curious to see you produce any evidence at all for this assertion you've managed to "gather" that's based in the real world and not just your own preconceptions. If you haven't heard "a lot shock or empathy or denunciation from the majority Muslim community", let alone those you so sweepingly dismiss as "so-called moderate", maybe it's because you're located in Canada. The condemnation, shock, and sorrow has been very much in evidence from all quarters for those of us nearer the scene of the atrocity.

[Turborama]

59. HATE!

[Quantess]

66. That's the ticket! Focus on somebody writing an opinion on the DU

not the person who stabbed and killed somebody for saying "Happy Easter".

[Turborama]

78. I abhor hate.

Wherever it comes from.

BTW, do you see the hypocrisy of your post yet?

[Quantess]

81. No, but I would appreciate it if you to point it out to me.

[muriel_volestrangler]

69. OK, so you don't love liberals, despite your user name

You make a post that denounces the whole of Islam, which the murder victim practised, as "a religion that encourages violence,and is an enemy of liberalism", say that moderates like the victim "submit to will of the most vocal and extreme", generally insult the victim's outlook and claim the reason others don't speak like you is a desire to be 'PC'?

And then, laughably, you accuse liberals of "giving comfort to the enemy (the racist right wing)". It's you who is parroting right wing phrases (like 'PC'), and is using a right wing idea of painting all Muslims as secret supporters of the extremists. When you've been called on it, you say 'oh, I didn't mean the victim, though he "follow(s) a religious cult that it is excused to kill someone who says happy Easter to Christians"'. No, it wasn't 'obvious' you weren't condemning what Mr. Shah said, because you didn't try in any way. You just condemned all moderate Muslims, which included him.

Like Denzil_DC, I await the evidence you claim to have of "a lot of support I would gather in that same community, for the actions of the murderer by many so-called moderate Muslims".

[Turborama]

82. Very well said.

you accuse liberals of "giving comfort to the enemy (the racist right wing)". It's you who is parroting right wing phrases (like 'PC'), and is using a right wing idea of painting all Muslims as secret supporters of the extremists.

A bigoted attitude that is prevalent on this site these days, sadly.

[LiberalLovinLug]

95. Oh boy.....(I mean Oh boy/girl/woman/man/LGBT/any race included)

I apologize. I used a colloquialism "I hate". I set myself up. Okay, just for you....I did not actually mean "I hate" liberals personally. I am a liberal myself. It was more a disappointment with some of their knee jerk reactions...kind of what you did with me by focusing on "I hate....". Sometimes one has to spell everything out like an elementary teacher and dot all your i's and cross your t's in order not to be open to misinterpretation theories that is seemingly a sport for some.

Anyways. On to explaining what I thought was clear. "Giving comfort to the enemy" is that some liberals opinions become inconsequential when all they do is react to the right wing's overblown attacks on the Muslim community, like Trumps edicts on denying immigration. Of course this must be criticized (I'd better add that JIC) But what I miss is a proactive movement, with progressives from North America, and from other western nations, together with more liberal immigrants, and overseas groups of middle eastern decent to stand up together against the religous dictations that hamper their rights, and threaten their lives, and that the silent majority is swayed by their own brainwashing to not speak out, and even may quietly agree with (again, the religious cultural indocrtination, NOT them as persons underneath it all). I believe that many can be deprogrammed, once they are given more information as well as interaction with what they, or their Amans, may have regarded as "infidels". I also found my way to rational thinking after being brought up in a fundamentalist Christian household.

And again, it is not the people I have an issue with, it is the cultural brainwashing towards religious inspired violence:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10141394002

Islamist protesters call for Sharia in Pakistan after Salman Taseer blasphemy row

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2013/05/01/64-percent-of-muslims-in-egypt-and-pakistan-support-the-death-penalty-for-leaving-islam/

Majorities of Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan support the death penalty for leaving Islam

It's that in the left's fervor to be completely opposite to anything the right says, that they excuse the brainwashing as simply part of their protected rights of religious practice. And instead...I would rather the focus be on ACTUAL middle eastern liberals in the minority in those Muslim dominated cultures that are waging a lonely difficult fight for equal rights, where they can be killed, like this shop keeper, for simply saying something humane and decent.

[muriel_volestrangler]

98. This happened in Scotland. The man arrested is from England.

Those 2 facts don't seem to feature in the way you see this at all. You refer to attitudes in Pakistan and Egypt. You seem to think that this means that is how Muslims the world over typically think.

The other problem with your posts is that you're attacking some version of a liberal that I can't see in this thread at all, and have only very rarely seen on DU. You've taken the occasion of the murder of a moderate Scottish Muslim to roll out some long-standing grudge you have with a few liberals somewhere else, and you've used such careless language that you've attacked liberals in general as if we've all written what you object to, and, worse, you've attacked the beliefs of the moderate Muslim victim himself.

And I think your remark about 'their western hosts' indicates you have a problem with immigration. You imply that Muslims are only in western countries temporarily, and are being 'hosted'.

[LiberalLovinLug]

99. I really don't want to pick a fight

I was expressing frustration that there is a reluctance to appreciate the innate dangers of the power of religious indoctrination. I hate it with Christianity in North America and Islam in such a large portion that is left of the Earth.

Yes, I am most concerned with more liberal Muslims, as well as non-Muslims that are Mid East citizens , that reside in Middle Eastern countries. But you seem to disregard that most, if not all, immigrants do not suddenly shed all their anti-liberal brainwashing just because they have been "hosted" (probably another dumb way to say it) to become full citizens eventually in Western countries.

There is a grey area. Nothing is black and white. That is more right wing thinking IMO. Their is a small minority, although not insignificant, that is radicalized into supporting groups like ISIS, even if they do not go and sign up. Then there is a more liberal minority element in the Muslim community that says live and let live. But the bulk of "moderate" Muslim immigrants do not agree with Western liberal ideology. Their views on gay marriage, let alone homosexuality, equal rights for women, are kept to themselves for the most part so as not to rock the boat. Because they are deep down decent people that don't want to offend their new hosts, and are grateful and polite. But liberals should not fool themselves into thinking all these new close-minded conservative future citizens, in this case caused by religious brainwashing, will be supporters of the Democratic party in the future. Once the Republicans get their collective heads screwed on to where they can at least fool most of the people that they are sane, and stop their anti-immigrant ranting, these new immigrants' votes will go to the candidate that is railing against abortion, gays, and supporting "family values".

The Conservatives in Canada under Harper (thank gawd he is gone) relied heavily on the new immigrant vote who are vastly more conservative than most native Canadians.

[Quantess]

65. Well said!

[muriel_volestrangler]

67. It was appalling said

Denzil_DC has produced a decent response to it. I await the evidence this "LiberalLovinLug" (who, remember, has come on DU to say "how they hate liberals who...&quot has of support for the murderer in the community. I think they've got fuck all.

Another vigil was held ­yesterday, just yards from where Asad was ­murdered. Around 200 people took part in a ­minute’s silence and a steady stream of people laid ­tributes throughout the day.

It was organised by Aleesa Malik, 17, and Nabah Younis, 16, who were customers in his shop.
...
Dr Salah Beltagui, director of the Muslim Council of Scotland, added: “There is a feeling of shock – a loss of any human life, whether it’s ­Muslim or not, is the same. ”
...
“Sadly, in our beautiful city there have always been those hellbent on bigotry and violence, but as a Sunni Muslim I proudly stand with my brothers and sisters of the ­Ahmadiyya community to say, ‘Not in our name’.”

Read more at http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/police-believe-asad-shah-killer-7636394#AQI3FGrqHmkxmkrC.99

Obviously, the sympathy of the vast majority of the local Muslims is with Mr. Shah, and they condemn his attack.

[Quantess]

68. What was so "appalling" about his/her post?

Thanks for the article. Don't you agree the "appalling" part is the stabbing and killing of this nice guy who wished people a happy easter?

Here, again, in your post, the blame is shifted to DU who dare say anything negative or critical about violent muslim extremism, rather than the actual violent muslim extremists and their fucked up beliefs.

[muriel_volestrangler]

70. See #69 (nt)

[Quantess]

72. What I appreciated from his /her post was the rather obviously true observation

that many liberals attack the voices who criticize certain aspects of muslim culture, instead of saying anything negative about the actual perpetrators of the violence. Anything slightly unfavorable about muslims is seen by some liberals as a broad-brush smear against "all" muslims, when in fact, nobody ever said "all muslims" when they point out the obvious cultural tendencies toward violence, misogyny, and anti-gay bigotry.

[muriel_volestrangler]

73. But their posts *are* 'all Muslims ...'

They don't grant exceptions (well, after I pointed out they were attacking the victim too, they half-heartedly made an exception for him, but they still claim his religion supports the attack on him). They attacked it all. It wasn't about 'certain aspects'; it was about the entire religion. And they attack liberals, for good measure. It's sad to see you say you appreciate the bit where they attack 'many liberals', and you think that's a "rather obviously true observation". You are supporting the "I hate liberals" bit, and so you really don't have any basis to be sarcastic when Turborama points out a post that is expressing that hate. You need to recognise what it is you're supporting.

[Quantess]

74. I'm the bad guy, now?

Who are the hateful ones, really? The people doing the murdering, or the people discussing it?

It seems as though criticizing muslim extremism is worse than the violence itself. I'm not being sarcastic, I am just pointing out the blaring hypocrisy.

[muriel_volestrangler]

75. Saying you're not as bad as the murderers is not a high bar you're setting yourself

I don't think you've pointed out any 'hypocrisy'. Yes, I think we all on DU do condemn the murderer, and Muslim extremists who support such things. The point it you've agreed with a couple of posts saying 'moderate' Muslims aren't condemning it, when they are, and blaming the whole religion as totally wrong (and a rather ridiculous claim that many moderate Muslims 'secretly' support the extremists - a claim that can never be disproven, and which is basically paranoid, because it's saying "you can never trust what they say&quot . This even included the views of the victim.

[Quantess]

79. If you don't see the hypocrisy, there really isn't much point in continuing this discussion with you

Have a nice day.

[Denzil_DC]

85. A discussion of a horrible crime on a mere online forum escalated to an expression of hate

based on a simple disagreement about ideas.

If you can't perceive the irony in that, I doubt anybody can help you see it.

[Quantess]

88. So, s/he used the word "hate" the same way you can say you hate rush hour traffic.

This discussion is chock full of irony, no doubt about that.

I wonder if you meant to reply to muriel volestrangler?

[Denzil_DC]

89. Why would you wonder if I meant to reply to muriel_volestrangler?

Unless this is an attempt to deflect and enlist me in your supposition that muriel_volestrangler is somehow guilty of hypocrisy?

Thank you for translating for the other poster. Maybe he'll chime in some time so we'll find out whether you're right, or whether he does actually feel the degree of animosity his words indicated to at least three of us.

[Quantess]

90. Well at least, can we agree that murder is a stronger expression of hate

than using the mere word during an internet discussion? This is getting silly.

[Denzil_DC]

92. Who on earth said anything to the contrary? Unless we count your trying to put words in their mouth.

Who's getting silly again?

[LiberalLovinLug]

97. Thanks for seeing what I actually meant

I made the mistake of giving someone an opening salvo by using a colloquialism that could be taken literally by someone wanting a fight.

All I was saying is I wish I'd hear more about the North American liberal community not just backing the Muslim majority from assholes like Trump and Cruz, but even more so, backing the Middle Eastern born liberal minority that have an almost impossible fight to carry out all on their own. For instance, there are women that carry out topless shock protests in some Middle Eastern countries to protest against having no rights as women, but you hardly hear of those, and they are quickly jailed, beaten, or worse.

[MowCowWhoHow III]

71. After Asad Shah's 'religiously prejudiced' death, we know inter-Muslim hatred is a problem in UK

After Asad Shah's 'religiously prejudiced' death, we know inter-Muslim hatred is a problem in Britain

By all accounts, the death of shopkeeper Asad Shah on Thursday night in Glasgow was alleged to be related to his background. It shocked the local community and a tribute event on Friday was attended by hundreds of people, including Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon. But, astonishingly, it is now suspected that Shah was killed by another Muslim man because he was an Ahmadi Muslim. It is the first high-profile anti-Ahmadi incident on British soil, and it has already sent ripples of shock throughout the small community.

Ahmadis are an Islamic sect, founded in modern day Pakistan in 1889. There’s no definitive number of Ahmadi Muslims: estimates range between two million to “tens of millions”, and though they are spread across the world, they are predominately based in Pakistan. Ahmadis are also considered heretics by many Sunni Muslims, and are viciously persecuted in their homeland. Pakistan treats Ahmadis no better than Apartheid South Africa treated black people; that is, with complete contempt.

It’s shocking, but not entirely surprising, that the persecution Ahmadis face in Pakistan has travelled over here. Several British Ahmadis I spoke to say they have known of someone who had been threatened or attacked for being an Ahmadi here in Britain. One anti-Ahmadi group with offices in London organises conferences that spread hate-speech against them; a popular Facebook group sent out a message of “congratulations” on news of Shah’s death.

The persecution of British Ahmadis by other Muslims has become worryingly normalised, yet has remained largely unspoken. In recent weeks, several British imams in Glasgow and Bradford openly praised Mumtaz Qadri, who murdered a Pakistani governor for campaigning against the country’s vicious blasphemy laws (used primarily to persecute and even kill religious minorities including Christians, Hindus, Sikhs and Ahmadis in Pakistan).

These are not isolated incidents. Last month a group of Muslims in Scunthorpe protested against an Ahmadi mosque being built, and there have been reports of similar incidents elsewhere around the country. In 2010, The Independent reported of hard line Muslims in west London calling for Ahmadis to be killed. In Tooting, mainstream Sunni preachers were found to have urged follower to boycotts Ahmadi businesses.

More: http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/after-asad-shahs-religiously-prejudiced-death-we-know-inter-muslim-hatred-is-a-problem-in-britain-a6955146.html

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

84. Please, please repost this in its own thread

Thanks.

[MowCowWhoHow III]

86. I don't think it strictly meets the LBN OP criteria.

But if you think it will be well received elsewhere then please repost it wherever (I mainly stick to LBN).

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

87. Post in general

Thanks!

[Coventina]

91. Yikes. I don't know what free-speech laws are in Britain, but this is extremely troubling.

I firmly believe in free speech and freedom of religion, but how do you deal with imams who call for the murder of others, and praise murderers?

Does that or should that fall under criminal behavior?

[romanic]

101. Very troubling.

These are not isolated incidents. Last month a group of Muslims in Scunthorpe protested against an Ahmadi mosque being built, and there have been reports of similar incidents elsewhere around the country. In 2010, The Independent reported of hard line Muslims in west London calling for Ahmadis to be killed. In Tooting, mainstream Sunni preachers were found to have urged follower to boycotts Ahmadi businesses.

How can British Muslims call for peace and tolerance when they cannot even tolerate each other? It's insane.

[Jesus Malverde]

96. Heard the killer travelled 200 miles to kill him.

Nice bunch...

[MowCowWhoHow III]

103. Murdered Muslim shopkeeper's family fear for their lives from hardline Islamic factions

Murdered Muslim shopkeeper's family fear for their lives from hardline Islamic factions

Asad Shah's wife and siblings pay tribute to him on the condition their names are not published for fear of retribution

The family of a popular Muslim shopkeeper who was murdered after posting an online Easter message to “my beloved Christian nation” has disclosed they fear for their lives following the brutal attack.

Asad Shah’s wife and siblings said they had been left “heartbroken” by the killing and they had been overwhelmed by the messages of support they had received from the local community in the Shawlands area of Glasgow.

But they only spoke on the condition their names were not published for fear of retribution and disclosed they have been advised by the police to be careful what they say in order to protect their security.

The family, originally from Pakistan, are members of the Ahmadiyya Islamic sect, which preaches “love for all, hatred for none”. However, it has faced persecution in some parts of the world from more hardline Muslim factions.

More: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/12205279/Murdered-Muslim-shopkeepers-family-fear-for-their-lives.html

[MowCowWhoHow III]

104. Asad Shah death: Man admits killing shopkeeper because he 'disrespected' Islam

Asad Shah death: Man admits killing shopkeeper because he 'disrespected' Islam

The man accused of murdering Glasgow shopkeeper Asad Shah has issued a statement saying he carried out the killing because he believed Mr Shah had "disrespected" Islam.

Tanveer Ahmed, 32, from Bradford, is accused of killing Mr Shah outside his shop in Glasgow almost a fortnight ago.

In the statement he denied the incident had anything to do with Christianity.

Mr Ahmed claimed Asad Shah had "disrespected" Islam by claiming to be a prophet.

Read more: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-35976958

Asad Shah murder accused claims responsibility for religious killing

A man accused of murdering a shopkeeper has issued a statement claiming responsibility for the killing, saying it was religiously motivated.

Tanveer Ahmed, 32, appeared at Glasgow Sheriff Court on Wednesday charged with murdering Asad Shah outside his store in the south side of the city last month.

Ahmed, of Bradford, made no plea or declaration but issued a statement through his lawyer following the private hearing, saying he had done it because Asad Shah claimed to be a Prophet.

Mr Shah belonged to the Ahmadi sect of Islam, a minority community which has faced persecution from other Muslim groups.

The highly unusual statement was made through Ahmed's lawyer, John Rafferty, after his second appearance at court before Sheriff Brian Adair.

Read more: http://stv.tv/news/west-central/1349047-asad-shah-murder-accused-claims-responsibility-for-religious-killing/

The highly unusual statement was made through Mr Ahmed's lawyer, John Rafferty after his second appearance at court before sheriff Brian Adair.

The statement given is: "My client Mr Tanveer Ahmed has specifically instructed me that today, 6 April 2016, to issue this statement to the press, the statement is in the words of my client.

"This all happened for one reason and no other issues and no other intentions.

"Asad Shah disrespected the messenger of Islam the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him. Mr Shah claimed to be a Prophet.

"When 1400 years ago the Prophet of Islam Muhammad peace be upon him has clearly said that 'I am the final messenger of Allah there is no more profits or messengers from God Allah after me.

'I am leaving you the final Quran. There is no changes. It is the final book of Allah and this is the final completion of Islam'.

'There is no more changes to it and no one has the right to claim to be a Prophet or to change the Quran or change Islam.'

"It is mentioned in the Quran that there is no doubt in this book no one has the right to disrespect the sayings of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him and no one has the right to disrespect the Prophet of Islam Muhammad Peace be upon him.

"If I had not done this others would and there would have been more killing and violence in the world.

"I wish to make it clear that the incident was nothing at all to do with Christianity or any other religious beliefs even although I am a follower of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him I also love and respect Jesus Christ."